The Third Depression - are we in the early stages?

[arce1988]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/28/opinion/28krugman.html

We are now, I fear, in the early stages of a third depression. It will probably look more like the Long Depression than the much more severe Great Depression. But the cost — to the world economy and, above all, to the millions of lives blighted by the absence of jobs — will nonetheless be immense.

And this third depression will be primarily a failure of policy. Around the world — most recently at last weekend’s deeply discouraging G-20 meeting — governments are obsessing about inflation when the real threat is deflation, preaching the need for belt-tightening when the real problem is inadequate spending.

[Natural Man]

tt..Too many useless people with no faith who dont contribute, not enough jobs, more and more robots... A selection has to be made. It's cyclical.

[Swlabr]

...

[outby43]

PED

[Kwon_2]

...

[Meso_z]

tt..Too many useless people with no faith who dont contribute, not enough jobs, more and more robots... A selection has to be made. It's cyclical.

Yes, you can hang yourself now. 

[pluck]

This whole so called recession/depression is a crock of shit.  The fucking media keeps reporting shit about joblessneless ...etc. etc

I live right outside of Chicago and the malls are still full of shoppers that clog the stores and spill over the parking lots. Drive on any main throughfare and the restaurants are still packed full of people.

I was in Miami/Fort Lauderdale/Tampa 2 weeks ago and more of the same...malls and restaurants still full of people.
Money is everywhere.

My girlfriend was laid off 3 years ago. She found a managerial position within 5 weeks of searching, stuck with it for since then and decided it was time for a change. She interviewed with 3 different companies for about 10 weeks (fucking insane) in the past 6 weeks she has had 3 full time jobs and quit the last 2 because each new job offer was a better paying one.

My own business if growing and thriving more and more every week that passes.

The poor and clueless will always complain and always will be poor and clueless.

Just because housing and construction industries took a nose dive, doesn't mean shit.

[aesthetics]

spending on infrastructure is down, real wages are down, tons of wealth has shifted from the middle class to the extremely rich. any of the consumer spending now is either done in speculative investment (i.e. securities, commodities that just drive up the cost of living for the rest of the people when the price of oil, wheat, gold, et cetera becomes over-inflated) or on luxury high end items, which makes sense considering the extremely wealthy were just bailed out recently and are flushed with tax payer cash, leaving the tax payers broke however.

while all of this stuff is in line with what paul krugman wants in a round-about way, though his complaint that it's just not enough of it, as he wants more govt. spending done, regardless if it's paying people to dig holes and refill it with dirt, and while it will in the nominal sense keep the economy "running" in the short term, it is very bad for the long term health of the country as none of these things are productive in any sort of way and will simply shift the problem further down into the future, where it will grow even larger. not to mention resource production and extraction has peaked already, and we're running out of materials to build all this worthless shit we are pissing away to keep the dow-jones industrial average at around ~10k so that bankers can simply get bigger bonuses.

the real truth is that we've been in a recession for the past 30 years and it will continue well into the future as nothing is being done to remedy it, only political theater to mask the real system problems while the oligarchs further plunder and enrich them selves by dismantling america from within. we (i assume most people here are under 30) will be the first of many generations who will be worse off than our parents.

[Overload]

Tell that to anyone in the AEC sector.

Architecture, Engineering and Construction firms have been cut back by 60% since 2008.

I think there is some truth in your post about media hype and whatnot, but the fact is that certain sectors are struggling to survive even in the largest cities.

I work in Houston for one of the largest land developers in the state.  Last year we billed 18.7 million.  In 2006 we billed 41 million.  We have 62 employees, in 2006 we had nearly 150.  Our clients can't get loans to build anything and all of our projects are on hold because clients aren't paying their bills.  5-10 years ago this was unheard of in this industry.  Today most of the big name AEC firms are letting people go and doing more with less.  We are only doing selective hires of people who are over qualified and are willing to work for less salary while doing the job of 3-4 people.

I know of over 10 Engineering firms that have gone out of business in the last 3 years.  The largest Architectural firm in Texas just let over 300 people go.

Sure starbucks and the malls are packed, but a lot of idiots are maxing out their credit thinking this is all going to turn around soon.

What business do you do? What about your girl? Every time one sector is down, another is up, but i promise you that i get paid to make projections and it's looking like shit for anything in the AEC world.

[reppingfor20]

This whole so called recession/depression is a crock of shit.  The fucking media keeps reporting shit about joblessneless ...etc. etc

I live right outside of Chicago and the malls are still full of shoppers that clog the stores and spill over the parking lots. Drive on any main throughfare and the restaurants are still packed full of people.

