Author Topic: So what is the best first cycle?  (Read 6799 times)

seraph

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So what is the best first cycle?
« on: December 23, 2011, 05:29:21 PM »
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Borracho

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #1 on: December 23, 2011, 06:00:40 PM »
I can't speak for anyone but myself and what my goals are. My first cycle is tbol and deca. Why? Cause I wanna keep my hair. I don't care what people on this board or other boards think and why should you?
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Borracho

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #2 on: December 23, 2011, 06:40:48 PM »
It has nothing to do with what people on here think... wtf lol.  I want to have good information from professionals to guide me in the right way for performance and health reasons.  People talk crap about test for a cycle on a daily basis here but don't back it up with any proof.  Doctors prescribe patients test only cycles all the time. So on one hand you have doctors saying a test only cycle is healthy yet you have forum people here saying its garbage.  I basically made this topic to see if some one with knowledge could actually provide proof is to why a test only cycle is not the best first time cycle.  I also have a feeling that all the people saying it is not are just clowns who have no clue.


ALSO I KNOW NOT EVERY ONE HERE SAYS A TEST ONLY CYCLE IS BAD THIS IS DIRECTED TOWARDS THE PEOPLE WHO DO. 

Professional what? lol

Doctors do not recommend any cycles. Testosterone is prescribed to those with low levels of the hormone that's it. 
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DorianGrey

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #3 on: December 23, 2011, 07:16:18 PM »
in for input...

getbig is the only place where tren is recommended as a first cycle....i missed out lol.

nosleep

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #4 on: December 23, 2011, 07:28:33 PM »
Professional what? lol

Doctors do not recommend any cycles. Testosterone is prescribed to those with low levels of the hormone that's it. 


PROFESSIONAL GETBIGGERS BRO. WE'RE PRO GB'ERS.

in for input...

getbig is the only place where tren is recommended as a first cycle....i missed out lol.

U KNOW THE LOGIC BEHIND IT MADE SENSE THEN, BUT NOW IT DOESNT. WHY NOT TREN FOR YOUR FIRST CYCLE?

PEOPLE SAY DONT DO IT TILL YOUR X(FILL IN 2ND, 5TH OR EVEN 10TH LOL) CYCLE, BUT TRUTH IS IF TREN SIDES EXIST TO YOU THEY WILL ON YOUR VERY FIRST CYCLE OR YOUR TENTH CYCLE.YOU AREN'T RUNNING AWAY WITH THEM, MIGHT AS WELL RUN WITH THEM AND SOLVE HOW TO COUNTERACT THOSE.
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SmoofCat

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #5 on: December 23, 2011, 07:35:35 PM »
I am only 25, but I have as much hormone experience as most people who "cycle" who are 50. This is basically my life and I am a legitimate contender to go pro one day. So take my advice for what it is, but don't expect me to spit some bro science at you right now (i.e. the alpha-keloids that testosterone produces are simply more effective than the celluloid inducing binders of trenbolone, despite the fact that trenbolone is 7 times more anabolic... etc etc etc). This is just real talk from my massive amount of experience:

A test only cycle is not fucking smart as your first cycle or ever. Testosterone in a cycle is for many purposes, but mainly libido. Think of it as your balls. But there are a list of other compounds that are straight up superior for muscle building purposes. However, they will often shut you down, hence the need for synthetic testosterone. Tren for example will build thick, lean muscle. On tren ace, you will build more lean muscle in one week than you would have otherwise built on a 3 month cycle of test @ 500 mg per week. Think of tren as your heart. But tren often leads to libido problems, and it definitely does shut you down. Here is where testosterone comes in- the synthetic testosterone raises your libido again and balances everything out.

But you are probably scared of running tren. You have read 1001 threads condemning the first time cycler for thinking about running tren. You have also read 25,000 threads telling you to run test only as your first cycle. So you definitely don't want to run tren, because you are convinced that you need to run "at least 3 cycles before you run tren". You have also read 1,000 threads on that topic on other boards. So I introduce either deca or eq, and in my recommendation you should run both. But you don't want to run both deca and eq at the same time because you have read 183 threads last month on the other board about not running deca with eq, because it will "shut you down too hard." So pick one or the other.

