Author Topic: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.  (Read 13901 times)

BOW

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #50 on: August 25, 2012, 06:59:31 PM »
Iphone is way overrated. My next phone will be Galaxy 3 or Note 2. I am currently using crackberry 9860 and 9800
hopefully the note 2 makes it on verizon

Nirvana

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #51 on: August 25, 2012, 08:46:35 PM »
Yes I NEED to spend 1000$ on a facebook/getbig machine.


I NEED it, the company said so.  I'm important like the commercial said and therefore NEED any and all apple products.

BayGBM

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #52 on: August 25, 2012, 10:07:19 PM »
'nuff said.  ::)

epic_alien

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #53 on: August 25, 2012, 10:52:34 PM »
I know, HT. It comes down to getting the retina and putting up with an external drive or having a 15 inch sony with blu-ray built in. Being a consumer is difficult shit!

i already have 2 retinas in my eyes bro,  why you want to go buy one a computer has?

GRACIE JIU-JITSU

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #54 on: August 26, 2012, 09:19:02 AM »


 Jury in Apple v. Samsung Goofed

Late in the process yesterday at the Apple v. Samsung trial, when the parties and the judge were reviewing the jury verdict form, Samsung noticed that there were, indeed, inconsistencies in the jury's verdict form, a possibility Samsung anticipated [PDF]. Here's the jury's Amended Verdict Form [PDF], amended to fix the mistakes. Here's the original [PDF]. Here's the note [PDF] the jury sent to the judge when told to fix the inconsistencies. What are they, they asked? "Please let the jury know," they wrote in the only note ever sent in their deliberations, "of the inconsistencies we are supposed to deliberate on."

In two instances, results were crazily contradictory, and the judge had to have the jury go back and fix the goofs. As a result the damages award was reduced to $1,049,343,540, 1 down from $1,051,855,000. For just one example, the jury had said one device didn't infringe, but then they awarded Apple $2 million for inducement. In another they awarded a couple of hundred thousand for a device they'd ruled didn't infringe at all. This all was revealed by The Verge in its live blog coverage:

    The jury appears to have awarded damages for the Galaxy Tab 10.1 LTE infringing — $219,694 worth — but didn't find that it had actually infringed anything....A similar inconsistency exists for the Intercept, for which they'd awarded Apple over $2 million

    Intercept: "The jury found no direct infringement but did find inducement" for the '915 and '163 utility patents. If a device didn't infringe, it would be rather hard for a company to induce said non-existant infringement.

Obviously, something is very wrong with this picture. The Verge also reported that the jury foreman, who is a patent holder himself [this appears to be his patent, "Method and apparatus for recording and storing video information"], told court officials that the jury didn't need the answer to its question to reach a verdict:

    The foreman told a court representative that the jurors had reached a decision without needing the instructions.

That's why I don't think this jury's ruling will stand, among other reasons.

I thought it wise to highlight this, because I saw this morning that some missed seeing it. For example, James Niccolai at PCWorld quotes a "legal expert" who clearly didn't:

    "It's surprising they came back so quickly, given that it was a complicated case and very complicated verdict form, but that said, it looks like they were thoughtful about it and they did their job," said Roy Futterman, director at DOAR Litigation Consulting and a clinical psychologist who works on trial strategies and the mindset of jurors.

    "One sign of that is that the verdicts were consistent, they held together -- they voted one way on infringement and another way on invalidity; it all tells the same big story," he said.

That's in an article titled "Quick Verdict in Apple Trial Doesn't Mean Jury Shirked Its Duty, Expert Says." If the jury instructions [PDF] are as long and complex as they were in this case, a quick verdict can indeed mean it shirked its duty. For example, if the jury rushed so much it assigned $2 million dollars to Apple, and then had to subtract it because there was no infringement, it raises a valid question: what was the basis for any of the damages figures the jury came up with? If they had any actual basis, how could they goof like this? Was there a factual basis for any of the damages figures?

Time will tell, but keep in mind that one of the plays you'll see next will likely be a Rule 50(b) motion by Samsung, and that's the one where you ask the judge for various relief on the basis that no reasonable jury could find what it did find on the evidence presented. Here's Google's still pending Rule 50(b) motion for judgment as a matter of law in the Oracle v. Google case, to give you an idea of what they look like. As you can see, you can ask for victory across the board or just on one part of what the jury decided.

