OBAMA'S ASS-KICKING OF 3333 CONTINUES...unemployment at 2.5 yr low 8.6%

[howardroark]

not necessarily..people leave the labor force for different reasons..you are assuming that they cannot find jobs which is true in some cases but not in all..some people take a rest from work, like I did and are not actively looking for jobs..some go back to school and become students....others drop out due to illness and can't work..some just decide to retire...others leave the country....some stay home and take care of children while being supported by a spouse.....so your contention that EVERYONE who is not working is looking for work and can't find a job is bogus..

SORRY for destroying your theory

You are not destroying "my" theory, LOL. This isn't a "theory," this is something that very mainstream economists have talked about and agreed upon.

Do people leave the labor force for a variety of reasons? Yes. But the labor force continually grows because the number of people who come into working age grows. Yet since 2008, the number of people who come into working age has grown while the labor force has SHRUNK or remained the same. Why? Because jobs are so few and far in-between that people who would normally join the labor force do not do so, while those who become unemployed cannot find new jobs, and then of course there are those who leave for normal reasons (retirement, etc.).

It's important to note that this is the first time this has happened since AT LEAST the mid 70s... I wouldn't be surprised if this was the first time this has happened since the Great Depression, but unfortunately economic statistics become more unreliable the further you go back in history. This is entirely a result of the modern economic picture destroying jobs, which is forcing people out of the labor force, which in turn is artificially lowering the unemployment rate.

As someone else has stated in another post, "at this rate we'll have 0% unemployment and 80 million food stamp recipients."

[howardroark]

BTW, unemployment statistics during the Great Depression supposedly included these "discouraged workers" who were unable to find jobs. Modern unemployment statistics, even U6, only include "discouraged workers" for up to 12 months. Had we used those same statistics back then, it would be interesting to see what would have happened to the unemployment rate, considering that 30% of the labor force was unable to find a job for a good three years or more. You essentially would have seen a massive drop in the unemployment rate despite the fact that the employment picture would have barely gotten better.

See the parallels?

Shadowstats attempts to count unemployment similarly to the way the government did in the 30s... And they peg the unemployment rate at >20% right now: http://www.shadowstats.com/alternate_data/unemployment-charts

[howardroark]

More unemployed people left the labor force (190,000) than jobs were created (120,000): http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/On-the-Economy/2011/1202/Unemployment-rate-decline-not-as-good-as-it-sounds

In any other time in the past 30 years, 120,000 jobs created would have meant that the unemployment rate would have gone UP, since the labor force would have grown about twice as much.

[tonymctones]

yes good point but the Republicans as well with their free enterprise and free market policies have been on board with this as well....they favored NAFTA just like the Democrats and free trade with China which has resulted in highly unfair trade practices by the Chinese and massive deficits with them in terms of trade...

Obama has been the only president to vocally speak out against this which has irritated the Chinese....We may have the highest corporate tax rate, but its way, way down from what it used to be.....and many big corporations are paying no taxes....

the Republicans have engaged in a practice all over the U.S. of purposely defunding the government and depriving it of tax revenue through reckless tax cuts and tax breaks for the wealthy..they do this hoping to starve the government of funds so that the gov't will cut spending...but the spending cuts never come and the Republicans themselves spend a lot as well....then borrow to cover the difference..at least the Democrats want to pay (with taxes) as we go...

Rectifying the situation is tough because other nations can manufacture things much more cheaply than we can....pay people in India, China, Indonesia, etc $2.00 or less an hour?...or pay an American worker $12.00 or more an hour?..if you were a business man what would u do?

first it doesnt matter how much we cut our corp tax rate if its still the highest in the world...I dont understand how ppl on the left cant seem to understand that.

second the reps doing something doesnt justify the dems and obama doing something thats called moral equivilency and it doesnt hold any water.

third is exactly my point if its cheaper to produce things over seas where are countries going to produce them?

well how do we make it cheaper for companies to produce here? get rid of costly and useless enviromental regulations, lower the tax rate, give incentives etc...

what does obama want to do?

increase regulations, raise the tax rate and take away incentives.

AND YOURE OK WITH THIS!!!

[Soul Crusher]

http://www.businessinsider.com/the-truth-about-the-falling-unemployment-mirage-in-3-charts-2011-12



Please refute this andre

[andreisdaman]

first it doesnt matter how much we cut our corp tax rate if its still the highest in the world...I dont understand how ppl on the left cant seem to understand that.

second the reps doing something doesnt justify the dems and obama doing something thats called moral equivilency and it doesnt hold any water.

third is exactly my point if its cheaper to produce things over seas where are countries going to produce them?

well how do we make it cheaper for companies to produce here? get rid of costly and useless enviromental regulations, lower the tax rate, give incentives etc...

what does obama want to do?

increase regulations, raise the tax rate and take away incentives.

AND YOURE OK WITH THIS!!!

what you say here sounds great and you mean well..but...the facts are its government regulations which protect Americans from being used and abused in the workplace....especially those who lack education and are poor.....in countries like china you can make someone work all day for $2 an hour, make them work with no overtime, no lunch, seven days a week and they have quotas that they must get a certain amount of work done..some even have to take work home with them.....there are few benefits, often no vacation time, etc...if you are businessman and you have a captive workforce such as this, of course your goods are going to be cheaper .....

