Author Topic: Reagan Was A Great Liberal  (Read 3353 times)

Soul Crusher

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #25 on: June 15, 2012, 06:15:16 AM »
Did they feel it the way Chris Matthews felt a chill? I'm a little too young to know how the nation felt under Reagan, but with 20/20 hindsight, I find it hard to believe that the leadership was all that great: beyond things like Iran-Contra, there's the fact that Reagan probably didn't have much more than 10 functioning neurons to rub together by the second half of his second term.


Both parties must want to work to get things done. And right now, the politicos are so polarized that they probably couldn't pass a non-binding resolution that the sun rises due East and sets due West.


Obama shoulders his share of the blame for the dysfunction and the deadlock. But he's not the only one to blame, which I'm sure comes as a surprise to you, seeing how you're obviously constrained by blinders that have his image painted on them, and prevent you from seeing anything else.


Why should the GOP work with obama? 

would you work with someone who called you names, said you were basically a traitor every day etc? 

Remember when obama told the gop "I won", "Grab a mop", "Get in the back of the bus", "Latinos need to punish their enemies", etc etc. 

I would tell obama to fuck off too.   He owns the dysfunction and has only himself to blame.   

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #26 on: June 15, 2012, 06:26:16 AM »

Why should the GOP work with obama? 

would you work with someone who called you names, said you were basically a traitor every day etc? 

Remember when obama told the gop "I won", "Grab a mop", "Get in the back of the bus", "Latinos need to punish their enemies", etc etc. 

I would tell obama to fuck off too.   He owns the dysfunction and has only himself to blame.   

LMAO. No one should work with anyone if those are your qualifiers, "he talked bad at us!!!!!" tha fuck outta here... My gripe with Obama is trying to work with the Retarded GOP too much. Your argument is retarded... as usual... Jump from a bridge..

Soul Crusher

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #27 on: June 15, 2012, 06:32:11 AM »
LMAO. No one should work with anyone if those are your qualifiers, "he talked bad at us!!!!!" tha fuck outta here... My gripe with Obama is trying to work with the Retarded GOP too much. Your argument is retarded... as usual... Jump from a bridge..



LOL - yeah he really tried that wth cap and trade, obamacare, stim bill etc. 

Whatever.  After the beating he took in the mid terms - he could have done what clinton did and moderated.  But nnnnnoooooooo, he doubled down on his bullshit and now has only himself to blame for the mess he is in. 


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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #28 on: June 15, 2012, 07:15:33 AM »

LOL - yeah he really tried that wth cap and trade, obamacare, stim bill etc. 

Whatever.  After the beating he took in the mid terms - he could have done what clinton did and moderated.  But nnnnnoooooooo, he doubled down on his bullshit and now has only himself to blame for the mess he is in. 


Tha fuck do you mean the "BEATING HE TOOK IN THE MIDTERMS" He didnt get beat in the midterms you idiot. He is still president, and that wasnt an election year, so the people who lost were the ones who took the beating... Dude get it together you dipshit

Soul Crusher

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #29 on: June 15, 2012, 07:19:05 AM »
Tha fuck do you mean the "BEATING HE TOOK IN THE MIDTERMS" He didnt get beat in the midterms you idiot. He is still president, and that wasnt an election year, so the people who lost were the ones who took the beating... Dude get it together you dipshit

Jesus Christ are you ignorant 


GigantorX

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #30 on: June 15, 2012, 08:01:15 AM »
I don't agree with the deifying of Reagan but I do believe that he was a good President, probably the best man for the job at the time and given the circumstances.

All you have to do is look to his 2 (maybe 3?) terms as Governor of California. He wasn't some dogmatic ideologue or anything, he was a good leader and he actually governed well.

That's what is important.

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #31 on: June 15, 2012, 08:14:22 AM »

LOL. 

Reagan was not a committed communist.   Obama is. 
You're not doing real well in this thread.

Perhaps you should stick to copy and paste in the other nine thousand threads you started and update pathalogically.

G

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #32 on: June 15, 2012, 08:16:17 AM »
You're not doing real well in this thread.

Perhaps you should stick to copy and paste in the other nine thousand threads you started and update pathalogically.




LOL.  I posted another thread on Reagan v Obama record.   


Anyone who remembers the 1980's can attest to why Reagan is well remembered by most. 

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #33 on: June 15, 2012, 08:31:17 AM »

LOL.  I posted another thread on Reagan v Obama record.   


