HELP: Need guidance/tips on current nuntrition/training

[Woldzilla]

Hi

I write this post to obtain guidance and knowledge on bodybuilding nutrition and to get tips regarding my current diet.

I used to train 3x a week from when I was 19 til I was 28 and grew pretty easy only never considered food as part of bodybuilding, just ignorant thinking only training makes you grow and lifting as heavy as possible not focussing too much on form and negatives.

After a period of 4,5 years no training (and noticing muscle decrease and fat increase) I started training again only this time reading a lot on training, nutrition and supplements and also watching youtube clips of pro bodybuilders a lot where they advise on these items.

Details: Currently I am 33, 5 foot 10, 210 lb with no abs showing (yet  )

Training: I train 3x a week based on Dorian Yates training advises (ref training board)

Cardio: I used to do cardio after training however I understand this limits your recovery so i stopped. Cardio in morning is no option with children and work so I hope my goal is possible without cardio but with correct nutrition and intense training

My goal is to get rid of the fat and keep/gain muscle

my diet  on training day is:

07:00 - breakfast: 1 cup oatmeal, 5 eggs (incl 2 yolks) and 1 banana
09:30 - shake: 2 scoops (40 gr) whey protein (isolate 75% - casein 25%) mixed in water + 1 multivitamin and 4 amino acid capsules
12:00 - lunch: 1 cup wholegrain rice, 0,75 chicken fillet/breast (because I see the pros take 1 whole), 1 cup vegetables (broccoli, cauliflower,sprouts, carrot or green beans) and I drink water
14:30 - shake: 2 scoops (40 gr) whey protein (isolate 75% - ca seine 25%) mixed in water + 4 amino acid capsules
17:00 - dinner: 1 cup wholegrain rice/pasta or potato, 0,75 chicken fillet or 1 box tuna or salmon, 1 cup vegetables (broccoli, cauliflower,sprouts, carrot or green beans) and I drink water
19:00 - preworkout: 2 ricecakes hand of raisins
21: 30 - postworkout and pre bed shake: 2 scoops (40 gr) whey protein (isolate 75% - ca seine 25%) mixed in water + 4 amino acid capsules + 1 banana

On a non training day I do the same except I change the preworkout meal for a meal on 19:00 similar to the one on 12:00 (rice, chicken, veg, water)


Please advice on improvements for my diet to obtain my goal to to get rid of the fat and keep/gain muscle.
Thanks in advance!

[DK II]

too many excuses, all "buts", "Excepts" and so on.

Grow some balls, dude!!

If you wanted to do morning cardio, you would do it before your kids wake up, don't blame it on the kids. You have too many carbs in your diet, and lose the pre WO carbs, instead eat some more protein for dinner. With a complete meal 2 hours befor WO, you shouldn't have problems with energy during training.

[wes]

Diet looks OK,I`d up the training to 5-6 days to burn more cals and definately include cardio in your routine right after training.

30 minutes of walking on a slightly inclined treadmill isn`t gonna` make your muscles disappear.

Also,you might want to cycle your carbs..............3 low days,followed by 2 slightly higher days and repeat + drink a shitload of water.

[Woldzilla]

Diet looks OK,I`d up the training to 5-6 days to burn more cals and definately include cardio in your routine right after training.

30 minutes of walking on a slightly inclined treadmill isn`t gonna` make your muscles disappear.

Also,you might want to cycle your carbs..............3 low days,followed by 2 slightly higher days and repeat + drink a shitload of water.

Thanks Wes, I ll try follow this... 1 question: why cycling carbs instead of keeping it at a certain level?

[wes]

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/wescott4.htm

[DK II]

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/wescott4.htm

Hey wes, but TA and Fatpanda say that a calorie is a calorie! 

[mossel]

i miss the hgh and test in this list...

[Bam-bam]

too many excuses, all "buts", "Excepts" and so on.

Grow some balls, dude!!

If you wanted to do morning cardio, you would do it before your kids wake up, don't blame it on the kids. You have too many carbs in your diet, and lose the pre WO carbs, instead eat some more protein for dinner. With a complete meal 2 hours befor WO, you shouldn't have problems with energy during training.

lose the pre workout carbs, why? isnt it important for energy during training?

[DK II]

lose the pre workout carbs, why? isnt it important for energy during training?

Sure they are, but IMO when you want to lose fat AND have a full meal 2h before WO, you don't need more carbs before WO, ESPECIALLY not fructose like in raisins. Complex carbs like brown rice will do their job here.

