Author Topic: When and Why PCT  (Read 2392 times)

Arnold jr

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When and Why PCT
« on: April 22, 2012, 02:55:35 PM »
Over the last year or so, getbig has largely become the anti-PCT bodybuilding board, and for the life of me I do not understand why. I've yet to hear anyone offer up a reasonable explanation. Most will say, just don't come off and you don't need a PCT...that's true, if you do not come off you won't be implementing a PCT plan. Even so, everyone, every last person on earth comes off at some point. A lot of guys do not want to stay on year round or the vast majority of the year like a lot of you guys do...I would say the guys who stay on year round fall into a very small minority. Further, if you stay on year round or most of it year after year, at some point in time your life is going to change, there's going to be a reason for you to come off. Saying you're never going to come off is an irresponsible statement as you have no way in predicting the future.

At any rate, if you're going to be off for 12wks or more, a PCT plan just makes sense. No, there's no PCT plan on earth that's going to promote a full recovery on its own, you won't finish your PCT plan and have your test levels back to where they were prior to supplementation just because you ran a PCT plan. However, you will stimulate production, provide your body an adequate amount of testosterone to function properly and you'll do so all the while your natural levels continue to climb.

More importantly, this just protects your health. Low testosterone levels are tremendously damaging to your health as this is one of the single most important hormones your body produces. A lot of guys assume if their libido isn't severely suppressed and they don't have any erectile dysfunction problems they're in the clear, but those are just two aspects of a low level condition, two of many and not everyone falls prey to all the symptoms.

Granted, if you are going to be off for an extended period of time, your natural levels will increase on their own assuming you didn't suffer from a low level condition prior to supplementation and did not severely damage your HTPA during supplementation with poor practices, this is true, they will increase on their own. But it's going to be much slower, and there will be an extended period of time where your levels are extremely low and there's simply no logical reason for putting your body under this kind of stress when a simple and extremely cheap PCT plan can prevent it.

Anyway, that's my two cents.

shreddedtobones

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Re: When and Why PCT
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2012, 04:20:47 PM »
Great thread! What would you recommend as a PCT for a very mild cycle?

Arnold jr

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Re: When and Why PCT
« Reply #2 on: April 22, 2012, 04:49:37 PM »
Great thread! What would you recommend as a PCT for a very mild cycle?

A few wks of Clomid or Nolvadex. Suppression is suppression, and general Nolva or Clomid plans will work for most cycles. Depending on the harshness of the cycle, this is when you might consider adding in HCG or extending the Nolva or Clomid use.

StackedDec

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Re: When and Why PCT
« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2012, 04:55:37 PM »
I am a fan of Nov and Clom.  I am also a fan of natural recovery.  It takes me about 30 days to recover naturally from a low level cycle, not a bb cycle.  If I use clomid it shortens to about 2 and a half to 3 weeks.  I dont like the fact that clomid gives me acne and takes some of the gains away, nut if I am shut down hard, it is a wonder drug.  Nov doesnt do nearly as much to get your natural test started, but it will do as much or more to stop the estrogen related sides when on, and when coming off.  Both are needed, but clomid is more important for guys who arent so concerned with the look, like BB concerned.  Just guys looking to get huge, ripped and strong, keep their gains, both are useful.

randy841

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Re: When and Why PCT
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2012, 05:12:42 PM »
PCT is often not emphasized, as everyone (me included) nowadays seem to be doing long cycles. It's still best to keep in the back of the mind the proper methodology, and to keep ancillaries on hand if forced to stop cold turkey or/and just choosing to rest for a while.


Borracho

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Re: When and Why PCT
« Reply #5 on: April 22, 2012, 05:57:56 PM »
Over the last year or so, getbig has largely become the anti-PCT bodybuilding board, and for the life of me I do not understand why. I've yet to hear anyone offer up a reasonable explanation. Most will say, just don't come off and you don't need a PCT...that's true, if you do not come off you won't be implementing a PCT plan. Even so, everyone, every last person on earth comes off at some point. A lot of guys do not want to stay on year round or the vast majority of the year like a lot of you guys do...I would say the guys who stay on year round fall into a very small minority. Further, if you stay on year round or most of it year after year, at some point in time your life is going to change, there's going to be a reason for you to come off. Saying you're never going to come off is an irresponsible statement as you have no way in predicting the future.