This story is far from over, in other words, and while Apple's CEO, Tim Cook, waxed philosophical about the trial, and saying that it was about values, not money, one important US value is that the jury fulfill its responsibilities, one of which is to read and make sure they understand and follow the jury instructions they are given. I believe Cook would agree that trials are supposed to be fair, with everyone doing their part. If this jury thought they knew the right result without instructions, and if they hurried so much they made glaring mistakes, and they did, and all in Apple's favor, something isn't right in this picture. As the legal blog, Above the Law expressed it:

    Here’s the thing, ladies and gentlemen of the Apple v. Samsung jury: It would take me more than three days to understand all the terms in the verdict! Much less come to a legally binding decision on all of these separate issues. Did you guys just flip a coin?

If it would take a lawyer three days to make sure he understood the terms in the form, how did the jury not need the time to do the same? There were 700 questions, remember, and one thing is plain, that the jury didn't take the time to avoid inconsistencies, one of which resulted in the jury casually throwing numbers around, like $2 million dollars for a nonfringement.

Come on. This is farce.

Professor Michael Risch points out an even worse inconsistency:

    How did the Galaxy Tab escape design patent infringement? This was the only device to be preliminarily enjoined (on appeal no less), and yet it was the one of the few devices to be spared the sledgehammer. And, by the way, it looks an awful lot like an iPad. Yet the Epic 4G, a phone I own (uh oh, Apple’s coming after me) — which has a slide out keyboard, a curved top and bottom, 4 buttons on the bottom, the word Samsung printed across the top, buttons in different places (and I know this because I look in all the wrong places on my wife’s iTouch), a differently shaped speaker, a differently placed camera, etc. — that device infringes the iPhone design patents....

    Relatedly, the ability to get a design patent on a user interface implies that design patent law is broken. This, to me, is the Supreme Court issue in this case. We can dicker about the “facts” of point 2, but whether you can stop all people from having square icons in rows of 4 with a dock is something that I thought we settled in Lotus v. Borland 15 years ago. I commend Apple for finding a way around basic UI law, but this type of ruling cannot stand.

This is the second lawyer I've seen predicting this case will go all the way to the US Supreme Court. He also compliments Groklaw for having "not only really detailed information, but really accurate information, and actual source documents. That combination is hard to find." Thank you.

Update: One of the jurors has now spoken, and CNET's Greg Sandoval has it, in his article, Exclusive: Apple-Samsung juror speaks out:

    Apple v. Samsung juror Manuel Ilagan said the nine-person jury that heard the patent infringement case between the companies knew after the first day that it believed Samsung had wronged Apple....

    The decision was very one-sided, but Ilagan said it wasn't clear the jurors were largely in agreement until after the first day of deliberations.

    "It didn't dawn on us [that we agreed that Samsung had infringed] on the first day," Ilagan said. "We were debating heavily, especially about the patents on bounce back and pinch-to-zoom. Apple said they owned patents, but we were debating about the prior art [about the same technology that Samsung said existed before the iPhone debuted]. [Velvin Hogan] was jury foreman. He had experience. He owned patents himself. In the beginning the debate was heated, but it was still civil. Hogan holds patents, so he took us through his experience. After that it was easier. After we debated that first patent -- what was prior art --because we had a hard time believing there was no prior art, that there wasn't something out there before Apple.

    "In fact we skipped that one," Ilagan continued, "so we could go on faster. It was bogging us down." ...

    "Once you determine that Samsung violated the patents," Ilagan said, "it's easy to just go down those different [Samsung] products because it was all the same. Like the trade dress, once you determine Samsung violated the trade dress, the flatscreen with the Bezel...then you go down the products to see if it had a bezel. But we took our time. We didn't rush. We had a debate before we made a decision. Sometimes it was getting heated."

This gets worse and worse.

Update 2: Dan Levine of Reuters has some words from the foreman:

    "We wanted to make sure the message we sent was not just a slap on the wrist," Hogan said. "We wanted to make sure it was sufficiently high to be painful, but not unreasonable."

    Hogan said jurors were able to complete their deliberations in less than three days -- much faster than legal experts had predicted -- because a few had engineering and legal experience, which helped with the complex issues in play. Once they determined Apple's patents were valid, jurors evaluated every single device separately, he said.

