Macy’s Fires Employee for Protecting Women’s Dressing Rooms from Cross-dresser

[LurkerNoMore]

No will else will back you up because they are not that delusional.

There is no bet because you know damn well nothing occurred.  That's why you wanted to make exemptions yesterday and now cancel it out all together.

Are you claiming that Macy's discriminated against her by not allowing her to impose her beliefs on someone else? Is that it? 

[MCWAY]

No will else will back you up because they are not that delusional.

Wrong! Beach Bum already did, shortly after I posted this thread. So, once again, you miss!!

There is no bet because you know damn well nothing occurred.  That's why you wanted to make exemptions yesterday and now cancel it out all together.

Are you claiming that Macy's discriminated against her by not allowing her to impose her beliefs on someone else? Is that it? 

I've made my statements perfectly clear. Either you get a reading tutor or purchase a Reader Rabbit disk.

[LurkerNoMore]

Wrong! Beach Bum already did, shortly after I posted this thread. So, once again, you miss!!

I've made my statements perfectly clear. Either you get a reading tutor or purchase a Reader Rabbit disk.

Maybe you can get Beach in here to pinpoint HOW her religious beliefs were discriminated against.  Because you sure as shit haven't done it.  And if you call that making your statements clear, then you are just admitting to what I have already said.   You've posted nonsense.  Not specifics. 

But continue on... since you can't tell how her discrimination occurred, then maybe you can tell me what page the Bible speaks about transgendered people and dressing rooms?  Maybe Constantine forgot to include that one.

[blacken700]

i"ll give you the reason these jesus do gooders want to control their live and yours too,they'e all the same.most are hypocrites like cain 

[Soul Crusher]

i"ll give you the reason these jesus do gooders want to control their live and yours too,they'e all the same.most are hypocrites like cain 

And you communists want to control my life as well, just in different ways.   How about both you and them, leave me the fuck alone?

[Butterbean]

^^^
so is the policy

I thought you would like this policy. 

Today Macy's dressing rooms, tomorrow gym locker rooms!

[LurkerNoMore]

I thought you would like this policy. 

Today Macy's dressing rooms, tomorrow gym locker rooms!

Butterbean, was this lady discriminated against on a religious basis?

[Butterbean]

Butterbean, was this lady discriminated against on a religious basis?

She claimed her religious beliefs stopped her from letting the man into the women's dressing room, so yes, in looking at the 2 posted policies, she was.   

Now, if the policies are more detailed, maybe that would make things more clear, but if it is as stated (simply) as in the earlier post, Macy's is at fault imo for a flawed overall policy.  And it looks as though they did throw one out in favor of the other.

Perhaps Macy's should just state they have unisex dressing rooms and potential employees would have that knowledge when deciding whether to apply there or not....also, I wonder if potential hires are instructed to read and agree to the written policy. 

Personally, one of the best sales people I've ever had is a gay man who comes in and out of the dressing area..bringing in things he thinks you'd like etc.  I have no problems w/that at all but a male customer who is a man dressed as a woman (or not) coming in there...I wouldn't feel as comfortable with. You're not as sure of his intentions....maybe he's simply shopping, maybe he's not.    There may be some men that don't want women in their dressing rooms either.....although probably a lower percentage relatively.

[tonymctones]

I thought you would like this policy. 

Today Macy's dressing rooms, tomorrow gym locker rooms!

LOL I havent seen much of the gym lately but ill try to get back into it and maybe that will change my opinion

Problem is though that if a regular guy like myself walked up there and said I was a women. They would stop me and not let me enter, yet if I dress up like a women somehow that makes it alright

[blacken700]

i didn't know macy's had a gym

[Soul Crusher]

i didn't know macy's had a gym

You seem very worked up over this.    Anything you want to share w the rest of us? 

[blacken700]

You seem very worked up over this.    Anything you want to share w the rest of us? 

all right you had to ruin the surprise, i was buying you a skirt to match the pink blouse you have and i payed a transgender person to try it on because he was the same size as you,5'2" tall.you happy now

[LurkerNoMore]

She claimed her religious beliefs stopped her from letting the man into the women's dressing room, so yes, in looking at the 2 posted policies, she was.   

Now, if the policies are more detailed, maybe that would make things more clear, but if it is as stated (simply) as in the earlier post, Macy's is at fault imo for a flawed overall policy.  And it looks as though they did throw one out in favor of the other.

Perhaps Macy's should just state they have unisex dressing rooms and potential employees would have that knowledge when deciding whether to apply there or not....also, I wonder if potential hires are instructed to read and agree to the written policy. 

