I want you to educate this guy re calorie surplus

[Oldschool Flip]

This guy is debating saying that "calorie surplus" ISN'T needed to gain lean muscle mass. Here's what he had to say.

Complete bro-science and absolutely not true. Again, to gain muscle you don't need a calorie surplus, only a positive nitrogen balance. There's no point in me posting clinical literature on the subject, as you will surely find some problem with the study set-up, control group, etc. It can be done. End of story. If you don't believe me, why don't YOU post something clinical proving it can't? -EK

Alright lay into this MFer and let's hear how you would educate his ass.

[JasonH]

I can see his point (not saying I agree with him in the slightest), but studies and documentary evidence from both sides of the argument are sorely lacking.

[Alexander D]

This guy is debating saying that "calorie surplus" ISN'T needed to gain lean muscle mass. Here's what he had to say.

Alright lay into this MFer and let's hear how you would educate his ass.

I dont think there is anything wrong with his line of thinking...

to gain WEIGHT... ie- go from 200lbs to 220lbs- you will need a calorie surplus... but to gain muscle and decrease bodyfat at the same time while maintaining your weight, you do not.

[wavelength]

the guy is right

[tendonitis]

the guy is absolutely right, you can gain lean muscle mass while losing weight

[OneMoreRep]

There is nothing fundamentally wrong with his statement.

"1"

[#1 Klaus fan]

Why would you need to gain fat to gain muscle? Take in the amount of calories that feed your body + the muscle growth = natural weight gain from training.

[Lundgren]

I can see his point (not saying I agree with him in the slightest), but studies and documentary evidence from both sides of the argument are sorely lacking.

X2 close the fucking thread no more bro science for fucks sake.

[chaos]

LOL OldschoolFlip posts like once every six months and this time he gets raped.........hahah

[EKnight]

OldSchool- how'd that work out for ya? You posted this "educate him" topic on several boards and they all came back with the same responses. -EK

[ManBearPig...]

There is nothing fundamentally wrong with his statement.

"1"

exactly, what's better for putting on muscle?  1000 calories of protein or 2000 calories of grease?

[Stavios]

well I have actually seen 2 guys get GREAT muscle gains while in calories deficit and also on DNP

true story

lot of sauce involved and perfect nutriment timing

[EKnight]

The whole thing started because on another forum, I said it is technically possible- albeit difficult for practical purposes- to build muscle without being in a caloric surplus. He went off half-cocked about how it couldn't be done at all beyond beginner gains, then when he couldn't prove it posted my name and post all over the internet trying to get someone to agree with him. -EK

[Deicide]

well I have actually seen 2 guys get GREAT muscle gains while in calories deficit and also on DNP

true story

lot of sauce involved and perfect nutriment timing

Yup

[_bruce_]

So... how much protein per manpound should one consume?

[EKnight]

If you're natural, results diminish after .8 grams per pound of bw, so for most people 1 gram per pound is sufficient. -EK