Anyone who remembers the 1980's can attest to why Reagan is well remembered by most. 

You are quite stupid arent you? My parents remember the 80s and they have a very different of Reagan as a President.
And before you say shit about "well they are black welfare people thats why" You can google both of my parents to view their success. They are very hard workers and extremely successful, but they know how Raegan was good for some people and bad for others.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #34 on: June 15, 2012, 08:35:36 AM »
You are quite stupid arent you? My parents remember the 80s and they have a very different of Reagan as a President.
And before you say shit about "well they are black welfare people thats why" You can google both of my parents to view their success. They are very hard workers and extremely successful, but they know how Raegan was good for some people and bad for others.

Blacks voted 88% for walter mondale, need I say more? 

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #35 on: June 15, 2012, 09:41:17 AM »
Blacks voted 88% for walter mondale, need I say more? 

And they are Americans also, (as are my parents) and still they didnt like Reagans term.. so... you really didnt prove anything by that

Soul Crusher

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #36 on: June 15, 2012, 09:48:42 AM »
And they are Americans also, (as are my parents) and still they didnt like Reagans term.. so... you really didnt prove anything by that

Do they like Obama's term?    LOL.   
 

Obama has never done a single fucking thing for black people. 

avxo

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #37 on: June 15, 2012, 10:47:04 AM »
Why should the GOP work with obama?

First of all, they should work together, not just "with Obama." And they should because they are our elected representatives - the people we sent up there to take care of the People's business, not to play games, try to score political points, bicker and throw invective. This applies to all our elected officials, not just Obama, or just the Republican members of the House, or the Democrats or the House, or the Republicans of the Senate or the Democrats of the Senate.


would you work with someone who called you names, said you were basically a traitor every day etc? 

(Sidenote: I don't recall Obama calling anyone a traitor. Do you have a reference?)

To answer your question, if I were a politician, I would try to work with anyone who wanted to try and work with me - even if our political positions didn't necessarily agree. I would have a vigorous debate and lay out my positions on the table and argue why I thought they were better than other alternatives. But I would do it without attacking the person behind those ideas. And I would listen to what they had to say because don't claim to have a monopoly on truth; I would be confident in my positions, but I would remain open to being convinced using logic and rationality. In short, I would act according to the belief that we, as Americans, have much more than brings us together than we have pushing as apart as Democrats and Republicans, and that ultimately, and that we all love this country and want to it continue to prosper and succeed and be a shining beacon to the whole world.

Alas, we have flotsam and jetsam in positions of power, bickering, and trying to backstab each other with paper knives, all the while professing their great love for the country and the lengths they go to to save it... Yeah, we're convinced. ::)


Remember when obama told the gop "I won", "Grab a mop", "Get in the back of the bus", "Latinos need to punish their enemies", etc etc. 

I don't remember all those quotes - but then again I don't follow Obama's statements as obsessively as you do - but my reaction is: "so what?" Politicians make dumb, polarizing statements all the time. While such statements are certainly divisive and don't help, they're hardly one-sided. The words may change, but the invective remains the same.


I would tell obama to fuck off too.   He owns the dysfunction and has only himself to blame.

Frankly, your statements only reinforce the fact that you have blinders on and that you cannot see anything except what's on the blinders, and I doubt any amount of posting will serve to convince you. The fact of the matter is that no politician owns the mess we're in free and clear. Some own more of it, some own less, but nobody owns the dysfunction and no one person is to blame exclusively.

Ultimately you know who is to blame? People who are hyper-partisan and see everyone else as an enemy and equate politics to warfare. People like you.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #38 on: June 15, 2012, 11:01:50 AM »
Like you said - you don't pay attention to what obama says and oes as much as I do. 




First of all, they should work together, not just "with Obama." And they should because they are our elected representatives - the people we sent up there to take care of the People's business, not to play games, try to score political points, bicker and throw invective. This applies to all our elected officials, not just Obama, or just the Republican members of the House, or the Democrats or the House, or the Republicans of the Senate or the Democrats of the Senate.


(Sidenote: I don't recall Obama calling anyone a traitor. Do you have a reference?)

To answer your question, if I were a politician, I would try to work with anyone who wanted to try and work with me - even if our political positions didn't necessarily agree. I would have a vigorous debate and lay out my positions on the table and argue why I thought they were better than other alternatives. But I would do it without attacking the person behind those ideas. And I would listen to what they had to say because don't claim to have a monopoly on truth; I would be confident in my positions, but I would remain open to being convinced using logic and rationality. In short, I would act according to the belief that we, as Americans, have much more than brings us together than we have pushing as apart as Democrats and Republicans, and that ultimately, and that we all love this country and want to it continue to prosper and succeed and be a shining beacon to the whole world.