Now I'll cut the shit and give it to you straight. If you run the deca, don't do it for less than 10 weeks. Do it at least @ 250 mg per week and at the most 500 mg per week, and you can shoot it only once per week if you want. The esters will allow that. If you choose the EQ, run at the minimum at 600 mg per week (the conversion is NOT 1:1 from deca to eq, so 250 mg deca does NOT equal 250 mg EQ) and at the maximum 900 mg per week. If you choose EQ, run it for at least 12 weeks, but I would highly recommend 16 weeks at least on it. EQ takes a little while longer to really kick in.

Then add in your 500 mg of testosterone on top of either of these two cycles and you are golden. You will gain so much more lean, real muscle than you would have on a 10-12 week test alone cycle.

There is a reason we dislike test only cycles in the thunder dome (get big). It is because if you run a testosterone cycle without anything else you will look like a furniture mover, not a bodybuilder. And also, a testosterone only cycle is worthless without gh. There is a saying that for every gram of testosterone, you need 5 iu of GH to make it work. That saying has a great deal of merit to it.

And heed my last piece of advice strongly- there is a TON of fake deca and eq out there. Do your research. Because you might take my advice and run a 16 week cycle of EQ @ 600 mg and test cyp @ 500 mg, and purchase both compounds, but the EQ turns out to actually not be EQ, and in all likelihood if it is counterfeit EQ it is testosterone. So in that situation, you end up running 1,100 mgs of testosterone a week.

Do your homework. You found the right board, trust me. Now take our advice and never fall victim for another internet steroid cliche again. Here at the thunder dome we shatter cliches and turn skinny kids into local champion; local champ into "I just won my ticket to nationals"; national invite into pro card. The other boards give you a sticky and they repeat the information over and over from that sticky like a bunch of parrots, and overall hormone IQ is very low.

nosleep

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #6 on: December 23, 2011, 07:42:57 PM »

And heed my last piece of advice strongly- there is a TON of fake deca and eq out there. Do your research. Because you might take my advice and run a 16 week cycle of EQ @ 600 mg and test cyp @ 500 mg, and purchase both compounds, but the EQ turns out to actually not be EQ, and in all likelihood if it is counterfeit EQ it is testosterone. So in that situation, you end up running 1,100 mgs of testosterone a week.

DID NOT READ ALL. BUT PEOPLE READ THIS.LEGIT HORMONAS.

IF U GOT A GREAT SOURCE, NEVER WORRY ABOUT THIS SWITCH UP OF EQ FOR TEST OR PRIMO FOR MASTERONA...HENCE,NEVER BUY UNLESS YOU KNOW YOUR SOURCE.
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SmoofCat

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #7 on: December 23, 2011, 08:44:14 PM »
DID NOT READ ALL. BUT PEOPLE READ THIS.LEGIT HORMONAS.

IF U GOT A GREAT SOURCE, NEVER WORRY ABOUT THIS SWITCH UP OF EQ FOR TEST OR PRIMO FOR MASTERONA...HENCE,NEVER BUY UNLESS YOU KNOW YOUR SOURCE.

Exactly. Listen to this guy's advice. I wish I had taken this advice over all of the baloney cliche advice on the other boards as a young man. This is the advice that gets you ahead in this game, and the failure to heed this advice is what gets you gyno and makes you look like Larry the Furniture Mover.

Legit... Hormonas...

Arnold jr

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #8 on: December 23, 2011, 10:46:09 PM »
There's a lot of good points in this thread, but I still don't understand why so many here seem to think a testosterone only cycle is such a horrible thing. I always here talk here about how test only will leave you puffy looking, and that can be true, but at the same time it can be false. I know plenty of guys who have dieted down for a show using only testosterone or testosterone and little else because that's all they could afford, and they ended up looking great. I've done it myself.