Now the jurors are contradicting each other. Lordy, the more they talk, the worse it gets. I'm sure Samsung is glad they are talking, though. Had they read the full jury instructions, all 109 pages [as PDF], they would have read that damages are not supposed to punish, merely to compensate for losses. Here's what they would have found in Final Jury Instruction No. 35, in part:

    The amount of those damages must be adequate to compensate the patent holder for the infringement. A damages award should put the patent holder in approximately the financial position it would have been in had the infringement not occurred, but in no event may the damages award be less than a reasonable royalty. You should keep in mind that the damages you award are meant to compensate the patent holder and not to punish an infringer.

The same instruction is repeated in Final Jury Instruction No. 53, in case they missed it the first time. Did they obey those instructions? Nay, did they even read them? The evidence, judging by the foreman's reported words, point the wrong way.

Update 3: Samsung lawyer John Quinn is quoted by USA Today saying they'll be asking the judge to toss this out and then appeal, if she does not:

    Samsung, the global leader among smartphone makers, vowed to fight. Its lawyers told the judge it intended to ask her to toss out the verdict.

    "This decision should not be allowed to stand because it would discourage innovation and limit the rights of consumers to make choices for themselves," Samsung lead lawyer John Quinn said. He argued that the judge or an appeals court should overturn the verdict.

    Apple lawyers plan to formally demand Samsung pull its most popular cellphones and computer tablets from the U.S. market. They also can ask the judge to triple the damages from $1.05 billion to $3 billion.

    U.S. District Judge Lucy Koh will decide those issues, along with Samsung's demand she overturn the jury's verdict, in several weeks. Quinn said Samsung would appeal if the judge refuses to toss out the decision....

    Samsung said after the verdict that it was "unfortunate that patent law can be manipulated to give one company a monopoly over rectangles with rounded corners."

    "This is by no means the final word in this case," Quinn said in a statement. "Patent law should not be twisted so as to give one company a monopoly over the shape of smartphones."

___________
1 Is that math even correct, even after the fix? One reader did the math, and he or she thinks their math is off, and the right total, even if all else is accurate, should be $1,049,423,540. Here's the calculation, taken from the Amended Verdict Form [PDF], so you can do your own checking:

    My math gives a different total

    ... in favor of Apple by a few 10,000's

    Captivate . . . . . . . . . .80,840,162

    Continuum . . . . . . . . . .16,399,117

    Droid Charge. . . . . . . . .50,672,869

    Epic 4G. . . . . . . . . . .130,180,894

    Exhibit 4G . . . . . . . . . .1,081,820

    Fascinate. . . . . . . . . .143,539,179

    Galaxy Ace . . . . . . . . . . . . . .0

    Galaxy Prevail. . . . . . . .57,867,383

    Galaxy S . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .0

    Galaxy S 4G . . . . . . . . .73,344,668

    Galaxy S II (AT&T). . . . . .40,494,356

    Galaxy S II (i9000). . . . . . . . . .0

    Galaxy S II (T-Mobile). . . .83,791,708

    Galaxy S II (Epic 4G Touch).100,326,988

    Galaxy S II (Skyrocket) . . .32,273,558

    Galaxy S (Showcase) . . . . .22,002,146

    Galaxy Tab . . . . . . . . . .1,966,691

    Galaxy Tab 10.1 WiFi . . . . . .833,076

    Galaxy Tab 10.1 4G LTE . . . . . . . .0

    Gem. . . . . . . . . . . . . .4,075,585

    Indulge . . . . . . . . . . .16,011,184

    Infuse 4G . . . . . . . . . .44,792,974

    Intercept. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .0

    Mesmerize . . . . . . . . . .53,123,612

    Nexus S 4G . . . . . . . . . .1,828,297

    Replenish. . . . . . . . . . .3,350,256

    Transform. . . . . . . . . . . .953,060

    Vibrant . . . . . . . . . . .89,673,957

    TOTAL. . . . . . . . . . .1,049,423,540



  http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=2012082510525390&repost=1
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HTexan

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #55 on: August 26, 2012, 10:01:59 AM »

 Jury in Apple v. Samsung Goofed

Late in the process yesterday at the Apple v. Samsung trial, when the parties and the judge were reviewing the jury verdict form, Samsung noticed that there were, indeed, inconsistencies in the jury's verdict form, a possibility Samsung anticipated [PDF]. Here's the jury's Amended Verdict Form [PDF], amended to fix the mistakes. Here's the original [PDF]. Here's the note [PDF] the jury sent to the judge when told to fix the inconsistencies. What are they, they asked? "Please let the jury know," they wrote in the only note ever sent in their deliberations, "of the inconsistencies we are supposed to deliberate on."

