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Author Topic: MMA is a joke. Traditional Kempo Karate is much better.  (Read 7909 times)
Bodybuilder Lex Reeves
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« on: September 28, 2011, 08:31:54 AM »

I was at my nephew's watching this UFC nonsense. A bunch of oily Brazilians and white trash humping each other. Garbage. I would pit my Black Belt in Kempo against one of these clowns any day of the week. One knife hand chop to the throat and the these Gracie characters are rendered helpless. There is no match for a traditional Karate master.
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delta9mda
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« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2011, 09:10:33 AM »

you are looking at it from the wrong angle. this is sport for these guys and not survival.
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Darren Avey
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« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2011, 09:11:37 AM »

WHat happens when they grab your arm and break it before you can even attempt one of your "chops"
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Bodybuilder Lex Reeves
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« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2011, 09:13:00 AM »

you are looking at it from the wrong angle. this is sport for these guys and not survival.
That's good then. Because they wouldn't survive real Karate.
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« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2011, 09:16:22 AM »

I was at my nephew's watching this UFC nonsense. A bunch of oily Brazilians and white trash humping each other. Garbage. I would pit my Black Belt in Kempo against one of these clowns any day of the week. One knife hand chop to the throat and the these Gracie characters are rendered helpless. There is no match for a traditional Karate master.

 you are lost, duck under your knife hand chop grab your legs take you down sit on top of you and punch you in the face, could you explain how your karate would get you out of this situation.

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« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2011, 09:25:01 AM »

As we've seen any standup fighter without great takedown defense and defensive grappling knowledge is going to lose rather quickly.

and I thought it was KENPO karate Wink
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Bodybuilder Lex Reeves
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« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2011, 09:37:21 AM »

As we've seen any standup fighter without great takedown defense and defensive grappling knowledge is going to lose rather quickly.

and I thought it was KENPO karate Wink
Run a google son.
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« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2011, 09:40:43 AM »

i favour the Pride Fighting

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HoHZpNX9nQc" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HoHZpNX9nQc</a>
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flipper5470
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« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2011, 09:47:02 AM »

Former MMA champ Lyoto Machida is a black belt in karate.  He employs a lot of karate in his striking....he lost the title at 205lbs when a Brazilian named Mauricio "Shogun" Rua knocked his ass out in less than one round....
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ob205
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« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2011, 10:41:36 AM »

When I saw this fight in UFC 2, it kind of settled the whole traditional karate vs. real fighting bullshit.  This guy was super high ranked "NINJA"

Pat Smith v. Ninja   If someone can embed this, it's great.

http://www.sportpost.com/video/view/Patrick+Smith+vs+Scott+Morris++UFC+2
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« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2011, 10:49:07 AM »

I agree to a degree: If a traditional arts practicioner understands and expects a possible "take down", he can beat a typcial MMA warrior in the street in most instances.

However, as was said, MMA, as it exists in the UFC, etc., is a sport.

Do you think the military teaches MMA as most know it to its special forces units? HELL NO. Totally a waste of time, energy and way too involved. Kill or maim the enemy and move the frick on.

To roll around with some guy (or bob and weave in a dance) for five minutes isn't remotely practical in a war/survival scenario.  

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MAXX
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« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2011, 10:54:40 AM »

I was at my nephew's watching this UFC nonsense. A bunch of oily Brazilians and white trash humping each other. Garbage. I would pit my Black Belt in Kempo against one of these clowns any day of the week. One knife hand chop to the throat and the these Gracie characters are rendered helpless. There is no match for a traditional Karate master.
wow. so go make your way to the UFC and make millions beating up UFC champs then. god luck.
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Fortress
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« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2011, 10:55:52 AM »

wow. so go make your way to the UFC and make millions beating up UFC champs then. god luck.

The UFC is a sporting federation.

Hope this helps.
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« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2011, 11:10:22 AM »

Fortress is the guy who thinks some fatass powerlifters would stand a chance against a seasoned professional mixed martial artist in a street fight  Roll Eyes
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« Reply #14 on: September 28, 2011, 11:34:15 AM »

I was at my nephew's watching this UFC nonsense. A bunch of oily Brazilians and white trash humping each other. Garbage. I would pit my Black Belt in Kempo against one of these clowns any day of the week. One knife hand chop to the throat and the these Gracie characters are rendered helpless. There is no match for a traditional Karate master.

I have trained in a very traditional style of kung fu called Choy Li Fut from 1978. I fought in many open competitions and even won a few when I lived in Australia, and I spent from November 1991 - August 1992 in South East Asia where I fought in open full contact competitions in Malaysia, the Philippines and Borneo, against silat, tkd, karate, muay thai, judo/jujutsu and other kung fu fighters. We were not allowed to attack the eyes or throat, or stomp on a downed opponent. Everything else was fair game, groin included.

I really thought I'd seen it all, and I thought I knew how to fight. Then came the first UFC and I saw people being taken down and choked, arm-barred, leglocked etc, and my first thought was "It would never happen to me". But you know what? I'd had so many disappointments and revelations with pretty much every traditional style, including my own, by that stage, I went and sought out a grappler, just to see if I really could stay on my feet, and i proceeded to get my arse handed to me.

I say this with the utmost respect from my perspective of someone with 33 years training. Most traditional styles are full of people who have no idea about fighting and are so ego bound they have no desire to learn. The brazilian concept of 'vale tudo' is the best thing to happen to martial arts/martial sport in a very long time. I don't think there is a lot technically wrong with traditional martial arts, but to think they teach you all you need to know about fighting, without being modified/adjusted and trained accordingly, is naive at best and ignorant at worst.

