history of steroids

[First Blood]

http://www.steroid.com/

History of Steroids
In order to trace the history and development of anabolic steroids from their beginning to their present day form, we first need to look back towards ancient times, when it was known that the testicles were required for both the development and maintenance of male sexual characteristics. In modernity, this concept was further developed, by a scientist named Berthold and his experiments on cockerels done in 1849. He removed the testes from these birds, and they lost several of the characteristics common to the male of their species, including sexual function. So, we knew as early as 1849 that the testicles functioned to promote what we consider to be primary male sexual properties; in other words, they are what "make men into men". Berthold also found that if the testicles were removed and then transplanted to the abdomen, the sexual function of the birds was largely unaffected. When the birds were dissected, it was found that no nervous connections were formed, but a vastly extensive series of capillarization took place. (1) This provided strong evidence that "the testes act upon the blood" (2) and he further concluded that this blood then had a systemic effect on the entire organism. Anabolic Steroid history, therefore, can be truly said to have made its first step with this simple series of experiments.

Later, in 1929 a procedure to produce an extract of potent activity from bull's testicles was attempted, and in 1935 a more purified form of this extract was created. A year later, a scientist named Ruzicka synthesized this compound, testosterone, from cholesterol, as did two other scientists, Butenandt and Hanisch (3). Testosterone was, of course, the first anabolic steroid ever created, and remains the basis for all other derivations we have currently being used in medicine today. Testosterone was then used in 1936, in an experiment demonstrating that nitrogen excretion of the castrated dog could be increased by giving the dog supplemental testosterone, and this would increase its body weight. (4) Shortly after this time, the Nazi´s were rumored to have given their soldiers anabolic steroids, but that rumor seems to be largely undocumented. Later, further experiments were carried out in men, of course showing that testosterone was a potent anabolic substance in humans. Later, between the years of 1948 and 1954, the pharmaceutical firms Searle and Ciba had experimented with the synthesizing of over a thousand different testosterone derivatives and similar analogues (15).

The story of steroids in athletics is now about to begin:
In 1954, a physician named John Ziegler attended the World Weightlifting Championships in Vienna, Austria, as the team's doctor. The Soviets dominated the competition that year, easily breaking several world records and winning gold medals in legions of weight classes. According to anecdotal reports, Ziegler invited the Soviet´s team doctor to a bar and the doctor told him that that his lifters had used testosterone injections as part of their training programs. Whether that story is true or not, ultimately, the Americans returned from the World Championships that year and immediately began their efforts to defeat the Soviets using pharmaceutical enhancement.

As you may have expected, when they returned to the United States, the team doctor began administering straight testosterone to his weightlifters. He also got involved with Ciba, the large pharmaceutical firm, and attempted to synthesize a substance with strength enhancing effects comparable or better than testosterone's. In 1956, Methandrostenolone was created, and given the name "Dianabol".

In the following years, little pink Dianabol tablets found their way into many weightlifter´s training program, fast forward a few years, and in the early 1960s, there was a clear gap between Ziegler´s weightlifters and the rest of the country, and much less of one between them and the Soviets. It was also in the 1960´s that another anabolic steroid had been developed and used to treat short stature in children with Turner Disease syndrome (13)

At this time, physicians around the United States began to take notice of steroids, and numerous studies were performed on athletes taking them, in an effort to stem the tide of athletes attempting to obtain steroids for use in sports. The early studies on steroids clearly showed that anabolic steroids offered no athletic benefit whatsoever, but in retrospect can be said to have several design flaws. The first issue with those studies, and the most glaring one was that the doses were usually very low, too low to really produce much of an effect at all. In addition, it was neither common for these studies to not be double blind nor to be randomized. A double blind study is one where neither the scientists nor the subjects of the study know if they are getting a real medication or a placebo. A randomized study is where the real medicine is randomly dispersed throughout the test group. Finally, in those early studies, nutrition and exercise was not really controlled or standardized. Not long after those flawed studies were concluded, the Physicians Desk Reference boldly (and wrongly) claimed that anabolic steroids were not useful in enhancing athletic performance. Despite this, in 1967, the International Olympic Council banned the use of anabolic steroids and by the mid 1970´s most major sporting organizations had also banned them.