In two instances, results were crazily contradictory, and the judge had to have the jury go back and fix the goofs. As a result the damages award was reduced to $1,049,343,540, 1 down from $1,051,855,000. For just one example, the jury had said one device didn't infringe, but then they awarded Apple $2 million for inducement. In another they awarded a couple of hundred thousand for a device they'd ruled didn't infringe at all. This all was revealed by The Verge in its live blog coverage:

    The jury appears to have awarded damages for the Galaxy Tab 10.1 LTE infringing — $219,694 worth — but didn't find that it had actually infringed anything....A similar inconsistency exists for the Intercept, for which they'd awarded Apple over $2 million

    Intercept: "The jury found no direct infringement but did find inducement" for the '915 and '163 utility patents. If a device didn't infringe, it would be rather hard for a company to induce said non-existant infringement.

Obviously, something is very wrong with this picture. The Verge also reported that the jury foreman, who is a patent holder himself [this appears to be his patent, "Method and apparatus for recording and storing video information"], told court officials that the jury didn't need the answer to its question to reach a verdict:

    The foreman told a court representative that the jurors had reached a decision without needing the instructions.

That's why I don't think this jury's ruling will stand, among other reasons.

I thought it wise to highlight this, because I saw this morning that some missed seeing it. For example, James Niccolai at PCWorld quotes a "legal expert" who clearly didn't:

    "It's surprising they came back so quickly, given that it was a complicated case and very complicated verdict form, but that said, it looks like they were thoughtful about it and they did their job," said Roy Futterman, director at DOAR Litigation Consulting and a clinical psychologist who works on trial strategies and the mindset of jurors.

    "One sign of that is that the verdicts were consistent, they held together -- they voted one way on infringement and another way on invalidity; it all tells the same big story," he said.

That's in an article titled "Quick Verdict in Apple Trial Doesn't Mean Jury Shirked Its Duty, Expert Says." If the jury instructions [PDF] are as long and complex as they were in this case, a quick verdict can indeed mean it shirked its duty. For example, if the jury rushed so much it assigned $2 million dollars to Apple, and then had to subtract it because there was no infringement, it raises a valid question: what was the basis for any of the damages figures the jury came up with? If they had any actual basis, how could they goof like this? Was there a factual basis for any of the damages figures?

Time will tell, but keep in mind that one of the plays you'll see next will likely be a Rule 50(b) motion by Samsung, and that's the one where you ask the judge for various relief on the basis that no reasonable jury could find what it did find on the evidence presented. Here's Google's still pending Rule 50(b) motion for judgment as a matter of law in the Oracle v. Google case, to give you an idea of what they look like. As you can see, you can ask for victory across the board or just on one part of what the jury decided.

This story is far from over, in other words, and while Apple's CEO, Tim Cook, waxed philosophical about the trial, and saying that it was about values, not money, one important US value is that the jury fulfill its responsibilities, one of which is to read and make sure they understand and follow the jury instructions they are given. I believe Cook would agree that trials are supposed to be fair, with everyone doing their part. If this jury thought they knew the right result without instructions, and if they hurried so much they made glaring mistakes, and they did, and all in Apple's favor, something isn't right in this picture. As the legal blog, Above the Law expressed it:

    Here’s the thing, ladies and gentlemen of the Apple v. Samsung jury: It would take me more than three days to understand all the terms in the verdict! Much less come to a legally binding decision on all of these separate issues. Did you guys just flip a coin?

If it would take a lawyer three days to make sure he understood the terms in the form, how did the jury not need the time to do the same? There were 700 questions, remember, and one thing is plain, that the jury didn't take the time to avoid inconsistencies, one of which resulted in the jury casually throwing numbers around, like $2 million dollars for a nonfringement.

Come on. This is farce.