At any rate, if you're going to be off for 12wks or more, a PCT plan just makes sense. No, there's no PCT plan on earth that's going to promote a full recovery on its own, you won't finish your PCT plan and have your test levels back to where they were prior to supplementation just because you ran a PCT plan. However, you will stimulate production, provide your body an adequate amount of testosterone to function properly and you'll do so all the while your natural levels continue to climb.

More importantly, this just protects your health. Low testosterone levels are tremendously damaging to your health as this is one of the single most important hormones your body produces. A lot of guys assume if their libido isn't severely suppressed and they don't have any erectile dysfunction problems they're in the clear, but those are just two aspects of a low level condition, two of many and not everyone falls prey to all the symptoms.

Granted, if you are going to be off for an extended period of time, your natural levels will increase on their own assuming you didn't suffer from a low level condition prior to supplementation and did not severely damage your HTPA during supplementation with poor practices, this is true, they will increase on their own. But it's going to be much slower, and there will be an extended period of time where your levels are extremely low and there's simply no logical reason for putting your body under this kind of stress when a simple and extremely cheap PCT plan can prevent it.

Anyway, that's my two cents.

Can you explain why you stated that timeline I bolded above please. I'm gonna be moving to another planet so I won't be able to bring my gear... so I'll be coming off for some time.
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Arnold jr

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Re: When and Why PCT
« Reply #6 on: April 22, 2012, 06:13:30 PM »
Can you explain why you stated that timeline I bolded above please. I'm gonna be moving to another planet so I won't be able to bring my gear... so I'll be coming off for some time.

Fair question.

Well, if you're not going to be off that long, all you'll do is stimulate production only to shut it right back down...not only does that not make any sense I can't imagine it being the healthiest thing in the world to do to your body. As is the case, once you complete a PCT plan, which is going to take 4-6wks, although stimulating production is a big part of the idea another part is simply letting your body normalize...letting it have a period to do all it does on it's own. There's nothing really all that magical about the 12wk mark, but much less would make a PCT pointless in my opinion.

Borracho

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Re: When and Why PCT
« Reply #7 on: April 22, 2012, 06:33:16 PM »
Fair question.

Well, if you're not going to be off that long, all you'll do is stimulate production only to shut it right back down...not only does that not make any sense I can't imagine it being the healthiest thing in the world to do to your body. As is the case, once you complete a PCT plan, which is going to take 4-6wks, although stimulating production is a big part of the idea another part is simply letting your body normalize...letting it have a period to do all it does on it's own. There's nothing really all that magical about the 12wk mark, but much less would make a PCT pointless in my opinion.

Cool.

I actually started nolva at about 60mgs last thursday and I already felt some action going on down there if that makes any sense. At this point I'm torn whether I'm gonna come off till I get settled in or indefinitely....for the time being. But now I'm thinking...shit just keep at it for now and once I get settled in keep going lol.

I'm very new to this stuff arnold jr....no turning back now huh?
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Max B

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Re: When and Why PCT
« Reply #8 on: April 22, 2012, 09:02:55 PM »
I actually run clomid while on cycle in bursts since i pretty much stay on all year, it helps with out alot of things and is a safer version of HCg in my opinion as my balls stay full and my loads huge...  arnold pretty much convinced me to stay away from hcg unless i truly had no sperm count and i was trying to the girl prego

Overload

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Re: When and Why PCT
« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2012, 11:10:45 AM »
All great points that i agree with 100%.

I was on for almost 4 years straight and I used Clomid for about a month. I was feeling like crap for a while but after a few months my test levels came back and i started feeling like me again. I always used to blast and cruise never thinking about coming off and I'm glad i used Clomid when i did. I was never really a fan of HCG, but i used it several times as part of my PCT. The best PCT i ever ran was just straight Clomid at 50-100mg ED for a few weeks.

Clomid tends to make people moody or emotional, but it didn't really bother me that much.

These days i would cruise rather than come off, but that doesn't mean everyone should do this. People really should be having bloodwork done so they know exactly what is going on inside them. PCT will always have its place no matter what cycles we run. Like Arnold said, we all have to come off some time.


8)

Arnold jr

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Re: When and Why PCT
« Reply #10 on: April 23, 2012, 12:06:26 PM »
I actually run clomid while on cycle in bursts since i pretty much stay on all year, it helps with out alot of things and is a safer version of HCg in my opinion as my balls stay full and my loads huge...  arnold pretty much convinced me to stay away from hcg unless i truly had no sperm count and i was trying to the girl prego

I've actually never really thought of this, but if it would work and help I'd be a much bigger fan of on-cycle Clomid as you described over HCG all day long.