Petition to bring back the 90s look (To the Judges from Getbig)

[Parker]

This is a petition to stop with the current look of the IFBB Pros---whether it be the supposedly "insulin" look that gh15 talks about, or the crappy genetics, what ever it may be. But it needs to stop. They need to take a look at the 90s and bring that look back---cut back, or whatever they need to do. The judges need to mandate it. And stick with it. Enforce it, like they mean it. If you agree, let them know on here. Maybe if this gets traction, Ron can let the judges know that there is a growing faction of fans, followers, enthusiasts that don't like where modern bbing is going. And maybe other forums can join in. 

[gh15]

it wont work ,, you wont have the monster size you have now,, i mean the monster weight... you wont have it with out what need to be done to have it ,, bodybuild are not that stupid they just do what need to be done to have chance at the top,, they wont to be the top in the top,, so they do it even though many manyyyy hate it and dont want to do it...they still do it ,, they have to

gh15 approved

[gh15]

i wish it could work ,, would be good for bodybuild ,,but you wont have the 260lb 5'8 on stage you have now day ....they want realy real large fellas on stage now day for some reason ,,thats just how it is

gh15 approved

[Fitness4Life]

i wish it could work ,, would be good for bodybuild ,,but you wont have the 260lb 5'8 on stage you have now day ....they want realy real large fellas on stage now day for some reason ,,thats just how it is

gh15 approved

it's weird, it's as if the judges trusted there gut when they gave it to Dexter, then went back to the trend afterwards with jay.  Did they get some kind of negative feedback due to Dex winning the O?

[gh15]

no,, its just that jay brought condition that was good enough with size that was too large for dex....and i told you they look for more size...so if you give them condition that is 9 out of 10...and dex has 10 out of 10 ...but jason is 10lb more proportionlay to height ....that 10lb more will give jason the win ...they want size!! its the ifbb ,,condition will count very much but only when its a good difference of 10-15% and over

gh15 approved

[Parker]

it wont work ,, you wont have the monster size you have now,, i mean the monster weight... you wont have it with out what need to be done to have it ,, bodybuild are not that stupid they just do what need to be done to have chance at the top,, they wont to be the top in the top,, so they do it even though many manyyyy hate it and dont want to do it...they still do it ,, they have togh15 approved

Then they need to voice their opinion...they need to say, "look I'mm fucking up my health, and ruining myself." The judges need to stop pushing their own agendas and judge by the criteria...they have chosen to create a situation where bbing is dying a sow death. I understand that each generation is bigger and better---but this crop is just "blah"....they have the size, but either they lack the seperation of the 90s guys, the crispness...Levrone still had it at 5'9 and 260, Flex was 5'10 and 216 at the 93 AC, and this guys today may weigh more, but can't hold a candle to him or Levrone.

it's weird, it's as if the judges trusted there gut when they gave it to Dexter, then went back to the trend afterwards with jay.  Did they get some kind of negative feedback due to Dex winning the O?

After Dex won, it was elation on here, and then guys were downing him---saying that he was a midget, and then there was the infamous pic with him and Roelly, where Roelly look "bigger".
I believe that Dex was a way of punishing Jay for coming out of condition...as Jay has been pushed as "The One"...

[erics]

The judges and the IFBB have no clue, have no idea about direction, about marketing potential, about anything. They just follow the whims of an awestruck teenage mindset.

As the IFBB ever done any kind of market research? Have they ever considered the pros and cons of having certain types of physiques representing bodybuilding and the effects it would have on revenue potential etc etc?

My guess is no, they haven't. They have no clue and the 'judging standards' are just one proof of that.

[Parker]

The judges and the IFBB have no clue, have no idea about direction, about marketing potential, about anything. They just follow the whims of an awestruck teenage mindset.

As the IFBB ever done any kind of market research? Have they ever considered the pros and cons of having certain types of physiques representing bodybuilding and the effects it would have on revenue potential etc etc?
My guess is no, they haven't. They have no clue and the 'judging standards' are just one proof of that.

This is a good question for Bob Chick...and something that needs to be looked into.

[erics]

This is a good question for Bob Chick...and something that needs to be looked into.

I did ask him. He wasn't sure but he felt they hadn't.

[Tito24]

who cares, we now can laugh at the freakshow

[Parker]

I did ask him. He wasn't sure but he felt they hadn't.

Then this is what they need to do. They need to hire a consulting firm to do market research about what the look needs to be...If it's less freak and more Mike O'hearn, then so be it.

[erics]

Then this is what they need to do. They need to hire a consulting firm to do market research about what the look needs to be...If it's less freak and more Mike O'hearn, then so be it.