Personally, one of the best sales people I've ever had is a gay man who comes in and out of the dressing area..bringing in things he thinks you'd like etc.  I have no problems w/that at all but a male customer who is a man dressed as a woman (or not) coming in there...I wouldn't feel as comfortable with. You're not as sure of his intentions....maybe he's simply shopping, maybe he's not.    There may be some men that don't want women in their dressing rooms either.....although probably a lower percentage relatively.

What part of the Bible deals with dressing rooms?

Or are you saying that Macy's religious policy allows for discrimination against others under the pretension of "religious freedom"?

Also, the only thing that occurred was that she was not allowed to impose her beliefs on others.  She could believe anything she wanted.  But she could not use her beliefs as an act of suppression upon another person. 

The fact that she even took a job at Macy's shows she isn't following her religious beliefs in the first place and just cherry picking the opportunity to use it as a tool against another being.

[Butterbean]

LOL I havent seen much of the gym lately but ill try to get back into it and maybe that will change my opinion

Problem is though that if a regular guy like myself walked up there and said I was a women. They would stop me and not let me enter, yet if I dress up like a women somehow that makes it alright

Not sure if you even need to dress like a woman though.  Seems like anyone can go into any dressing room at anytime.  They should probably just state they are unisex.

[Butterbean]

What part of the Bible deals with dressing rooms?

Or are you saying that Macy's religious policy allows for discrimination against others under the pretension of "religious freedom"?

Also, the only thing that occurred was that she was not allowed to impose her beliefs on others.  She could believe anything she wanted.  But she could not use her beliefs as an act of suppression upon another person.  

The fact that she even took a job at Macy's shows she isn't following her religious beliefs in the first place and just cherry picking the opportunity to use it as a tool against another being.

According to the article:
"The cross-dressing young man claimed that he is a “female.” Johnson said that he was wearing make-up and girl’s clothing, but clearly he was a male."


"Johnson replied that Macy’s is also non-discriminatory toward religion, and that it would go against her religious beliefs to lie that he was a woman"'

So her feeling seemed to be that she would be "lying" if she allowed a man in the female dressing room.   Ex 20 speaks to this as well as other places in the bible.

Like I said before, I wonder if she was aware of the policy before starting work there.  If she knew about it and had a problem, they should have discussed possible scenarios w/the appropriate responses and/or which policy they would favor over the other so everyone could make an informed choice.

Also, the only thing that occurred was that she was not allowed to impose her beliefs on others.  She could believe anything she wanted.  But she could not use her beliefs as an act of suppression upon another person. 

Lurker, do you see that the LGBT policy imposes some people's beliefs on others?  It results in "women's" or "men's" dressing rooms to become neither.....so people that count on or would like these dressing rooms that are stated as such to remain as such no longer have that?

[LurkerNoMore]

According to the article:
"The cross-dressing young man claimed that he is a “female.” Johnson said that he was wearing make-up and girl’s clothing, but clearly he was a male."


"Johnson replied that Macy’s is also non-discriminatory toward religion, and that it would go against her religious beliefs to lie that he was a woman"'

So her feeling seemed to be that she would be "lying" if she allowed a man in the female dressing room.   Ex 20 speaks to this as well as other places in the bible.

Like I said before, I wonder if she was aware of the policy before starting work there.  If she knew about it and had a problem, they should have discussed possible scenarios w/the appropriate responses and/or which policy they would favor over the other so everyone could make an informed choice.



Lurker, do you see that the LGBT policy imposes some people's beliefs on others?  It results in "women's" or "men's" dressing rooms to become neither.....so people that count on or would like these dressing rooms that are stated as such to remain as such no longer have that?

I did not see where the freak was trying to impose his beliefs or lifestyle on her.  I saw he was doing what he was allowed to in his rights of the company. 

Was Macy's forcing her to accept homosexuality or crossdressing or whatever?  Was Macy's telling her she couldn't have a belief against it?  No.  She could believe whatever and accept whatever, but she could not use that to deny another person something that the store point blank granted them.

No that was not the case was it? They were keeping her from imposing her beliefs on another person.  There is nothing in the Bible that addresses transgendered people.  So therefore, she had no "belief" to be violated.  If she was true to her beliefs then she would have never taken a job at Macy's because the Bible does spell out it is a sin to combine cotton and wool.  Therefore, if she was ringing up mittens or scarves or blankets or jackets, then she was directly violating her own "beliefs".  Or maybe she was refusing to sell customers those items? 

