Black education gap looks even bleaker...WTF?

[George Whorewell]

It's cultural, it's generational, it's political and it's economic (in that order).

When you come from a culture that glorifies stupidity, blames everyone else for the problems it faces and raises almost three quarters of it's children out of wedlock, you can't spend, read or educate your people out of the hole.  

When you have generation upon generation of poverty- the end result of young fuck ups producing more young fuck ups in a perpetual state of low expectations, high incarceration rates, illegitimacy, drug addiction, crime and violence; you can only hope for a handfull of unlikely success stories in the midst of a bottomless pit of wasted lives.

When you mindlessly, relentlessly, moronically and suicidally support the same useless, corrupt and self interested politicians with the same tired, inept and ineffective policies simply because they tell you what you want to hear; It's whiteys fault, it's rich peoples fault, it's FEMA's fault, etc. and then follow that up with buying into promises of free shit, quick fixes and government subsidized handouts, you are using the lines being fed to you in the same way a crack addict uses their final hit; it's a temporary high that will wear off and then force you to kill or rob someone to score your next fix. The difference is that symbolically you are killing another generation of your own people by continuing the cycle of government dependency, laziness and lethargy.  


Finally, economics play an obvious role. People with money (or even middle class people) can hire tutors, send their kids to private school etc. Intelligent people that realize their children may not have the aptitude to go to college encourage them to take up a trade. Other intelligent people try to send their children to charter schools. Most blacks can't or don't consider these options because the politicians they mindlessly support are against both practices. However, at the end of the day it comes down to parenting. If the mother works full time and isn't raising the child, who encourages the kid to do his homework or is in constant dialogue with the teacher?


There are a few other things that contribute to the state of blacks in America, but I think these points sum them up.

[doison]

At this point, you can't make any claim for "blame" on their minority status.  

Asians and Indians= minorities too.  
But you learn your math from an Asian, go see your Indian doctor, and get your tweeds from your black dealer....

It's the culture.  As long as "studying" makes you an uncle Tom and all your problems are because of "the man," there's not going to be any changes.  


Anyone that's in college knows what the "kid that always walks in late" looks like.  They know what the "kid that actually answers cell phone calls in the middle of class" looks like.  

Any Engineering, Physics, or Mathematics student knows that any class they take after Differential Equations is going to be a mix of Asian, White, and Indian students.....and that's it,
It's an unfortunate situation that isn't going to change unless society itself "changes."  Between the black culture and white guilt....it'll always be "the man's fault," that minorities are held back....as long as that minority is African American.

[~UN_$ung~]

this thread shows you why ZERO progess will be made



contrast, how people are speaking in this thread...........when its anonymous, and white people could speak their mind about how they REALLY feel



to the bullshit.........kum-bye-a singing, utopian , were-all-the-same-and-in-this-together dishonest bullshit EVERYONE IS THE SAME, is all ecomonic..........liies people tell in day to day life and in the media so they arent branded with the scarlet "R"




in real life, people cannot tell the truth like they are in this thread, cause their life and careers would be destroyed and they woudl be labeled a racist



so this thread, contrasted with how people talk in everyday life..............is the exact reason why there will be no progress...........cause how can there be progress, if you cant even truthfully identify the problem??

[doison]

this thread shows you why ZERO progess will be made



contrast, how people are speaking in this thread...........when its anonymous, and white people could speak their mind about how they REALLY feel



to the bullshit.........kum-bye-a singing, utopian , were-all-the-same-and-in-this-together dishonest bullshit EVERYONE IS THE SAME, is all ecomonic..........




in real life, people cannot tell the truth like they are in this thread, cause their lif would be destroyed and they woudl be labeled a racist



so this thread, contrasted with how people talk in everyday life..............is the exact reason why there will be no progress...........cause how can there be progress, if you cant even truthfully identify the problem??

[WillGrant]

want to know what's sad wiggs?