Professor Michael Risch points out an even worse inconsistency:

    How did the Galaxy Tab escape design patent infringement? This was the only device to be preliminarily enjoined (on appeal no less), and yet it was the one of the few devices to be spared the sledgehammer. And, by the way, it looks an awful lot like an iPad. Yet the Epic 4G, a phone I own (uh oh, Apple’s coming after me) — which has a slide out keyboard, a curved top and bottom, 4 buttons on the bottom, the word Samsung printed across the top, buttons in different places (and I know this because I look in all the wrong places on my wife’s iTouch), a differently shaped speaker, a differently placed camera, etc. — that device infringes the iPhone design patents....

    Relatedly, the ability to get a design patent on a user interface implies that design patent law is broken. This, to me, is the Supreme Court issue in this case. We can dicker about the “facts” of point 2, but whether you can stop all people from having square icons in rows of 4 with a dock is something that I thought we settled in Lotus v. Borland 15 years ago. I commend Apple for finding a way around basic UI law, but this type of ruling cannot stand.

This is the second lawyer I've seen predicting this case will go all the way to the US Supreme Court. He also compliments Groklaw for having "not only really detailed information, but really accurate information, and actual source documents. That combination is hard to find." Thank you.

Update: One of the jurors has now spoken, and CNET's Greg Sandoval has it, in his article, Exclusive: Apple-Samsung juror speaks out:

    Apple v. Samsung juror Manuel Ilagan said the nine-person jury that heard the patent infringement case between the companies knew after the first day that it believed Samsung had wronged Apple....

    The decision was very one-sided, but Ilagan said it wasn't clear the jurors were largely in agreement until after the first day of deliberations.

    "It didn't dawn on us [that we agreed that Samsung had infringed] on the first day," Ilagan said. "We were debating heavily, especially about the patents on bounce back and pinch-to-zoom. Apple said they owned patents, but we were debating about the prior art [about the same technology that Samsung said existed before the iPhone debuted]. [Velvin Hogan] was jury foreman. He had experience. He owned patents himself. In the beginning the debate was heated, but it was still civil. Hogan holds patents, so he took us through his experience. After that it was easier. After we debated that first patent -- what was prior art --because we had a hard time believing there was no prior art, that there wasn't something out there before Apple.

    "In fact we skipped that one," Ilagan continued, "so we could go on faster. It was bogging us down." ...

    "Once you determine that Samsung violated the patents," Ilagan said, "it's easy to just go down those different [Samsung] products because it was all the same. Like the trade dress, once you determine Samsung violated the trade dress, the flatscreen with the Bezel...then you go down the products to see if it had a bezel. But we took our time. We didn't rush. We had a debate before we made a decision. Sometimes it was getting heated."

This gets worse and worse.

Update 2: Dan Levine of Reuters has some words from the foreman:

    "We wanted to make sure the message we sent was not just a slap on the wrist," Hogan said. "We wanted to make sure it was sufficiently high to be painful, but not unreasonable."

    Hogan said jurors were able to complete their deliberations in less than three days -- much faster than legal experts had predicted -- because a few had engineering and legal experience, which helped with the complex issues in play. Once they determined Apple's patents were valid, jurors evaluated every single device separately, he said.

Now the jurors are contradicting each other. Lordy, the more they talk, the worse it gets. I'm sure Samsung is glad they are talking, though. Had they read the full jury instructions, all 109 pages [as PDF], they would have read that damages are not supposed to punish, merely to compensate for losses. Here's what they would have found in Final Jury Instruction No. 35, in part:

    The amount of those damages must be adequate to compensate the patent holder for the infringement. A damages award should put the patent holder in approximately the financial position it would have been in had the infringement not occurred, but in no event may the damages award be less than a reasonable royalty. You should keep in mind that the damages you award are meant to compensate the patent holder and not to punish an infringer.

The same instruction is repeated in Final Jury Instruction No. 53, in case they missed it the first time. Did they obey those instructions? Nay, did they even read them? The evidence, judging by the foreman's reported words, point the wrong way.

Update 3: Samsung lawyer John Quinn is quoted by USA Today saying they'll be asking the judge to toss this out and then appeal, if she does not:

    Samsung, the global leader among smartphone makers, vowed to fight. Its lawyers told the judge it intended to ask her to toss out the verdict.