There are many things they should be doing, one of them being how to ensure the sport remains viable and therefore, sustainable.

Even in the earlier days, bodybuilding was considered a freakshow but there was always the possibility of seeing something more in it. These days, that possibility no longer exists. There is only the freakshow and that limits the potential audience/market.

The simple logic behind this, however, seems lost on the powers to be.

[gh15]

There are many things they should be doing, one of them being how to ensure the sport remains viable and therefore, sustainable.

Even in the earlier days, bodybuilding was considered a freakshow but there was always the possibility of seeing something more in it. These days, that possibility no longer exists. There is only the freakshow and that limits the potential audience/market.

The simple logic behind this, however, seems lost on the powers to be.

no no ,, back in the day in the 80s with samir,, in the 70s with frank ,, in the 60s with larry ....all was very in reach with good work and basic hormones and addition of some products in and out...it wasnt liek who can buy more gh and insulina ...it wasnt who can do 30 iu a day gh and who can put in them tons of insulina a day ...it just wasnt like this...the main point was to use aas....and improve with some gh into it in the 80s mainly...but the fellas worked on improving conditioning inorder to match the best...it was different thinking...conditioning was numero uno..ask anyone from that time...conditioning was big deal....you wanted always to get this crispy dry and maintain as much size as you could with hormones...but! then arrived dorian....he could pull it! he could,, he also didnt abuse the hell out of insulina...he used but didnt abuse it like nut case... he did use quite a bit but! did not abuseeee it ,,do you understand there are bodybuild who put into their physiqe 150 iu a day of insulina? do you get it? this is what ruined bodybuuildiung!! it will get anyone swollen puff from within ...ANY ONE! and if you are nto completely musclless and have some muscle on you when start ....you will blow up and look huge and rubbery muscular... which is what happening in the last 10 years which is shame for bodybuild..its not real muscle development it is a joke

gh15 approved

[erics]

What I meant was that the average person would consider someone like Zane or Paris a freak because, quite frankly, they don't look normal. BUT, they had other qualities, unlike today's competitors.

Modern bodybuilding has eliminated the value of posing, muscle separation, proportion and lines. It has rewarded size and 'hardness'. They keep eliminating and eliminating while all the while rewarding size and more size.

When you look at the photos of Zane in 1979 or Bannout in 1983, what element of conditioning did they NOT have that the modern guys apparently do?

It's nuts. Just nuts.

[MB]

The judges can only judge what's in front of them.  If a '90's type physique showed up, they would be rewarded.  

[erics]

The judges can only judge what's in front of them.  If a '90's type physique showed up, they would be rewarded.

I disagree. They didn't have to award Branch second place over Dexter. But they did. They didn't have to award a clearly oiled up and ready to burst Wheeler second place to Ronnie when Cormier was perfect.

Prior to each contest, they should announce the core tenets of the criteria that they will be judging the competitors on. That would go a long way towards helping things.

[Chick]

The judges can only judge what's in front of them.  If a '90's type physique showed up, they would be rewarded.  

Exactly right...

Every sport progresses...in BB, that has meant bigger, heavier, more muscle...not always the best package, but there are exceptions in everything.

As for any research, as someone asked...even the most novice physiques are too extreme for the general public..which is why it wouldnt make a damn bit of difference.

We dont need to appeal to the general public..we need to appeal to our OWN fans...by way of better entertainment, shows, incorporating more personality into the sport...look at wrestling...its the storylines that sell, not the 1,000,000,0000th suplex, leg drop, etc...

Not saying anything needs to be scripted, or silly outfits/ costumes...just more attention to selling the rivalries, stories, challenges, etc...

A great example Ive used in the past, was back a few years ago at the British GP, where KIng and Craig went at it on stage...biggest crowd reaction of the night...and they were battling....for 4th and 5th.  

It wasnt the fact that they werent going toe to toe for the title...it was the fact that they hated each other, were talking smack onstage, and raised the energy level and fan interaction 1,000% that night...it was real, genuine emotion....THATS what sells, and THATS what would be needed to interject some much needed interest into the sport...competitions dont have much appeal...shows do.

[erics]

True, personalities, rivalries etc all help to make things much, much more interesting. No arguments there.

Every sport progresses...in BB, that has meant bigger, heavier, more muscle...not always the best package, but there are exceptions in everything.

When was the last time a truly balanced and proportioned physique with pleasing lines won a show? If these kinds of physiques were winning, would that not count as progess? Why does progress have to be measured only in terms of size? Frank Zane in 1979 had one of the most amazing physiques in the history of the sport - has anyone been able to match what he achieved since? Yet, after his first couple of amazing Olympias, Coleman gets worse and worse and yet somehow he is the greatest...