Women got a later start than blacks did

and now theres more women doctors and women lawyers than men lawyers and men doctors

strange that affirmative action worked with women but not blacks, isn't it?

all whities fault brah 

[Fury]

This pic sums it up:



But for what it's worth, the smartest person around my age that I've ever known was a black guy with a straight up African last name. He's now in the PhD program for theoretical chemistry at MIT. Unbelievably intelligent.

[Parker]

I see this shit everyday...and there are different avenues to attack it. And yes, Un-Sung is correct black parents, have failed their kids, or should I say, black mothers have failed their sons. From picking better fathers, to coddling their behavior and helping them grow into Man-Children. From putting more emphasis on looking cool, athletics, and being a player, or entertainment. to thinking that education or being educated is for white people...
When I was in HS, I was frowned on and bullied because I raised my hand in class, as a black male, we are supposed to be "stupid", and other black males, wanted me to fall in line. I was not raised by my parents to be like that.

Odd how in American folklore, John Henry exemplified hardwork, and in the Af American Folklore Br'r Rabbit was known for his quick wit and outsmarting people. In Africa, there are fables of tricksters, intelligent entities that are known for their smarts and the ability to get over on people. Okami, himself has said that the Nigerians, bascially have used the their welfare system to "trick" them. And withing certain Nigerian ethnic groups, it is a badge of honor to see how you get over on people.

Many blacks, going by the Jesse Jackson model, want restitution for slavery---we are too far removed for that to help us. But, our Restitution resides in  free Education. You take that, and then build up your communities.

Problem is, that the Jesse Jacksons and Al Sharptons of th world are part of the reason why blacks have fallen down the rabbit hole, stumbling upon the steps of victimhood. Always searching for Racism, instead of searching for ways to better your position.

And black people, by far have the lowest self esteem of all people. That's why we put each other down for not having the material things that others do.More emphasis is put on the things you have obtained, than what you know. basically being slave, and a slve to an inanimate object is the worse type of slave.

I'm rambling now, and lost my point...   

[KevinP85]

I see this shit everyday...and there are different avenues to attack it. And yes, Un-Sung is correct black parents, have failed their kids, or should I say, black mothers have failed their sons. From picking better fathers, to coddling their behavior and helping them grow into Man-Children. From putting more emphasis on looking cool, athletics, and being a player, or entertainment. to thinking that education or being educated is for white people...
When I was in HS, I was frowned on and bullied because I raised my hand in class, as a black male, we are supposed to be "stupid", and other black males, wanted me to fall in line. I was not raised by my parents to be like that.

Odd how in American folklore, John Henry exemplified hardwork, and in the Af American Folklore Br'r Rabbit was known for his quick wit and outsmarting people. In Africa, there are fables of tricksters, intelligent entities that are known for their smarts and the ability to get over on people. Okami, himself has said that the Nigerians, bascially have used the their welfare system to "trick" them. And withing certain Nigerian ethnic groups, it is a badge of honor to see how you get over on people.

Many blacks, going by the Jesse Jackson model, want restitution for slavery---we are too far removed for that to help us. But, our Restitution resides in  free Education. You take that, and then build up your communities.

Problem is, that the Jesse Jacksons and Al Sharptons of th world are part of the reason why blacks have fallen down the rabbit hole, stumbling upon the steps of victimhood. Always searching for Racism, instead of searching for ways to better your position.

And black people, by far have the lowest self esteem of all people. That's why we put each other down for not having the material things that others do.More emphasis is put on the things you have obtained, than what you know. basically being slave, and a slve to an inanimate object is the worse type of slave.

I'm rambling now, and lost my point...   

Props man, so should there be more Bill Cosby's then??

[jon cole]

-simple point, black children adopted by white family always succeed.

-they're nothing more awful than a fat black chick, walking slowly, watching people with a look empty of all intelligence, openly racist, always blaming other people for etc, remember "epic beard man" and these fat chick shouting "kill him".