    "This decision should not be allowed to stand because it would discourage innovation and limit the rights of consumers to make choices for themselves," Samsung lead lawyer John Quinn said. He argued that the judge or an appeals court should overturn the verdict.

    Apple lawyers plan to formally demand Samsung pull its most popular cellphones and computer tablets from the U.S. market. They also can ask the judge to triple the damages from $1.05 billion to $3 billion.

    U.S. District Judge Lucy Koh will decide those issues, along with Samsung's demand she overturn the jury's verdict, in several weeks. Quinn said Samsung would appeal if the judge refuses to toss out the decision....

    Samsung said after the verdict that it was "unfortunate that patent law can be manipulated to give one company a monopoly over rectangles with rounded corners."

    "This is by no means the final word in this case," Quinn said in a statement. "Patent law should not be twisted so as to give one company a monopoly over the shape of smartphones."

___________
1 Is that math even correct, even after the fix? One reader did the math, and he or she thinks their math is off, and the right total, even if all else is accurate, should be $1,049,423,540. Here's the calculation, taken from the Amended Verdict Form [PDF], so you can do your own checking:

    My math gives a different total

    ... in favor of Apple by a few 10,000's

    Captivate . . . . . . . . . .80,840,162

    Continuum . . . . . . . . . .16,399,117

    Droid Charge. . . . . . . . .50,672,869

    Epic 4G. . . . . . . . . . .130,180,894

    Exhibit 4G . . . . . . . . . .1,081,820

    Fascinate. . . . . . . . . .143,539,179

    Galaxy Ace . . . . . . . . . . . . . .0

    Galaxy Prevail. . . . . . . .57,867,383

    Galaxy S . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .0

    Galaxy S 4G . . . . . . . . .73,344,668

    Galaxy S II (AT&T). . . . . .40,494,356

    Galaxy S II (i9000). . . . . . . . . .0

    Galaxy S II (T-Mobile). . . .83,791,708

    Galaxy S II (Epic 4G Touch).100,326,988

    Galaxy S II (Skyrocket) . . .32,273,558

    Galaxy S (Showcase) . . . . .22,002,146

    Galaxy Tab . . . . . . . . . .1,966,691

    Galaxy Tab 10.1 WiFi . . . . . .833,076

    Galaxy Tab 10.1 4G LTE . . . . . . . .0

    Gem. . . . . . . . . . . . . .4,075,585

    Indulge . . . . . . . . . . .16,011,184

    Infuse 4G . . . . . . . . . .44,792,974

    Intercept. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .0

    Mesmerize . . . . . . . . . .53,123,612

    Nexus S 4G . . . . . . . . . .1,828,297

    Replenish. . . . . . . . . . .3,350,256

    Transform. . . . . . . . . . . .953,060

    Vibrant . . . . . . . . . . .89,673,957

    TOTAL. . . . . . . . . . .1,049,423,540



  http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=2012082510525390&repost=1

Wtf dude? The link would have been enough.
A

Nomad

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #56 on: August 27, 2012, 10:29:02 PM »
'nuff said.  ::)

So Samsung increased the screen size.

HOYL SHIETTT TIME TO START SUING THE FUCK OUT OF SAMMICHSUNG
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BIG ACH

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #57 on: August 28, 2012, 10:12:17 AM »

On the opposite end of the spectrum, In Germany Apple has admitted to infringing on patents owned by Motorola, and and two have struck a deal where Motorola will license some of its standards-essential patents to Apple...


http://www.engadget.com/2012/08/28/apple-strikes-licensing-deal-with-motorola-in-germany/

Motorola's war with Apple has certainly been overshadowed by the showdown with Samsung. But, with the latter melodrama shifting into quiet mode, focus is coming back to the battle with Moto. That ongoing story has taken a rather unexpected turn, however. A filing on Monday revealed that the Google subsidiary has agreed to license some (if not all) of its standards-essential patents to Cupertino... in Germany, at least. When exactly the deal was struck isn't clear, and neither side has announced a royalty rate as of yet. It could be that the German courts will decide what is appropriate according to FRAND rules, but the agreement also includes an admission by Apple that it is liable for past damages relating to these patents. The terms seem to include only "cellular standard-essential" patents, which means the company's claims regarding WiFi and video codecs could still be used as an avenue of attack. But, with at least one set of FRAND patents set aside, we wouldn't be surprised if the rest followed. It may be that Moto has simply decided to pick its fights more carefully, in light Apple's recent legal victory and growing pressure from the European Commission surrounding potential abuse of standards-essential patents. Or, it could be an olive branch and a sign that the patent wars are winding down -- a possibility we'd joyously embrace.

