What is "Progressive Overload"?

[Jaime]

I'm a true natural bodybuilder,  I gained about 35-40 lbs of muscle ( over 10 years ) basically lifting the same amount of weight because my weak joints (specially shoulders).

Thing is Che, 99% of people that talk about natural training have no first hand experience of it over an extended period of time, or any training at all... Personal trainer syndrome.

I think that if you keep working a muscle and breaking it down, that it stimulates growth. There may be an argument that it is not as efficient without clear progressive resistance, but it works.

[dj181]

How does it work without progressive overload? If the key was just to "pump" the muscles and break them down, then marathon runners should have big legs, which they don't have.

[Jaime]

How does it work without progressive overload? If the key was just to "pump" the muscles and break them down, then marathon runners should have big legs, which they don't have.

Marathon runners tax their systems to complete exhaustion, there is also zero restistance being utilized. Everybody knows that cardio is catabolic.

Gymnast might be a better example.

[dj181]

Good point, but how many gymnasts continue to get bigger and bigger muscles, after their initial growth from their gymnastic exercises?

[che]

Thing is Che, 99% of people that talk about natural training have no first hand experience of it over an extended period of time, or any training at all... Personal trainer syndrome.

I think that if you keep working a muscle and breaking it down, that it stimulates growth. There may be an argument that it is not as efficient without clear progressive resistance, but it works.

Exactly .

[Jaime]

Good point, but how many gymnasts continue to get bigger and bigger muscles, after their initial growth from their gymnastic exercises?

I think it depends on their genetics, some of them are pretty jacked, very good builds. They do weight train though.

I like to train heavy, but i think there are a lot of examples of not having to keep pushing the weight up still being effective.

Once you hit your natural plateau, no ammount of different training methods is going to push you beyond that point, only drugs.

[che]

Good point, but how many gymnasts continue to get bigger and bigger muscles, after their initial growth from their gymnastic exercises?

If gymnasts eat to get bigger they would get bigger  ,for a natural bodybuilder food /diet is more important than training ,I would say 70% to 30 %.

[dj181]

Sorry my man, but I have to disagree with you there. All "eating more" did for me was make me a fat pig.

[che]

Sorry my man, but I have to disagree with you there. All "eating more" did for me was make me a fat pig.

You need  to  not only eat the right foods, but the right amount of foods,  for natural bodybuilders gains come really slow if you aren't patient natural bodybuilding isn't for you my friend .

[dj181]

I'm just curious about something here, as far as "slow gains" are concerned... What do you think about Mike Mentzer's claims that he would regularly have clients gain 20 to 30 pounds in 3 to 4 months? Was he speaking BS? Remember, he said regularly, not occasionally.

[che]

I'm just curious about something here, as far as "slow gains" are concerned... What do you think about Mike Mentzer's claims that he would regularly have clients gain 20 to 30 pounds in 3 to 4 months? Was he speaking BS? Remember, he said regularly, not occasionally.

20-30lbs of muscle impossible , 20-30lbs of muscles and fat (mostly fat )very possible

[MB]

Once you hit your natural plateau, no ammount of different training methods is going to push you beyond that point, only drugs.

This is true.  Once you hit your natural plateau, you have to be smart about things.  We only have so many sets and reps in our bodies before things start to break down.  It makes sense to decrease the training volume and develop a strength maintenance program from there.  

[First Blood]

I'm a true natural bodybuilder,  I gained about 35-40 lbs of muscle ( over 10 years ) basically lifting the same amount of weight because my weak joints (specially shoulders).

then you are some kind of exception because most people will look exactly the same if their poundages stay the same. nothing will happen after a while. when did you start training? as a teenager?

this has also been confirmed by research (progressive increase of tension on the muscle being the primary growth stimulus).

[First Blood]

Once you hit your natural plateau, no ammount of different training methods is going to push you beyond that point, only drugs.

but that does not disprove the fact that you need to grow stronger inorder to grow. you can get stronger without growing (via neural factors) but you won't grow unless there is some kind of progressive overload.

[tbombz]

but that does not disprove the fact that you need to grow stronger inorder to grow. you can get stronger without growing (via neural factors) but you won't grow unless there is some kind of progressive overload.

yaaaaaaaa buddy


My workout today:


Bench
Empty bar x 10
135 x 10
225 x5
365 x 1
365 x 1
385 x 1
365 x 1
225 x 15
135 x 10


Dumbbell laterals
20lbrs x 10
45lbrs x 10
70lbrs x 10
70lbrs x 8
70lbrs x 8
45lbrs x 10
20lbrs x 15
10 lbrs x 20

Tricep single arm db overhead xtensions
20lbrs x 10
40lbrs x 10
40lbrs x 10
40lbrs x 10
20lbrs x 15

Db curls
20lbs x 2 x 20
45lbs x 10
70lbs x 10
70lbs x 8
70lbs x 6
45lbs x 10
20 lbs x 20

Finish up with a giant set, cycling through these exercises 3 times:
Push ups with feet elevated x 15
Db press 80lbs, 90lbs, 60lbs, x 10
Tricep pushdowns x 15
Db curls 30lbs x 10
Sit ups on a decline bench x 15

[che]

people will look exactly the same if their poundages stay the same.