I'm french and sometine i watch the american show "extrem make over", the stuff about building a new house for poor.
i remember in one show a black family:
 
-unemployed parent because of a "life accident"
-7/8 children
-and all the family spend day sitting on the stair in front of the house like they're waiting for something falling from the sky, no racist quote or disprespect here but it was like watching chimp in the zoo.

men that was like a cliché, but that was real.


and also that stupid black gangsta attitude,  most black people one day decided that looking stupid was their norm, men i hate rap culture, it's shit

[Captain Equipoise]

Props man, so should there be more Bill Cosby's then??

There really should, Bill Cosby has stated on many occasions that he is ashamed and embarrassed by the black youth of today and the parents that weren't there and failed them, he's published several long diatribes on this..

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5345290/

[Cy Tolliver]

diatribes

That's a great word that doesn't get used hardly enough!!!

[clued-up]

that stupid black gangsta attitude,  most black people one day decided that looking stupid was their norm, men i hate rap culture, it's shit

Yes... s t u p i d mutherfuckers.

[jon cole]

Yes... s t u p i d mutherfuckers.

oh lol.

[NordicNerd]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40095887/ns/us_news-the_new_york_times

 

Some please help me understand this as I'm 31 now and been out of high school too long to understand kids today...
I understand this thread will get negative really quick...I'm not understanding why this is and has been like this for so long...I mean we're talking about freaking high school...
Myself, Parker, G-thang, Dr. Kadje, Benny Blanco (I think), and Bay are all college grads...I cant speak of others because I don't know...This shit makes me sad...I wish there were a simple answer but I'm quite baffled by the numbers...What makes us different from others?

My perception is that there is an unfortunate mix of factors involved here. 

1. Culture: The US "black" culture values money, physical appearance, athletic performance, "hipness" as related to clothes, music and so on. The black culture views school skills as "nerdy" and uncool. Thus, black boys does not dedicate themselves to studying.

2. Family life and early learning:  Many US black kids grow up without their biological father present. Thus, the mother must provide most of the early learning environment for the kids. If she is poor and overworked, she will not have the capacity to provide optimal early learning for the kids

3. Genetics. Intelligence is highly inheritable (this is undisputed) and intelligence is the most important predictor of academic performance. If black women selects men based on the black cultural values such as physical appearance, "coolness"/"hipness" and so on, and not based on intellect, there will be less tendency for highly intellelligent but "nerdy" black males to have children and thus the kids will be less well performing academically. Thus, culture and genetics interact in this unfortunate situation. My perception is that to be a nerd as a black young boy must be very difficult. Is this true? It is said that within the jewish ashkenazi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenazi_Jews) community, intelligence has been a very important and highly valued trait and thus selected in male partners. Today, this is the most intelligent ethnical group in the world. Maybe black women should value intelligent men more...? But what is valued is highly cultural. This is a gordian knot.

4. Expectations from the society. As a black person, you meet prejudice and low academic expectations. This will negatively affect your academic performance.

NN

[Parker]

-simple point, black children adopted by white family always succeed. -they're nothing more awful than a fat black chick, walking slowly, watching people with a look empty of all intelligence, openly racist, always blaming other people for etc, remember "epic beard man" and these fat chick shouting "kill him".


I'm french and sometine i watch the american show "extrem make over", the stuff about building a new house for poor.
i remember in one show a black family:
 
-unemployed parent because of a "life accident"
-7/8 children
-and all the family spend day sitting on the stair in front of the house like they're waiting for something falling from the sky, no racist quote or disprespect here but it was like watching chimp in the zoo.

men that was like a cliché, but that was real.


and also that stupid black gangsta attitude,  most black people one day decided that looking stupid was their norm, men i hate rap culture, it's shit

Sorry but this is untrue, I've seen some that have not...and we've all seen white kids that haven't succeed. Fact is, Black People are the Canary In the Cave for America, what goes wrong with black people eventually goes wrong with the rest of America. And now you see tons of disenfranchised white males from either single parent, broken homes, or dysfunctional families who are nothing more than wastes of space slackers...who do you think is MMA/Bodybuilding's base...these folk.