BayGBM

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #58 on: August 28, 2012, 11:06:51 AM »
So Samsung increased the screen size.

HOYL SHIETTT TIME TO START SUING THE FUCK OUT OF SAMMICHSUNG


They didn’t just make the screen bigger.  They produced a 132 page internal report discussing why early versions of the Galaxy were deficient and needed to be more like the iPhone.  The internal Samsung report was authored in 2010 by the company's engineering team which meticulously compares and contrasts the usability and design of the Galaxy S against the iPhone.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/102322739/Samsung-Comparison-Report

The methodical report first compares the two handsets, points out the differences and offers "Directions for improvement" which almost always take the form of Apple's already-instituted solution. Everything from home screen icons to phone apps were studied, bringing comments ranging from fixing screen overlapping to filling empty spaces with a "loading" sign as seen in the soon-to-be defunct iOS YouTube app.

 ::)

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #59 on: August 28, 2012, 11:26:48 AM »

They didn’t just make the screen bigger.  They produced a 132 page internal report discussing why early versions of the Galaxy were deficient and needed to be more like the iPhone.  The internal Samsung report was authored in 2010 by the company's engineering team which meticulously compares and contrasts the usability and design of the Galaxy S against the iPhone.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/102322739/Samsung-Comparison-Report

The methodical report first compares the two handsets, points out the differences and offers "Directions for improvement" which almost always take the form of Apple's already-instituted solution. Everything from home screen icons to phone apps were studied, bringing comments ranging from fixing screen overlapping to filling empty spaces with a "loading" sign as seen in the soon-to-be defunct iOS YouTube app.

 ::)
Whats your point here Bay?
Companies always intergrate more popular features from competitors into their own product. Thats how they create a competitive product that people want to buy. Apple, IMHO, is whining like a spoiled child.

Mr Anabolic

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #60 on: August 28, 2012, 11:34:02 AM »
Anyone who plays the stock market should seriously consider shorting AAPL.

BayGBM

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #61 on: August 28, 2012, 11:42:58 AM »
Whats your point here Bay?
Companies always intergrate more popular features from competitors into their own product. Thats how they create a competitive product that people want to buy. Apple, IMHO, is whining like a spoiled child.


My point was made by the jury: Samsung violated the patents covering the look, feel, design, and functionality of the iPhone.  One can argue (as the loser and their sympathizers in such cases often do) that those things should not be subject to patent protection, but that is a discussion for another court to decide.  Good designers and engineers are paid very well for their efforts when their products and creations excel in the marketplace.  Competitors cannot simply make a page for page copy (in this case 132 pages) of their work without paying licensing fees or being held accountable in court. 

Buyers of the Samsung S phones should be happy; without the iPhone, Samsung would have nothing to copy and they would still be selling the Before models pictured  above—which obviously were not selling very well.  :-[

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #62 on: August 28, 2012, 11:47:02 AM »
this will be appealed

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #63 on: August 28, 2012, 12:01:34 PM »



BTW Fuck Apple.

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #64 on: August 28, 2012, 12:33:51 PM »
only a matter of time before an open source hand held device comes a long, can't wait.

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #65 on: August 28, 2012, 12:51:26 PM »
only a matter of time before an open source hand held device comes a long, can't wait.


Android is open source?

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #66 on: August 28, 2012, 01:21:54 PM »
Buyers of the Samsung S phones should be happy; without the iPhone, Samsung would have nothing to copy and they would still be selling the Before models pictured  above—which obviously were not selling very well.  :-[

absolutely false speculation ::)

notice one of the "before" models even has no keyboard (unless it slides out), and cosmetic minutiae notwithstanding, looks very much like an iphone-style device already.

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #67 on: August 28, 2012, 02:19:25 PM »
Bay melting all over in this thread.  Can the cliches get any gayer?