If you really think hitting someone in the throat who is intent on hitting you back or taking you to the ground is easy, I suggest you try and do for real and see what happens. I've been there. I've tried it. It's not like the movies.
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« Reply #15 on: September 28, 2011, 12:04:32 PM »

Allow headbutting in MMA and 90 percent of BJJ moves from the guard(on your back) are rendered useless when you're trying to control a guys limbs and he's raining headbutts from the top position.
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Fortress
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« Reply #16 on: September 28, 2011, 12:06:53 PM »

Fortress is the guy who thinks some fatass powerlifters would stand a chance against a seasoned professional mixed martial artist in a street fight  Roll Eyes

Yep, that's me.
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JAM
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« Reply #17 on: September 28, 2011, 12:13:01 PM »

I'm a bit partial to martial arts that use weapons.   Grin

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4SHWXQBVL4" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4SHWXQBVL4</a>

 Cool
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Fortress
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« Reply #18 on: September 28, 2011, 12:15:56 PM »

I have trained in a very traditional style of kung fu called Choy Li Fut from 1978. I fought in many open competitions and even won a few when I lived in Australia, and I spent from November 1991 - August 1992 in South East Asia where I fought in open full contact competitions in Malaysia, the Philippines and Borneo, against silat, tkd, karate, muay thai, judo/jujutsu and other kung fu fighters. We were not allowed to attack the eyes or throat, or stomp on a downed opponent. Everything else was fair game, groin included.

I really thought I'd seen it all, and I thought I knew how to fight. Then came the first UFC and I saw people being taken down and choked, arm-barred, leglocked etc, and my first thought was "It would never happen to me". But you know what? I'd had so many disappointments and revelations with pretty much every traditional style, including my own, by that stage, I went and sought out a grappler, just to see if I really could stay on my feet, and i proceeded to get my arse handed to me.

I say this with the utmost respect from my perspective of someone with 33 years training. Most traditional styles are full of people who have no idea about fighting and are so ego bound they have no desire to learn. The brazilian concept of 'vale tudo' is the best thing to happen to martial arts/martial sport in a very long time. I don't think there is a lot technically wrong with traditional martial arts, but to think they teach you all you need to know about fighting, without being modified/adjusted and trained accordingly, is naive at best and ignorant at worst.

If you really think hitting someone in the throat who is intent on hitting you back or taking you to the ground is easy, I suggest you try and do for real and see what happens. I've been there. I've tried it. It's not like the movies.

Good post.

I have trained in Hung Fa Yi Kung Fu and, no, it isn't easy to win with only strikes of a traditional type. I have worked as a doorman/bouncer for many years and can also state that MMA sporting events do not allow several key fighting choices that, when used effectively and without restraint, do much to nullify most BJJ submission/lock moves.

Factor in supreme size, strength and aggression, and a great many of these Tap-Out warriors are left with injury and smashed egos.
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« Reply #19 on: September 28, 2011, 12:33:32 PM »

Good post.

I have trained in Hung Fa Yi Kung Fu and, no, it isn't easy to win with only strikes of a traditional type. I have worked as a doorman/bouncer for many years and can also state that MMA sporting events do not allow several key fighting choices that, when used effectively and without restraint, do much to nullify most BJJ submission/lock moves.

Factor in supreme size, strength and aggression, and a great many of these Tap-Out warriors are left with injury and smashed egos.

If you've worked the door then you've modified what you've learned and you've had no choice but to go all out on occasion. This is 'real' reality training. I take offense at the typical traditionalist who free spars 3 nights a week thinking that in the same situation, they will perform the same way with equal effectiveness.

The mma craze is not the be all and end all of combatives - but as an avenue to pressure test the majority of your techniques and your psychological state, mma is excellent. And lets not forget - it IS a sport. That means it is a testing ground for people with skill and athletic ability to go against other people who are equally skilled and athletic,to see who can make their shit work best.

You put a traditionalist from a self defense based style in against someone like that - they should lose every.. single.. time. It's not the same thing - yet so many knuckleheads think it is.

I have spent almost my entire life studying and teaching kung fu and tai chi. I love them and will continue them until I am dead, but I am under no illusions as to what is and is not effective in the things I have learned. I have many many friends from many many traditional styles of martial arts. Some of them appreciate what mma has done for the martial arts. Some of them are still living under a rock.
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« Reply #20 on: September 28, 2011, 12:35:54 PM »

 Roll Eyes
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galain
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« Reply #21 on: September 28, 2011, 01:05:55 PM »

I will also add this, just because I think it's worth noting. I've visited more schools than I care to think about. Many (not all) traditional martial art dojos/kwoons/dojangs had members who thought they were the shit and acted like arrogant arsewipes.

In the sportfighting clubs I've been in, I have rarely seen this attitude at all. Most people were very friendly and welcoming. This goes equally for Singapore, Germany where I now live, Australia and even Japan. The only 'traditional' place I can think of that was as welcoming as the newer hybrid schools was Thailand, but the thai boxers are pretty secure in what they do anyway.
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« Reply #22 on: September 28, 2011, 01:14:49 PM »

WHat happens when they grab your arm and break it before you can even attempt one of your "chops"


* flair_lethal.jpg (28.39 KB, 400x267 - viewed 1700 times.)
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Bodybuilder Lex Reeves
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« Reply #23 on: September 28, 2011, 01:28:38 PM »

WHat happens when they grab your arm and break it before you can even attempt one of your "chops"
Then they get their hand shattered trying.
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« Reply #24 on: September 28, 2011, 02:33:34 PM »

Allow headbutting in MMA and 90 percent of BJJ moves from the guard(on your back) are rendered useless when you're trying to control a guys limbs and he's raining headbutts from the top position.

pretty sure headbutting was allowed in the first UFC's.......you know the ones that Royce Gracie won
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