Don't generalized like that...the generational aspect is what really is the issue, whether it be white, or black, The Baby Boomer generation has failed their kids. Whether it be black women with picking the wrong men, and thinking that they can raise a kid by themselves, or white parents who play "friends" with their kids and let them talk to them however they want.

The Ganster thing, it wasn't until the late 60's when blacks were in the projects, did black men become "menacing", before it the stereotype was that black men were "yellow" and cowardly, which is why James Jeffries wouldn't fight Jack Johnson---black men can't fight were not worthy opponents (which why they only fought black men basement events, right )

By the 70's when amny blacks had moved from the South to the projects, and  lack of education, jobs, etc, crime flourished, combined that with the Southern attitude of trying to educate one's self is being white, you have the recipe for the "Thug Negro"....and the rest is history...in order to sell "being real" black men have only the option of being thugs...this is the business model. Unfortunately, black people need to learn how to define themselves and not let others define them...are you a Thug or are you a Man? Are you a Whore or are you a Woman?  

Props man, so should there be more Bill Cosby's then??

yes, and he is viewed as a Pariah, and I agree with him, but he is also somewhat out of touch...the main problem is that their is a Generation MisCommunication...you don't criticize Gen. X and Y, because we already have low self esteem, you show us how to do it the right way. You talk to us, not scold us...nobody listens to being scolded. And that is what it seems like Bill Cosby does.

[webcake]

just bribe them with fried chicken and grape drank

[Parker]

just bribe them with fried chicken and grape drank

Grape Drank, mostly a Southern and midwest thing...people around the DC area are too sophisticated for that...

[Per Se]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40095887/ns/us_news-the_new_york_times

 

Some please help me understand this as I'm 31 now and been out of high school too long to understand kids today...
I understand this thread will get negative really quick...I'm not understanding why this is and has been like this for so long...I mean we're talking about freaking high school...
Myself, Parker, G-thang, Dr. Kadje, Benny Blanco (I think), and Bay are all college grads...I cant speak of others because I don't know...This shit makes me sad...I wish there were a simple answer but I'm quite baffled by the numbers...What makes us different from others?


An achievement gap separating black from white students has long been documented — a social divide extremely vexing to policy makers and the target of one blast of school reform after another.

But a new report focusing on black males suggests that the picture is even bleaker than generally known.

Only 12 percent of black fourth-grade boys are proficient in reading, compared with 38 percent of white boys, and only 12 percent of black eighth-grade boys are proficient in math, compared with 44 percent of white boys.

Poverty alone does not seem to explain the differences: poor white boys do just as well as African-American boys who do not live in poverty, measured by whether they qualify for subsidized school lunches.

The data was distilled from highly respected national math and reading tests, known as the National Assessment for Educational Progress, which are given to students in fourth and eighth grades, most recently in 2009. The report, “A Call for Change,” is to be released Tuesday by the Council of the Great City Schools, an advocacy group for urban public schools.

Although the outlines of the problem and many specifics have been previously reported, the group hopes that including so much of what it calls “jaw-dropping data” in one place will spark a new sense of national urgency.

“What this clearly shows is that black males who are not eligible for free and reduced-price lunch are doing no better than white males who are poor,” said Michael Casserly, executive director of the council.

The report shows that black boys on average fall behind from their earliest years. Black mothers have a higher infant mortality rate and black children are twice as likely as whites to live in a home where no parent has a job. In high school, African-American boys drop out at nearly twice the rate of white boys, and their SAT scores are on average 104 points lower. In college, black men represented just 5 percent of students in 2008.

The analysis of results on the national tests found that math scores in 2009 for black boys were not much different than those for black girls in Grades 4 and 8, but black boys lagged behind Hispanics of both sexes, and they fell behind white boys by at least 30 points, a gap sometimes interpreted as three academic grades.

The search for explanations has recently looked at causes besides poverty, and this report may further spur those efforts.

“There’s accumulating evidence that there are racial differences in what kids experience before the first day of kindergarten,” said Ronald Ferguson, director of the Achievement Gap Initiative at Harvard. “They have to do with a lot of sociological and historical forces. In order to address those, we have to be able to have conversations that people are unwilling to have.”

