Author Topic: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars  (Read 1666 times)

MB_722

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The most expensive public policy and most precious civil liberty involves the life and death issue of war. For cost: Nobel Prize-winning economist Joseph Stiglitz and Harvard's Linda Bilmes co-authored a paper that current US wars have a long-term cost to US taxpayers of $3 to $5 trillion now. That's up to ~$50,000 per US household (this also means if your household income is $100,000/year that your share of current US war cost is $100,000).
The below is an excerpt from a recent public speech by 92-year-old Ben Ferencz to the "young people." Ben was a US prosecutor at the Nuremberg Trials. He has publicly stated for years now that the US does in current wars what the US prosecuted and executed Nazis for doing: Wars of Aggression under the specious pretext of "self-defense." His testimony joins the following that I know of and documented previously:
 
One of the first academic leaders to explain the obvious is Francis Boyle, Harvard-educated (Ph.D in political science and J.D.) international law professor. His outrage is expressed in the title of his article, Is Bush’s War Illegal? Let us Count the Ways:
 

    “The precedent again goes back to the Nuremberg Judgment of 1946 when the lawyers for the Nazi defendants argued that we, the Nazi government had a right to go to war in self-defense as we saw it, and no one could tell us any differently. Of course that preposterous argument was rejected by Nuremberg. It is very distressing to see some of the highest level of officials of our country making legal arguments that were rejected by the Nuremberg Tribunal.”

Richard Falk, Professor Emeritus of International Law at Princeton:
 

    “An objective observer would reach the conclusion that this Iraq war is a War of Aggression, and as such, that it amounts to a Crime against Peace of the sort for which surviving German leaders were indicted, prosecuted and punished at the Nuremberg trials conducted shortly after the Second World War.”

Secretary General of the United Nations, Kofi Annan responding to the direct question whether the Iraq War is illegal:
 

    “I have indicated it was not in conformity with the UN charter… from the charter point of view, it was illegal."

In the January 2010 UK Chilcot Inquiry, testimony revealed that all 27 UK Foreign Affairs lawyers were in agreement that the US/UK war was an unlawful War of Aggression. Their unanimous professional legal assessment before the war began was rejected without public disclosure of their work and public debate.
 

    So there we are. We have a difficult world, and really it's up to the young people to do something about it. Do what your heart tells you is the right thing - stop glorifying war. Do it as best you can. We are spending $2 billion every day on the military. We have a stronger military than every nation in the world combined. What for? No one wants the US to be the self-appointed policeman of he world. The country is on the verge of bankruptcy. We are denying people the elements of health and education by wasting our money on weapons of mass destruction that we cannot use. If you cannot reach and persuade politicians to reverse this disastrous policy, you may have to take to the streets. What else can we do?
     
    America is a great democracy, and in every democracy it's normal, and it should be that way, that people have differences of opinion. But a democracy can only work if its people are being told the truth. You cannot run a country as Hitler did, feeding the public a pack of lies to frighten them that they are being threatened so it's justified to kill people you don't even know. You cannot do that. It's not logical, it's not decent, it's not moral and it's not helpful. When an unmanned bomber from a secret American airfield fires rockets into a little Pakistan or Afghan village and thereby kills or maims unknown numbers of innocent people, what is the effect of that?
     
    Every victim will hate Americans forever and will be willing to die killing as many Americans as possible. Where there is no court of justice wild vengeance is the alternative.
     
    I'm a law-man. I believe in the rule of law. I see that we are provoking what we condemn as dangerous terrorism. The country is terrified. The freedom from fear that President Roosevelt talked about doesn't exist in America today, Armies of airport guards check the shoes of old ladies to see if they've got a bomb hidden there. What have we come to? It's not my world any more. My future is behind me. But, for your sake, and for those who have grand-children, make up your mind. Speak up when you can. Talk to your Congressman. Talk to your friends. Talk to your enemies. It's up to the lawyers to lay down the rules and create the courts. We're doing that, slowly and with difficulty. We need help from the public. You are the public. Good luck to you. 


