Author Topic: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention  (Read 8711 times)

Dos Equis

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #50 on: May 05, 2012, 08:12:55 PM »
We don't have a democracy, we have a republic. There's a difference and you may want to ask yourself what it is one day.


Thanks for clearing that up.   ::)

avxo

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #51 on: May 05, 2012, 08:36:55 PM »
Thanks for clearing that up.   ::)

You're welcome. ;)

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Soul Crusher

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #53 on: May 06, 2012, 04:04:56 PM »
Paul wins majority of delegates from Maine GOP
Associated Press ^ | 5/6/12 | Glenn Adams
Posted on May 6, 2012 6:44:53 PM EDT by SmithL

AUGUSTA, Maine (AP) -- With Mitt Romney's nomination all but decided, Ron Paul supporters wrested control of the Maine Republican Convention and elected a majority slate supporting the Texas congressman to the GOP national convention, party officials said as the two-day convention neared its end Sunday. The results gave the Texas congressman a late state victory.

(Excerpt) Read more at hosted.ap.org ...

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #54 on: May 06, 2012, 04:32:59 PM »
Paul wins majority of delegates from Maine GOP
Associated Press ^ | 5/6/12 | Glenn Adams
Posted on May 6, 2012 6:44:53 PM EDT by SmithL

AUGUSTA, Maine (AP) -- With Mitt Romney's nomination all but decided, Ron Paul supporters wrested control of the Maine Republican Convention and elected a majority slate supporting the Texas congressman to the GOP national convention, party officials said as the two-day convention neared its end Sunday. The results gave the Texas congressman a late state victory.

(Excerpt) Read more at hosted.ap.org ...

Win.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #55 on: May 06, 2012, 05:14:01 PM »
Ron Paul supporters capture majority of Nevada’s national delegates
Las Vegas Sun ^ | 05/06/2012 | By Anjeanette Damon
Posted on May 6, 2012 8:07:18 PM EDT by redreno

Republican presidential hopeful Ron Paul captured the majority of Nevada’s national delegates early Sunday, overwhelming likely nominee Mitt Romney with an organized contingent who easily took control of the state convention.

Paul’s supporters won 22 of the 25 national delegate slots up for election at the state convention in Sparks on Saturday. Romney won three.

Another three automatic delegates are expected to support Romney, meaning Romney will have six supporters in the delegation and Paul will have 22.

(Excerpt) Read more at lasvegassun.com ...

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #56 on: May 06, 2012, 05:36:26 PM »
d

Skip8282

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #57 on: May 06, 2012, 05:56:29 PM »
It's undemocratic to have a person run in 50 primaries/caucuses, lose every single one, finish dead last in the popular vote, but still "win" at the end of the day.  That candidate would not be who the people wanted or voted for. 






True, it would be very undemocratic.

I'm at a crossroads though of thinking that him getting in, even if sneaky, may be the best thing.  But, maybe I'm just being a self-righteous douchebag.  If it's the people's will to keep him out...so be it.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #58 on: May 06, 2012, 05:59:40 PM »



True, it would be very undemocratic.

I'm at a crossroads though of thinking that him getting in, even if sneaky, may be the best thing.  But, maybe I'm just being a self-righteous douchebag.  If it's the people's will to keep him out...so be it.


The trash at the Repub establishment set the rules for the primary which favored mittens and if Paul can use those rules to get in or get what he wants so be it.

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #59 on: May 06, 2012, 06:48:39 PM »

The trash at the Repub establishment set the rules for the primary which favored mittens and if Paul can use those rules to get in or get what he wants so be it.
Thats the way I look at it.
The establishment is rewriting the rules or breaking them to keep him out, im gonna laugh my fucking ass off if he uses their own rules to win.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #60 on: May 07, 2012, 08:20:05 AM »
Ron Paul Could Still Win Enough Delegates To Deny Mitt Romney The Republican Nomination
 The American Dream ^ | 5/7/2012 | Staff

Posted on Monday, May 07, 2012 10:45:57 AM by IbJensen





Despite what you may have heard from the mainstream media, Mitt Romney does not have the Republican nomination locked up. In fact, he is rapidly losing delegates that almost everyone assumed that he already had in the bag.

To understand why this is happening, you have to understand the delegate selection process. Each state has different rules for selecting delegates to the Republican national convention, and in many states the "voting" done by the public does not determine the allocation of delegates to particular candidates at all. And the truth is that delegates are the only thing that really matters in this race.