I agree that maybe we should make more incentives for businesses to manufacture here, but corporate loopholes must be closed as well.....we are losing billions of tax dollars overseas..and the rich have brainwashed guys like you into subsidizing their lifestyles "in the name of job creation"..believe me..they can afford to pay more....you and I are subsidizing their yachts, mansions, etc....you don't get it

[Soul Crusher]

Have you ever worked in a real job?   

[andreisdaman]

Have you ever worked in a real job?   

Some question coming from a fake lawyer..have you?

[Soul Crusher]

Some question coming from a fake lawyer..have you?

You know where my office is moron. 

[andreisdaman]

You know where my office is moron. 

are you a paralegal there?..or the janitor?

[Soul Crusher]

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/12/03/mark_levin_on_unemployment_numbers_and_the_shrinking_workforce.html


Andre - please refute this.   

[andreisdaman]

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2011/12/03/mark_levin_on_unemployment_numbers_and_the_shrinking_workforce.html


Andre - please refute this.   

I can't..I'm not an economist....its all too confusing...no one knows whose right or whose wrong

[Soul Crusher]

I can't..I'm not an economist....its all too confusing...no one knows whose right or whose wrong

lol!!!!!   Yet you are smart enough on this to start a thread saying obama is kicking my ass? ? ?


LMFAO!!!!

[howardroark]

Andre's response: "I don't know, therefore nobody knows."

I guess that's as good of an admission of defeat as we can hope for. Perhaps this thread should be renamed the asskicking of andre - employment at an all-time low?

[Fury]

How sad is it that people are actually celebrating 315k people falling off the rolls and the UE dropping to a mere 8.6%? Looks like Obama got his wish with that European socialism as we've got clowns now cheering UE numbers in 8s. 

[andreisdaman]

lol!!!!!   Yet you are smart enough on this to start a thread saying obama is kicking my ass? ? ?


LMFAO!!!!

unlike a lot of people on here I don't pretend that I know everything..I admit when I don't know something rather than throw out bullshit to the masses like some of you....I quoted the stats given by the gov't ....the stats show that UE rate has gone down...I made no other claims

[Soul Crusher]

unlike a lot of people on here I don't pretend that I know everything..I admit when I don't know something rather than throw out bullshit to the masses like some of you....I quoted the stats given by the gov't ....the stats show that UE rate has gone down...I made no other claims

Andre - you are the 95% 

[andreisdaman]

Andre - you are the 95% 

sigh........

[Soul Crusher]

I voted for Obama because he was cool and black.  I expected him to pay for my gas and mortgage.  I expected him to get me a job with health benefits and a decent wage.  4 years later, despite the fact that gasoline prices have doubled, the national debt has climbed $5 trillion dollars, he has given away the store to Wall Street bankers like Jon Corzine, Geithner, Gentsler, Summers, Blankfien, I have no job, black unemployment is well in to the double digits, I still support him.  He is doing a great job despite the racist GOP attempts to stop his agenda. 

Fired up – ready to go.  Yes We Can!

I am the 95%

[whork]

I voted for Obama because he was cool and black.  I expected him to pay for my gas and mortgage.  I expected him to get me a job with health benefits and a decent wage.  4 years later, despite the fact that gasoline prices have doubled, the national debt has climbed $5 trillion dollars, he has given away the store to Wall Street bankers like Jon Corzine, Geithner, Gentsler, Summers, Blankfien, I have no job, black unemployment is well in to the double digits, I still support him.  He is doing a great job despite the racist GOP attempts to stop his agenda.  

Fired up – ready to go.  Yes We Can!

I am the 95%

Well since he has given the store to Wall Street we at least know he is not a socialist commie

[howardroark]

unlike a lot of people on here I don't pretend that I know everything..I admit when I don't know something rather than throw out bullshit to the masses like some of you....I quoted the stats given by the gov't ....the stats show that UE rate has gone down...I made no other claims

The stats also show the labor force shrinking, much of the shrinkage coming from the ranks of the unemployed, despite the fact that the labor force has continually grown for the past 30 years!

[andreisdaman]

The stats also show the labor force shrinking, much of the shrinkage coming from the ranks of the unemployed, despite the fact that the labor force has continually grown for the past 30 years!

so what do you want me to do about it???...the labor force has shrunk at other times in our history....no complaints then....

accept the stats and move on....this nitpicking is really annoying

[Soul Crusher]

so what do you want me to do about it???...the labor force has shrunk at other times in our history....no complaints then....

accept the stats and move on....this nitpicking is really annoying

LMFAO!   So you agree that nothing in reality is improving? 

[andreisdaman]

LMFAO!   So you agree that nothing in reality is improving? 

you guys say that..I stated the stats..which whether you like it or not are the facts....believe it or not.....

[howardroark]

you guys say that..I stated the stats..which whether you like it or not are the facts....believe it or not.....

And you conveniently ignored the other stats in the EXACT SAME UNEMPLOYMENT REPORT REPORTING THAT THE LABOR FORCE HAS SHRUNK, AND MUCH OF THAT SHRINKAGE HAS COME FROM THE RANKS OF THE UNEMPLOYED.

Things that make you go "hmmmm."