Now, I won't say you have to run a test only cycle for your first cycle or that you have to run X amount of cycles before you can add Trenbolone or anything like that....that's all ridiculous talk. I will say testosterone is the most important steroid IMO and will do far more for you than just protect your libido. I've run a bazillion test only cycles, I've run plenty of cycles with everything under the sun in a stack...you can make anything work.

SmoofCat

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #9 on: December 23, 2011, 11:24:01 PM »
There's a lot of good points in this thread, but I still don't understand why so many here seem to think a testosterone only cycle is such a horrible thing. I always here talk here about how test only will leave you puffy looking, and that can be true, but at the same time it can be false. I know plenty of guys who have dieted down for a show using only testosterone or testosterone and little else because that's all they could afford, and they ended up looking great. I've done it myself.

Now, I won't say you have to run a test only cycle for your first cycle or that you have to run X amount of cycles before you can add Trenbolone or anything like that....that's all ridiculous talk. I will say testosterone is the most important steroid IMO and will do far more for you than just protect your libido. I've run a bazillion test only cycles, I've run plenty of cycles with everything under the sun in a stack...you can make anything work.


I was only using "testosterone as a libido booster" as support for the "testosterone is to your balls as tren is to your heart" analogy. Let me be literal here for a moment- test does far more for you than just boost your libido. That being said, I still view it as significantly less effective than deca, eq, and tren and I would go as far as to say that I think higher of masteron, halo and primo than I do of testosterone. That is just my personal opinion of testosterone for bodybuilding purposes. It has its time. If you are on year round, there are definitely times when you are running a gram or close to it of test. I know some guys who run more than a gram of test. However, the biggest and best physiques I know were not built of test. Test was used as a supplement to support their libidos as the other drugs built them.

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #10 on: December 23, 2011, 11:26:35 PM »
I went with Turinabol  for 4 weeks 20,30,40,50 ED and used some suspension after the first week. I only ran the cycle for 6weeks I got huge just off the tbol in a week. after 3 weeks I had almost gained 20 pounds and i was honestly pleased so i didnt see a point of running the cycle longer than a few more weeks just to see if the strength gains got more intense. I would definatley say use a oral and a low dose test for your first cycle.

Test E-250-500mg-8-12 weeks
Dbol-10,20,30,40mg foir the first 4 weeks only jump up 10mg every week

make sure you have everything before you start get your pct in check before you start that is a stupid mistake alot of first timers make they orer it towards the end but get puffy aching nips within a few weeks. you could also throw in EQ to this cycle. I wouldn't go with deca till your 2nd cycle. 400mg EQ stack great with Test E and Dbol. you will get 20 pounds easy if you train and eat right if you are a responder and get good gear.. I was sent highly potent gear my first cycle. very potent!

Borracho

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #11 on: December 24, 2011, 04:51:46 AM »
PROFESSIONAL GETBIGGERS BRO. WE'RE PRO GB'ERS.

U KNOW THE LOGIC BEHIND IT MADE SENSE THEN, BUT NOW IT DOESNT. WHY NOT TREN FOR YOUR FIRST CYCLE?

PEOPLE SAY DONT DO IT TILL YOUR X(FILL IN 2ND, 5TH OR EVEN 10TH LOL) CYCLE, BUT TRUTH IS IF TREN SIDES EXIST TO YOU THEY WILL ON YOUR VERY FIRST CYCLE OR YOUR TENTH CYCLE.YOU AREN'T RUNNING AWAY WITH THEM, MIGHT AS WELL RUN WITH THEM AND SOLVE HOW TO COUNTERACT THOSE.

oh yeah  ;D

But you see op...you will get different responses as to which "cycle" to run your first go at it. This is the best board online cause we don't regurgitate the same advice over and over like on other boards like smoofcat mentioned. There is freedom here where as on another board if someone was to suggest something other than 500 mg of test e for 12 weeks he would get flamed and have their input censored.

How can or why should every single beginner use the same generic first time cycle??? I never understood that...does that make sense to you?
Does everyone train the same, eat the same or have the same goals too?

