NY Knicks with Carmello Anthony

[TacoBell]

2004 detroit pistons

Rasheed Wallace will be in the HOF.  But lol I knew someone was gonna bring that up..

[flexingtonsteele]

No you wouldnt.  And if you would, well thats why youre not an nba exec lol.  Not that I am, but your list is wrong.

The top 3 in the league are:
kobe, lebron, durant.  You can argue who is 1-3, kobe will be the first to fall out of there due to age, but hes clearly the most accomplished and goes down as the best of the 3 till they start winning multiple titles.

#4 is wade
#5 is melo.

Even amare has publicly deferred to melo in press conference as the leader.  Amare never did nor would win as the primary option.  
The nba is about perimeter playerstake over the game and score.   In order to win a GREAT player MUST be the primary option.

  Sorry but you're wrong the nba is about size!

Thats why the lakers have been in the finals the past 3 years and almost every single nba champion EVER has had a dominant post player.

Defense and ez baskets ( inside scoring ) and depth win in the league. Perimiter players are great but they dont win you big games. Thats why the heat are 1-7 against the lakers, celtics, bulls, and san antonio this year.

[JOHN MATRIX]

  Sorry but you're wrong the nba is about size!

Thats why the lakers have been in the finals the past 3 years and almost every single nba champion EVER has had a dominant post player.

Defense and ez baskets ( inside scoring ) and depth win in the league. Perimiter players are great but they dont win you big games. Thats why the heat are 1-7 against the lakers, celtics, bulls, and san antonio this year.

this is correct

and rasheed in the HOF is kinda iffy.

[TacoBell]

No you are both wrong.
1st regular season means nothing.  So it doesnt matter what the heats record is vs whoever.
2nd Sheed definitely gets in.
3rd perimeter greats can win with role bigs much easier than superstar bigs with no outside presence.  It just doesnt happen.
These are facts.

[flexingtonsteele]

No you are both wrong.
1st regular season means nothing.  So it doesnt matter what the heats record is vs whoever.
2nd Sheed definitely gets in.
3rd perimeter greats can win with role bigs much easier than superstar bigs with no outside presence.  It just doesnt happen.
These are facts.

Sorry bro but you're totally wrong.

With the exception of the chicago bulls with the greatest player who's played the game and one year the pistons won the championship. Every team in the past 25 years who has won an nba championship has had a dominant big!

Now thats a fact.

And you're right regular season means nothing, thats why teams like the phoenix suns and cleveland cavaliers have had great reg seasons records but have fizzled in the postseason.

[TacoBell]

I cant believe you guys are even arguing this.  Since the magic/bird era, ie the modern era of nba basketball, it has been an unquestionably perimeter dominated league.  Look at who the finals MVP was in the last 30 years.  It was a perimeter player twice as often as a big.  This is a perimeter player dominated league and the great ones are the ones who win. Period.

[JOHN MATRIX]

Sorry bro but you're totally wrong.

With the exception of the chicago bulls with the greatest player who's played the game and one year the pistons won the championship. Every team in the past 25 years who has won an nba championship has had a dominant big!

Now thats a fact.

And you're right regular season means nothing, thats why teams like the phoenix suns and cleveland cavaliers have had great reg seasons records but have fizzled in the postseason.

exactly. the jordan-pippen bulls are the SOLE team as far back as i can remember who won a title without a dominance front court.

Kobe (best perimeter player in the world) could  not win until he got Gasol in the great collusions of 2008... the Lakers for the last 3 years have had by far the best front court in the nba.

celtics won with KG and the rest of their manufactured super team (2nd best front court in the nba besides the Lakers)

Spurs leaned on Duncan

Rockets had Olajuwon

the list gpes on and on

in the playoffs the game slows down, and the teams with the best half court execution, paint scoring, and defense wins.

the past is littered with the corpses of the hyped-up high scoring regular season teams (shaq-hardaway magic, early 2000's kings, nash-stoudemire suns, all the dallas teams, etc etc..)

[JOHN MATRIX]

I cant believe you guys are even arguing this.  Since the magic/bird era, ie the modern era of nba basketball, it has been an unquestionably perimeter dominated league.  Look at who the finals MVP was in the last 30 years.  It was a perimeter player twice as often as a big.  This is a perimeter player dominated league and the great ones are the ones who win. Period.

ROFL you are completely wrong, the entire 80's and 90's were big-man dominated eras...its only since around 2003ish that its become a perimeter player's league. and even then, its STILL the teams with the best front courts that win playoff series. the sole exception to this has been the Jordan bulls.

[flexingtonsteele]

I cant believe you guys are even arguing this.  Since the magic/bird era, ie the modern era of nba basketball, it has been an unquestionably perimeter dominated league.  Look at who the finals MVP was in the last 30 years.  It was a perimeter player twice as often as a big.  This is a perimeter player dominated league and the great ones are the ones who win. Period.