To my way of thinking, that represents a failure on the part of the IFBB to promote and educate its own fanbase on what constitutes a great physique. Instead of looking for awesome, the judges should be looking for perfection.

We dont need to appeal to the general public..we need to appeal to our OWN fans...

I think that is rather short-sighted. Our 'own' fans are supporting pregnant sauropods. Obviously then, many of them will support almost anything. So I don't see you losing those fans. Why not support something that any reasonable person could also be invited to support? Why make it difficult for any reasonable person to support bodybuilding? What is wrong with promoting balance and lines and that sort of thing? Why does bodybuilding have to satsify only a mentality that only accepts 'awesomeness' as a standard?

Promoting personalities and supporting proportion, posing and lines are not mutually exclusive.

[SilverSpoon]

gh15 and Chick, is the insulina that is often spoken of here the reason that many of the top bodybuilders looked their best when they won the USAs or Nationals???

[RJ]

Exactly right...

Every sport progresses...in BB, that has meant bigger, heavier, more muscle...not always the best package, but there are exceptions in everything.

As for any research, as someone asked...even the most novice physiques are too extreme for the general public..which is why it wouldnt make a damn bit of difference.

We dont need to appeal to the general public..we need to appeal to our OWN fans...by way of better entertainment, shows, incorporating more personality into the sport...look at wrestling...its the storylines that sell, not the 1,000,000,0000th suplex, leg drop, etc...

Not saying anything needs to be scripted, or silly outfits/ costumes...just more attention to selling the rivalries, stories, challenges, etc...

A great example Ive used in the past, was back a few years ago at the British GP, where KIng and Craig went at it on stage...biggest crowd reaction of the night...and they were battling....for 4th and 5th.  

It wasnt the fact that they werent going toe to toe for the title...it was the fact that they hated each other, were talking smack onstage, and raised the energy level and fan interaction 1,000% that night...it was real, genuine emotion....THATS what sells, and THATS what would be needed to interject some much needed interest into the sport...competitions dont have much appeal...shows do.

You are exactly right Mr. Chick.

Bodybuilding will never appeal to the general public.

You hit the nail on the head in regards to making the sport more entertaining to the fans that do support it.

[funk51]

these are the only 90's i care about.

[Nails]

Only BodyBuilding Mag Rag that sells, are the ones with Arnold from the 60's


Jay Cutler is still competing against Arnold Schwarzenegger even thou he retired since 1980

[Parker]

Chick, here is the thing...bbing is not really "progressing" per se, but "mutating", slwly but surely, it's doing the same thing as in many of aspects of Am culture that have no quality control. This "give you what I thnk you want" mentality is one of the reasons why the Big Three fell to to Japanese.
If there are tenets for bbing, then the judges need to be held to keeping them, if not, they need to be fired...as they are the supposed keepers of quality---what they reward sets the standard---
if they cannot do that, yet continually reward the "insulinia" monsters with little seperation, then you start to see the bber's quality start to erode.

[Pet shop boys]

Too late for that.

And btw you know there's not such thing as "evolution in our sport " when the so called Diehard fans dont like the physiques of today,as much as those of  20-15 years ago.

Branch and Heath look like shit compared with anyone from the top 6 (early 90's Mr.O).


And since they all (90's and todays) lift same weights,same cardio, eat same food (protein) and sleep same amount of time
 today BB is simply the result of today's drugs


WOOOSSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHH.

[erics]

If there are tenets for bbing, then the judges need to be held to keeping them, if not, they need to be fired...as they are the supposed keepers of quality---what they reward sets the standard---
if they cannot do that, yet continually reward the "insulinia" monsters with little seperation, then you start to see the bber's quality start to erode.

It is obvious, isn't it?

Despite the mirage success of the Olympia and Arnold, bodybuilding is falling victim to its own sense of exaggeration.

They've taken away posing because, apparently, it's a physique show. Okay then, why not cut out all forms of posing (ie, flexing)and just have the guys stand there totally relaxed? Nuts, right?

Flexing the body creates an image, flexing the body while in motion adds another dimension to that image. Yet for some reason, the physique in motion and phsyique assessment are considered to have nothing do with each other!

Posing has been run into the gournd until now, all we have left is a few gyrating gorillas acting like aging rap stars while begging for applause.

Even the sport's own fans mock this!

Have the powers that be ever considered that there might be fans other than the ones who salivate at pregnant looking men? There are many ways of creating further interest in a show, as Chick suggested, but that doesn't mean you have to kill the foundations of the sport.

It's nuts, just nuts and the judges are heavily to blame for rewarding blob bodies rather than perfect bodies.