My girlfriend's 18 year old brother is about to run a very, very stupid cycle.

[local hero]

And he is not taking my advice on why to not run this. I am going to show him this page tomorrow with everyone's input on this matter. For some reason he has a misconception that more testosterone: better build.

He has never run a cycle before, but is absolutely at his natural peak. He actually trained well up to this point and built a solid natural base.

HAVING SAID ALL OF THAT, he is about to run this mess of a cycle:

1,500 mg of test E per week
1,000 mg of tren E per week
1,000 mg of mast E per week


I feel very guilty because he asked me the other day what compounds I was on, and I told him honestly: test, tren, masteron. However, I didn't mention that I was on a gram of both tren and masteron and only 100 mg of test per week. I never expected or knew that he had a legit source to get gear. And while I will not mention where he got it, the kid somehow magically pulled a shit load of primo gear out of his ass yesterday and showed me (we train together once a week).

He went and did a little research (on other sites obviously) and came to the conclusion that he had to run significantly more test than tren. hence the 1500 mg per week, which i told him will be a fucking disaster, and he is not listening.

Can some people just help me set the kid straight please. Let him know what this cycle will make him look like (especially since he is not running gh).

Sorry for this weird request. I just really care about this kid, and he is basically family, and I hate to see him preparing to hurt himself like this.

then you go on to say he's only 170 somthing and cant even bench 225 for 1 rep?.... he's no where near where he should be at, thats barely scratching the surface of whats attainable as a young natural laddie

ive no problem with starting young, but you should have some solid base behind you 1st at least

[ChevChelios]

I benched 225 for 8 naturally,went on AAS and now i'm stuck at 315 for 5.Guess i need to up the dose,only 250 test-e and 300 tren-a p/w.The thing is i can progress further on these doses,it's the T3 and letro that ruines my strength.I dropped the letro 1 week ago,planning on lowering the t3,see how things work up 

[FAST LANE]

I benched 225 for 8 naturally,went on AAS and now i'm stuck at 315 for 5.Guess i need to up the dose,only 250 test-e and 300 tren-a p/w.The thing is i can progress further on these doses,it's the T3 and letro that ruines my strength.I dropped the letro 1 week ago,planning on lowering the t3,see how things work up 

T3 lowers strength??

[LittleJ]

That's more to do with you being African American.

I went to a white school.

[LittleJ]

i have never heard of this in my life and i played at the highest level of high school ice hockey in the usa essentially. at least 50% of us were on hormones. not consistently (we all cycled), but over half of us were on.

They tested us for everything. We had like 10 random drug test during the season but none during the offseason. I think the punishment for failing a test was 50-60 miles before you could play again.

[makaveli25]

They tested us for everything. We had like 10 random drug test during the season but none during the offseason. I think the punishment for failing a test was 50-60 miles before you could play again.

That sucks. I played d3 college ball. They didn't test anyone.

[Max B]

i have never heard of this in my life and i played at the highest level of high school ice hockey in the usa essentially. at least 50% of us were on hormones. not consistently (we all cycled), but over half of us were on.

where'd you play bro?

[SmoofCat]

He decided to go with the Tren ace instead?

P.S. might wanna get him a jail pass ... 

yes yes, i was incorrect originally about the esther.

he has all short esters, except for the test, which is in fact test E.

[SmoofCat]

then you go on to say he's only 170 somthing and cant even bench 225 for 1 rep?.... he's no where near where he should be at, thats barely scratching the surface of whats attainable as a young natural laddie

ive no problem with starting young, but you should have some solid base behind you 1st at least

eh i disagree actually. he just does not have the build to ever bench 225 for lots of reps as a natural. i could see him getting 5 maybe if he focused on only bodybuilding and had no life and ate every 2 hours etc etc etc, no social life, no dates because he has to eat his meal every 2 hours. that kind of thing.

he has legitimately been training naturally now for a number of years, and he started @ 5'10'' and 110 lbs. And in the last year, he has not made any gains whatsoever and is stuck at 170, and his nutrition is on point, and his training is too. He is just a naturally frail mother fucker. Not all of us are born strong. I mean this kid would naturally, if he never touched a weight, be about 135 lbs @ 5'10'' as an adult. So I think he is g2g now.

I happened to be a different case when I was just getting into hormones, because I just was blessed with a significantly larger build than him. I couldn't be below 180 lbs if I tried @ 6 foot. In fact, I was skinny as fucking hell @ 180 before I really got serious about lifting.