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Dos Equis

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2011, 06:32:07 PM »
Comparing us to Hitler and the Nazis?  Absurd.

George Whorewell

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2011, 08:40:51 PM »
Just goes to show you that most Europeans possess the intelligence of a jar of mayonnaise.

dario73

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2011, 05:28:23 AM »
Seems that the for some people the older they get the stupider they become.

Soul Crusher

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2011, 05:36:46 AM »
Seems that the for some people the older they get the stupider they become.

dario73

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2011, 07:50:36 AM »
What the hell is that,3333?  I have to go now and tear the eyes out of my head. That would be a lot less painful than to look at that image.

Soul Crusher

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2011, 07:51:24 AM »
What the hell is that,3333?  I have to go now and tear the eyes out of my head. That would be a lot less painful than to look at that image.

Some older moron with an obama tat on his side.   

kcballer

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2011, 09:25:18 AM »
Interesting.  Seems quite with it and lucid to me.  Iraq was a stupid war to begin with. 
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Soul Crusher

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2011, 09:27:33 AM »
Interesting.  Seems quite with it and lucid to me.  Iraq was a stupid war to begin with. 

Yet you support military intervention in Lybia.   Got it. 

Fury

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2011, 09:28:00 AM »
Interesting.  Seems quite with it and lucid to me.  Iraq was a stupid war to begin with.  

.....as you advocate a No Fly Zone in Libya.  ::)

Yet you support military intervention in Lybia.   Got it.  

Hahaha, beat me to it. Perfect example of the sheer hypocrisy of your typical far-lefty.

dario73

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2011, 09:35:44 AM »
Yet you support military intervention in Lybia.   Got it. 

Like most liberals/Democrats, he is a hypocrite.

dario73

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2011, 09:38:49 AM »
Some older moron with an obama tat on his side.   

He seems pretty representative of the morons that still support him.  A complete waste of skin.

kcballer

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2011, 09:39:59 AM »
Yet you support military intervention in Lybia.   Got it. 

Libya was a peoples revolution, i supported US intervention with NATO.  Not alone.  Nice try to trip me up though.   ;)
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Fury

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2011, 09:41:10 AM »
Libya was a peoples revolution, i supported US intervention with NATO.  Not alone.  Nice try to trip me up though.   ;)

You did get tripped up. You look like a typical leftist hypocrite....as usual.

But you're welcome to make yourself look like a bigger fool as you try to worm you're way out of it.

OzmO

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2011, 09:43:16 AM »
I don't see it.   How does the Libya things compare to the irag war?

kcballer

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2011, 09:49:44 AM »
You did get tripped up. You look like a typical leftist hypocrite....as usual.

But you're welcome to make yourself look like a bigger fool as you try to worm you're way out of it.

Where?  One is a people uprising which i supported NATO involvement in, the other a war of aggression fueled by a lie of weapons of mass destruction. 
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Fury

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2011, 09:51:58 AM »
I don't see it.   How does the Libya things compare to the irag war?

How isn't it? Invading a sovereign country in the midst of a civil war in order to unseat a dictator that is of no strategic or military importance to us is an imperialist act that does nothing to further our interests, something lefties like kcballer LOVE railing against Republicans for endorsing. And if you want to reference human rights violations as justification, what Saddam did to the Iraqis and Kurds was far worse than Qadaffi is doing right now.

We have no business in Libya. I know the Europeans are pushing for it because: 1) They're completely fucking inept and have little to no military as we play babysitter for them and 2) Europe is much more dependent on Libyan oil than we are.

England brokered the Lockerbie bomber's release as part of an oil deal. Let them go in there and "save" the masses. But they can't, because they don't have the capabilities (like the rest of Europe). NATO might as well be renamed to "the US military" as we are the only sizable military force in it. Europe just hangs on for the ride. ::)


How fucking ridiculous that someone will actually chastise the US for the Iraq War while simultaneously advocating that we invade another country and get involved in yet ANOTHER war.