And if someone here says that a test only cycle sucks than that's their personal opinion. There is no predominant thought here like on the other boards. You have your own goals and you have to be the one that chooses which side effects you are willing to put up with if they do arise. Not that you will get them all from certain steroids but if they do, you're the one that has to deal with them not some random person on a steroid board.
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Voland

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #12 on: December 24, 2011, 05:05:55 AM »
Unfortunately you won't know what the best cycle would've been until you've experimented with several compounds, doses, combinations etc. 
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abijahmaniaco

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #13 on: December 24, 2011, 05:36:43 AM »
safest most fool proof cycle imo is testosterone enanthate and nandrolone decanoate at a dosage of between 375 and 600 mg each (depending on your height and size already). no reason to do an oral first cycle. just unnecessary liver strain.

after running that for eight to 12 weeks. take at least four weeks off and then jump on a more specialized-to-your-goals stack.

balzac

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #14 on: December 24, 2011, 02:23:26 PM »
250 mg test enanthat e5d for 20-25 weeks...

abijahmaniaco

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #15 on: December 24, 2011, 03:48:23 PM »
What dosage would you recommend for 205 pounds at 12% bf.

500 or 600 mg

Also Any issue with running test sustanan instead of test enanthate?

nah. that's fine. i just avoid sustanon bc i think it's over rated. enanthate is cheaper and you get more test mg per mg. however the difference is negligible.

whitewidow

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #16 on: December 24, 2011, 04:03:49 PM »
safest most fool proof cycle imo is testosterone enanthate and nandrolone decanoate at a dosage of between 375 and 600 mg each (depending on your height and size already). no reason to do an oral first cycle. just unnecessary liver strain.

after running that for eight to 12 weeks. take at least four weeks off and then jump on a more specialized-to-your-goals stack.

Id go with the Test E 250mg-500mg a week but EQ 400mg not deca. I would also use a oral to jumpstart. dbol or tbol. first timers respond great to orals. really only a little Test E say 250mg one shot a week and 30mg dbol should get a first timer 20 pounds if the gear is potent and they know how to train and eat like a bodybuilder

SmoofCat

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« Reply #17 on: December 24, 2011, 04:23:08 PM »
Id go with the Test E 250mg-500mg a week but EQ 400mg not deca. I would also use a oral to jumpstart. dbol or tbol. first timers respond great to orals. really only a little Test E say 250mg one shot a week and 30mg dbol should get a first timer 20 pounds if the gear is potent and they know how to train and eat like a bodybuilder

In a way I agree with this. Going with EQ over Deca might be the smart move. Because IMO deca leads to a lot more sides than tren does for me. I really never understood the propaganda out there on the boards about awful tren sides. And I have run everything from home cooked fina to top chef batches @ up to a gram per week. It is when I start using deca @ over 500 mg per week that I start to get funny sides, and I find EQ to be a very smooth experience even at up to a gram. The anxiety can be a little intense, but as I have said repeatedly, there are many ways to beat your anxiety (obviously I am not referring to narcotics. narcotics + AS: maniac).

abijahmaniaco

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #18 on: December 24, 2011, 04:48:47 PM »
Id go with the Test E 250mg-500mg a week but EQ 400mg not deca. I would also use a oral to jumpstart. dbol or tbol. first timers respond great to orals. really only a little Test E say 250mg one shot a week and 30mg dbol should get a first timer 20 pounds if the gear is potent and they know how to train and eat like a bodybuilder

my first cycle i gained 30 lbs on locally cooked test and deca. clean too. albeit watery.

i went off for too long hunting for another local source.

when i finally went back on i had lost most of my gains and that time i did test at 750, deca at 600, and five weeks of dbol tapering up to 50 mg a day. i gained 34lbs in 12 weeks this time, but judging by the mirror i know that that extra four lbs was just water. :-\ so what was really the point in adding an oral and upping the dosages? none that i can see. you can only gain so fast and only so much on aas before you have to explore other mechanisms like gh and insulin anyway.

