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Author Topic: Earth’s Magnetic Pole Srews Up Runway At Florida Airport  (Read 833 times)
SAMSON123
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« on: January 07, 2011, 09:58:23 PM »

Magnetic pole shifting was considered a non issue a minute ago now the scientist are admitting it is very real and can be dangerous if not addressed

Earth’s magnetic pole shifts, screws up runway at Florida airport
By Liz Goodwin



 By Liz Goodwin liz Goodwin – Fri Jan 7, 4:45 pm ET



An airport in Tampa, Florida, has had to temporarily close its runways to keep up with Earth's magnetic north pole, which is drifting toward Russia at a rate of 40 miles per year.

Fox News reports that the international airport was forced to adjust the signs on its busiest runway Thursday because pilots depend on the magnetic fields to navigate. The runway will be closed until Jan. 13, and will re-open with new taxiway signs that indicate its new location on aviation charts, the Tampa Bay Tribune reports.

Paul Takemoto, a spokesman for the FAA, says the Earth's magnetic fields are constantly in flux -- but rarely so much so that runway signage needs to be changed. "You want to be absolutely precise in your compass heading," he told Fox. "To make sure the precision is there that we need, you have to make these changes."

"The Earth's poles are changing constantly, and when they change more than three degrees, that can affect runway numbering," FAA spokesperson Kathleen Bergen told Fox News. It's unclear whether any other airports will have to adjust their runways.

Earth's magnetic field, which still flummoxes those who study it, "is thought to be generated deep inside the planet," LiveScience writer Jeanna Bryner explains. "An inner core of solid iron is surrounded by an outer core of molten iron. They rotate at different rates, and the interaction between the regions creates what scientists call a 'hydromagnetic dynamo.' It's something like an electric motor, and it generates a magnetic field akin to a giant bar magnet."

Sometimes, the poles completely flip -- and presumably when that happens, many bigger changes are afoot than modest tweaks to airport signs. The last time the planet experienced a polarity flip was 780,000 years ago.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_thelookout/20110107/sc_yblog_thelookout/florida-temporarily-closes-runway-due-to-magnetic-pole-shifting
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« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2011, 09:59:27 PM »

Haha... Who uses magnets anymore.

It's all GPS now. No magnetic north required.
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SAMSON123
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« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2011, 10:34:45 PM »

Haha... Who uses magnets anymore.

It's all GPS now. No magnetic north required.

Don't know where you are getting this info from, but pilots are still very much using compasses to assess where they are in their travels. It is never good to get hooked on electronic devices which FAIL during an outage or disruption...it is always wise to know how to use the traditional non-electronic means of guidance...FAILSAFE
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« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2011, 10:42:01 PM »

Wrong.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_navigation

Navigation aids


Good pilots use all means available to help navigate. Many GA aircraft are fitted with a variety of navigation aids, such as Automatic direction finder (ADF), inertial navigation, compasses, radar navigation, VHF omnidirectional range (VOR) and GNSS.

ADF uses non-directional beacons (NDBs) on the ground to drive a display which shows the direction of the beacon from the aircraft. The pilot may use this bearing to draw a line on the map to show the bearing from the beacon. By using a second beacon, two lines may be drawn to locate the aircraft at the intersection of the lines. This is called a cross-cut. Alternatively, if the track takes the flight directly overhead a beacon, the pilot can use the ADF instrument to maintain heading relative to the beacon, though "following the needle" is bad practice, especially in the presence of a strong cross wind - the pilot's actual track will spiral in towards the beacon, not what was intended. NDBs also can give erroneous readings because they use very long wavelengths, which are easily bent and reflected by ground features and the atmosphere. NDBs continue to be used as a common form of navigation in some countries with relatively few navigational aids.

VOR is a more sophisticated system, and is still the primary air navigation system established for aircraft flying under IFR in those countries with many navigational aids. In this system, a beacon emits a specially modulated signal which consists of two sine waves which are out of phase. The phase difference corresponds to the actual bearing relative to true north that the receiver is from the station. The upshot is that the receiver can determine with certainty the exact bearing from the station. Again, a cross-cut is used to pinpoint the location. Many VOR stations also have additional equipment called DME (distance measuring equipment) which will allow a suitable receiver to determine the exact distance from the station. Together with the bearing, this allows an exact position to be determined from a single beacon alone. For convenience, some VOR stations also transmit local weather information which the pilot can listen in to, perhaps generated by an Automated Surface Observing System.
Prior to the advent of GNSS, Celestial Navigation was also used by trained navigators on military bombers and transport aircraft in the event of all electronic navigational aids being turned off in time of war. Originally navigators used an astrodome and regular sextant but the more streamlined periscopic sextant was used from the 1940s to the 1990s. From the 1970s airliners used inertial navigation systems, especially on inter-continental routes, until the shooting down of Korean Air Lines Flight 007 in 1983 prompted the US government to make GPS available for civilian use.