Steroids in Olympics
Just prior to the ban on steroids in the Olympics, the German Democratic Republic (GDR) began a program with the goals of synthesizing new anabolic steroids for their athletes to use in various sports. Their body of research remains the most extensive collection of information on the use of steroids in athletes ever complied (5). Despite the small size of their country, they managed to consistently dominate the top ranks of various sports, competing with both the United States and the Soviet Union for total medals in both the Olympics and various World Championships. In 1972, the IOC began a full scale drug-testing program (.

By 1982, the International Olympic Council had developed a test for the detection of excess levels of testosterone in athletes, known as the "Testosterone: Epitestosterone test". In this test, levels of testosterone vs/ epitestosterone are measured, and if the testosterone level is 6x that of the epitestosterone level, it can safely be concluded that some form of testosterone has been used by the athlete. This is because testosterone is commonly no more than 6x the natural level of epitestosterone found naturally in the body. Thus, if there were more than that ratio, it was not naturally occurring, in all probability. The IOC was, as usual, one step behind the athletes. The GDR had already done a study on their athletes using a form of testosterone which would leave the body quickly, and thus they would be ready for the IOC test within three days of their last injection (6). They then developed a protocol to allow their athletes to continue steroid use, ceasing it only long enough to pass the drug test. In addition, the German firm Jenapharm, who had been supplying the government with steroids for their athletes, developed an epitestosterone product to administer to athletes to bring the ratio back to normal without discontinuing steroid use (5).

Their doping methods were so advanced, however, that they remained undetected for many years, until late 1989 when information was leaked to the western media about a government sponsored program of systematic anabolic steroid administration and concealment. Eventually, in the early 1990´s, the Germans had finally gotten caught, and the ensuing scandal was one which helped give anabolic steroids the bad reputation they have had ever since. Ironically, it was also in the early 1990´s that anabolic steroids had started to be used by the medical community to improve survival rates of AIDS and Cancer patients, when it was discovered that loss of lean body mass was associated with increased mortality rates respective to those diseases (14).

A similar story was being played out in the United States at about that same time. Before 1988, steroids were only prescription drugs, as classified by by the FDA (Food and Drug Administration). FDA determines which drugs will be classified as over-the-counter versus those which will only be available through prescription. At this time, the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act, was invoked to restrict the access of steroids, making them available only by prescription. They were still not controlled substances at this time, however.

A "Controlled substance" is one that is more firmly regulated than uncontrolled prescription drugs. As an example, contact lenses can only be legally purchased with a prescription, but they are not &qont;rolled" per se. This stricter control of steroids created a vastly more intense examination of the doctors prescribing them; and of course, more harsh penalties for wrongful dispensing. 1988 also marked the passage of the Anti-Drug Abuse Act, which put steroids in a totally different prescription category, one that stipulated very severe legal penalties for illegal sale or possession with intent to distribute. Now, steroid possession and/or distribution was considered a felony. Next, the United States Congress added steroids to the Controlled Substances Act as an amendment known as the Anabolic Steroid Control Act of 1990. Steroids were now placed in "Schedule III" classification, along with amphetamines, methamphetamines, opium, and morphine, and carrying the same penalties for buying or selling them. This legislation and classification was passed without the support of the American Medical Association, the FDA, the DEA, and the National Institute on Drug Abuse, all of whom actually protested the federal and state lIn the early part of the new millennium, steroids have again been pushed to the forefront of the news by the introduction of "prohormones" which were first developed and marketed by Patrick Arnold. It is at this point that the history of steroids in baseball begins to become more prominent; this is in all probability because Major League Baseball had no steroid testing program in effect during this time. During his epic quest to break Roger Maris´ home-run record, Mark Maguire was spotted by a reporter to have had a bottle of Androstendione in his locker. Although androstendione is not a steroid, and is simply a prohormone, the word /spanym-buyer, as did demand& and unfortunately, the prevalence of fake or counterfeit steroids.