OzmO

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2011, 09:56:11 AM »
Kcballer said we should invade Libya?

I was aginast irag, for Afghanistan, and would be very much against invading Libya.

No sure about the no fly zone thing.  If anything, like you say, let those broke fuck euro countries do it.

Soul Crusher

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2011, 09:57:23 AM »
Kcballer said we should invade Libya?

I was aginast irag, for Afghanistan, and would be very much against invading Libya.

No sure about the no fly zone thing.  If anything, like you say, let those broke fuck euro countries do it.

Yes he did.   

Fury

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #19 on: March 16, 2011, 10:00:02 AM »
Kcballer said we should invade Libya?

I was aginast irag, for Afghanistan, and would be very much against invading Libya.

No sure about the no fly zone thing.  If anything, like you say, let those broke fuck euro countries do it.

People seem to think that a No-Fly Zone would be this easy thing to implement. Qadaffi has a sizable and somewhat modern airforce. He also has the anti-air capabilities of taking our planes down from the ground.

There's no point in risking American lives in order to help some people who, when they're not busy fighting a civil war, hate us, and in a country that is of no strategic importance to us.

We're not the world police. And we're certainly not the tip of the spear for Europe's quest to keep their oil flow going. The French and English want a No-Fly Zone? Take their armies down there and do it. Oh, they can't? Must be nice having us to protect them, which allows them to cut their defense budgets and then open up free time for them to rail against us 24/7.

kcballer

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2011, 10:02:33 AM »
Kcballer said we should invade Libya?

I was aginast irag, for Afghanistan, and would be very much against invading Libya.

No sure about the no fly zone thing.  If anything, like you say, let those broke fuck euro countries do it.

Not invade, but NATO should provide help to the uprising people.  The US is apart of NATO, so we would be involved.  

Iraq wasn't in an uprising, i never said the world would miss Sadaam.  It won't.  But the war was not of the people doing, Libya is a revolution started by the people.  They only need supplies and help, not US boots on the ground.  

You're still failing at the comparison though.  Iraq and Libya are not the same, one is a revolution of the people, the other a war of aggression built on a house of lies.  
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Fury

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2011, 10:05:59 AM »
Not invade, but NATO should provide help to the uprising people.  The US is apart of NATO, so we would be involved.  

Iraq wasn't in an uprising, i never said the world would miss Sadaam.  It won't.  But the war was not of the people doing, Libya is a revolution started by the people.  They only need supplies and help, not US boots on the ground.  

You're still failing at the comparison though.  Iraq and Libya are not the same, one is a revolution of the people, the other a war of aggression built on a house of lies.  

No, I'm not. You, like the other foolish far-lefties out there, think establishing a No-Fly Zone in a country that has a sizable air force and the capabilities to take our planes down would be the easiest thing in the world.

Get out of fantasy land.

It's not our job to swing the odds in a CIVIL War. There are several civil wars going on right now. Why is this one special? Could it be because it has ground to a halt the Arab uprisings and your far-lefty goals of new Islamic supremacist states taking the place of the deposed leaders?

In the words of the far-left:

We're not the world police.
We're not the world police.
We're not the world police.


kcballer

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2011, 10:08:45 AM »
 ::)  yes i think it's the easiest thing in the world.  Oh please you're flailing in your attempts to trip me up. 

Iraq was different, the prosecutor is right.

NATO should help the Libyan uprising.  Simple as that. 
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225for70

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2011, 10:11:51 AM »
Interesting.  Seems quite with it and lucid to me.  Iraq Is was a stupid war to begin with. 

Fixed...

OzmO

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Re: 92-year-old US Nuremberg prosecutor: US wars same as Nazi wars
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2011, 10:13:39 AM »
I don't think they could take our planes down.  

But I do like the euro countries  dealing with it instead of the USA.  

And kc, you gotta admit, those same people who ar asking for our help will turn on us the second they get power.