In state after state, the Ron Paul campaign is focusing on the delegate selection process with laser-like precision, and it is paying off big time. At this point, there is still a legitimate chance that Ron Paul will be able to win enough delegates to deny Mitt Romney the nomination on the first ballot at the Republican national convention in Tampa. If Romney does not have the 1,144 delegates that he needs on the first ballot, then it becomes a brokered convention and anything becomes possible at that point.

Sadly, most Americans have no idea how this process really works.

For example, originally we were all told that Mitt Romney won Iowa.

Then, later on we were told that a mistake was made and that Rick Santorum actually won Iowa.

Well, it turns out that Ron Paul actually won 20 out of the 28 delegates in Iowa. That is because the process of actually selecting the delegates occurred long after the voting by the public was over.

So what happens if the Ron Paul campaign is able to produce similar results in state after state?

The Ron Paul campaign is very organized, very motivated and they understand the rules of the game. As a recent Politico article detailed, there are huge amounts of unbound delegates out there that are still up for grabs....

There are roughly 30 states and territories where delegates aren’t bound to a particular candidate. The majority of the other states, according to a number of party officials, call for delegates to be bound for a first round of balloting but not the ensuing rounds.

“The dirty little secret is: At the end of the day, these guys and gals can vote any way they want,” said a Republican who has attended national conventions for decades. “Each state has different (laws) on pledged delegates.” In many states, the "official" results of voting done by the public mean next to nothing. The talking heads on television often tell us how many delegates are "projected" to go to a particular candidate, but as we have seen in Iowa and in so many other states, those "projections" are basically meaningless.

A recent Salon article discussed how the delegate selection process really works and how the Ron Paul campaign is using these rules to shake up the game....

In many caucus states, the “official” results that most people saw this winter were from nonbinding straw polls conducted in conjunction with precinct-level caucuses. But when it comes to choosing national convention delegates, the real action is at district caucuses and state conventions. In the past, this distinction hasn’t mattered much, but for the Paul forces – who lack the numbers to win statewide primaries but have the devotion to pack any room, anywhere, at any time – it has offered an inviting loophole. When turnout is small and no one is looking, the Paul folks can win, and that’s what’s been happening in a number of states.

To Paul die-hards, this will all culminate in a surprise for the ages in Tampa, with the political world suddenly realizing that Romney actually doesn’t have the 1,144 delegates needed to win the nomination, thereby allowing Paul to extract major concessions or even steal the nomination for himself. So could Ron Paul really deny Mitt Romney the Republican nomination?

At this point, nobody really seems to know what the real delegate count is.

Websites such as The Real 2012 Delegate Count are more accurate than most sources in the mainstream media, but even that site has been underestimating the true number of Ron Paul delegates.

Right now, Mitt Romney is not anywhere close to having the number of delegates that he needs for the nomination and Ron Paul just keeps picking up more delegates with each passing week.

For example, a Washington Post article that was posted on Sunday reported that Ron Paul just achieved a stunning delegate victory in Nevada....

Despite former Massachusetts governor Mitt Romney’s overwhelming victory in the Nevada caucuses, Texas Rep. Ron Paul has won a majority of the state’s delegates to the party’s national convention later this year in Tampa, Florida.

Thanks to organized Paul supporters, who have been working to increase their candidate’s support at state conventions around the country, 22 of the 25 Nevada delegates up for grabs will be Paul supporters. (Another three are automatic delegates.) That was a state that Romney supposedly "won".

It looks like Romney has a real problem.

In state after state, Ron Paul is gobbling up delegates. The following are quotes from a recent Huffington Post article about what the Ron Paul campaign has been able to achieve in the past few weeks....

-"Sure enough, Paul has already won 20 out of the 24 delegates allocated in Minnesota, by winning a majority of the congressional district contests."

-"In Louisiana, Paulites "dominated" the congressional district caucuses this past Saturday, according to the New Orleans Times-Picayune. Paul's supporters carried four of the state's congressional districts, and are guaranteed at least 17 of 46 delegates in the Bayou State, with the potential to pick up more at the state convention on June 2."

-"The other state that Benton likely has his eye on is Colorado, where the Denver Post reported in mid-April that Paul supporters and Santorum backers combined forces to win a "stunning upset" at the state convention, guaranteeing that about half of the state's 33 delegates will be for Paul in August."

And look what just happened in Maine according to USA Today....

In votes leading to the close of the two-day Maine convention, Paul supporters were elected to 21 of the 24 delegate spots from Maine to the GOP national convention in Tampa, Fla.

So Ron Paul is definitely accumulating a huge pile of his own delegates, but even many so-called "pledged delegates" for Romney could end up playing a huge role for Ron Paul.

