Author Topic: Does wisconsin matter?  (Read 4533 times)

Straw Man

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #50 on: June 05, 2012, 08:44:05 PM »
You think the Supreme Court made the right decision on the Citizens United case?

corporations are people my friend

Jesus died for the sins of corporations like Exxon and BP


Soul Crusher

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #51 on: June 05, 2012, 08:44:49 PM »
corporations are people my friend

Jesus died for the sins of corporations like Exxon and BP




LOL.   Always an excuse.   Don't you grasp that you ideology. Is failed? 

240 is Back

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #52 on: June 05, 2012, 08:46:50 PM »
Where were you with this horseshit whining when Obama outspent McCain?  I guess Obama bought the election in 2008. Right?

YES.  If their money was equal, it would have gone down to the wire.  Mccain was stuck with public money.  Obama had so much money he couldn't spend it all at the end - remember the 30 minute commercial in every state on network TV... all while mccain was splitting his last $ up between battleground states?

of course Obama won in 2008 because he had more money.  Common sense.

Straw Man

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #53 on: June 05, 2012, 08:52:45 PM »

LOL.   Always an excuse.   Don't you grasp that you ideology. Is failed? 

english please

Soul Crusher

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #54 on: June 05, 2012, 08:54:18 PM »
english please


Landslide coming in November.     



dario73

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #55 on: June 05, 2012, 08:57:15 PM »
corporations are people my friend

Jesus died for the sins of corporations like Exxon and BP



HEHEHE. Poor imbecile.

MCWAY

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #56 on: June 05, 2012, 08:57:31 PM »
YES.  If their money was equal, it would have gone down to the wire.  Mccain was stuck with public money.  Obama had so much money he couldn't spend it all at the end - remember the 30 minute commercial in every state on network TV... all while mccain was splitting his last $ up between battleground states?

of course Obama won in 2008 because he had more money.  Common sense.

More money doesn't equate to victory; I believe I mentioned the biggest example of that earlier.

With that said, McCain learned the hard way that you DO NOT let the left define the rules of engagement. Thanks to the Citizens United ruling, conservatives can get ALL the campaign $$$$ they need to go toe-to-toe with their liberal opponents. And, THAT'S what has the lefties FUMING!!!

240 is Back

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #57 on: June 05, 2012, 09:15:00 PM »
More money doesn't equate to victory;

A stunning 94% of the time, the candidate who spends the most money on their campaign wins the election

I'm sure as it goes from a 1.1-to-1 ratio, up to a 12-to-1 ratio, the odds of the bigger spender winning goes up too ;)

Soul Crusher

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #58 on: June 06, 2012, 12:01:23 PM »
Wisconsin speaks. Again.
By endorsing Walker's cost cuts, taxpayers make public spending nationwide an issue for Nov. 6 and beyond


http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-edit-wisconsin-20120606,0,5928310.story




With their ballots Tuesday, a majority of Wisconsin voters endorsed dramatic changes Gov. Scott Walker has delivered: Taxpayers see the $1 billion in taxpayer money that Walker's ideas have empowered state and local officials to save. They see that property taxes have fallen on his watch. They see that, rather than decimating government workforces, the cost-cutting has averted layoffs of many teachers and other public employees.

Through his signature Act 10, which became law not quite a year ago, Walker and his legislative allies have restructured how state and local governments work — the scope of their activities and the compensation they pay. This is the fourth election, beginning with the general election of 2010, in which Wisconsinites essentially have said they support that aggressive restructuring.

Many of those voters also expect that, going forward, the dividends for Wisconsin residents, their school districts and other governments will continue to grow. As old labor contracts expire, public officials will write into the new contracts the other Walker-inspired personnel provisions — such as higher (but still relatively inexpensive) employees' contributions to their pension and health plans — that have lowered government expenses. New labor pacts, that is, should keep reducing government costs across Wisconsin.