Steroids remained in the media, occasionally making an appearance when an athlete tested positive, or admitted using them, but for another decade, they remained uncharacteristically out of the medias attention.

In the early part of the new millennium, steroids have again been pushed to the forefront of the news by the introduction of prohormones which were first developed and marketed by Patrick Arnold. It is at this point that the history of steroids in baseball begins to become more prominent; this is in all probability because Major League Baseball had no steroid testing program in effect during this time. During his epic quest to break Roger Maris home-run record, Mark Maguire was spotted by a reporter to have had a bottle of Androstendione in his locker. Although androstendione is not a steroid, and is simply a prohormone, the word steroid was again found circulating in the news on a nightly basis.

Not shortly after Roger Maris record was broken, another baseball player, Jason Giambi and various other athletes were either suspected of, or proven to have, taken anabolic steroids. Again, Congress convened a hearing, and just as they did the first time in 1990, they did not determine that steroids were a danger, but rather that the danger was more in protecting professional sports organizations. The updated statute has been updated to proscribe pro-hormones also The definition of an anabolic steroid as defined currently in the United States under (41)(A) is that "anabolic steroid" means any drug or hormonal substance, chemically and pharmacologically related to testosterone (other than estrogens, progestins, corticosteroids, and dehydroepiandrosterone (7).

Currently, steroid use is far from declining. Among 12th graders surveyed in 2000, 2.5% reported using steroids at least once in their lives, while in 2004 the number was 3.4% (9). A recent internet study also concluded that anabolic steroid use among weightlifters and bodybuilders continues (12), and by all accounts, there are no signs of it stopping in athletics any time soon.

In addition, the legitimate use of anabolic steroids for a variety of medical problems also continues, ranging from the treatment of Andropause or Menopause, and ranging from speeding the recovery in burn victims to helping improve quality of life in Aids patients, to helping fight breast cancer and stave off osteoporosis.

Thus, the history of anabolic steroids is not something that has already occurred and been written, but rather it is a continuing history being written every day by scientists, lawmakers, doctors and of course, athletes.

References
Maisel AQ. The Hormone Quest (1965) Random House
Kochakian CD. J Nutr (1935) 23 135
Kenyon AT et al. Endocrinology (1938) 23 135
Kochakian CD. Handbook Exp Pharmacol (1975) 43 1
Clinical Chemistry. 43, No7, 1997.
Clausnitzer, et al [Article in German] 1982.
United States Congressional records.
Vet Hum Toxicol. 2003 Mar;45(2):97-102.
United States Bureau of Statistics, 2005.
National Institute on Drug Abuse
United States Drug Enforcement Agency
Clin J Sport Med. 2005 Sep;15(5):326-30.
Marti Henneberg, C, et al. J. Pediatr 6;783-88. 1975.
Journal of the American Medical Association, Editorial. April 14, 1999, vol 281, No. 14.
Steroids. 1996 Aug;61(:492-503.

[Stark]

cliffhangers:

Steroids are just the finishing touch - Robert Cicherillo

[First Blood]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anabolic_steroid

History

Isolation of gonadal AAS
 
Chemical structure of the natural anabolic hormone testosterone, 17β-hydroxy-4-androsten-3-oneThe use of gonadal steroids pre-dates their identification and isolation. Medical use of testicle extract began in the late 19th century while its effects on strength were still being studied.[5] The isolation of gonadal steroids can be traced back to 1931 when Adolf Butenandt, a chemist in Marburg, purified 15 milligrams of the male hormone androstenone from tens of thousands of litres of urine. This steroid was subsequently synthesized in 1934 by Leopold Ruzicka, a chemist in Zurich.[6]

