Author Topic: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success  (Read 39803 times)

Van_Bilderass

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #100 on: February 13, 2011, 03:21:36 PM »
van nothing special happens at failure you know this, youve said it before. but in reality, somethign does happen at failure, and its the opposite of special, its muscle damage and a buildup of lactic acid/other bad shit that interferes with muscle growth, decreases strength, etc.


whats the most important factor for hypertrophy? me and you both know its loa.d going to failure does nothing.  higher reps,pumping the muscle can increase glycogen, etc.

dont get into great bodybuilders who trained pump style. those guys were on boat loads of drugs had great genetics and even still  they may not have lifted heavy, but they had the ability to lift heavy when they wanted to. strong muscle=big muscle.

load=#1 importanmt factor.
2 important factor= frequency, diet,

and ofc ourse results are always much better on hormones


Yes load is the main factor. But like I said in another thread, whether going to failure is good or bad depends on the exercise. Today I did some triceps and was thinking of this. I know from experience that I get no training effect from pushdowns if I stop 2-3 reps from failure. It's just not taxing enough, muscularly or neurally. I don't get stronger. Stopping 2-3 reps shy of failure would be enough if de-trained but after 2-3 workouts I have to push harder. On the other hand, going to absolute failure on squats for example may kill all strength progression for weeks.

After a long training career you learn how hard you need to push to get to a certain level. One exercise harder, another not so hard. Going to failure is not the trigger like Mentzer claimed, nothing special happens, but sometimes going to failure is advantageous, and sometimes going beyond that is as well.

Progressively increasing loads is important. Lots of people will argue this but no one really believes it. Everyone keeps at least a little track of their training loads, even if they are "pumpers". You ask a pumper how their workout went and they may say, "great workout, today I squatted 350 for 30", for example. If load had no bearing why mention it?  :D

Yes you can be a great bb training with relatively small loads. Drugs, drug response and muscle shape is all more important than training but we're talking training and the effect from training only, not whether drugs or training is more important. In this context load progression matters.

PJim

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #101 on: February 13, 2011, 03:54:28 PM »
Some of you make me chuckle. Tdongz especially. You can't go around making statements such as "nothing happens at failure" and then proceed to say it's best to train 2-3 reps before so. Why 2-3 reps before failure? Why not 4-5 reps before failure if it's so bad? Hell, why don't we just actually do 3 reps entirely, even if we would fail at 12? You can only gauge so much from this kind of guessing game. Also, what about your three levels of strength? You aren't going to be maximising strength and size gains if you are only scraping your current concentric ability, let alone your eccentric ability! Also Tdongz, you've been juiced up for a while now, your perception of what is giving you the best gains is shrouded by the fact that you are already altering/bypassing the body's natural growth mechanism.

Palpatine Q

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #102 on: February 13, 2011, 04:03:25 PM »
You don't need tips on training as you have great genetics and are on drugs. You'll grow doing anything. :D
And it would be a mistake for a natural twink to ask you anything training related. You'd kill his enthusiasm saying, "you've been training for 2 months and nothing's happened... it'll never happen. Go do something else". :D

But yeah, genetics is everything. And if you want to look like a bodybuilder you'll need drugs as well. Twinks such as myself can get pretty strong though, and there's lots of tricks to employ if that's what you want (strength).

Two months is a bit premature.

But if you have been training consistently and eating right for a year and not much is happening, yeah you might want to pick up another hobby.

That's IF your goal is to be a very big, very muscular person....if you enjoy lifting for lifting's sake and do it for health reasons and to get stronger, by all means have at it.

I get asked every single day of my life, "what do you do for XXXXXXXX ?"

Same thing you do.....there are no "secret training protocols that will have you EXPLODING with new muscle growth!!!!!!"

Unless you read a lot of FLEX magazine   8) ;D

tbombz

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #103 on: February 13, 2011, 04:13:13 PM »
Ok , Post comparisions to this:










And if you cannot even beat this then please SHUT your fucking mouth when it comes to training. OK?!?!


sure, here, this are from when i was 17 and natty..  so the comparison is fair..   :)







 :-*

Palpatine Q

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #104 on: February 13, 2011, 04:18:58 PM »
sure, here, this are from when i was 17 and natty..  so the comparison is fair..   :)







 :-*

actually he is much thicker than you....but then again he's only 19 inches tall.