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #68 on: August 28, 2012, 02:34:06 PM »
bay has killed in the name of Apple.
O

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #69 on: August 28, 2012, 03:36:47 PM »

They didn’t just make the screen bigger.  They produced a 132 page internal report discussing why early versions of the Galaxy were deficient and needed to be more like the iPhone.  The internal Samsung report was authored in 2010 by the company's engineering team which meticulously compares and contrasts the usability and design of the Galaxy S against the iPhone.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/102322739/Samsung-Comparison-Report

The methodical report first compares the two handsets, points out the differences and offers "Directions for improvement" which almost always take the form of Apple's already-instituted solution. Everything from home screen icons to phone apps were studied, bringing comments ranging from fixing screen overlapping to filling empty spaces with a "loading" sign as seen in the soon-to-be defunct iOS YouTube app.

 ::)

So...incorporating a touch screen, wait....a BIGGER touchscreen is grounds for a lawsuit?  Huh?  Also since when is a companies internal report which details on how to improve a product in order to make it more competitive also basis for a patent infringement lawsuit?

Seriously, your and or Apple logic in this case is flawed.
all drugs - TPPIIP

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #70 on: August 28, 2012, 03:56:14 PM »
I love you guys who are arguing for the side of Samsung.

Just imagine for a minute.  For years phones had buttons and all they could do is dial a number and maybe text if you type 6-6-6-4-4-4-3-3-2-1-5-5-5-6  you might spell a word.

Then you spend millions to a billion in research and development in creating a touch screen that when you press it against your head it doesn't accidently press other buttons.  You only put a single home button on it, you perfect the pinch and stretch zoom with two fingers.  Years and years, thousands of engineers and a ton of money spent, then you go to market and some chinese company copies what you did and sells it as a competitor without doing any of the legwork or innovation.

Would you be happy?


You know how on an iphone when a phone number is in an email of webpage it is highlighted in blue and you can click it to auto-dial?  That was patented by apple in the 90's well before any touch phone came to be.

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #71 on: August 28, 2012, 04:07:59 PM »

My point was made by the jury: Samsung violated the patents covering the look, feel, design, and functionality of the iPhone.  One can argue (as the loser and their sympathizers in such cases often do) that those things should not be subject to patent protection, but that is a discussion for another court to decide.  Good designers and engineers are paid very well for their efforts when their products and creations excel in the marketplace.  Competitors cannot simply make a page for page copy (in this case 132 pages) of their work without paying licensing fees or being held accountable in court. 

Buyers of the Samsung S phones should be happy; without the iPhone, Samsung would have nothing to copy and they would still be selling the Before models pictured  above—which obviously were not selling very well.  :-[

Ah, ok, you're arguing the strict letter of the law. From your posts, I inferred that you were somehow upset at Samsung for doing what every company has done for decades.

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #72 on: August 28, 2012, 06:14:57 PM »
Ah, ok, you're arguing the strict letter of the law. From your posts, I inferred that you were somehow upset at Samsung for doing what every company has done for decades.

I am not upset at Samsung or any other company, but I do agree with El Diablo Blanco.  If I (as an individual or a company) invested the time and money to create the iPhone and someone else came along and aped it as obviously as Samsung did--as made clear in their internal report with pages and pages of how they could exactly copy the iPhone--I'd be in court as well.

It's easy to argue after the fact that X, Y, or Z feature is "obvious" and therefore should not have patent protection, but the before and after pix of Samsung phone and their reception in the marketplace after copying the iPhone is pretty obvious--at least it was to the jury.  Why didn't Samsung offer these obvious features and designs before the iPhone?  ::)

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #73 on: August 28, 2012, 06:17:38 PM »
 Google Has Had Enough: Files Lawsuit To Ban Multiple Apple Products
 
  Stop litigating and start innovating.

 http://techcrunch.com/2012/08/20/motorolas-new-patent-lawsuit-against-apple-the-details/
Gracie Rules

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Re: apple is @$$ raping samsung in court.
« Reply #74 on: August 28, 2012, 06:28:56 PM »
Google Has Had Enough: Files Lawsuit To Ban Multiple Apple Products
 
  Stop litigating and start innovating.

 http://techcrunch.com/2012/08/20/motorolas-new-patent-lawsuit-against-apple-the-details/

This is getting juicy