If he wants to lose fat, he will have to reduce calories. Looking at the nutrition plan, i saw a chance to cut there.
The point is to keep insulin levels low and steady, having a full meal and then raise insulin levels with rice cakes and push fructose into the liver with all the rest of the meal floating through your intestines is not a good idea.



On the other hand, i would rather go with wes' carb cycling approach, i didn't think of that. Instead of 3 days high 2 days low there would be also the option to cut carb more drastically on non-WO days, for example no carbs after noon on non-WO days.

[mossel]

for cutting use the dave palumbo diet...


A sample of his diet is below:

MEAL #1 5 whole eggs (OMEGA-3 EGGS ); add another 4 egg whites to this

MEAL #2 SHAKE: 50g Whey Protein with 1 ? tablespoon of All Natural Peanut butter (no sugar)....

MEAL #3 "Lean Protein Meal": 8oz chicken with 1/3-cup cashew nuts (almonds, or walnuts)

MEAL #4 SHAKE: 50g Whey Protein with 1 ? tablespoons of All Natural Peanut butter (no sugar added

MEAL #5 "Fatty Protein Meal": 8oz Salmon, Swordfish, or RED MEAT with a green salad (no tomatoes, carrots, or red peppers) with 1 tablespoon of Olive Oil or Macadamia nut oil and vinegar..

MEAL #6 SHAKE: 50g Whey with 1 ? tablespoon all natural peanut butter or 4 whole (Omega-3) eggs and 4 extra whites..


and another sample: (I use this one)


MEAL #1 6 whole eggs (OMEGA-3 EGGS )

MEAL #2 SHAKE: 50g Whey Protein with 1 tablespoon of All Natural Peanut butter

MEAL #3 "Lean Protein Meal": 8 oz chicken with 1 tb macadamia nut oil

MEAL #4 SHAKE: 50g Whey Protein with 1 tablespoons of All Natural Peanut butter

MEAL #5 6 whole eggs (OMEGA-3 EGGS )

MEAL #6 SHAKE: 50g Whey with 1 tablespoon all natural peanut butter

[Woldzilla]

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/wescott4.htm

thanks again wes. interesting article. would you recoomend the high card days of the cycle to be the workout days?

[Woldzilla]

for cutting use the dave palumbo diet...


A sample of his diet is below:

MEAL #1 5 whole eggs (OMEGA-3 EGGS ); add another 4 egg whites to this

MEAL #2 SHAKE: 50g Whey Protein with 1 ? tablespoon of All Natural Peanut butter (no sugar)....

MEAL #3 "Lean Protein Meal": 8oz chicken with 1/3-cup cashew nuts (almonds, or walnuts)

MEAL #4 SHAKE: 50g Whey Protein with 1 ? tablespoons of All Natural Peanut butter (no sugar added

MEAL #5 "Fatty Protein Meal": 8oz Salmon, Swordfish, or RED MEAT with a green salad (no tomatoes, carrots, or red peppers) with 1 tablespoon of Olive Oil or Macadamia nut oil and vinegar..

MEAL #6 SHAKE: 50g Whey with 1 ? tablespoon all natural peanut butter or 4 whole (Omega-3) eggs and 4 extra whites..


and another sample: (I use this one)


MEAL #1 6 whole eggs (OMEGA-3 EGGS )

MEAL #2 SHAKE: 50g Whey Protein with 1 tablespoon of All Natural Peanut butter

MEAL #3 "Lean Protein Meal": 8 oz chicken with 1 tb macadamia nut oil

MEAL #4 SHAKE: 50g Whey Protein with 1 tablespoons of All Natural Peanut butter

MEAL #5 6 whole eggs (OMEGA-3 EGGS )

MEAL #6 SHAKE: 50g Whey with 1 tablespoon all natural peanut butter

uhmmm... thanks but I am a bit sceptic to palumbo.. I fully respect him as a bodybuilder but his midsection worries me in trying his routine.. although that most likely was not due to his nutrition

[local hero]

his diet is sound for fatties, if i were miles out of shape for a show or a holiday id be doing somthing similar

[Woldzilla]

his diet is sound for fatties, if i were miles out of shape for a show or a holiday id be doing somthing similar

Up to now I have not considered putting oil or peanutbutter in my proteinshake.
Why is it beneficial to do so..digestion?

[wes]

thanks again wes. interesting article. would you recoomend the high card days of the cycle to be the workout days?

No,just stick to the plan,you`ll have plenty of fat to use as fuel.

Carbs are not an essential nutrient and once you get to the higher carb days,you`ll be replenished.

