Greece now taxes people making $55,000/year at 42%

[MCWAY]

As I said before, it always STARTS with the rich; but, it doesn't end with the rich.

How much longer, before Obama and the government starts coming for more of our money?

Greeks earning €42,000 to be taxed at top rate

Read more here: http://www.kansascity.com/2012/12/13/3964936/greeks-earning-42000-to-be-taxed.html#storylink=cpy


ATHENS, Greece -- Greeks earning more than €42,000 ($55,000) per year will now be taxed at a new top rate of 42 percent, under a major new tax reform bill submitted to the country's parliament late Thursday.

Under the new guidelines, the 42 percent top tax rate and earnings threshold replaces the previous level of 45 percent for incomes above €100,000 ($130,770). The new rate is part of a simplification of the country's tax rules. There are currently eight tax bands ranging from 18 percent to 45 percent. These will be replaced by three tax rates: 22 percent, 32 percent and 42 percent.

Greeks earning less than €25,000 ($32,700) a year are set to benefit from the new system in spite of the raise in the basic tax band as the government is proposing to raise the threshold on which income is taxed.

The new tax rates, part of the austerity measures demanded by the country's international rescue lenders, were submitted to parliament hours after the finance ministers from the 17 European Union countries that use the euro agreed in Brussels to restart rescue loan payments. Greece is in line to get €49.1 billion ($64 billion) between now and March, with €34.3 billion of that amount due in the coming days.

Greek finance minister, Yannis Stournaras, presented his colleagues form the other 16 European Union details of his country's long-awaited tax overhaul before the bill was submitted.

In return for the rescue loans, Greece's international lenders have insisted on a series of reforms, tax raises and spending cuts.

But the successive hikes in taxes, required to meet deficit-cutting targets, have hammered the economy, pushing unemployment up to 26 percent, and with more than 20 percent of the population now officially living in poverty - earning less than €7,200 ($9,420) per year.


http://www.kansascity.com/2012/12/13/3964936/greeks-earning-42000-to-be-taxed.html

[War-Horse]

Greece doesnt drive the world economy like the USA.  And attacking the middleclass here would make sure you dont get voted in.

Many HUGE mistakes were made by greece to get to this point.  And it states that the creditors are demanding this as part of the bailout agreement.....greece is just a puppet along for the ride.  Agree, its gonna be huge mess for them.

[MCWAY]

Greece doesnt drive the world economy like the USA.  And attacking the middleclass here would make sure you dont get voted in.

I'm not attacking the middle class. What I've stated is that the middle class will be the ones who get the shaft, for foolishly thinking that Obama's ridiculous policies are only going to stick it to the rich and won't affect them.

Many HUGE mistakes were made by greece to get to this point.  And it states that the creditors are demanding this as part of the bailout agreement.....greece is just a puppet along for the ride.  Agree, its gonna be huge mess for them.

Among those huge mistakes:

- Spending more than they take into their coffers (sound familiar?)
- Excessively taxing the rich, in an attempt to boost revenues (sound familiar?)
- After rich haul tail and take their money elsewhere, taxing the middle class into near poverty (coming soon to the red, white, and blue).

[tbombz]

Middle class is a relative term.  55k per year (4,600 per month) might be middle class here in America but in Greece I'm sure its considered quite well off.     And mcway,  you are claiming high tax rates drove away the wealthy in Greece..  Where's your proof there was any such behavior to a significant extent? (significant meaning it would cause a fundamental shift in fiscal policy)

[MCWAY]

Middle class is a relative term.  55k per year (4,600 per month) might be middle class here in America but in Greece I'm sure its considered quite well off.     And mcway,  you are claiming high tax rates drove away the wealthy in Greece..  Where's your proof there was any such behavior to a significant extent? (significant meaning it would cause a fundamental shift in fiscal policy)

Let me clarify. You can drive them away without their actual leaving. That's why I said, "haul tail and take their money elsewhere."

They simply park their money overseas, as the rich often do.

As for the middle class thing, making $4,600 a month but only taking home about $2,700 a month (assuming you don't pay state taxes) isn't being well off.

[tbombz]

So please provide some evidence that tax rates on the wealthy have caused a significant change in Greece's economy.    2k per month is extraordinarily wealthy in certain places of the world. Considering the situation Greece is in at the moment 2k per month is probably pretty good

[MCWAY]

So please provide some evidence that tax rates on the wealthy have caused a significant change in Greece's economy.    2k per month is extraordinarily wealthy in certain places of the world. Considering the situation Greece is in at the moment 2k per month is probably pretty good

Considering some of those riots, perhaps it's not pretty good.

I already mentioned what caused the change in Greece's economy: TOO MUCH SPENDING.

Taxing the rich is a feeble attempt to mitigate that spending. Again, does that sound familiar?