Those include “conversations about early childhood parenting practices,” Dr. Ferguson said. “The activities that parents conduct with their 2-, 3- and 4-year-olds. How much we talk to them, the ways we talk to them, the ways we enforce discipline, the ways we encourage them to think and develop a sense of autonomy.”

The report urges convening a White House conference, encouraging Congress to appropriate more money for schools and establishing networks of black mentors.

What it does not discuss are policy responses identified with a robust school reform movement that emphasizes closing failing schools, offering charter schools as alternatives and raising the quality of teachers.

The report did not go down this road because “there’s not a lot of research to indicate that many of those strategies produce better results,” Mr. Casserly said.

Other have a different response. The key to narrowing the achievement gap, said Dr. Ferguson, is “really good teaching.”

One large urban school district that has made progress is Baltimore’s, where the dropout rate for African-American boys declined to 4.9 percent during the last academic year, down from 11.9 percent three years earlier. Graduation rates for black boys were also up: 57 percent in 2009-10, compared with 51 percent three years earlier.

Andres A. Alonso, the chief executive of the Baltimore City Public Schools, said the improvement had little to do with changes at the margins, like lengthening the school day or adding mentors. Rather, Mr. Alonso cited aggressively closing failing schools, knocking on the doors of dropouts’ homes to lure them back and creating real-time alerts — “almost like an electrical charge” — when a student misses several days of school.

“Hispanic kids and African-American kids this year had a lower dropout rate than white kids,” Mr. Alonso said.

This article, Proficiency of Black Students Is Found to Be Far Lower Than Expected, first appeared in The New York Times.

is this Wiggs guy a Matt C gimmick?

[The Showstoppa]

Grape Drank, mostly a Southern and midwest thing...people around the DC area are too sophisticated for that...

Oh, all uppity drinking your orange drank, huh? 

[Option D]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40095887/ns/us_news-the_new_york_times

 

Some please help me understand this as I'm 31 now and been out of high school too long to understand kids today...
I understand this thread will get negative really quick...I'm not understanding why this is and has been like this for so long...I mean we're talking about freaking high school...
Myself, Parker, G-thang, Dr. Kadje, Benny Blanco (I think), and Bay are all college grads ...I cant speak of others because I don't know...This shit makes me sad...I wish there were a simple answer but I'm quite baffled by the numbers...What makes us different from others?


An achievement gap separating black from white students has long been documented — a social divide extremely vexing to policy makers and the target of one blast of school reform after another.

But a new report focusing on black males suggests that the picture is even bleaker than generally known.

Only 12 percent of black fourth-grade boys are proficient in reading, compared with 38 percent of white boys, and only 12 percent of black eighth-grade boys are proficient in math, compared with 44 percent of white boys.

Poverty alone does not seem to explain the differences: poor white boys do just as well as African-American boys who do not live in poverty, measured by whether they qualify for subsidized school lunches.

The data was distilled from highly respected national math and reading tests, known as the National Assessment for Educational Progress, which are given to students in fourth and eighth grades, most recently in 2009. The report, “A Call for Change,” is to be released Tuesday by the Council of the Great City Schools, an advocacy group for urban public schools.

Although the outlines of the problem and many specifics have been previously reported, the group hopes that including so much of what it calls “jaw-dropping data” in one place will spark a new sense of national urgency.

“What this clearly shows is that black males who are not eligible for free and reduced-price lunch are doing no better than white males who are poor,” said Michael Casserly, executive director of the council.

The report shows that black boys on average fall behind from their earliest years. Black mothers have a higher infant mortality rate and black children are twice as likely as whites to live in a home where no parent has a job. In high school, African-American boys drop out at nearly twice the rate of white boys, and their SAT scores are on average 104 points lower. In college, black men represented just 5 percent of students in 2008.

The analysis of results on the national tests found that math scores in 2009 for black boys were not much different than those for black girls in Grades 4 and 8, but black boys lagged behind Hispanics of both sexes, and they fell behind white boys by at least 30 points, a gap sometimes interpreted as three academic grades.