 At bbing contests in Sweden they use him as the trophy...the audience loves it.

tbombz

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #105 on: February 13, 2011, 04:22:03 PM »
actually he is much thicker than you....but then again he's only 19 inches tall.

 At bbing contests in Sweden they use him as the trophy...the audience loves it.
look at the back double bi comparison. in his other pic, like the one he is flexing his arm from the side, its all angle. hes got no size what so ever

Palpatine Q

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #106 on: February 13, 2011, 04:28:40 PM »
look at the back double bi comparison. in his other pic, like the one he is flexing his arm from the side, its all angle. hes got no size what so ever


actually the BDB is the one shot where he's not using trick angles....I agree about the rest though.

But he carries more muscle than you in those shots. which is fine being that you are 17 in them and he's a grown (Hahahahaahaa :D) man on steroids. and you still hold your own

chaos

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #107 on: February 13, 2011, 04:30:36 PM »
he's a grown (Hahahahaahaa :D) man on steroids. and you still hold your own
Swedes a juicer? Nahhh....
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!

225for70

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #108 on: February 13, 2011, 04:32:14 PM »
Tbombz has good genetics for having a Huge ass Biscuit shaped dome piece.

GH15 approved

Palpatine Q

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #109 on: February 13, 2011, 04:35:08 PM »
Swedes a juicer? Nahhh....

I have no clue....but everyone and their mother accuses me so i figure I'll return the favor.



JUICHEAD  :)

tbombz

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #110 on: February 13, 2011, 04:36:24 PM »
actually the BDB is the one shot where he's not using trick angles....I agree about the rest though.

But he carries more muscle than you in those shots. which is fine being that you are 17 in them and he's a grown (Hahahahaahaa :D) man on steroids. and you still hold your own
thats what i was saying. look at the back double bi pic and compare it to mine. cuz the other ones are all angle.


Vince B

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #111 on: February 13, 2011, 04:36:53 PM »
Yes load is the main factor. But like I said in another thread, whether going to failure is good or bad depends on the exercise. Today I did some triceps and was thinking of this. I know from experience that I get no training effect from pushdowns if I stop 2-3 reps from failure. It's just not taxing enough, muscularly or neurally. I don't get stronger. Stopping 2-3 reps shy of failure would be enough if de-trained but after 2-3 workouts I have to push harder. On the other hand, going to absolute failure on squats for example may kill all strength progression for weeks.


Once your arms are about 17 1/2 inches the pressdowns no longer stimulate hypertrophy. This is where experience is needed. You have to do something else. The best exercises are known but not universally. So many guys look at magazines or copy what others do in the gym. I swear these things are embraced like viruses. It takes experience and scientific training to get rid of ineffective exercises. You also have to get rid of dangerous exercises and ones that don't benefit bodybuilders like deadlifts. Most muscleheads are so stubborn and thick that they literally wouldn't see the truth if it hit them over the head. That is how ingrained theories and methods are in most people who lift weights. They believe things like religious beliefs. When this occurs reason and logic go out the window never to return. They insist on using free weights and all manner of other rubbish. They consume pointless amounts of expensive protein. They argue until the cows come home but are not big and never will be. When all fails they take drugs. When that fails they take more drugs. When they reach plateaus they insist it is all genetics. Ah, the folly of lifting weights. What a complete waste of time to debate this topic with most people.

chaos

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #112 on: February 13, 2011, 04:38:53 PM »
Once your arms are about 17 1/2 inches the pressdowns no longer stimulate hypertrophy.
I quit reading right here cause it's quite obvious you are a dolt.
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!

tbombz

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #113 on: February 13, 2011, 04:40:27 PM »
I quit reading right here cause it's quite obvious you are a dolt.
;D  x2

Palpatine Q

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #114 on: February 13, 2011, 04:44:07 PM »
Once your arms are about 17 1/2 inches the pressdowns no longer stimulate hypertrophy. This is where experience is needed. You have to do something else. The best exercises are known but not universally. So many guys look at magazines or copy what others do in the gym. I swear these things are embraced like viruses. It takes experience and scientific training to get rid of ineffective exercises. You also have to get rid of dangerous exercises and ones that don't benefit bodybuilders like deadlifts. Most muscleheads are so stubborn and thick that they literally wouldn't see the truth if it hit them over the head. That is how ingrained theories and methods are in most people who lift weights. They believe things like religious beliefs. When this occurs reason and logic go out the window never to return. They insist on using free weights and all manner of other rubbish. They consume pointless amounts of expensive protein. They argue until the cows come home but are not big and never will be. When all fails they take drugs. When that fails they take more drugs. When they reach plateaus they insist it is all genetics. Ah, the folly of lifting weights. What a complete waste of time to debate this topic with most people.