In the 1930s it was already known that the testes contained a more powerful androgen than androstenone, and three groups of scientists, funded by competing pharmaceutical companies in the Netherlands, Nazi Germany and Switzerland, raced to isolate it.[6][7] This hormone was first identified by Karoly Gyula David, E. Dingemanse, J. Freud and Ernst Laqueur in a May 1935 paper "On Crystalline Male Hormone from Testicles (Testosterone)."[8] They named the hormone testosterone, from the stems of testicle and sterol, and the suffix of ketone. The chemical synthesis of testosterone was achieved in August that year, when Butenandt and G. Hanisch published a paper describing "A Method for Preparing Testosterone from Cholesterol."[9] Only a week later, the third group, Ruzicka and A. Wettstein, announced a patent application in a paper "On the Artificial Preparation of the Testicular Hormone Testosterone (Androsten-3-one-17-ol)."[10] Ruzicka and Butenandt were offered the 1939 Nobel Prize in Chemistry for their work, but the Nazi government forced Butenandt to decline the honor, although he accepted the prize after the end of World War II.[6][7]

Clinical trials on humans, involving either oral doses of methyltestosterone or injections of testosterone propionate, began as early as 1937.[6] Testosterone propionate is mentioned in a letter to the editor of Strength and Health magazine in 1938; this is the earliest known reference to an anabolic steroid in a U.S. weightlifting or bodybuilding magazine.[6] There are often reported rumors that German soldiers were administered anabolic steroids during the Second World War, the aim being to increase their aggression and stamina, but these are, as yet, unproven.[11] Adolf Hitler himself, according to his physician, was injected with testosterone derivatives to treat various ailments.[12] AAS were used in experiments conducted by the Nazis on concentration camp inmates,[12] and later by the allies attempting to treat the malnourished victims that survived Nazi camps.[11]

Development of synthetic AAS
 
Chemical structure of the synthetic steroid Methandrostenolone (Dianabol). 17α-methylation (upper right corner) enhances oral bioavailability.The development of muscle-building properties of testosterone was pursued in the 1940s, in the Soviet Union and in Eastern Bloc countries such as East Germany, where steroid programs were used to enhance the performance of Olympic and other amateur weight lifters. In response to the success of Russian weightlifters, the U.S. Olympic Team physician Dr. John Ziegler worked with synthetic chemists to develop an anabolic steroid with reduced androgenic effects.[13] Ziegler's work resulted in the production of methandrostenolone, which Ciba Pharmaceuticals marketed as Dianabol. The new steroid was approved for use in the U.S. by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) in 1958. It was most commonly administered to burn victims and the elderly. The drug's off-label users were mostly bodybuilders and weight lifters. Although Ziegler prescribed only small doses to athletes, he soon discovered that those who abused Dianabol suffered from enlarged prostates and atrophied testes.[14] AAS were placed on the list of banned substances of the IOC in 1976, and a decade later the committee introduced 'out-of-competition' doping tests because many athletes used AAS in their training period rather than during competition.[3]

Three major ideas governed modifications of testosterone into a multitude of AAS: alkylation at 17-alpha position with methyl or ethyl group created orally active compounds because it slows the degradation of the drug by the liver, esterification of testosterone and nortestosterone at the 17-beta position allows the substance to be administered parenterally and increases the duration of effectiveness because agents soluble in oily liquids may be present in the body for several months, and finally alterations of the ring structure were applied for both oral and parenteral agents to seeking to obtain different anabolic to androgenic effect ratios.[15]

[Spike]

cliffhangers:

Steroids are just the finishing touch - Robert Cicherillo

sometimes you get the elevator
sometimes you get the shaft

[andreisdaman]

Very nice research...informative!!!...very good job!

[che]

Very nice research...informative!!!...very good job!

Outed

[First Blood]

Very nice research...informative!!!...very good job!

 ...I know...not really much research..but will try to add some more stuff later.

[timfogarty]

testosterone propionate is mentioned by name in a 1938 letter to the editor in Strength and Health

[andreisdaman]

Outed

outed as what???

[Stark]

outed as what???

You aren't from around here are you boy?

[First Blood]

testosterone propionate is mentioned by name in a 1938 letter to the editor in Strength and Health

yes I know I recently read a study where that was mentioned. 

to me it seems very likely that bodybuilders experimented with drugs in the 40s. It's often said that bodybuilders really started experimenting in the mid 50s (and then it really took of in the early 60s) but there were special health clinics already in the 40s were you could get testosterone.