so in my experience orals are just not necessary imo ever. you can accomplish the exact same thing with injectables without unnecessary liver toxicity. (remember: "all aas drugs activate the same cellular receptor, and as such share similar protein anabolizing properties.") and always remember more does not necessary equate more gains; although it does always equate more side effects!

let me share with you all something that i feel is very important especially in light of the information bfg is sharing and the out of this world dosages he's condoning
this is a paragraph from william lleyllen's anabolics 10th edition:
Quote
the dosage used is important in determining the level of benefit received. anabolic/androgenic steroids tend to be most efficient at promoting muscle gains when taken at a moderately supratherapeutic dosage level. below this (therapeutic), potential anabolic benefits are often counterbalanced, at least to some extent, by the suppression of endogenous testosterone. at very high doses (excessive supratherapeutic), smaller incremental gains are noticed (diminishing returns). in the case of testosterone enanthate or cypionate, for example, a dosage of 100 mg per week is considered therapeutic, and is generally insufficient for noticing strong anabolic benefits. when the dosages is in the 200-600 mg per week range, however, the drug is highly efficient at supporting muscle growth (moderate supratherapeutic). above this range, a greater level of muscle gain may be noticed, but the amount will be small in comparison to the dosage increase.

abijahmaniaco

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Re: !
« Reply #19 on: December 24, 2011, 04:52:17 PM »
In a way I agree with this. Going with EQ over Deca might be the smart move. Because IMO deca leads to a lot more sides than tren does for me. I really never understood the propaganda out there on the boards about awful tren sides. And I have run everything from home cooked fina to top chef batches @ up to a gram per week. It is when I start using deca @ over 500 mg per week that I start to get funny sides, and I find EQ to be a very smooth experience even at up to a gram. The anxiety can be a little intense, but as I have said repeatedly, there are many ways to beat your anxiety (obviously I am not referring to narcotics. narcotics + AS: maniac).

this is the first i've ever heard someone say they experience more sides on deca than tren! although i've experienced none on either. i love steroids. ;D

SmoofCat

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Re: !
« Reply #20 on: December 24, 2011, 05:06:19 PM »
this is the first i've ever heard someone say they experience more sides on deca than tren! although i've experienced none on either. i love steroids. ;D

tren makes me feel great, deca often makes me feel lazy and bloated. as i have said before, i can deal with the anxiety related effects of tren, because i am a bi of a jedi. but the bloat from deca is a bit hard to deal with, especially when i used to run it without gh

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Re: !
« Reply #21 on: December 24, 2011, 05:07:16 PM »
tren makes me feel great, deca often makes me feel lazy and bloated. as i have said before, i can deal with the anxiety related effects of tren, because i am a bi of a jedi. but the bloat from deca is a bit hard to deal with, especially when i used to run it without gh

HAVE YOU RAN NPP BEFORE? AND CAN YOU COMPARE THOSE TWO?
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SmoofCat

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Re: !
« Reply #22 on: December 24, 2011, 05:10:33 PM »
HAVE YOU RAN NPP BEFORE? AND CAN YOU COMPARE THOSE TWO?

yes i have and they are both amazing for the joints. with npp you retain significantly less water. however, obviously the downside is pinning.

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #23 on: December 24, 2011, 09:16:53 PM »
i don't know why people keep making an emphasis on "first" and "second cycle"

generally, all that means is that people haven't run a lot of gear and are inexperienced with various compounds other than test deca or d-bol. so the logical next step in their cycle progression, whatever cycle number it is (since it's irrelevant) would be to just add more steroids. i mean, that's really all there is too it, bodybuilding is all drugs anyways. keep adding more until you get to the size you want.

SmoofCat

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Re: So what is the best first cycle?
« Reply #24 on: December 24, 2011, 10:05:23 PM »
You are some one who says a test only cycle is not good.  So what would your first cycle be?

ok I think the better question at this point is how often do you want to pin? Can you imagine pinning 4-7 times a week, or would you be much happier with just pinning 2-3 times per week? Also, what are your goals with this cycle. Describe them in detail. Give me more information one what you are after and I am going to construct you something tailored to what you are after.