In some states, Ron Paul supporters have been getting elected into delegate slots that are supposed to go to Romney. This is highly unusual, and it could really shake things up at the national convention. As a Salon article recently explained there will be quite a few Ron Paul supporters that will actually be going to Tampa "disguised" as Romney delegates....

Besides the pledged delegates he’s won so far and the extras he’s collecting through caucuses and state conventions, Paul will also have some supporters disguised as Romney delegates.

To understand how this works, just consider his campaign’s mischief in Massachusetts, where Romney won 72 percent of the primary vote – and with it, a monopoly on the state’s pledged convention delegates. But to determine who would fill those pledged delegate slots, the state GOP held caucuses recently, and the Paul crowd came out in force, gobbling up 16 of the 19 available positions. In how many other states will this happen, or has it already happened?

But those delegates are required to vote for Romney, right?

Not so fast.

The Ron Paul campaign could actually ask those "disguised" Romney delegates to abstain during the first round of voting in Tampa. If Romney did not win on the first ballot, those delegates would then become unbound and would be able to support Ron Paul.

In fact, Ronald Reagan considered using this tactic against Gerald Ford in 1976. The following is from a 1976 article entitled "Reagan Forces May ‘Steal’ Ford Votes"....

“In secret strategy sessions, Reagan aides have toyed with the idea of asking delegates to abstain as long as their state laws require them to honor the primary verdicts.

This would prevent the President from riding up an early-ballot victory. Then, in subsequent ballots, they could legally switch to Reagan.

Delegates have abstained from voting before. Back in 2008, at least 14 delegates abstained from voting at the Republican national convention.

So what would happen if the Ron Paul campaign was able to get 100 or 150 "Romney delegates" to abstain from voting during the first ballot in Tampa?

That is a very intriguing question.

And remember, Rick Santorum and Newt Gingrich also have significant numbers of delegates pledged to each of them.

So Ron Paul does not need to accumulate 1,144 delegates himself to deny Mitt Romney the nomination on the first ballot. He just needs to keep Romney from getting to 1,144.

The race for the Republican nomination is not over.

You can find a state by state breakdown of delegate voting rules right here.

It is not too late to get involved.

If nobody gets to 1,144 on the first ballot in Tampa, it becomes a "brokered convention" and anyone can become the nominee - even someone that is not running right now.

So if you are not satisfied with Mitt Romney as the Republican nominee, don't lose hope yet.

The game is still being played.

It would be a challenge, but if his supporters get energized enough, it certainly is possible that Ron Paul could still win enough delegates to deny Mitt Romney the Republican nomination on the first ballot in Tampa.

And if that happens, anything is possible.


howardroark

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #61 on: May 07, 2012, 09:18:59 AM »
I don't remember "vehement" denials.  What I remember telling you is the the person who gets to 1144 after winning the necessary number of states will be the nominee.  And that's exactly what's going to happen. 

You clearly said that the number of bound delegates coming out of these states would represent the popular vote in the non-binding straw polls. The OP of this thread is you admitting that you're a bumbling idiot and basically had no clue what you were talking about.

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #62 on: May 07, 2012, 09:42:26 AM »
You clearly said that the number of bound delegates coming out of these states would represent the popular vote in the non-binding straw polls. The OP of this thread is you admitting that you're a bumbling idiot and basically had no clue what you were talking about.

Some people are incapable of independent critical thinking.  If he hasn't unlocked his mind at this point there is no hope. 
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Dos Equis

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #63 on: May 07, 2012, 12:44:41 PM »
Ron Paul supporters capture majority of Nevada’s national delegates
Las Vegas Sun ^ | 05/06/2012 | By Anjeanette Damon
Posted on May 6, 2012 8:07:18 PM EDT by redreno

Republican presidential hopeful Ron Paul captured the majority of Nevada’s national delegates early Sunday, overwhelming likely nominee Mitt Romney with an organized contingent who easily took control of the state convention.

Paul’s supporters won 22 of the 25 national delegate slots up for election at the state convention in Sparks on Saturday. Romney won three.

Another three automatic delegates are expected to support Romney, meaning Romney will have six supporters in the delegation and Paul will have 22.

(Excerpt) Read more at lasvegassun.com ...


Meh.  Doesn't matter.  Assuming they actually get seated, they'll be voting for Romney on the first ballot at the convention or they will get removed. 

Dos Equis

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #64 on: May 07, 2012, 12:46:40 PM »



True, it would be very undemocratic.