It takes a lot to fully deplete,trust me on that.

as far as fats/oils go,you get enough trace fats in the foods listed in my diet plan trust me on that too.

Fats are calorie dense and should only be eaten after weight loss goals are reached................. ....extra fats that is.

[wes]

Hey wes, but TA and Fatpanda say that a calorie is a calorie! 

Don`t forget Wavelength!! 

Good advice on no pre-workout carbs DK.........usually I just have whey in water before training since the object is to burn fat,not carbs.

[DK II]

Don`t gorget Wavelength!! 

Good advice on pre-workout carbs DK.........usually I just have whey in water before training since the object is to burn fat,not carbs.

I forgot about WL. I think he has finally gotten to his goal of being 100lbs. 


Whey in water is great, i drink 10g amino acids before training and then 10g BCAA during training.

[wes]

BCAA`s,also good stuff!

Wavelength is a good guy but at his age with his metabolism,he can more than likely eat anything he wants and stay lean as long as he`s active.

[DK II]

BCAA`s,also good stuff!

Wavelength is a good guy but at his age with his metabolism,he can more than likely eat anything he wants and stay lean as long as he`s active.

That'S the funny thing, he only ate ONE meal a day plus a giant Whey shake (100g).

His diet is shitty at best, Aethiopian starvation diet.

[Woldzilla]

Don`t forget Wavelength!! 

Good advice on no pre-workout carbs DK.........usually I just have whey in water before training since the object is to burn fat,not carbs.

@Wes: Ill try the carb cycling.. do I understand it correctly that during a 7day week I should have 3 zero carb day, with zero carbs meaning only protein sources and vegatables and fruit as I thought the idea was not to count vegies/fruits as carbs on these days?

@DK I followed your advice as yesterday I trained and left the pre training meal out as suggested by you and I had no lack of energy at all so I stick with that, thanks DK.

[Woldzilla]

@Wes: Ill try the carb cycling.. do I understand it correctly that during a 7day week I should have 3 zero carb day, with zero carbs meaning only protein sources and vegatables and fruit as I thought the idea was not to count vegies/fruits as carbs on these days?

@DK I followed your advice as yesterday I trained and left the pre training meal out as suggested by you and I had no lack of energy at all so I stick with that, thanks DK.

by the way: my dad who is a former powerlifting world champion is seriously disappointed I take nutritional advice from others ... apart from the fact that he is disappointed I am more interested in bodybuilding than powerlifting although I do respect that sport, I favour bodybuilding

[DK II]

by the way: my dad who is a former powerlifting world champion is seriously disappointed I take nutritional advice from others ... apart from the fact that he is disappointed I am more interested in bodybuilding than powerlifting although I do respect that sport, I favour bodybuilding

PL and BB are a total different ball game.

in PL, you have to be strong, even if you look like a fat fuck, in BB you have to LOOK strong, even if you are weak as fuck it doesn't matter. 

[Woldzilla]

PL and BB are a total different ball game.

in PL, you have to be strong, even if you look like a fat fuck, in BB you have to LOOK strong, even if you are weak as fuck it doesn't matter. 

Hehe good one, In his day (1980's) powerlifters and strongmen often looked like offseason boybuilders and it was good entertainment, nowadays...like the complaints on bodybuilding, the PL and strongmen leagues have changed significantly for the worse over the last 20 yrs too...or lets say went ahead too far.. lot of fat people that look to have serious health issues

[wes]

@Wes: Ill try the carb cycling.. do I understand it correctly that during a 7day week I should have 3 zero carb day, with zero carbs meaning only protein sources and vegatables and fruit as I thought the idea was not to count vegies/fruits as carbs on these days?

I only do the 3 zero carb days occasionally, or if I get stuck at a plateau as far as fat burning is concerned.

I don`t count  veggies as a carb source, and I don`t eat any fruit while dieting.........too much sugar.

I do however count complex carbs from vegetable sources,ie. (potatoes,rice,yams,oatmeal,etc.),but you probably already assumed this but just in case. 

Remember,I do this for contests not just to lose weight,so a piece of fruit a day probably isn`t going to hurt you.

[DK II]

I only do the 3 zero carb days occasionally, or if I get stuck at a plateau as far as fat burning is concerned.

I don`t count  veggies as a carb source, and I don`t eat any fruit while dieting.........too much sugar.

I do however count complex carbs from vegetable sources,ie. (potatoes,rice,yams,oatmeal,etc.),but you probably already assumed this but just in case. 

Remember,I do this for contests not just to lose weight,so a piece of fruit a day probably isn`t going to hurt you.

Just up the Clen a bit, then it's ok.