[stuntmovie]

?there were special health clinics already in the 40s were you could get testosterone."

First Blood, I'm certainly not an expert on this subject, but I do seem to recall that those clinics you mentioned above were more accurately referred to as European health spas for very wealthy clients who wanted to maintain a youthful apperance with no thought of 'bodybuilding' in mind.

In fact the term 'bodybuilding' was relatively unknown back then.

The Hollywood motion picture studios would send their top stars to these spas sor various 'treatments' so that they could continue to look appealing to their movie going fans.

Today .... plastic surgery is the substitute.

[gh15]

?there were special health clinics already in the 40s were you could get testosterone."

First Blood, I'm certainly not an expert on this subject, but I do seem to recall that those clinics you mentioned above were more accurately referred to as European health spas for very wealthy clients who wanted to maintain a youthful apperance with no thought of 'bodybuilding' in mind.

In fact the term 'bodybuilding' was relatively unknown back then.

The Hollywood motion picture studios would send their top stars to these spas sor various 'treatments' so that they could continue to look appealing to their movie going fans.

Today .... plastic surgery is the substitute.

and it was brought back to usa,,and usa was the center of the universe back then ,,and thats how reeves the fucken liar used it,,like many others,,same as bodybuildr todsay use gh in the 10s of units and tell you he use 3 because he is poor,,

LIARS LIARS LIARS ,,THATS THE ONLY THING CONSISTANT ABOUT A BODYBILDER,,me included i say manytime i do gh only 3 week in when im already 10 week in,,etc etc,,cult of liars!

gh15 approved

[stuntmovie]

AND .... Unlike many others on this board, I find it difficult to believe that bodybuilders used roids as early as the 1940's. I have never heard that roids were in use in the 40's from an accurate source.

Sorry bout that, GH.

It is my personal belief that various top-flight movie stars were 'administered' roids for youth enhancement purposes in the so called European spas during the 30's/40's and possibly even earlier, but 'bodybuilders' themselves did not get involved in aas use until the late 50's.

I have no stats, facts, or figures to back me up, but I lived through those days and knew the lifting game well enough to believe I'm correct.

And the above does pertain to the bodybuilding crowd only as the 'competitive lifting athletes' have a completely different story to tell.

[gh15]

AND .... Unlike many others on this board, I find it difficult to believe that bodybuilders used roids as early as the 1940's. I have never heard that roids were in use in the 40's from an accurate source.

Sorry bout that, GH.

It is my personal belief that various top-flight movie stars were 'administered' roids for youth enhancement purposes in the so called European spas during the 30's/40's and possibly even earlier, but 'bodybuilders' themselves did not get involved in aas use until the late 50's.

I have no stats, facts, or figures to back me up, but I lived through those days and knew the lifting game well enough to believe I'm correct.

And the above does pertain to the bodybuilding crowd only as the 'competitive lifting athletes' have a completely different story to tell.

they were,,as i say i aleays say truth about hormone,,i said here yesterday or few days back that gh was not used until 80s unlike someone who said it was used in 70s ,,so i dont always say drug drug ,,but steroids were there in the form of testosterone since 30s since hitler time

gh15 approved

[gh15]

also competive lifting ,,and bodybuilding ,,all related,,the term bodybuilding is and was like big HUH to the public,,even today they dont know much they think in term of arnold and big muscle but to them big bloofy is still buf and muscular,,you put shirt on you and have some weight and some broad shoulder and they think you bodybuilder,,so the public knwo nothing,,

second,,it all interacts,,like combat pilot and comerical pilot,,they both diff pilot but! they both still pilot,,they fly airplane,,they know how to fly it and what need to be done,,

the problem is that back in day the liars were few,,and they could hide it veryu well because betty sue from mid texas didnt care about it,,she cared about raising her 5 kids and putting food on table,,so back then lie was easy,,NOW DAY when goverment is in your ass in americana and police state,,lie become a lot bigger,, alot more liar,,and alot more ways to get same results,,human are smart my friend

gh15 approved

[DK II]

testosterone propionate is mentioned by name in a 1938 letter to the editor in Strength and Health

And there goes the myth of natural bodybuilders.... LOL!