I'm at a crossroads though of thinking that him getting in, even if sneaky, may be the best thing.  But, maybe I'm just being a self-righteous douchebag.  If it's the people's will to keep him out...so be it.

Yeah.  This whole process is supposed to be about letting the voters decide.  And after 42 state contests, they've decided they don't want Ron Paul.  It's really ironic that some of his supporters mention "liberty" so much while at the same time try to disenfranchise millions of voters. 

Dos Equis

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #65 on: May 07, 2012, 12:51:14 PM »
You clearly said that the number of bound delegates coming out of these states would represent the popular vote in the non-binding straw polls. The OP of this thread is you admitting that you're a bumbling idiot and basically had no clue what you were talking about.

What I clearly said is the candidate with the required number of delegates will be the nominee.  Just like Nevada.  Romney won the popular vote in Nevada.  The "Ron Paul" delegates will either vote for Romney or get removed.  That is what will happen for every state Romney won.  There isn't going to be a brokered convention.   ::)

I actually talked to a Hawaii delegate today who will be attending the convention.  I asked him about the Nevada and Maine results and he rolled his eyes.  Pretty funny.   :)  His word:  "futile."  He also said he thinks the Ron Paul supporters are "crazy."  No prompting from me.   :)

But it's good that you kids are getting so involved in the process.  Keep up the good fight.  Stay involved.   

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #66 on: May 07, 2012, 03:11:33 PM »
Yeah.  This whole process is supposed to be about letting the voters decide.  And after 42 state contests, they've decided they don't want Ron Paul.  It's really ironic that some of his supporters mention "liberty" so much while at the same time try to disenfranchise millions of voters. 

I'm getting sick of your ignorance.

Dos Equis

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #67 on: May 07, 2012, 03:20:50 PM »
I'm getting sick of your ignorance.

There is a really complicated way to deal with it:  don't read what I post or engage me.   :)

It is Paulbots like you who help prevent Ron Paul from being taken seriously. 

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #68 on: May 07, 2012, 07:49:40 PM »
MAY 6, 2012, 8:39 PM
Still in the Race, and Plotting a Path to the Convention

By MICHAEL D. SHEAR
The marquee names in the cast of the 2012 presidential election are Mitt Romney and Barack Obama. But in the days ahead, watch out for a somewhat forgotten member of the extras: Ron Paul.

Ben Margot/Associated PressRon Paul in April.
Mr. Paul, below, a Texas congressman, officially remains in the hunt for the Republican nomination. And now, his well-organized network of faithful supporters is causing trouble for Mr. Romney at state party conventions around the country.

In state after state, Mr. Paul’s libertarian-minded army of volunteers is trying to seize delegates from Mr. Romney, taking over party chairmanships and ousting longstanding party officials with ties to Mr. Romney.

Nothing Mr. Paul is doing threatens Mr. Romney’s hold on the nomination. But the actions could have an impact at the Republican National Convention on these fronts:

THE DELEGATES In essence, Mr. Paul is doing what Rick Santorum and Newt Gingrich had threatened to do — use gatherings of conservative voters at state party conventions to peel away delegates that were awarded to Mr. Romney during the primaries and caucuses.

He is having some success.

In Nevada on Saturday, Bob List, a former governor and a Romney supporter, lost his seat on the Republican National Committee (and his ticket to the convention) to a backer of Mr. Paul, according to The Las Vegas Review-Journal.

A headline from The Portland Press Herald in Maine tells the story there: “Ron Paul Supporters Take Over Maine G.O.P. Convention.” Supporters of Mr. Paul were elected chairman and secretary of the state convention.

In Iowa, Mr. Paul’s supporters dominated the selection of at-large delegates, according to The Iowa Republican. And in Alaska, his supporters grabbed the convention chairmanship as well, says The Alaska Dispatch.

THE TALLY Thanks to Mr. Paul’s supporters, he will arrive in Tampa, Fla., for the Republican convention this summer with more delegates than many media tallies would suggest.

That will not give him a real shot at the nomination, but it might give him the ability to make a ruckus while he is there. The more delegates he has, the better chance he might have to prevent Mr. Romney from being nominated on the first ballot.

Even if that does not happen, Mr. Paul could use a larger number of delegates as leverage for a better speaking slot at the convention. Or he could negotiate with Mr. Romney’s people for a bigger role for his son, Senator Rand Paul of Kentucky.

THE PLATFORM But Mr. Paul’s main goal is most likely to put himself at the center of shaping the party’s official platform at the convention.

The platform lays out where the party stands on social, economic and military issues, and it is written by a committee that typically operates at the direction of the nominee — in this case, Mr. Romney.