Alas, we have flotsam and jetsam in positions of power, bickering, and trying to backstab each other with paper knives, all the while professing their great love for the country and the lengths they go to to save it... Yeah, we're convinced. ::)


I don't remember all those quotes - but then again I don't follow Obama's statements as obsessively as you do - but my reaction is: "so what?" Politicians make dumb, polarizing statements all the time. While such statements are certainly divisive and don't help, they're hardly one-sided. The words may change, but the invective remains the same.


Frankly, your statements only reinforce the fact that you have blinders on and that you cannot see anything except what's on the blinders, and I doubt any amount of posting will serve to convince you. The fact of the matter is that no politician owns the mess we're in free and clear. Some own more of it, some own less, but nobody owns the dysfunction and no one person is to blame exclusively.

Ultimately you know who is to blame? People who are hyper-partisan and see everyone else as an enemy and equate politics to warfare. People like you.


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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #39 on: June 15, 2012, 11:04:15 AM »
que the double rolley eyes from the guy...

3333 isnt equipped to argue this with you

Soul Crusher

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #40 on: June 15, 2012, 11:06:20 AM »
que the double rolley eyes from the guy...

3333 isnt equipped to argue this with you

LOL. 

Funny coming from delusional idiots like yourself who voted for obama and still don't grasp why he has failed so miserably and are prepared to vote for 4 more years of treason and chaos all for one reason which you won't admit.  Pathetic.   


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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #41 on: June 15, 2012, 11:09:39 AM »
LOL. 

Funny coming from delusional idiots like yourself who voted for obama and still don't grasp why he has failed so miserably and are prepared to vote for 4 more years of treason and chaos all for one reason which you won't admit.  Pathetic.   



If what he did was Treason.. he would have been tried. Please point out his Treason, as that is a heavy accusation. And not in your opinion, instead, pull up the legal definition of the act and compare your specific instances where President Obama's are actions are consistant.

avxo

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #42 on: June 15, 2012, 11:13:22 AM »
Like you said - you don't pay attention to what obama says and oes as much as I do. 

Such an answer! I've been defeated! *generic monster dying sound*

Soul Crusher

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #43 on: June 15, 2012, 11:13:57 AM »
If what he did was Treason.. he would have been tried. Please point out his Treason, as that is a heavy accusation. And not in your opinion, instead, pull up the legal definition of the act and compare your specific instances where President Obama's are actions are consistant.

Amensty for illegals via Exec Order today.    

I love it too since blacks, who are the most hurt by this, wont say shit because they are slaves to Obama.  

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #44 on: June 15, 2012, 11:18:18 AM »
Amensty for illegals via Exec Order today.    

I love it too since blacks, who are the most hurt by this, wont say shit because they are slaves to Obama.  


Ok.. so then we should see him face the charge of Treason any time now?

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #45 on: June 15, 2012, 11:20:44 AM »
Such an answer! I've been defeated! *generic monster dying sound*

He said that the republicans are putting "party before the country" in not adopting his programs.  What does that tell you?   

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #46 on: June 15, 2012, 11:23:53 AM »
He said that the republicans are putting "party before the country" in not adopting his programs.  What does that tell you?   


Woah thats wattered down from your accusations in the begining of the thread.

Soul Crusher

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #47 on: June 15, 2012, 11:26:34 AM »

Woah thats wattered down from your accusations in the begining of the thread.


What is the implication of that statement? 




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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #48 on: June 15, 2012, 11:26:45 AM »
After President George W. Bush sent Congress an outline of his tax reform plan on February 8, some critics immediately began to attack it as a return to what they portray as the fiscally irresponsible policies of the Reagan Administration. According to these commentators, Congress should scale back--if not outright reject--President Bush's tax reform proposals because they are based on a period when the wealthy received excessive tax cuts and revenue was wasted on defense even though most Americans struggled in poverty. This is a revisionist view of recent history that ignores reality and denies the fact that President Reagan's sound policies and determination deserve much of the credit for the current economic picture. Congress should embrace President Bush's tax reform plan as a responsible return to the most successful economic policy of the 20th century.