[tbombz]

Spending doesn't damage an economy. Spending increases GDP and employment.    I think what you mean is that the massive reduction in spending due to massive debt is what has damaged the economy. Yes, that would be true.  The culprit for the depression is the debt.  The debt was caused by an in balance between spending and revenues.  Not enough taxes to cover all expenditures. That would be the root cause of the depression, as it caused the debt which caused spending to decrease which has damaged employment and GDP. 

[Al Doggity]

Among those huge mistakes:

- Spending more than they take into their coffers (sound familiar?)
- Excessively taxing the rich, in an attempt to boost revenues (sound familiar?)
- After rich haul tail and take their money elsewhere, taxing the middle class into near poverty (coming soon to the red, white, and blue).

One of the biggest problems was something you didn't list: rampant tax evasion. Greece has a high rate of self-employed professionals who under-report their incomes to pay lower-tax rates. These rates are designed with that in mind. Just for comparison, the corporate tax rate was hiked from 20% to 26%.

[MCWAY]

One of the biggest problems was something you didn't list: rampant tax evasion. Greece has a high rate of self-employed professionals who under-report their incomes to pay lower-tax rates. These rates are designed with that in mind.

Tax evasion is indeed an issue. That, combined with the other three issues, can lead to fiscal disaster.

[Al Doggity]

Tax evasion is indeed an issue. That, combined with the other three issues, can lead to fiscal disaster.

Of the three things you listed, I think only one is a real issue. My point was that Greece's economy can't really be considered a harbinger of what's going to happen in America. The differences are too great.

[MCWAY]

Of the three things you listed, I think only one is a real issue. My point was that Greece's economy can't really be considered a harbinger of what's going to happen in America. The differences are too great.

This hasn't happened to just Greece. And the pattern is much the same.

How does America follow such a pattern and not face the same fate? Are we banking on our ability to quickly throw out the politicians who foster this, when we see the disastrous results?

[Al Doggity]

This hasn't happened to just Greece. And the pattern is much the same.

How does America follow such a pattern and not face the same fate? Are we banking on our ability to quickly throw out the politicians who foster this, when we see the disastrous results?

Which other countries are taxing the middle class at over 40%?

[Conker]

Greece is pretty much an exceptional case, not too many countries in as bad a financial state. They let the public sector get too large and it ran away with itself, public sector workers being payed bonuses for turning up to work on time, 2hr lunch breaks etc...and they are all now paying the price.

They probably have very little choice about the tax rates set, the EU now pretty much dictates economic policy in Greece.

[Straw Man]

As I said before, it always STARTS with the rich; but, it doesn't end with the rich.

How much longer, before Obama and the government starts coming for more of our money?

Obviously you must support Obama in his effort to make the Bush tax cuts permanent for those making < 250k

[MCWAY]

Obviously you must support Obama in his effort to make the Bush tax cuts permanent for those making < 250k

I support keeping the tax cuts permanent for EVERYONE. And considering it was Obama's idea to let them expire in the first place, NO! I don't support his lunacy.

[Straw Man]

I support keeping the tax cuts permanent for EVERYONE. And considering it was Obama's idea to let them expire in the first place, NO! I don't support his lunacy.

you'll be happy to know that is exactly what is gong to happen

EVERYONE is going to get a tax cut on the first 250k

there is your tax cut for everyone

Happy Hanukkah

[Soul Crusher]

you'll be happy to know that is exactly what is gong to happen

EVERYONE is going to get a tax cut on the first 250k

there is your tax cut for everyone

Happy Hanukkah

Are you a member of the Tribe of Israel?  Lecchh Chaim!

[whork]

Which other countries are taxing the middle class at over 40%?

Im in Denmark i pay 50% in taxes and 75% on income above a set amount.

[whork]

I support keeping the tax cuts permanent for EVERYONE. And considering it was Obama's idea to let them expire in the first place, NO! I don't support his lunacy.

The taxes rates before Bush was lunacy?

[Straw Man]

Are you a member of the Tribe of Israel?  Lecchh Chaim!

nope

[bears]

The taxes rates before Bush was lunacy?

you're not looking at the big picture.  no they weren't.  but when you take into consideration the sales tax rates were lower in pretty much every state, the gas prices were lower, the US dollar was worth more, the value of people's biggest investments, their homes, were steadily rising, and real estate taxes were lower across the board for everyone yes raising rates doesn't seem to be the most prudent thing to do right now.  like i've said before, not one of those things taken by itself is unfair or over the top.  but all taken together it puts our citizens in a bad spot.  none of those things that i've mentioned was a huge bite taken from the US citizens.  the government is slowly bleeding us.  they're NEVER going to stab us with a butcher knife.  I live in Illinois.  I pay more taxes than any of you.  and it doesn't help.  we're in the worst shape of any of the states.  and we do exactly what you want us to do.  we beat the hell out of corporations and tax the shit out of them.    and it's not working.

[bears]

Im in Denmark i pay 50% in taxes and 75% on income above a set amount.

and they have a balanced budget and would literally laugh out loud at the shit our government spends it money on.