I cant believe you are arguing this either.

Because what im saying is fact lol.

[flexingtonsteele]

ROFL you are completely wrong, the entire 80's and 90's were big-man dominated eras...its only since around 2003ish that its become a perimeter player's league. and even then, its STILL the teams with the best front courts that win playoff series. the sole exception to this has been the Jordan bulls.

True, basketball will forever be about size.

Its a big mans game.

I agree with everything you said above and pretty much cant say anything more on this topic.

[TacoBell]

exactly. the jordan-pippen bulls are the SOLE team as far back as i can remember who won a title without a dominance front court.

Kobe (best perimeter player in the world) could  not win until he got Gasol in the great collusions of 2008... the Lakers for the last 3 years have had by far the best front court in the nba.

celtics won with KG and the rest of their manufactured super team (2nd best front court in the nba besides the Lakers)

Spurs leaned on Duncan

Rockets had Olajuwon

the list gpes on and on

in the playoffs the game slows down, and the teams with the best half court execution, paint scoring, and defense wins.

the past is littered with the corpses of the hyped-up high scoring regular season teams (shaq-hardaway magic, early 2000's kings, nash-stoudemire suns, all the dallas teams, etc etc..)

Totally wrong and attempted to be skewed version of history.  
Of course it takes more than one good player to win a championship, but with that said...

Kobe got help from Pau, but it was still kobes show.
Celtics win behind Pierce and hell KG isnt even a inside presence, hes just tall, and shoots jumpers.
Spurs most recently leaned on parker and ginobli, not duncan.
Heat win when Wade goes nuts in the playoffs.
Early 2k lakers win behind Shaq but still it becomes Kobes team when push comes to shove.  Why....?
Then you got a whole bunch of Michael and the Rockets only win when he doesnt play AND because Big Shot Robert Horry hits unbelievable clinchers.
Then its Isaih, Bird, Magic era.  

Thats what happened

[flexingtonsteele]

Totally wrong and attempted to be skewed version of history. 
Of course it takes more than one good player to win a championship, but with that said...

Kobe got help from Pau, but it was still kobes show.
Celtics win behind Pierce and hell KG isnt even a inside presence, hes just tall, and shoots jumpers.
Spurs most recently leaned on parker and ginobli, not duncan.
Heat win when Wade goes nuts in the playoffs.
Early 2k lakers win behind Shaq but still it becomes Kobes team when push comes to shove.  Why....?
Then you got a whole bunch of Michael and the Rockets only win when he doesnt play AND because Big Shot Robert Horry hits unbelievable clinchers.
Then its Isaih, Bird, Magic era. 

Thats what happened

Are you just delusional or dont have a clue about basketball?

The lakers were a 7th seed at best and were bounced out of the playoffs in the 1st rd every year after shaq left until they got gasol (coincidentally they made the nba finals that same year )

KG is one of the best POWER forwards in the last 20 years. He's an inside prescence on both ends of the floor.

Tim Duncan IS the best pf in the history of the game. He IS the reason the spurs have been so good for the past decade and why david robinson has his one nba title. Oh yea that team had neither parker or manu.

The heat won because they had Shaq. Plain and simple.

The lakers teams were shaqs teams. Not Kobe's which was evident by the lakers record when shaq was traded.

Now anything else???

[TacoBell]

Are you just delusional or dont have a clue about basketball?

The lakers were a 7th seed at best and were bounced out of the playoffs in the 1st rd every year after shaq left until they got gasol (coincidentally they made the nba finals that same year )

KG is one of the best POWER forwards in the last 20 years. He's an inside prescence on both ends of the floor.

Tim Duncan IS the best pf in the history of the game. He IS the reason the spurs have been so good for the past decade and why david robinson has his one nba title. Oh yea that team had neither parker or manu.

The heat won because they had Shaq. Plain and simple.

The lakers teams were shaqs teams. Not Kobe's which was evident by the lakers record when shaq was traded.

Now anything else???

Yes, the else is that you are clueless.  Im not saying that inside presence isnt important, but in the NBA and at the highest level teams are built from the outside in.  

So tell me then, why did the Lakers pick Kobe over Shaq?  And the Heat won cause of Shaq?  You obviously didnt watch the playoffs that year, because no one would say that.  

When Duncan won yes he was the best player, but that is the one example, besides the fact that they had sean elliot, avery johnson, and robert horry to save their ass in game 5.

So in the last 30 years the Finals MVP was a perimeter player TWICE as many times as an inside player.  EXPLAIN

You are just wrong, Im sorry

[flexingtonsteele]

Yes, the else is that you are clueless.  Im not saying that inside presence isnt important, but in the NBA and at the highest level teams are built from the outside in.  