I started lifting weights when I was a 18yo , e.g., I've never benched more than 225Lbs  I did  change #of reps,rest time between sets ,supersets ,# of exercises......etc   but poundages stayed the same for years .

[dj181]

Well, if you have perform more reps with the same weight, then you have applied progressive overload. So are you saying that you have never ever increased the weight on any of your exercises?

[Ursus]

yaaaaaaaa buddy


My workout today:


Bench
Empty bar x 10
135 x 10
225 x5
365 x 1
365 x 1
385 x 1
365 x 1
225 x 15
135 x 10


Dumbbell laterals
20lbrs x 10
45lbrs x 10
70lbrs x 10
70lbrs x 8
70lbrs x 8
45lbrs x 10
20lbrs x 15
10 lbrs x 20

Tricep single arm db overhead xtensions
20lbrs x 10
40lbrs x 10
40lbrs x 10
40lbrs x 10
20lbrs x 15

Db curls
20lbs x 2 x 20
45lbs x 10
70lbs x 10
70lbs x 8
70lbs x 6
45lbs x 10
20 lbs x 20

Finish up with a giant set, cycling through these exercises 3 times:
Push ups with feet elevated x 15
Db press 80lbs, 90lbs, 60lbs, x 10
Tricep pushdowns x 15
Db curls 30lbs x 10
Sit ups on a decline bench x 15

That looks a horrible workout man. Not hating.

[dj181]

Fuck isolation moves and stick with the basic compound movements. Benches, squats, deads, rows, dips, chins.

[tbombz]

That looks a horrible workout man. Not hating.

LoL.

It is working very well for me. Both gaining size and gaining strength better than ever.  I warm up thoroughly, then jump up to a max weight. Do 3-4 sets stopping one or two rep shy of failure, resting at least 3-5 mins between each set. After doing the heavy work I cut the weight in half and rep it out until it starts to burn. Cut the weight in half again, to a very light weight, and rep that out till it burns.  Then I'm done with that body part. Although I usually do a few more real light sets throughout my workout just to keep the muscle pumped.  I train each half my body each day, 2 days on 1 day off. Everything gets hit every three days.

Been making noticeable gains every workout.

[YoungBlood]

There can be many things that factor into the definition of "progressive overload." Deduce the phrase and it's "not rocket surgery." Progressive=continuing progress, overload=more than (in this case) muscle can withstand.

The key is in time under tension (tut). Different loads can be applied with TUT and depending on the time applied and the muscle, a variety of results can be the result.

Hamstrings like heavy loads, emphasis on both the negative and positive of the lift. The quads respond to both high and low reps. But the soleus muscle doesn't really respond to heavy weight and low reps, though as a variation it can be fun, just not a principle to always be adhered to.

From lifting a 225# load in the bench press using a 311 tempo for 10 reps you will get a very different response from your chest than doing 6 reps with a slow rep scheme of 224.

There's also genetics, things you can't change; fiber type, length of limbs/muscle insertions or how well your body responds to protein/carbs/drugs etc...

Boiled down, progressive overload can be cut into many different ways and you can lift a relatively similar amount of weight for a long time and continue to make gains.

[tbombz]

Sure, you can make gains by increasing reps and/or decreasing rest between sets. But not noticeable gains. Think of all the bodybuilders out there who juice, eat a ton, and train HARD... But they never look any different. They might gain a few lbs A year, but that is completely unnoticeable to anyone but their own eyes. If you want to make real gains, the kind of gains where everyone tells you that you look bigger, the kind of gains that are noticeable even in a sweater and jacket...then you need to lift more weight, not just do more reps and decrease rest between sets. Now, if you take your max weight,and increase reps to 8, then you will see great gains. But when your talking about using a weight you can rep 10 or more times, and using that weight for months on end, just trying to get more reps and decrease rest between sets, then you aren't going to be growing, you'll just be maintaining what you've already got.

[The Abdominal Snoman]

"Progressive Overload"

Sounds like Onlyme put an ad in the paper looking for guys to join his band

[lesaucer]

''progressive overload''= little balloonie wanna be guru words for: busting your ass in the gym to failure, doing all reps range, low-medium-high. nothing complicated about this.

[haider]

''progressive overload''= little balloonie wanna be guru words for: busting your ass in the gym to failure, doing all reps range, low-medium-high. nothing complicated about this.

no.