The search for explanations has recently looked at causes besides poverty, and this report may further spur those efforts.

“There’s accumulating evidence that there are racial differences in what kids experience before the first day of kindergarten,” said Ronald Ferguson, director of the Achievement Gap Initiative at Harvard. “They have to do with a lot of sociological and historical forces. In order to address those, we have to be able to have conversations that people are unwilling to have.”

Those include “conversations about early childhood parenting practices,” Dr. Ferguson said. “The activities that parents conduct with their 2-, 3- and 4-year-olds. How much we talk to them, the ways we talk to them, the ways we enforce discipline, the ways we encourage them to think and develop a sense of autonomy.”

The report urges convening a White House conference, encouraging Congress to appropriate more money for schools and establishing networks of black mentors.

What it does not discuss are policy responses identified with a robust school reform movement that emphasizes closing failing schools, offering charter schools as alternatives and raising the quality of teachers.

The report did not go down this road because “there’s not a lot of research to indicate that many of those strategies produce better results,” Mr. Casserly said.

Other have a different response. The key to narrowing the achievement gap, said Dr. Ferguson, is “really good teaching.”

One large urban school district that has made progress is Baltimore’s, where the dropout rate for African-American boys declined to 4.9 percent during the last academic year, down from 11.9 percent three years earlier. Graduation rates for black boys were also up: 57 percent in 2009-10, compared with 51 percent three years earlier.

Andres A. Alonso, the chief executive of the Baltimore City Public Schools, said the improvement had little to do with changes at the margins, like lengthening the school day or adding mentors. Rather, Mr. Alonso cited aggressively closing failing schools, knocking on the doors of dropouts’ homes to lure them back and creating real-time alerts — “almost like an electrical charge” — when a student misses several days of school.

“Hispanic kids and African-American kids this year had a lower dropout rate than white kids,” Mr. Alonso said.

This article, Proficiency of Black Students Is Found to Be Far Lower Than Expected, first appeared in The New York Times.

Bitch im a college grad too.. Morehouse

[doison]

yes, and he is viewed as a Pariah, and I agree with him, but he is also somewhat out of touch...the main problem is that their is a Generation MisCommunication...you don't criticize Gen. X and Y, because we already have low self esteem, you show us how to do it the right way. You talk to us, not scold us...nobody listens to being scolded. And that is what it seems like Bill Cosby does.

You serious?  
No wonder there is an education "gap."  That's the biggest crock of self-entitled absurdity I've ever heard....seriously, is it always someone else's fault?  

Let me get this straight, an entire culture is based around mocking any peer that "tries" to succeed and then blaming their own lack of success on "the man."  
Then, after one of those "uncle Toms" that actually did succeed grows tired enough of his self-defeating culture to speak out against it.....and the "culture's" response is to say it is his fault that people won't listen.....because he wasn't nice enough?

[The Showstoppa]

Bitch im a college grad too.. Morehouse

Thats right....and Benny Blanco needs to ask for a refund from Phoenix University.....

[Tre]

Public schools, churches, and mainstream media are all complicit in the collective dumbing down of America.

A public that lacks logic, common sense, and reasoning skills will always be subject to the whims of those in power, whom they will willingly place there, often on basis of uninformed emotion.  

Reality.

[spinnis]

Wigglet........all I'm gonna say about this is it is the "black culture" fault.......meaning black heros are the gangsters and rappers and drug dealers.........so young black kids want that, don't want to be Cliff Huxtable........that's too hard, being a piece of shit is easy.

Ive said this a million times and no one gets it

[The Showstoppa]

Ive said this a million times and no one gets it

Yeah, they do.  Anyone, regardless of race, knows it.....now whether they will admit it or not is another thing.  If they do admit it, they run the risk of being put into the sell-out/uncle tom category.....so it's more "street" to just blame others for your own failures, rather than take some responsibility.....and believe me you see it in the low-income whites here too.