But delegates for Mr. Paul could try to upset that arrangement by pushing hard to be included in the platform debates. Mr. Paul’s views on the Federal Reserve, Iraq and Afghanistan, drug policy, health care and the deficit are very different from Mr. Romney’s.

In the end, Mr. Romney’s allies are likely to win those debates. Modern political conventions have become largely ceremonial affairs, and Mr. Paul probably will not change that, even with the extra delegates he is amassing.

THE YOUTH VOTE There is one other danger for Mr. Romney as his political team tries to deal with Mr. Paul.

Many of Mr. Paul’s supporters across the country are young voters Mr. Romney will need in November as he competes with President Obama. In some places, the youth vote — if it turns out — could be decisive.

As a result, Mr. Romney cannot afford to treat Mr. Paul in a dismissive way that could turn off his supporters. That might give Mr. Paul even more leverage at the convention as he seeks to advance his movement and his issues.

Dos Equis

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #69 on: May 07, 2012, 10:45:37 PM »

That will not give him a real shot at the nomination, but it might give him the ability to make a ruckus while he is there. The more delegates he has, the better chance he might have to prevent Mr. Romney from being nominated on the first ballot.


Correct.  They're just going to alienate a lot of people, then probably disappear when Romney is nominated. 

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #70 on: May 08, 2012, 04:38:15 AM »
BB,

If you had to choose to win against Obama with Ron Paul, or lose against obama with Mitt ROmney...

Which would you choose?

You don't have to answer, of course.

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #71 on: May 08, 2012, 06:38:42 AM »
msnbc attacking ron paul for his delegates stategy.   but chuck todd admitted RP's crowds are much bigger than Romney's.

In Maine  - 21 of the 24 delegates in Maine (a state mitt won) are supporting Ron paul.

Nevada - Romney won - but RP SUpporters just won 22 of the 25 delegates.  They CANNOT vote for ron paul - but they can skip voting.  So Romney would get 3 delegates there and fall 22 short there.

Mass - Romney won 70% of vote.  But 16 of 38 delegate seats belong on Ron Paul.

WOW - Paul delegates who are required to vote Mitt actually CAN not vote at all. 


SUPPOSE Ron Paul delegates have 30 to 40% of the delegates... something that is loooking like a possibility - Does Mitt put him on the ticket?  Or just limp out of the convention looking rather impotent and limp d*cked?

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #72 on: May 08, 2012, 06:41:03 AM »
msnbc attacking ron paul for his delegates stategy.   but chuck todd admitted RP's crowds are much bigger than Romney's.

In Maine  - 21 of the 24 delegates in Maine (a state mitt won) are supporting Ron paul.

Nevada - Romney won - but RP SUpporters just won 22 of the 25 delegates.  They CANNOT vote for ron paul - but they can skip voting.  So Romney would get 3 delegates there and fall 22 short there.

Mass - Romney won 70% of vote.  But 16 of 38 delegate seats belong on Ron Paul.

WOW - Paul delegates who are required to vote Mitt actually CAN not vote at all. 


SUPPOSE Ron Paul delegates have 30 to 40% of the delegates... something that is loooking like a possibility - Does Mitt put him on the ticket?  Or just limp out of the convention looking rather impotent and limp d*cked?


If romney put RP as Veep or gave him a spot as Treas Sec. Romney would do himself a ton of good. 


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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #73 on: May 08, 2012, 06:49:35 AM »

If romney put RP as Veep or gave him a spot as Treas Sec. Romney would do himself a ton of good. 



I'l say it right now.  Mitt adds Ron Paul and he wins this race running away.

Mitt and Ron Paul would have to work things out, maybe paint it as a union of moderate and far-right conservatism. 

It'd be unbeatable.  I know getbiggers deny it, but a lot of ron paul supporters (anti-war, anti-bush repubs) did vote obama last time.

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Re: Paul campaign has new tactic to win delegates, hijack GOP convention
« Reply #74 on: May 08, 2012, 06:53:05 AM »
I'l say it right now.  Mitt adds Ron Paul and he wins this race running away.

Mitt and Ron Paul would have to work things out, maybe paint it as a union of moderate and far-right conservatism. 

It'd be unbeatable.  I know getbiggers deny it, but a lot of ron paul supporters (anti-war, anti-bush repubs) did vote obama last time.


ron Paul would get Mittens the additional 3%-5% planning on sitting it out and that would be enough to push him over the top easily. 

Mittens would also get the Ron Paul army hopefully to mobilize online and on college campuses to take on the marxists and communists backing that treasonous piece of garbage in office now.