On Tuesday evening, CBS News issued early exit polling results that attest to how sophisticated the voters immersed in this passionate Wisconsin debate over taxes and spending have become. And how sharply divided they are. The Wisconsin electorate spends its time bivouacked in battle-ready encampments.

Some 54 percent of voters told pollsters they have a favorable view of government employees unions; 43 percent do not. That said, some 50 percent of voters approve of Walker's restrictions to collective bargaining; 48 percent do not. More generally, CBS reported, 54 percent of voters think government should have a more limited role in solving problems; 42 percent say government should do more.

But the rancor preceding Tuesday's election, the strong voter turnout and the urgency for both sides to explain What This Means will influence the five months between now and Nov. 6. Democratic and Republican pols coast to coast see taxpayers in traditionally liberal-leaning, high-taxes, high-services Wisconsin saying they want to cut government costs, debts and compensation. The American Enterprise Institute calculates that even after Act 10, the source of so many accusations of oppression, the average state worker receives wages and benefits of $81,637, versus $67,068 for a similarly skilled private sector worker. X minus Y equals (gulp) $14,569.

On Tuesday, a majority of the voters who for a year and a half have spent the most time weighing those sorts of numbers reaffirmed that they think their Wisconsin governments had grown too elephantine, too expensive.

There's another elephant in the room: Act 10 ended the compulsory collection of union dues by government employers. It turns out that when workers have a free choice of whether to keep paying, many decide that it isn't worth the money. We were surprised last week by a Wall Street Journal report that Wisconsin membership in the American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees plummeted from 62,818 in March 2011 to 28,745 in February 2012. At the American Federation of Teachers, 6,000 of 17,000 Wisconsin members have walked away.

Drop-offs that stark have implications not only for the unions, but also for politicians who rely on union donations to fund their campaigns.

After Walker's victory, the implication of which we're surest is this: Government spending and taxpayer debt, the issues that spectacularly animated the politics of the 2010 election cycle, will be potent in 2012. Wisconsin is but one reason. Turmoil in European nations that spent and borrowed themselves into disaster will focus Americans on what can happen when public officials spend money they don't have.

Wisconsin voters again have affirmed their decision:

Spending discipline is the order of the day.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #59 on: June 06, 2012, 12:49:05 PM »
White House Wisconsin Spin Won’t Wash


Jonathan S. Tobin | @tobincommentary 06.06.2012 - 1:30 AM
















Given the decisive nature of Scott Walker’s recall victory, it’s not likely that Democrats who were prepared to cry foul if they lost in a squeaker will be talking about a “stolen election” after he won with 54 percent of the vote. Instead, the main Democratic talking point in the days after their recall debacle will be to claim that not only is it not a harbinger of more defeats in November but that it may not even have an impact on how Wisconsin will vote for president. Democrats were encouraged by exit polls that showed President Obama holding a big lead over Mitt Romney among recall voters. However, any liberal enthusiasm about the finding is bound to be diminished by the fact those polls were obviously skewed toward Democrats because the 50-50 split they predicted on the recall was disastrously wrong.
 
But the White House spin that the recall will have no impact on what happens in the fall is not just wrong because of the faulty exit polls. After months of attempts to interpret Republican and Democratic primary results in terms of their predictive value for a general election, Wisconsin didn’t just provide the country with its first partisan matchup of the year. It was the most bitterly contested state election in years, with money pouring in on both sides from around the country. And rather than being a test of personalities as most elections generally prove to be, the attempt by the unions and their liberal allies to take Walker’s scalp as revenge for his legislative achievements provided the country with a clear ideological battle. In a straightforward battle between liberals and conservatives, the latter won in a state that President Obama carried by 14 points in 2008. Anyone who thinks Obama isn’t in for the fight of his life there this year just isn’t paying attention.
 