Finally, an aircraft may be supervised from the ground using surveillance information from e.g. radar or multilateration. ATC can then feed back information to the pilot to help establish position, or can actually tell the pilot the position of the aircraft, depending on the level of ATC service the pilot is receiving.

The use of GNSS in aircraft is becoming increasingly common. GNSS provides very precise aircraft position, altitude, heading and ground speed information. GNSS makes navigation precision once reserved to large RNAV-equipped aircraft available to the GA pilot. Recently, more and more airports include GNSS instrument approaches. GNSS approaches consist of either overlays to existing non-precision approaches or stand-alone GNSS non-precision approaches.



VOR (VHF Omindirectional Frequency) uses neither compass or GPS.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VHF_omnidirectional_range

It only cares about what Magnetic North is at time of installation, after that, it doesn't give a shit.


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SAMSON123
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« Reply #4 on: January 07, 2011, 11:47:46 PM »

Wrong.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_navigation

Navigation aids


Good pilots use all means available to help navigate. Many GA aircraft are fitted with a variety of navigation aids, such as Automatic direction finder (ADF), inertial navigation, compasses, radar navigation, VHF omnidirectional range (VOR) and GNSS.

ADF uses non-directional beacons (NDBs) on the ground to drive a display which shows the direction of the beacon from the aircraft. The pilot may use this bearing to draw a line on the map to show the bearing from the beacon. By using a second beacon, two lines may be drawn to locate the aircraft at the intersection of the lines. This is called a cross-cut. Alternatively, if the track takes the flight directly overhead a beacon, the pilot can use the ADF instrument to maintain heading relative to the beacon, though "following the needle" is bad practice, especially in the presence of a strong cross wind - the pilot's actual track will spiral in towards the beacon, not what was intended. NDBs also can give erroneous readings because they use very long wavelengths, which are easily bent and reflected by ground features and the atmosphere. NDBs continue to be used as a common form of navigation in some countries with relatively few navigational aids.

VOR is a more sophisticated system, and is still the primary air navigation system established for aircraft flying under IFR in those countries with many navigational aids. In this system, a beacon emits a specially modulated signal which consists of two sine waves which are out of phase. The phase difference corresponds to the actual bearing relative to true north that the receiver is from the station. The upshot is that the receiver can determine with certainty the exact bearing from the station. Again, a cross-cut is used to pinpoint the location. Many VOR stations also have additional equipment called DME (distance measuring equipment) which will allow a suitable receiver to determine the exact distance from the station. Together with the bearing, this allows an exact position to be determined from a single beacon alone. For convenience, some VOR stations also transmit local weather information which the pilot can listen in to, perhaps generated by an Automated Surface Observing System.
Prior to the advent of GNSS, Celestial Navigation was also used by trained navigators on military bombers and transport aircraft in the event of all electronic navigational aids being turned off in time of war. Originally navigators used an astrodome and regular sextant but the more streamlined periscopic sextant was used from the 1940s to the 1990s. From the 1970s airliners used inertial navigation systems, especially on inter-continental routes, until the shooting down of Korean Air Lines Flight 007 in 1983 prompted the US government to make GPS available for civilian use.

Finally, an aircraft may be supervised from the ground using surveillance information from e.g. radar or multilateration. ATC can then feed back information to the pilot to help establish position, or can actually tell the pilot the position of the aircraft, depending on the level of ATC service the pilot is receiving.

The use of GNSS in aircraft is becoming increasingly common. GNSS provides very precise aircraft position, altitude, heading and ground speed information. GNSS makes navigation precision once reserved to large RNAV-equipped aircraft available to the GA pilot. Recently, more and more airports include GNSS instrument approaches. GNSS approaches consist of either overlays to existing non-precision approaches or stand-alone GNSS non-precision approaches.



VOR (VHF Omindirectional Frequency) uses neither compass or GPS.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VHF_omnidirectional_range

It only cares about what Magnetic North is at time of installation, after that, it doesn't give a shit.




YOU'RE WRONG!!!!!

Did you somehow miss the first line of the article you posted??? I highlighted COMPASSES in big letters just in case. As I said despite all the electronic crap...PILOTS MUST KNOW HOW TO USE TRADITIONAL NON ELECTRONIC BASES GUIDANCE SYSTEMS. A EMP pulse or lightening strike can instantly render all of that electronic crap USELESS...then what? A pilot can not fly by sight alone it is very easy to get disoriented, lose all sense of direction and altitude and crash.
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Chavez = Evita Peron
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« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2011, 05:26:39 PM »

YOU'RE WRONG!!!!!

