Vince - Was Bertil Fox a victim of racism or unfair judging in your opinion?

[gib]

Interested to know your thoughts.

[Deicide]

Interested to know your thoughts.

Kind of.

[tommywishbone]

Bertil was a spook who lost his temper and killed his wife. After reviewing the case throughly, I believe he was judged fairly.

[disco_stu]

ive seen many shows tht fox was in and in my opinion he got at least the placings he deserved.

ive never understood the hype around him by those who see the odd photo and short video of him and go crazy nut hugging over his "mass" and thickness.

truth is that he wasnt that pleasing on the eye, posed like shit, wasnt balanced and despite the hype, wasnt usually the thickest, densest guy in the contests. in some cases he was close, and in certain bodyparts, maybe, but all around he had some glaring flaws and his posing was so crap he was relegated to an also ran.

and then yes, he killed another person...but that was coincidence and nothing to do with steroids..like all the other ailments and psychotic episodes that are all too common by hormone abusers.

[mass243]

And he did exercises with weird style... worked out for him though

[Figo]

Fox was the DJ of his day

he won many tank-top olympias

[keanu]

Bertil Fox = thick skin, lack of conditioning/quality.

[~UN_$ung~]

i havent seen really any of his shows, pictures rarely tell the whole story........and there arent even a lot of pics floating around


but that youtube video someone posted the other day, about his life and murder charge............they show some footage from the 83 olympia (the one samir bannout won)


and he DEFINITELY should not have placed 5th that year. it was a real screwing...........it seems like in those years they were really going for a streamlined look, smaller guys with great proportions and conditioning............ ..you had zane, dickerson, bannout

........and fox was the mass monster of his day


but you could definitely have made a case of why he should have won that olympia, or at LEAST placed above 5th.

.........mind you, thats his first olympia, and after that they said he became disenfranchised with the sport......and badmouthed the IFBB........so it hurt his placings henceforth

[Tito24]

these mouthy whores deserved to die

[Vince B]

Not sure which Vince you mean! Anyway, I did read an article re Bertil Fox and his trial in St Kitts and it is a strange story. Of course we have no way of knowing if he was guilty or not. He sent a letter to Chris Lund saying it was an accident that his girlfriend and his mother were killed during a struggle to get his gun back. One thing seems clear. There were irregularities during the trial and Fox was an outsider there and the small community thought he was guilty and that is exactly what the jury concluded. Fox was in business with a mate and according to Bertil this guy helped get him convicted because he wanted to own Fox's Gym. Sounds like Shawn Ray and Milos!

I have no idea about this trial but I do recall that it was controversial. Let this be a lesson to everyone. Don't fool around in small towns. Bertil's girlfriend was 20 and her mother was 36 whereas Bertil was over 40. What was he thinking? Of course you can't rule out gym owner's disease. The mother warned her daughter that Bertil wouldn't be loyal because he would soon be off with some floosies from the gym. Who knows? Something doesn't sound right about the whole saga. Luckily for Bertil his death sentence was ruled unconstitutional and was converted to life inprisonment.

Have a read of this article and see what you think.

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0KFY/is_10_23/ai_n15894917/?tag=content;col1

[Parker]

i havent seen really any of his shows, pictures rarely tell the whole story........and there arent even a lot of pics floating around


but that youtube video someone posted the other day, about his life and murder charge............they show some footage from the 83 olympia (the one samir bannout won)


and he DEFINITELY should not have placed 5th that year. it was a real screwing...........it seems like in those years they were really going for a streamlined look, smaller guys with great proportions and conditioning............ ..you had zane, dickerson, bannout

........and fox was the mass monster of his day


but you could definitely have made a case of why he should have won that olympia, or at LEAST placed

above 5th.

.........mind you, thats his first olympia, and after that they said he became disenfranchised with the sport......and badmouthed the IFBB........so it hurt his placings henceforth

basically he was the classical insecure fvckwit who got involved with bodybuilding and couldn't take the losses in life. He became a muscular giant, while still being a mental and emotional midget. He reminds me of Craig Titus and his tirade against a Phil Hernon or when Victor Richards lost...and he was abusive, due in part to not being able to express himself, so he lost his wife, lost his young girlfriend to some young white dude...

As Rick Wayne had said, he was insecure, and a insecure person tends to want to control things around him, that most people realize that you can't control. Like judging and placings, or a woman leaving you...

But, he did have a point, all the judges are skinny or fat people who have never trained, or who are out of shape. But does a FDA official have to eat beef, to judge the quality of it?

[crownshep]

.........mind you, thats his first olympia, and after that they said he became disenfranchised with the sport......and badmouthed the IFBB........so it hurt his placings henceforth

It was his 2nd Olympia,he competed in the 82 one,i went to watch it at Wembley and really expected him to do well,but when you saw him stood with the other contestants he didn`t really stand out.Then he posed to some reggae music and just repeated most musculars over and over,which didn`t compare well to the polished posing of people like Bannout,Makkawy and Dickerson.He placed where he should have(7th) in 82,but i would have placed him as high as 2nd in the 83 Olympia.

[willl]

matherfucker brainlees peniseass  dumb  whietbred sun of a bitch

mus t take some reel brainlees peniseass  2 mess with a gay that size,  well womens always get  away scott free while men fukced over  by the penile system. hang in there beef it ull be on  staige agian in  no time and no mouthy whores  can take ur mr o titels away

[erics]

But, he did have a point, all the judges are skinny or fat people who have never trained, or who are out of shape.