[stuntmovie]

GH, Thanks for your input  but I have to disagree with you in part.

My main disagreement with your recent response is your referral to bodybuilders back in those days as 'liers',

Back then there was no reason to lie no matter what drug you used. No federal agency was after your ass back then and some guys would even inject themselves in plain sight after or before a workout.

The only 'lieing' that was going on was an attempt at preventing your opponents from finding out what really worked .... be it drugs or training methods.

No one who used roids lied about using them, but they would lie about which ones to use or which combinations worked best.

The 'lieing' actually started once roid use became illegal, but not before.

On the other hand, it was not a common occurence to go around town  bragging about using roids. And the quantity used back then by any one individual is miniscule compared to day.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that generally a person's use of roids back then was nowhere as secretive as it is today and persons who are today accused of using roids back then would most likely have stated they used them when they were legal back then.

Sorry! Too many "back thens".

[Tapeworm]

Sorry! Too many "back thens".

No way.  Good post, Stunt. 

[DK II]

GH, Thanks for your input  but I have to disagree with you in part.

My main disagreement with your recent response is your referral to bodybuilders back in those days as 'liers',

Back then there was no reason to lie no matter what drug you used. No federal agency was after your ass back then and some guys would even inject themselves in plain sight after or before a workout.

The only 'lieing' that was going on was an attempt at preventing your opponents from finding out what really worked .... be it drugs or training methods.

No one who used roids lied about using them, but they would lie about which ones to use or which combinations worked best.

The 'lieing' actually started once roid use became illegal, but not before.

On the other hand, it was not a common occurence to go around town  bragging about using roids. And the quantity used back then by any one individual is miniscule compared to day.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that generally a person's use of roids back then was nowhere as secretive as it is today and persons who are today accused of using roids back then would most likely have stated they used them when they were legal back then.

Sorry! Too many "back thens".

good post.

[biff]

GH, Thanks for your input  but I have to disagree with you in part.

My main disagreement with your recent response is your referral to bodybuilders back in those days as 'liers',

Back then there was no reason to lie no matter what drug you used. No federal agency was after your ass back then and some guys would even inject themselves in plain sight after or before a workout.

The only 'lieing' that was going on was an attempt at preventing your opponents from finding out what really worked .... be it drugs or training methods.

No one who used roids lied about using them, but they would lie about which ones to use or which combinations worked best.

The 'lieing' actually started once roid use became illegal, but not before.

On the other hand, it was not a common occurence to go around town  bragging about using roids. And the quantity used back then by any one individual is miniscule compared to day.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that generally a person's use of roids back then was nowhere as secretive as it is today and persons who are today accused of using roids back then would most likely have stated they used them when they were legal back then.

Sorry! Too many "back thens".

you may well be correct in your assessment.
but you're forgetting the 'machismo' factor.

many guys dont want people to think they need any assistance to achieve the body they have, some will even lie about how much they really work out, how they eat, etc.  lying and saying 'ah i dont NEED any of that shit (steroids)' isnt so far fetched, especially if you are someone whose success depends on being seen as manly.

[gh15]

you may well be correct in your assessment.
but you're forgetting the 'machismo' factor.

many guys dont want people to think they need any assistance to achieve the body they have, some will even lie about how much they really work out, how they eat, etc.  lying and saying 'ah i dont NEED any of that shit (steroids)' isnt so far fetched, especially if you are someone whose success depends on being seen as manly.

same as the 197lb average loser in americana that walk around 8% at 5'10 with muscle popping out of his ears while claimiming to be natural,,why? because he is good friend and never do drugs,,why? because he is known you from kindergarten so he say truth,,why because drugs are for homo bodybuilder and not for good guys,,why? because he drink and party too m,uchn and 22 and have marvelous genetics and dont need to eat at all just sit and drink and have 190lb at 6% by nature,,THOSE ARE THE LIES THOSE FELLA KIDS OF GENERATION NOTHINGNESS SPIT,,it was like that in past too,,but today way worse,,and many believe them both then and now,,now a lot less because then was no gh15 around,,but even now quite few believe especially goolible males and the whores who only care about malls and party party and malls and drinking ofcourse,,

the worst liars are the ones in the arm forces in americana ,,soldier,,police,,etc

only in americana you can have a 22 year old walking 200lb 5'10 mid single digits 19 incher arms and claim all natural,,ONLY IN AMERICANA! and they lie to your face with out even blinking,,they usually keep very quiet like croach when it coe to real life ,,but juice is coming out of their head with any movement they make,,they LIVE FOR A SHOW,,ofcourse never compete


gh15 approved

[timfogarty]