It is true that the size of Walker’s victory was in no small measure the result of moderate disgust at a union vendetta that was rightly seen as an attempt to override the verdict of the voters in 2010. Some of those who cast ballots for Walker may wind up drifting back to the Democrats in November to back President Obama. Yet the Democratic defeat — and the widespread dismay by liberals at the way the president gave the recall his half-hearted support will have repercussions for his party.
 
Walker’s win is just one more of a string of recent events that are starting to convince the nation that Obama is likely to be a one-term president. Along with the growing list of economic statistics that make a summer economic recovery unlikely, the stunning conservative victory in Wisconsin will make it harder for the president to claim that Republican solutions are unpopular or that support for entitlement reform is a sign of extremism.
 
Instead of merely a local political fight that got national coverage, the failed recall may prove to be a decisive moment in an election that looked only a few months ago to be the president’s to lose. Though five months is a lifetime in politics, Wisconsin could be the moment when Mitt Romney’s campaign moves into overdrive and the rickety nature of the Obama re-election effort becomes manifest. The presidential election wasn’t won in Wisconsin on June 5, but the recall may be best remembered in the future as the tipping point that transformed Obama from a likely winner to an incumbent headed to one-term status.

http://www.commentarymagazine.com/2012/06/06/white-house-wisconsin-spin-wont-wash-obama-scott-walker


Soul Crusher

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doison

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #61 on: June 07, 2012, 09:41:52 PM »
Tied in what polls? The RCP average has Walker up by 6.7

A recent WeAskAmerica poll of nearly 1700 likely voters has Walker up 54-42.

In fact, if you check the RCP poll used in that average, PPP is about the only poll that has Walker up by 3 or less (a couple have Barrett ahead). The rest have Walker up by 5 or more.

I'll go with Walker by 5 or 6.



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Soul Crusher

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #62 on: June 08, 2012, 03:40:02 AM »
Analysis: Conservatives used tactics of the left in Wisconsin win
By Nick Carey | Reuters – Wed, Jun 6, 2012
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MADISON, Wisconsin (Reuters) - Activists with the conservative Tea Party movement say they owe a lot to their schooling in left-wing community organizing tactics for the historic Republican victory over the Democrats and their union allies in the Wisconsin recall election.
While the Democrats said huge campaign spending by conservatives supporters of Republican Scott Walker allowed him on Tuesday to become the first governor in U.S. history to survive a recall election, the Republicans point to their grassroots, get-out-the-vote work as more important.
"Advertising can only do so much," said Ned Ryun, head of the national conservative group American Majority, whose sister group American Majority Action worked closely with Wisconsin activists. "But talking to someone face to face is a game changer."
Combine that personal contact with energizing a mass movement of door knockers and the latest phone software technology to track voters and you have many of the ingredients for the victory, they say.
The conservative activists have literally taken a page out of a left-wing radical's guide to organizing - as many have read the late Saul Alinsky's "Rules for Radicals."
Born in 1909 in Chicago, Alinsky - who died in 1972 - began his organizing career in the city's poor Back of the Yards district and is widely considered the founder of modern community organizing.
"There was no manual for organizing on the right, so we adapted it to the conservative cause," said Brown, of We the People of the Republic, a Tea Party group based in Madison, Wisconsin. "The left has been good at it for 100 years, so what better place to start?"
Labor unions and liberal activists forced the recall election against Walker because of his successful effort last year to curb the collective bargaining powers of public sector workers in the Midwestern U.S. state famous for its beer, cheese and Harley-Davidson motorcycles.
The unions, with a reputation for excelling at grass-roots organizing, not only failed to oust Walker - but he beat his Democratic challenger, Milwaukee Mayor Tom Barrett, by an even bigger margin than his 2010 gubernatorial victory.
Out-of-state conservatives flooded Wisconsin with tens of millions of dollars in campaign cash in an election seen as a barometer of the American political mood ahead of the November 6 presidential election. Walker outspend Barrett by more than 7-to-1.
Leading U.S. conservative donors made donations to boost Walker.
Luke Hilgemann, Wisconsin state director of Americans for Prosperity, which is backed by conservative billionaire brothers David and Charles Koch, said the group coordinated a network of some 100,000 local activists. Most of their efforts centered on 17 key counties.
Money alone doesn't win elections. In the three weeks before the election, Walker benefited from a disciplined get-out-the-vote drive mounted by people associated with the Tea Party movement, which reviles President Barack Obama. Wisconsin could be a key battleground state in the November 6 election as Obama seeks re-election against Republican Mitt Romney.
A lot of the campaign cash bankrolled a wave of pro-Walker advertising. Exit polls taken on Tuesday, however, indicated the ads may not have been a decisive factor; nearly 90 percent of voters say they chose their candidate before the ad barrage.
"Not only is the Tea Party alive and kicking, those guys ran a great get-out-the-vote campaign," said Ford O'Connell, a Republican strategist and chairman of the CivicForum PAC political group. "They have given away the secret recipe for what could win the election for Mitt Romney."
"This is a paradigm shift," added Matt Kibbe, president of FreedomWorks, a conservative group chaired by former Republican House of Representatives Majority leader Dick Armey that provides training and resources to Tea Party activists. "If the grassroots embrace a cause, they make all the difference."
UNION FAULTS
Analysts said Democrats and unions made fundamental mistakes in Wisconsin. Instead of uniting behind one candidate to challenge Walker, Democrats waged a divisive primary and most unions did not back the eventual winner Tom Barrett, who has had his own disputes with unions as mayor of Milwaukee.
The Democrats lost valuable time and money while Walker was traveling the country collecting millions of dollars to back his election effort. They also may have miscalculated in choosing Barrett, who previously had lost to Walker in 2010.
"If they are going to recall a governor, it hardly makes sense to try to challenge him with a candidate who lost against him last time," said Marick Masters, a professor of business and director of labor studies at Wayne State University in Detroit.