You can't cherry pick what parts of the Bible to live by when you adhere to principles of hypocrisy by ignoring other parts of it all together.

P.S.  I give you credit for articulating a much more in depth and specific answer than anyone else on this board.

[Butterbean]

I did not see where the freak was trying to impose his beliefs or lifestyle on her.  I saw he was doing what he was allowed to in his rights of the company. 

Was Macy's forcing her to accept homosexuality or crossdressing or whatever?  Was Macy's telling her she couldn't have a belief against it?  No.  She could believe whatever and accept whatever, but she could not use that to deny another person something that the store point blank granted them.

No that was not the case was it? They were keeping her from imposing her beliefs on another person.  There is nothing in the Bible that addresses transgendered people.  So therefore, she had no "belief" to be violated.  If she was true to her beliefs then she would have never taken a job at Macy's because the Bible does spell out it is a sin to combine cotton and wool.  Therefore, if she was ringing up mittens or scarves or blankets or jackets, then she was directly violating her own "beliefs".  Or maybe she was refusing to sell customers those items? 

You can't cherry pick what parts of the Bible to live by when you adhere to principles of hypocrisy by ignoring other parts of it all together.

P.S.  I give you credit for articulating a much more in depth and specific answer than anyone else on this board.

Thanks for the kind P.S.

I agree that it's not the transgendered guy's fault that this happened...the fault of this situation lies w/Macy's flawed policies imo. 

But if the reason they have the LGBT dressing room policy is because of former pressure from anyone ...then those that applied the pressure are imposing their beliefs upon others.  If it's Macy's that took it upon themselves to implement the policy, then Macy's (people) are imposing their beliefs upon others.

And, the two sections of the policy are at odds w/each other.

I'm sure you know the bible speaks against engaging in homosexual acts, but let's assume this guy was a virgin.   In regard to your statement that it doesn't  mention "transgendered"  I would submit that this scripture could apply to the situation: 1 Corinthians 6:9
Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,


But that wasn't exactly her argument, I think.  She said she believed she would have to "lie" to allow the guy into the women's dressing room.  That was her issue....so she felt doing so would constitute some kind of lie on her part.  If she knew the policy before her hire, I think she should have let the guy use the dressing room, but I'm not that lady and cannot speak on her mindset w/100% accuracy.

I think there are issues on boths sides that can be construed as pressing one's beliefs on another.  Imo, if she knew about the open dressing room policy prior to her hire, she should have let him in.  The sad thing is that this may push him further away from wanting to know God (if he doesn't) but it seems she was standing up for what she believed was the correct thing to do.


Oh, and the combining of the different fabrics is Mosaic Law.  Has nothing to do w/a Christian (who should keep moral law but not Mosaic).

[LurkerNoMore]

^^^^

That is how one presents a counter argument.  Whether it is about religion or not.  Some people on here should take note.

Whether he was a virgin or not is irrelevant to the case because there was no sexual activity going on in the dressing room.

Macy's adopting the LGBT policy was not imposing their beliefs on anyone but rather giving others the choice to identify with themselves.  It isn't like they were standing there directing people to which dressing room to use based upon appearance.  By the standard, this lady was directly imposing her beliefs on someone else.  Now let's say this person worshipped the God of Hair Straighteners or Revlon or whatever else transgendered people pray to.  And that God and his religion said they could use any dressing room they wanted.  She by then was violating their religion with her own beliefs.  How do you make a determination which religion is the "right" one in such an instance?

And if the effeminate are not allowed in heaven, I guess there is no hope for 333, Aaron carter or Justin Beiber.

[Soul Crusher]

^^^^

That is how one presents a counter argument.  Whether it is about religion or not.  Some people on here should take note.

Whether he was a virgin or not is irrelevant to the case because there was no sexual activity going on in the dressing room.

Macy's adopting the LGBT policy was not imposing their beliefs on anyone but rather giving others the choice to identify with themselves.  It isn't like they were standing there directing people to which dressing room to use based upon appearance.  By the standard, this lady was directly imposing her beliefs on someone else.  Now let's say this person worshipped the God of Hair Straighteners or Revlon or whatever else transgendered people pray to.  And that God and his religion said they could use any dressing room they wanted.  She by then was violating their religion with her own beliefs.  How do you make a determination which religion is the "right" one in such an instance?

And if the effeminate are not allowed in heaven, I guess there is no hope for 333, Aaron carter or Justin Beiber.

oR YOU KNOW WHO.   