President Ronald Reagan's record includes sweeping economic reforms and deep across-the-board tax cuts, market deregulation, and sound monetary policies to contain inflation. His policies resulted in the largest peacetime economic boom in American history and nearly 35 million more jobs. As the Joint Economic Committee reported in April 2000:2

    In 1981, newly elected President Ronald Reagan refocused fiscal policy on the long run. He proposed, and Congress passed, sharp cuts in marginal tax rates. The cuts increased incentives to work and stimulated growth. These were funda-mental policy changes that provided the foundation for the Great Expansion that began in December 1982.

    As Exhibit 1 shows, the economic record of the last 17 years is remarkable, particularly when viewed against the backdrop of the 1970s. The United States has experienced two of the longest and strongest expansions in our history back to back. They have been interrupted only by a shallow eight-month downturn in 1990-91.



    Chart 1
    Even with the growing surplus, however, a small but vocal faction in Congress opposes any policies that would allow taxpayers to keep more of their own money through real tax cuts and that generally would shift power from the government to the people. This attempt to rewrite history should not be surprising. Proponents of additional government spending try to make the Reagan boom appear to be a bust because they fear that Reagan's success will help President Bush build popular support for lower taxes, further deregulation, and reduced government spending. But their rhetoric is easily countered by the evidence.

    history confirms the soundness of the Reagan, and now Bush, approach to economic policy. Under President Reagan, federal revenues increased even with tax cuts, federal spending did not decrease, the country experienced the longest period of sustained growth during peacetime in its history, and the rich paid more taxes proportionately than they had before the tax cuts were implemented.
    HOW DID THE REAGAN TAX CUTS AFFECT THE U.S. TREASURY?

    Many critics of reducing taxes claim that the Reagan tax cuts drained the U.S. Treasury. The reality is that federal revenues increased significantly between 1980 and 1990:

        Total federal revenues doubled from just over $517 billion in 1980 to more than $1 trillion in 1990. In constant inflation-adjusted dollars, this was a 28 percent increase in revenue.3

        As a percentage of the gross domestic product (GDP), federal revenues declined only slightly from 18.9 percent in 1980 to 18 percent in 1990.4
        Revenues from individual income taxes climbed from just over $244 billion in 1980 to nearly $467 billion in 1990.5 In inflation-adjusted dollars, this amounts to a 25 percent increase.

    HOW DID REAGAN'S POLICIES AFFECT FEDERAL SPENDING?

    Although critics continue to focus on President Reagan's budget "cuts," federal spending rose significantly during the 1980s:

        Federal spending more than doubled, growing from almost $591 billion in 1980 to $1.25 trillion in 1990. In constant inflation-adjusted dollars, this was an increase of 35.8 percent.6

        As a percentage of GDP, federal expenditures grew slightly from 21.6 percent in 1980 to 21.8 percent in 1990.7

        Contrary to popular myth, while inflation-adjusted defense spending increased by 50 percent between 1980 and 1989, it was curtailed when the Cold War ended and fell by 15 percent between 1989 and 1993. However, means-tested entitlements, which do not include Social Security or Medicare, rose by over 102 percent between 1980 and 1993, and they have continued climbing ever since.8
        Total spending on all national security programs never equaled domestic spending, even when Social Security, Medicare, and net interest are excluded from domestic totals. In addition, national security spending fell during the Administration of the senior President Bush, while domestic spending increased in both mandatory and discretionary accounts.9 (See Chart 1.)




    HOW DID REAGAN'S POLICIES AFFECT ECONOMIC GROWTH?

    Despite the steep recession in 1982--brought on by tight money policies that were instituted to squeeze out the historic inflation level of the late 1970s--by 1983, the Reagan policies of reducing taxes, spending, regulation, and inflation were in place. The result was unprecedented economic growth:

        This economic boom lasted 92 months without a recession, from November 1982 to July 1990, the longest period of sustained growth during peacetime and the second-longest period of sustained growth in U.S. history. The growth in the economy lasted more than twice as long as the average period of expansions since World War II.10

        The American economy grew by about one-third in real inflation-adjusted terms. This was the equivalent of adding the entire economy of East and West Germany or two-thirds of Japan's economy to the U.S. economy.11
        From 1950 to 1973, real economic growth in the U.S. economy averaged 3.6 percent per year. From 1973 to 1982, it averaged only 1.6 percent. The Reagan economic boom restored the more usual growth rate as the economy averaged 3.5 percent in real growth from the beginning of 1983 to the end of 1990.12

    HOW DID REAGAN'S POLICIES AFFECT THE FEDERAL TAX BURDEN?