Now this kid is almost my height, but he could never be my pre hormone weight or strength without hormones. God didn't create us all equally, and I see no reason to tell him he can't start using hormones.

HOWEVER using the amount he is using is a fucking joke. I think he should be on 500 mg prop and 200 mg tren ace every week for his first cycle, and that is absolutely it. That is the absolute maximum.

[makaveli25]

eh i disagree actually. he just does not have the build to ever bench 225 for multiple reps as a natural. he has legitimately been training naturally now for a number of years, and he started @ 5'10'' and 110 lbs. And in the last year, he has not made any gains whatsoever and is stuck at 170, and his nutrition is on point, and his training is too. He is just a naturally frail mother fucker. Not all of us are born strong. I mean this kid would naturally, if he never touched a weight, be about 135 lbs @ 5'10'' as an adult. So I think he is g2g now.

I happened to be a different case when I was just getting into hormones, because I just was blessed with a significantly larger build than him. I couldn't be below 180 lbs if I tried @ 6 foot. In fact, I was skinny as fucking hell @ 180 before I really got serious about lifting.

Now this kid is almost my height, but he could never be my pre hormone weight or strength without hormones. God didn't create us all equally, and I see no reason to tell him he can't start using hormones.

HOWEVER using the amount he is using is a fucking joke. I think he should be on 500 mg prop and 200 mg tren ace every week for his first cycle, and that is absolutely it. That is the absolute maximum.


EDIT- I just want to add that I already can foresee a lot of people arguing that "anyone" can bench 225 for multiple reps as a natural if they work hard enough. This is fucking bullshit. Some people just are born with genetically terrible builds, and it takes them years to even get up to 135 lbs. This kid is one of these people. He is fucking capped at 170 naturally. I mean he has a size 27 waist. 170 is a feat for him. I am proud that he even got there and stayed under 12%. Also, if numbers mean anything, to his credit he built a strong squat for his pathetic size. He was doing 315 for reps the last time I saw him in the gym working legs as a natural. So he just simply has one of those naturally girly upper bodies. He would wear roughly a size 36 suit coat. I mean his upper body is borderline child status.

Good post man. I couldn't rep 225 until I got a few weeks into my first cycle of dbol and sustanon. I trained my ass off to. I had 8 years of hard training under my belt I was 21 when I started my first cycle. I just wasn't built to lift a lot of weights. Very lanky arms. I was middle distance runner in highschool very skinny. I can get 315 a couple of times now. Just not built for strenght like some of you. My natural training was legit to. We had a very serious strength and conditioning coach when I played college ball. Our training was hard and serious.

[Max B]

lol not to sound like a dick but i was repping 225 for 12-15 easily as a natural.  but yeah were all built differently and ive always been a muscular dude but its hard for me to get truly shredded and have to use diuretics to drop water etc.

[makaveli25]

lol not to sound like a dick but i was repping 225 for 12-15 easily as a natural.  but yeah were all built differently and ive always been a muscular dude but its hard for me to get truly shredded and have to use diuretics to drop water etc.

I couldn't even come close to that but I could dunk a basketball and run the 800meters under 2 minutes. God gave us all different gifts.

[chess315]

I benched 225 for 8 naturally,went on AAS and now i'm stuck at 315 for 5.Guess i need to up the dose,only 250 test-e and 300 tren-a p/w.The thing is i can progress further on these doses,it's the T3 and letro that ruines my strength.I dropped the letro 1 week ago,planning on lowering the t3,see how things work up 

thats about right steroids really arent good for much more then 30% strength increase at best which you would have gained some of that strength steroids or not

[Ripped190]

thats about right steroids really arent good for much more then 30% strength increase at best which you would have gained some of that strength steroids or not

Is this really true? I always thought that steroids made u crazy strong but I have been training natural for 9 years and then this year started taking roids and my strength is about the same i'm just a lil more muscular and a lot leaner.

[randy841]

Is this really true? I always thought that steroids made u crazy strong but I have been training natural for 9 years and then this year started taking roids and my strength is about the same i'm just a lil more muscular and a lot leaner.

Not sure about crazy strong. But strength/gains are dosage dependent, alongside one's diet and training.
The more you do the better gains you get.