17 1/2 inches is the cutoff huh ??

LOLOLOLOL.

Care to explain how you came to this conclusion ??

chaos

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #115 on: February 13, 2011, 04:44:31 PM »
;D  x2
WTF like there's some magic number your body recognizes and shut off the acceptance of an exercise.

Geez, glad he didn't post his theories on hypertrophy......I'll be sure to steer clear of that crap.
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!

Palpatine Q

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #116 on: February 13, 2011, 04:46:11 PM »
WTF like there's some magic number your body recognizes and shut off the acceptance of an exercise.

Geez, glad he didn't post his theories on hypertrophy......I'll be sure to steer clear of that crap.

I would have to say that's in the running for "stupidest thing I've ever read on Getbig"

chaos

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #117 on: February 13, 2011, 04:49:12 PM »
I would have to say that's in the running for "stupidest thing I've ever read on Getbig"
Definitely top ten material.......but at the moment I can't think of anything stupider. ;D
Liar!!!!Filt!!!!

225for70

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #118 on: February 13, 2011, 05:06:39 PM »
Yao ming has 18.25 arms. ???

Palpatine Q

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #119 on: February 13, 2011, 05:12:40 PM »
Definitely top ten material.......but at the moment I can't think of anything stupider. ;D

Yes the dreaded 17 1/2 inch barrier.....the guy who solves that is going to be a rich man

Vince B

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #120 on: February 13, 2011, 05:29:57 PM »
The specifics of hypertrophy stimulation are rather simple but the application of the technology filled with complications and difficulties. When movement is involved joints don't stay where they are supposed to stay and this phenomenon gets worse the heavier the resistance. Triceps should be trained when in a stretched position and the upper arms should be restricted from moving outward or upward. Even on proper equipment people cheat. They use too much weight so form disappears and the effectiveness with it. You need a good brain to get big. If you lack one with sufficient experience then there is little hope you will succeed. You can recruit someone with more experience but there are no guarantees in bodybuilding. You can think you are doing the same thing but might miss the mark in one way or another.

Anyone with deep experience wouldn't laugh at the details I have posted. Knuckleheads and wannabes are oblivious so see humour instead of being enlightened.

Palpatine Q

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #121 on: February 13, 2011, 05:35:51 PM »
The specifics of hypertrophy stimulation are rather simple but the application of the technology filled with complications and difficulties. When movement is involved joints don't stay where they are supposed to stay and this phenomenon gets worse the heavier the resistance. Triceps should be trained when in a stretched position and the upper arms should be restricted from moving outward or upward. Even on proper equipment people cheat. They use too much weight so form disappears and the effectiveness with it. You need a good brain to get big. If you lack one with sufficient experience then there is little hope you will succeed. You can recruit someone with more experience but there are no guarantees in bodybuilding. You can think you are doing the same thing but might miss the mark in one way or another.

Anyone with deep experience wouldn't laugh at the details I have posted. Knuckleheads and wannabes are oblivious so see humour instead of being enlightened.


Nonsense......muscles contract, period.

put them under a load, be it a square piece of iron attached to a cable...or a round piece of iron on a bar.....they can't tell the difference they just do their job.

Vince B

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #122 on: February 13, 2011, 05:48:12 PM »
So many clueless guys here. Predictable but sad just the same. Bodybuilders as a group are stupid. No doubt about that and confirmed hourly on Getbig.

Master Blaster

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #123 on: February 13, 2011, 05:49:27 PM »
if font = navy blue
: scroll past

Palpatine Q

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Re: stimulate, dont annihilate!!! key to training success
« Reply #124 on: February 13, 2011, 05:52:28 PM »
So many clueless guys here. Predictable but sad just the same. Bodybuilders as a group are stupid. No doubt about that and confirmed hourly on Getbig.

and yet in my stupidity i've managed to get up to 250 muscular pounds, but i have no clue  ::)