    Perhaps the greatest myth concerning the 1980s is that Ronald Reagan slashed taxes so dramatically for the rich that they no longer have paid their fair share. The flaw in this myth is that it mixes tax rates with taxes actually paid and ignores the real trend of taxation:

        In 1991, after the Reagan rate cuts were well in place, the top 1 percent of taxpayers in income paid 25 percent of all income taxes; the top 5 percent paid 43 percent; and the bottom 50 percent paid only 5 percent.13 To suggest that this distribution is unfair because it is too easy on upper-income groups is nothing less than absurd.

        The proportion of total income taxes paid by the top 1 percent rose sharply under President Reagan, from 18 percent in 1981 to 28 percent in 1988.14

        Average effective income tax rates were cut even more for lower-income groups than for higher-income groups. While the average effective tax rate for the top 1 percent fell by 30 percent between 1980 and 1992, and by 35 percent for the top 20 percent of income earners, it fell by 44 percent for the second-highest quintile, 46 percent for the middle quintile, 64 percent for the second-lowest quintile, and 263 percent for the bottom quintile.15
        These reductions for the lowest-income groups were so large because President Reagan doubled the personal exemption, increased the standard deduction, and tripled the earned income tax credit (EITC), which provides net cash for single-parent families with children at the lowest income levels. These changes eliminated income tax liability altogether for over 4 million lower-income families.16

    Critics often add in the Social Security payroll tax and argue that the total federal tax burden shifted more to lower-income groups and away from upper-income groups; but President Reagan's changes were in the income tax, not in the Social Security payroll tax. The payroll tax was imposed by proponents of big government over the past 50 years, and it is they, not Ronald Reagan, who should be held accountable for its distributional effects.

    Nevertheless, even if one counts the Social Security payroll tax, the share of total federal taxes increased between 1980 and 1989 for the following groups:

        For the top 1 percent of taxpayers, from 12.9 percent in 1980 to 15.4 percent in 1989;

        For the top 5 percent of taxpayers, from 27.3 percent in 1980 to 30.4 percent in 1989; and
        For the top 20 percent of taxpayers, from 56.1 percent in 1980 to 58.6 percent in 1989.

    On the other hand, the share of total federal taxes, if one includes the Social Security payroll tax, declined for four groups:

        For the second-highest 20 percent of taxpayers, from 22.2 percent in 1980 to 20.8 percent in 1989;

        For the middle 20 percent of taxpayers, from 13.2 percent in 1980 to 12.5 percent in 1989;

        For the second-lowest 20 percent of taxpayers, from 6.9 percent in 1980 to 6.4 percent in 1989; and
        For the lowest 20 percent of taxpayers, from 1.6 percent in 1980 to 1.5 percent in 1989.17

    CONCLUSION

    No matter how advocates of big government try to rewrite history, Ronald Reagan's record of fiscal responsibility continues to stand as the most successful economic policy of the 20th century. His tax reforms triggered an economic expansion that continues to this day. His investments in national security ended the Cold War and made possible the subsequent defense spending reductions that are largely responsible for the current federal surpluses. His efforts to restrain the expansion of federal government helped to limit the growth of domestic spending.

    If Reagan's critics had been willing to work with him to limit domestic spending even further and to control the growth of entitlements, the budget would have been balanced five to ten years sooner and without the massive tax increase imposed in 1993. Today, Members of Congress from across the political spectrum should stand on the evidence and defend the Reagan record.

    To the extent that President Bush's proposals mirror those of Ronald Reagan, his plan should be a welcome strategy to lower the tax burden on Americans and to make the system more responsible. If the advocates of big government in Congress cooperate with President Bush rather than merely continuing to fund obsolete, wasteful, and redundant programs, there is no limit to the prosperity that Americans can generate.

    Peter Sperry is the Grover M. Hermann Fellow in Federal Budgetary Affairs in the Thomas A. Roe Institute for Economic Policy Studies at The Heritage Foundation.

http://www.heritage.org/research/reports/2001/03/the-real-reagan-economic-record


HOPE THIS HELPS!

kcballer

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Re: Reagan Was A Great Liberal
« Reply #49 on: June 15, 2012, 11:33:34 AM »
Reagan was a mouthpiece who is revered for things he did not actually do. Like be a "fiscal conservative" Pity idiots can not see it.
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