On Wednesday, top labor leaders such as AFL-CIO President Richard Trumka and Teamsters General President Jim Hoffa were not acknowledging any mistakes publicly and dismissed the idea that events in Wisconsin had a broad implications for the labor movement's future.

"Walker needed every last dime and every last divisive TV ad to maintain a weakened hold on his office," Trumka said.

Success in Wisconsin this year came with the aid of technology such as a new get-out-the-vote app called Gravity that American Majority Action provided free to Tea Party activists, as conservatives targeted like-minded voters.

Prior to the election, Tea Party activists reported encountering voters who backed Walker but would be out of state on the day of the election. So activists helped them fill out absentee ballots.
"We would have lost those votes if we hadn't showed up," said Matt Batzel, state director of American Majority Action. "That's what this is all about."

George Whorewell

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #63 on: June 08, 2012, 10:40:44 PM »
YES.  If their money was equal, it would have gone down to the wire.  Mccain was stuck with public money.  Obama had so much money he couldn't spend it all at the end - remember the 30 minute commercial in every state on network TV... all while mccain was splitting his last $ up between battleground states?

of course Obama won in 2008 because he had more money.  Common sense.

Hey retard-- do some digging into how the Osama admin has taken full advantage of the Supreme Court decision for their own benefit.

You probably wont bc your a lazy, functionally illiterate slob who would be better suited as a parrot than a human being.

If I give you some bird seed spiked with poison, will you post some pictures and screen shots of the Matt T episode? Adonis needs some company as the boards lamest, most emotionally fragile poster.



garebear

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Re: Does wisconsin matter?
« Reply #64 on: June 09, 2012, 03:15:34 AM »
Hey retard-- do some digging into how the Osama admin has taken full advantage of the Supreme Court decision for their own benefit.

You probably wont bc your a lazy, functionally illiterate slob who would be better suited as a parrot than a human being.

If I give you some bird seed spiked with poison, will you post some pictures and screen shots of the Matt T episode? Adonis needs some company as the boards lamest, most emotionally fragile poster.



Oh, Whorewell. Where did it all go so wrong for you?
G