Who is in favor of Obamaca?

[Soul Crusher]

Interesting coming from someone who knew little about pharm from Canada. I would think someone complaining that there isn't enough "free market" would be well versed on this.  It suggests that you are just regurgitating what the talking heads tell you to say.

If you read my post closely, you will see I am not for government control of the industry but reform WAS and STILL IS needed.  When companies get too big competition decreases and then they have a near total control of what they can charge, add that to being able to sell there pharm without world wide competition and then you the ass fucking we have been getting when we are forced to pay $74 versus $14 for the same drug.  Also, must of the new reform in OBcare is good, becuase "free market" wasn't producing services that address those issues for the reasons i said earlier int he paragraph.  

I don't disagree there is regulation that doesn't help cost.  (read it again, so you don't misunderstand me, and then read it once more, and then again once more)  I even indirectly listed one.  

Perhaps you can tell us, some of the regulation from the government that is causing higher prices.

PS re-read this:  'how can forcing people under penalty of law to buy products form a private company be a good thing"  I have been saying it over and over on the forum.

The health insurance industry is exempt from Anti-Trust laws and has a govt enforced monopoly, which always leads to higher prices.

[GigantorX]

And by the way, I'm in favor of "GigantorCare".

[Shockwave]

What possible reasoning could be behind exempting them from anti-trust laws?

[OzmO]

The health insurance industry is exempt from Anti-Trust laws and has a govt enforced monopoly, which always leads to higher prices.

I don't know if they are by definition but JFC!  How much more of a ideal situational could it be for them?

For me this is 1 step short of Tyranny.

[OzmO]

We are not beyond the free market approach.

Based on limited reading, and through my personal bias.  Which is best described as free market libertarian. I think the free market ideals should be used to reduce over regulation where appropriate and to limit the amount of regulatory bodies within the industry.  It seems to be there is some back and forth between state liscensing and governing beurocracies and federal ones.  And it also seems that the healthcare industry is unique in that it is regulated by many bodies that are controlled by the professionals themselves.  Hospital quality of results is regulated by beuracracies.  Doctor liscensing and accredidation is regulated by a variety of beuracracies state, federal and private.  I just named a couple but there are a lot of aspects of healthcare regulated by many differen bodies.  I agree, that some regulation is necesarry and am not a moron.  Im not just repeating free market rehtoric.  Regulation protects the consumer.  My personal bias is toward more choice for the consumer and more power in the consumers hands.  I think using free market ideals a a guide, reform should take place and regulation that stays should be necessary and should protect the coonsumer and enable choice most of all.  I admit to not being any kind of exoert on this and dont know how this could be achieved.  But i definately dont believe in giving it over to the government to take care of.  My initial argument being that i never hear anyone talk about limiting the scope of regulatioor using the market as a better guide for reform.  

I hear ya, but its hard to mostly agree unless there is some specific examples of regulation that causes prices to increase as i am ignorant on the matter too. 

[Soul Crusher]

I hear ya, but its hard to mostly agree unless there is some specific examples of regulation that causes prices to increase as i am ignorant on the matter too. 

Spcefic example is that in NYS we are forced to cover more things on an insurance policy than say North Carolina, whether we like it or not, and the carriers can not decide or offer plans unless they cover things as dictated by the state.  Thus, the prices go up. 

[OzmO]

Spcefic example is that in NYS we are forced to cover more things on an insurance policy than say North Carolina, whether we like it or not, and the carriers can not decide or offer plans unless they cover things as dictated by the state.  Thus, the prices go up. 

Makes sense, but what things are those?

[Soul Crusher]

Makes sense, but what things are those?

Depression, alcohol treatment, all sorts of shit that people should pay out of pocket for.   

Many people just want a low cost high deductible catastrophic plan but many states don't allow it. 

[kcballer]

Depression, alcohol treatment, all sorts of shit that people should pay out of pocket for.   

Many people just want a low cost high deductible catastrophic plan but many states don't allow it. 

Because the state then has to pay for the services that those people without the coverage use at some point in their life time.

[Dos Equis]

Obamacare, no.

Health Care Reform, YES.