[tonymctones]

Not sure if you even need to dress like a woman though.  Seems like anyone can go into any dressing room at anytime.  They should probably just state they are unisex.

hmm good point, that would solve the situation

[LurkerNoMore]

oR YOU KNOW WHO.   

Yes.  You!

[MCWAY]

The plot seems to be thickening at Macy's

Men Using Women’s Fitting Rooms Appears to be a Common problem at Macy’s

 

Another Macy’s employee has contacted Liberty Counsel and shared about repeated issues with men using the women’s fitting rooms. This individual asked to remain anonymous out of fear of losing her job. The employee said she constantly has to ask men to leave the women’s fitting rooms. In addition, she has been asked numerous times by mothers who have daughters in the fitting rooms to please ask the men to leave the women’s dressing rooms.

With the Christmas shopping season in full swing, customers around the country are sending Macy’s a message that such a bizarre policy is not acceptable. One woman posted on Macy’s Facebook page that her family normally spends $2,000 at Macy’s and they are planning to boycott the store.

This story of Macy’s Lesbian Gay Bisexual Transgender policy which allows men to use the women’s fitting rooms came to light when Macy’s fired Natalie Johnson from its San Antonio store after she politely told a clearly identified man that he could not re-enter the women’s fitting rooms.

Macy’s policy that allows men to use the women’s fitting rooms makes no sense. This policy has put at risk every woman shopper who enters one of these rooms.

http://www.lc.org/index.cfm?PID=14102&AlertID=1340

Tens of Thousands of People Petition Macy’s to “Protect our Women’s Fitting Rooms”



Tens of thousands of people have signed onto Liberty Counsel’s open letter asking Macy’s to change its policy that allows men to use the women’s fitting rooms. Liberty Counsel is delivering this letter today. Just last week, it came to light that a mother and her daughter were subjected to trying on clothes in Macy’s a dressing room run by a man presenting as a woman at the Galleria Mall in Dallas, Texas. This employee escorts women to the dressing rooms, entering the dressing rooms to clean out the clothes, and even providing different sized items to women while they are trying on their clothes.

Other reports are coming in from women around the country indicating that at various Macy’s stores men are routinely allowed to simply “hang out” in the women’s dressing rooms. In these situations, the men were identifying as men. One Macy’s employee said that mothers wanting to protect their young children have repeatedly asked store employees to tell the men to leave. In some situations employees refused to do so, claiming fear of a lawsuit.

Liberty Counsel’s open letter states, in part:

As an American who recognizes the crucial importance of cultural boundaries and same gender guidelines to the welfare of any society, I am appalled by your corporate decision to allow men to use whatever changing facilities they choose in Macy’s stores. This policy is both misguided and absurd. It creates an unnecessary threat to the comfort and safety of your customers and helps undermine the stability of our society! I am deeply concerned that pro-homosexual activism has brought your organization to enact such a poorly thought-out policy.

I applaud Natalie Johnson’s resolve to stand up for what she knew to be right and deny a man access to the women’s fitting room!  Macy's policy, which allows men to use the women's fitting room, is fraught with problems. This policy will cause significant issues and will alienate the majority of Macy's customers. I call on Macy’s to do the right thing by reinstating Natalie Johnson and reversing this absurd policy.  

Macy’s needs to protect women and change its policy that allows men to use the women’s fitting room. The current policy is a liability waiting to happen.

http://www.lc.org/index.cfm?PID=14102&AlertID=1343

As I suspected, guys hanging out in WOMEN'S dressing rooms (and they aren't even trannies). This policy of Macy's is beyond stupid.

[LurkerNoMore]

Sounds like you should have kept the bet.

I am sure the court will rule against Macy's.

[blacken700]

a bunch of do gooders write the Liberty Counsel= do gooder legal team,these people just can't mind their own business

[MCWAY]

a bunch of do gooders write the Liberty Counsel= do gooder legal team,these people just can't mind their own business

When women and girls are dressing in WOMEN'S dressing rooms and there are MEN in those dressing rooms, it becomes their business.

The last pitiful excuse you, Lurker, Chad, et al. kept giving was that this guy thinks or identifies himself as a girl. So, it's supposedly OK.

Now, we get reports that men (who aren't trannies) are hanging in these dressing rooms. Women are reporting them to the store employees; yet, they aren't doing JACK about it, because they're afraid of being sued.

Liberty should take this issue up. The absurdity of that screwball policy should be exposed and ultimately SCRAPPED.