So tell me then, why did the Lakers pick Kobe over Shaq?  And the Heat won cause of Shaq?  You obviously didnt watch the playoffs that year, because no one would say that.  Because Kobe is/was alot younger and Kobe is a DAMN good player. And yes they won because of shaq, you do realize the heat were 42-40 the year before they got shaq then won the finals 2 years after his arrival.

When Duncan won yes he was the best player, but that is the one example, besides the fact that they had sean elliot, avery johnson, and robert horry to save their ass in game 5. LOL, the guys u named were all role players.

So in the last 30 years the Finals MVP was a perimeter player TWICE as many times as an inside player.  EXPLAIN. The reason the teams won was because of defense and interior prescence. Not perimiter players

You are just wrong, Im sorry

[JOHN MATRIX]

Yes, the else is that you are clueless.  Im not saying that inside presence isnt important, but in the NBA and at the highest level teams are built from the outside in.  

So tell me then, why did the Lakers pick Kobe over Shaq?  And the Heat won cause of Shaq?  You obviously didnt watch the playoffs that year, because no one would say that.  

When Duncan won yes he was the best player, but that is the one example, besides the fact that they had sean elliot, avery johnson, and robert horry to save their ass in game 5.

So in the last 30 years the Finals MVP was a perimeter player TWICE as many times as an inside player.  EXPLAIN

You are just wrong, Im sorry

95% of the nba's coaches, GM's, and analysts disagree with you there bro.

and for the rest: the Lakers chose kobe over shaq in 2005 because shaq was already on the decline and kobe was entering his prime and had lots of good years left.

thats it.

if the choice was 2000 shaq or 2005 kobe, they would have picked shaq 10 times out of 10.

and LMFAO at suggesting tim duncan owes his titles to sean elliot and AVERY FUCKING JOHNSON LOLOLOLOL they were both there for only one title and were COMPLETELY CARRIED by tim duncan the whole way.

[flexingtonsteele]

95% of the nba's coaches, GM's, and analysts disagree with you there bro.

and for the rest: the Lakers chose kobe over shaq in 2005 because shaq was already on the decline and kobe was entering his prime and had lots of good years left.

thats it.

if the choice was 2000 shaq or 2005 kobe, they would have picked shaq 10 times out of 10.

and LMFAO at suggesting tim duncan owes his titles to sean elliot and AVERY FUCKING JOHNSON LOLOLOLOL they were both there for only one title and were COMPLETELY CARRIED by tim duncan the whole way.

JM we're beating a dead horse here.

I give up.

[TacoBell]

I give up.

Good.

And by the way, on your 10 guys Id pick before Melo list, which is what this argument was actually about, 7 were perimeter players.  

[225for70]

Tacoloco laying the smackdown on flexington, John Matrix..

[TacoBell]

Tacoloco laying the smackdown on flexington, John Matrix..

Maybe Flexington is just used to people deferring to him in basketball discussion because he's blackish?

[flexingtonsteele]

Good.

And by the way, on your 10 guys Id pick before Melo list, which is what this argument was actually about, 7 were perimeter players.  

That was just 10 id pick ahead of him. There are plenty more

Carmelo is a great talent, but not top 5 @ all.

BTW.......Wade and LBJ are more of slashers/scorers then perimiter players. But im sure you realized that.

[flexingtonsteele]

Maybe Flexington is just used to people deferring to him in basketball discussion because he's blackish?

Maybe you're just used to talking to people who have no clue about basketball.

Therefore leaving you under the false impression that you actually know what you're talking about.

When obviously from this discussion you dont!

[TacoBell]

That was just 10 id pick ahead of him. There are plenty more

Dude you cant be serious.
You picked 10, only 3 were big, and of those 3 no one would pick pau or amare before melo.  Come on.
That means of the top 11 players in the league, 9 of the first 10 are perimeter.  

[flexingtonsteele]

Dude you cant be serious.
You picked 10, only 3 were big, and of those 3 no one would pick pau or amare before melo.  Come on.
That means of the top 11 players in the league, 9 of the first 10 are perimeter. 

Do you know how many times Denver made it out of the first round of the playoffs in the 7 years they had carmelo???

ONCE!

And he's a top five talent???

Come on bro, just give up.

[TacoBell]

http://dimemag.com/2010/02/the-top-5-players-in-the-nba/


Hmmm let's see what a basketball magazine has to say.

[flexingtonsteele]

http://dimemag.com/2010/02/the-top-5-players-in-the-nba/


Hmmm let's see what a basketball magazine has to say.

Carmelo does one thing, which he does quite well. But all he does is score! He doesnt defend and he rebounds poorly. He's a great scorer. That doesnt make him a top 5 talent.

He's not a top 5 player. Top five players dont make it out of the first round once in 7 years.