[SmoofCat]

lol not to sound like a dick but i was repping 225 for 12-15 easily as a natural.  but yeah were all built differently and ive always been a muscular dude but its hard for me to get truly shredded and have to use diuretics to drop water etc.

Max I was naturally so thin, but due to my frame I was benching 225 for reps naturally. However 315 would NEVER happen for me naturally. I have a 6'6 wingspan (I can grab a basketball rim without any step, just jumping off two feet from a stand still.)

We're all built differently

[Max B]

ya i know you're type of build, guys like you usually have the illusion that your so much bigger than u really are when ur in good shape. me in the other hand im as thick as a cock  

i wear an 18inch dress shirt 35/36 fill it out fully ... right now im running red tops and 800mgs of total gear (off season) you could say till i bring the tren in again late spring. ill be on prob 1.5 grams over the spring and summer, prob doing 10iu EOD red tops/ new kigs.   im 5'11 215 right now

[qbkilla]

eh i disagree actually. he just does not have the build to ever bench 225 for lots of reps as a natural. i could see him getting 5 maybe if he focused on only bodybuilding and had no life and ate every 2 hours etc etc etc, no social life, no dates because he has to eat his meal every 2 hours. that kind of thing.

he has legitimately been training naturally now for a number of years, and he started @ 5'10'' and 110 lbs. And in the last year, he has not made any gains whatsoever and is stuck at 170, and his nutrition is on point, and his training is too. He is just a naturally frail mother fucker. Not all of us are born strong. I mean this kid would naturally, if he never touched a weight, be about 135 lbs @ 5'10'' as an adult. So I think he is g2g now.

I happened to be a different case when I was just getting into hormones, because I just was blessed with a significantly larger build than him. I couldn't be below 180 lbs if I tried @ 6 foot. In fact, I was skinny as fucking hell @ 180 before I really got serious about lifting.

Now this kid is almost my height, but he could never be my pre hormone weight or strength without hormones. God didn't create us all equally, and I see no reason to tell him he can't start using hormones.

HOWEVER using the amount he is using is a fucking joke. I think he should be on 500 mg prop and 200 mg tren ace every week for his first cycle, and that is absolutely it. That is the absolute maximum.

im confused by this post about his level of dedication.  so he isn't willing to eat every 2-3 hours but what do you mean his nutrition is on point?  i know some guys say eat when hungry and eat fruit putting and eat berries and bannas with your peptides and humanafort lol....but ive got the best results with an old school trainer where i eat steak and potato and nuts and weigh my food out and eat it every 2-3 hours.  so this guy is not willing to eat every 2-3 hours?  i think that would be the first thing he needs to do before he even thinks about juice.  im just confused by your description of his level of dedication.

[Max B]

im confused by this post about his level of dedication.  so he isn't willing to eat every 2-3 hours but what do you mean his nutrition is on point?  i know some guys say eat when hungry and eat fruit putting and eat berries and bannas with your peptides and humanafort lol....but ive got the best results with an old school trainer where i eat steak and potato and nuts and weigh my food out and eat it every 2-3 hours.  so this guy is not willing to eat every 2-3 hours?  i think that would be the first thing he needs to do before he even thinks about juice.  im just confused by your description of his level of dedication.

Lol not sure if serious......

[SmoofCat]

im confused by this post about his level of dedication.  so he isn't willing to eat every 2-3 hours but what do you mean his nutrition is on point?  i know some guys say eat when hungry and eat fruit putting and eat berries and bannas with your peptides and humanafort lol....but ive got the best results with an old school trainer where i eat steak and potato and nuts and weigh my food out and eat it every 2-3 hours.  so this guy is not willing to eat every 2-3 hours?  i think that would be the first thing he needs to do before he even thinks about juice.  im just confused by your description of his level of dedication.

well i frankly disagree with you 100 %.

there is no need to torture yourself natural bodybuilding.

what is the point?? build a base. do research. then use hormones.

and yes, 172 lbs @ 5'10'' and lean is a base. trust me, as someone who truly understands hormones on a deep level, i am saying the kid was ready for hormones. he has a pathetic frame with the wrists and ankles of a woman, but the fact that he got to a lean 172 with that frame is a testament to how far he came as a natural, and the years he put into it. this kid would otherwise be 130 lbs roughly if not for the weights. that is the type of frame he has.

however, the cycle he decided to do is not g2g by me. the cycle he decided to go with is something a pro would run, along with mucho gh to take advantage of the 1.5 grams of test in there.