Unlike most of those who cry out of their asses on here without a clue, my career is actually in the Health Administration field.  The current model is beyond broken and only favors one entity.  I will let you guess which one that is.  Health Care Reform (or as many of us here in the biz call it Health Care Rehabilitation) is needed on all levels without a doubt.  Anyone trying to debate that point is beyond stupid.

However, I believe that reform should start from within.  Imagine a dentist doing a root canal without you opening your mouth.  Instead they just cut through your cheek and jaw.  That basically sums up the current approach to health care reform.   Yeah, the dentist can still fix the root canal but then he leaves a bigger problem behind.   If you wake up and question why the side of your face is torn up and held in place with duct tape, you really don't want to hear "oh forget that, all you need to know is that the root canal was a success."

Reform should start from within for those people who currently already have health insurance.  The people who already pay for it or who have it because they get it through their employer for waking up and hauling their ass to work each day to be productive members of our society should be the people who benefit from the reform first.  

Handing out health care and increasing the number of people covered is not really fixing health care.  It is simply exposing more people to the current broken model.  

Good post.  You should do this kind of thing more often. 

[LurkerNoMore]

Good post.  You should do this kind of thing more often. 

I do it all the time.   You just never notice.

[Soul Crusher]

I do it all the time.   You just never notice.

Beach does not hang out on the gay forum to see those posts of yours.       

[kcballer]

Beach does not hang out on the gay forum to see those posts of yours.       

But your knowledge of said posts means you do. 

[Straw Man]

people who have started receiving the benefit are in favor of it and most repubs are in favor of many of the provision (except of course for their only contribution which was the mandate)

As more of the benefit roll out in 2013/2014 etc.. more and more people will like it

[OzmO]

people who have started receiving the benefit are in favor of it and most repubs are in favor of many of the provision (except of course for their only contribution which was the mandate)

As more of the benefit roll out in 2013/2014 etc.. more and more people will like it

If prices go up?

[Dos Equis]

I do it all the time.   You just never notice.

I don't read every thread or every post in every thread, so I guess it's possible you make good substantive contributions in those I don't read, but in the ones I do read, 90 percent or more are directed to 33.

[OzmO]

Please state why.  Use facts.


Avoid spin, insults, etc.

Bump

[Straw Man]

If prices go up?

my cost of health care has already gone up 300% and I have no expectation of it going down

The healthcare legislation is far from perfect but certainly better than nothing and especially so for those that simply can't get healthcare now due to pre-existing conditions or exorbitant prices

[Shockwave]

my cost of health care has already gone up 300% and I have no expectation of it going down

The healthcare legislation is far from perfect but certainly better than nothing and especially so for those that simply can't get healthcare now due to pre-existing conditions or exorbitant prices

Im actually somewhat impressed that youre willing to pay 300% more in order to help those that are in need.

[Soul Crusher]

Im actually somewhat impressed that youre willing to pay 300% more in order to help those that are in need.

The entire premise of ObamaCare is based on a fraud and a lie.

[LurkerNoMore]

I don't read every thread or every post in every thread, so I guess it's possible you make good substantive contributions in those I don't read, but in the ones I do read, 90 percent or more are directed to 33.

But accurate and fact based those are as well.

[Shockwave]

The entire premise of ObamaCare is based on a fraud and a lie.

Wasnt getting into anything on Obamacare - just that he seems to actually walk the walk.
If my premiums went up 300% to pay for people that dont work/have health insurance, Id freak out, as will many people who wanted this legislation passed. Im impressed that Straw doesnt.
Then again, Im not huge on supporting other peoples laziness.

[OzmO]

Im actually somewhat impressed that youre willing to pay 300% more in order to help those that are in need.

10% is fine by me, 300%?  Go fuck yourself.

[OzmO]

my cost of health care has already gone up 300% and I have no expectation of it going down

The healthcare legislation is far from perfect but certainly better than nothing and especially so for those that simply can't get healthcare now due to pre-existing conditions or exorbitant prices

From when to when did  this go up 300%?

[Dos Equis]

But accurate and fact based those are as well.

Even if they are, they don't contribute anything to the board.  Your posts in this thread are very good.