I was in Miami/Fort Lauderdale/Tampa 2 weeks ago and more of the same...malls and restaurants still full of people.
Money is everywhere.

My girlfriend was laid off 3 years ago. She found a managerial position within 5 weeks of searching, stuck with it for since then and decided it was time for a change. She interviewed with 3 different companies for about 10 weeks (fucking insane) in the past 6 weeks she has had 3 full time jobs and quit the last 2 because each new job offer was a better paying one.

My own business if growing and thriving more and more every week that passes.

The poor and clueless will always complain and always will be poor and clueless.

Just because housing and construction industries took a nose dive, doesn't mean shit.

lol living in a bubble

[Nirvana]

I'm fortunate and have a job.  Cause I'm the hardest working man on earth, anyone without a job is lazy and worthless.  I will never lose my job for any reason including injury, bad things only happen to lazy people.

[The RedMeatKid]

Who changed the title of this thread and why?

[ChevChelios]

Sons and daughters....

[howardroark]

You know how I know Krugman doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about? There was no "Long Depression." Read a little economic history.

[IronMagazine.com]

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/28/opinion/28krugman.html

We are now, I fear, in the early stages of a third depression. It will probably look more like the Long Depression than the much more severe Great Depression. But the cost — to the world economy and, above all, to the millions of lives blighted by the absence of jobs — will nonetheless be immense.

And this third depression will be primarily a failure of policy. Around the world — most recently at last weekend’s deeply discouraging G-20 meeting — governments are obsessing about inflation when the real threat is deflation, preaching the need for belt-tightening when the real problem is inadequate spending.

Published: June 27, 2010

[MikMaq]

Tell that to anyone in the AEC sector.

Architecture, Engineering and Construction firms have been cut back by 60% since 2008.

I think there is some truth in your post about media hype and whatnot, but the fact is that certain sectors are struggling to survive even in the largest cities.

I work in Houston for one of the largest land developers in the state.  Last year we billed 18.7 million.  In 2006 we billed 41 million.  We have 62 employees, in 2006 we had nearly 150.  Our clients can't get loans to build anything and all of our projects are on hold because clients aren't paying their bills.  5-10 years ago this was unheard of in this industry.  Today most of the big name AEC firms are letting people go and doing more with less.  We are only doing selective hires of people who are over qualified and are willing to work for less salary while doing the job of 3-4 people.

I know of over 10 Engineering firms that have gone out of business in the last 3 years.  The largest Architectural firm in Texas just let over 300 people go.

Sure starbucks and the malls are packed, but a lot of idiots are maxing out their credit thinking this is all going to turn around soon.

What business do you do? What about your girl? Every time one sector is down, another is up, but i promise you that i get paid to make projections and it's looking like shit for anything in the AEC world.

The obvious, the malls are still full because china is flooding us with underpriced goods, in actual fact the malls will always be full because there more able to deal with recessions.

The boomers have screwed us out of everything, our generation is fucked.

[Hulkotron]

I don't know and what's more I don't give a fuck.

[MikMaq]

I don't know and what's more I don't give a fuck.

Until it affects you and then you'll just be another 333395 bitching and moaning like a five year old.

[Soul Crusher]

Krugman is the biggest idiot on the planet.  as best his is angry little muppet.   

[240 is Back]

jobs are still out there.

but you don't just get a job because you show up - you have to be GOOD at that job.

You can't just be any 312 pound fat pig, 5 minutes from diabetes, coming in demanding health insurance.  Not anymore.

It's more competitive now.  

[Soul Crusher]

Krugman is a long running joke to people with a clue. 

[_bruce_]

After the Nixon shock it was all over.

[arce1988]

krugman = nobel prize

[Soul Crusher]

krugman = nobel prize

And?   Arafat, Gore, and Obama also have a Nobel Prize.   

Krugman is a farce calling for a space alien invasion to fix our mess.   You call that smart?   

[tbombz]

In 2008 and 2009, it seemed as if we might have learned from history. Unlike their predecessors, who raised interest rates in the face of financial crisis, the current leaders of the Federal Reserve and the European Central Bank slashed rates and moved to support credit markets. Unlike governments of the past, which tried to balance budgets in the face of a plunging economy, today’s governments allowed deficits to rise. And better policies helped the world avoid complete collapse: the recession brought on by the financial crisis arguably ended last summer.


It’s almost as if the financial markets understand what policy makers seemingly don’t: that while long-term fiscal responsibility is important, slashing spending in the midst of a depression, which deepens that depression and paves the way for deflation, is actually self-defeating.