I've stated this before and have gotten grief for it, but I believe that Grimek was the very first Mr America to use steroids.  (He was also the very first AAU Mr America, the two prev contests were not AAU).  His physique was so beyond anyone else at the time.  Yet it's no different than any light juicer of the last 50 years.   It's clear that the people of Strength and Health knew about testosterone esters at that time, since they're mentioned in their magazine.  And Grimek was one of the people at Strength and Health.

Why was Grimek's physique so beyond anyone at that time?  Either he had a biological advantage (super genes or a medical condition such as acromegaly) or he had knowledge that the others didn't have.  His genetics don't look out of the ordinary from today's perspective, and there were no signs of a medical condition throughout the rest of his life.  

So that means he had some knowledge that others didn't have.  his nutrition and training was well publicized in the mags.  So what else could it be?

I've also mentioned before the stories of both George Eiferman and Jack Delinger in the summers before their Mr America wins in 1948 and 1949, both already national level bodybuilders, going out to Yarik's Gym in Oakland for the summer and coming back 30-40 pounds heavier.  Circumstantial evidences, but still cannot be casually dismissed.

[stuntmovie]

Thanks, Tim! I like the way you state it. The use of roids by Grimek, Eifferman, Dillinger, and the rest could have definitely been a possibility, but you refrain from stating that it was a definite fact.

Anything is possible but I was pretty involved in those days and I didn't walk around with my eyes wide shut.

I respect your humble attitude and honest opinion.

For some unknown reason I tend to agree with your idea that Grimek used 'enhancements' when he was at his peak. I say that because I have an acquaintence who worked for Mr Hoffman in York, Pa a long while back and although I had no interest about it at that time, he mentioned those days frequently and York's strong desire to maintain their great Olympic Lifting team.

And, of course, you know where that can lead!

I'm in the process of attempting to contact him at present to see if he would be willing to talk about those days so that I can post it on this board. If I do manage to do so, you'll definitely get the fact without the inherent bullshit.

Bifff, I can't disagree with but I still stand by my original post regarding use of roids before they became illegal. (See above someplace!)

..... And in addition to the fact that roids are presently illegal, many people 'lie' simply because it's none of your damn business!  
 
It's almost like me asking you, "Do you wirpe your ass with your right hand or your left?". Bad example but I think you get the idea.

Respectfully submitted of course ..... Stunt

BTW .... I knew George Eifferman well. He presented me with an award of sorts which I proudly accepted and was more thrilled by what his wife told me after that presentation .... more on that later.

I also had the opportunity to meet Jack Dillinger and sit and talk with him for a couple of hours at some metal shop in the East Bay area. He was immobile due to a full cast on his leg which he broke while falling off a bar-stool. An honest story from an honest and thirsty man.

Writting these last few paragraphs as a self reminder to talk about it/them later..... Mallard Williamson, MLO, Hanging by the neck, young Eddy Corney, John Corvello, Wayne Bouvier, Bill's Pasadena Gym, Rory as a teen age barber in the gym, Ralph Countryman, Arti Zeller, Gene Mozee, Solo El Fenzi, Bob Birdsong,
the Docs, Zuvers, Curt Freeman, Pat Casey. Bill March, Bill Stathis, Mel Knoll, Reeves gets punched, etc...

Doing my best to exclude any untested rumors or profound bullshit, but ya gotta excuse me if I fook up with the dates and some locations.

All the above in the late 50's/early 60's.  And more to come if anyone is still interested.

[timfogarty]

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