Did you somehow miss the first line of the article you posted??? I highlighted COMPASSES in big letters just in case. As I said despite all the electronic crap...PILOTS MUST KNOW HOW TO USE TRADITIONAL NON ELECTRONIC BASES GUIDANCE SYSTEMS. A EMP pulse or lightening strike can instantly render all of that electronic crap USELESS...then what? A pilot can not fly by sight alone it is very easy to get disoriented, lose all sense of direction and altitude and crash.

No, you can't read English obviously.

The VOR is the primary means of navigation in today's commercial airplanes. The compass is there but is an after thought.

Obviously English is your second language... I get that, but please. Just stop, you look foolish.
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SAMSON123
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« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2011, 05:55:34 PM »

No, you can't read English obviously.

The VOR is the primary means of navigation in today's commercial airplanes. The compass is there but is an after thought.

Obviously English is your second language... I get that, but please. Just stop, you look foolish.


Obviously IDIOCY is your forte and comprehension a unsolved mystery. NO PILOT WILL EVER GET HIS LICENSE WITHOUT KNOWING HOW TO FLY USING A COMPASS....PERIOD. I don't care what so called guidance system is in effect. If you think you can get a license without being able to using a traditional guidance method I suggest you contact ANY flying school and ask. Report back to this board witht he answer you get. IT WILL BE NO!!!!!
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« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2011, 10:49:58 AM »

Obviously IDIOCY is your forte and comprehension a unsolved mystery. NO PILOT WILL EVER GET HIS LICENSE WITHOUT KNOWING HOW TO FLY USING A COMPASS....PERIOD. I don't care what so called guidance system is in effect. If you think you can get a license without being able to using a traditional guidance method I suggest you contact ANY flying school and ask. Report back to this board witht he answer you get. IT WILL BE NO!!!!!

Hahaha... So what?

Getting a license has nothing to do with Airplanes not being able to take off.

What does a pilot reading a compass have to do with the story you posted?

Answer?

Nothing.

Because you don't need a compass to navigate a commercial aircraft.
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SAMSON123
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« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2011, 12:59:52 PM »

Hahaha... So what?

Getting a license has nothing to do with Airplanes not being able to take off.

What does a pilot reading a compass have to do with the story you posted?

Answer?

Nothing.

Because you don't need a compass to navigate a commercial aircraft.

I am not not sure what all this unintelligent rambling you are making here is supposed to be about. The issue is not about planes taking off, but about pilots being able to navigate a/the plane which would include flying, taking off and landing with the correct coordinates should something interfere: pole shifts, electromagnetic disturbances, lightening, power failure etc etc

A license is UNOBTAINABLE without a pilot being very learned in non-electric navigational equipment: compasses, altimeters, landmarks, sight and even direction based upon rising/setting sun.

So far as what compasses have to do with the story, it was YOU who claimed COMPASSES are not necessary to fly because, according to you, ALL PLANES RELY ON GPS, which I informed you was incorrect.

BTW Did you contact any flight school to learn that a license requires knowing the use of manual indicators/navigational equipment like compasses, altimeters, etc etc? These devices are not secondary they are all PRIMARY...just as wearing a seat belt, following the speed limit, adhering to rules of the road when driving a car. No one of these things supercedes the other, they are all primary means of safely driving.
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« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2011, 01:04:40 PM »

I am not not sure what all this unintelligent rambling you are making here is supposed to be about. The issue is not about planes taking off, but about pilots being able to navigate a/the plane which would include flying, taking off and landing with the correct coordinates should something interfere: pole shifts, electromagnetic disturbances, lightening, power failure etc etc

A license is UNOBTAINABLE without a pilot being very learned in non-electric navigational equipment: compasses, altimeters, landmarks, sight and even direction based upon rising/setting sun.

So far as what compasses have to do with the story, it was YOU who claimed COMPASSES are not necessary to fly because, according to you, ALL PLANES RELY ON GPS, which I informed you was incorrect.

BTW Did you contact any flight school to learn that a license requires knowing the use of manual indicators/navigational equipment like compasses, altimeters, etc etc? These devices are not secondary they are all PRIMARY...just as wearing a seat belt, following the speed limit, adhering to rules of the road when driving a car. No one of these things supercedes the other, they are all primary means of safely driving.

I don't think you get it.

While you need to know how to use a compass to  get a license, the plane does not use it for navigation.

Do you really not understand that?

You're bringing up things which have zero bearing on the subject at hand which is "why planes didn't take off"
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