I've never given this logic any credit. What experience in weight training does a judge need to know what a physique looks like?

Bodybuilding, theoretically, is supposed be about building a certain type of physique that aspires to certain criteria. As a competing bodybuilder, you either satisfy that criteria or you don't.

(Of course, it would help if the criteria were adhered to...)

A bodybuilder complaining about the judges not knowing what the competitors go through is just sour grapes.

[~UN_$ung~]

basically he was the classical insecure fvckwit who got involved with bodybuilding and couldn't take the losses in life. He became a muscular giant, while still being a mental and emotional midget. He reminds me of Craig Titus and his tirade against a Phil Hernon or when Victor Richards lost...and he was abusive, due in part to not being able to express himself, so he lost his wife, lost his young girlfriend to some young white dude...

As Rick Wayne had said, he was insecure, and a insecure person tends to want to control things around him, that most people realize that you can't control. Like judging and placings, or a woman leaving you...

But, he did have a point, all the judges are skinny or fat people who have never trained, or who are out of shape. But does a FDA official have to eat beef, to judge the quality of it?

yeh, he seem like  a real insecure prick who just was terminally unhappy in general


mix these elements with an evil treacherous women, who tortures, cheats, and emasculates


recepie for disaster

[Vince B]

It would be natural for anyone in prison to claim they are innocent if they are hoping a retrial might get them released.

When reading about Bertil trying to retrieve his gun something doesn't seem right. Two women shot during the struggle? I wonder what crime scene science would make of that testimony today? Maybe a cold case team could go there and get justice for Bertil?

There is a Bertil Fox com site that states he is innocent of all charges.

http://www.bertilfox.com/contact.html

[Parker]

I've never given this logic any credit. What experience in weight training does a judge need to know what a physique looks like?

Bodybuilding, theoretically, is supposed be about building a certain type of physique that aspires to certain criteria. As a competing bodybuilder, you either satisfy that criteria or you don't.

(Of course, it would help if the criteria were adhered to...)

A bodybuilder complaining about the judges not knowing what the competitors go through is just sour grapes.

That's why I asked does one have toeat beef, to judge the (visual) quality of it. But, what Bertil was really getting at the the subjectiveness of the judging...those who don't, or haven't work out, are they judging the body as they see or as they want their bodies to look? If several on the judging panel, want/desire/or promote the mass monster look, and then there are those that have the same for the classical,  think of how that is in conflict. Look at it now, as you said yourself, the judging criteria should be adhere to, but when you have you own thoughs on what the "ultimate physique" should be, instead of sticking to the judging criteria, then problems arise

[PJim]

Racism? definitely not

[erics]

If several on the judging panel, want/desire/or promote the mass monster look, and then there are those that have the same for the classical,  think of how that is in conflict. Look at it now, as you said yourself, the judging criteria should be adhere to, but when you have you own thoughs on what the "ultimate physique" should be, instead of sticking to the judging criteria, then problems arise

You are 100% correct.

As far as I know, the IFBB does (did?) have a set of criteria that is (was?) written down in the rulebook for judges to follow.

I think it was Chris Dickerson who suggested that before each contest, the rules and what the judges are looking for should be reiterated so that everybody, including the judges, are reminded of the criteria.

[Vince B]

The issue re racism in the IFBB is an interesting one. I told Dexter Jackson that the black guys had to be heaps better than the white guys to win. Case in point is this years Mr Olympia where many observers felt Phil Heath should have won over Jay Culter.

No one can deny that the IFBB is an organization where control is paramount. Play along and you might get rewarded. Disobey or think for yourself and you won't be Mr Olympia. So we have a sorry history in the Mr Olympia where lots of bad things happened. Remember that Joe Weider started the contest to give all champions an opportunity to continue competing against each other. It wasn't long that we saw politics enter the scene and Serge Nubret and Sergio Oliva both got the shaft for various reasons. Arnold was the cooperative bloke and he fit in really well with the IFBB and vice versa. By the time Sergio was allowed to compete in the Olympia he was over the hill. Lee Priest got the shaft. Bev Francis was never allowed to be Ms Olympia no matter how she presented or how feminine.

Bertil Fox probably wasn't given a fair go in the IFBB. Guys who cooperated like Franco were over-rewarded with titles.

[Matt C]

Was Bertil Fox a victim of racism

Yes.

In 1983 he was beaten by a Lebanese bodybuilder and two Black bodybuilders because the judges were racist.

[hangclean]

matherfucker brainlees peniseass  dumb  whietbred sun of a bitch

mus t take some reel brainlees peniseass  2 mess with a gay that size,  well womens always get  away scott free while men fukced over  by the penile system. hang in there beef it ull be on  staige agian in  no time and no mouthy whores  can take ur mr o titels away

I guess know one remembers rehtaf ruo.

[Parker]

Yes.

In 1983 he was beaten by a Lebanese bodybuilder and two Black bodybuilders because the judges were racist.

Bertil was "racist" against himself....I guess he blames racism and whitey for his shitty back...I guess the way he trained had nothing to do with it

[basil]

I guess know one remembers rehtaf ruo.

Hahaha.  Beef it Betil.  Funniest shit ever on here.