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Author Topic: Calif. Judge to Rule If Boy Murdered Neo-Nazi  (Read 1779 times)
Alex23
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« on: January 14, 2013, 09:53:17 AM »



http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-neo-nazi-sentencing-20130114,0,4686512.story

Before sunrise, a troubled 10-year-old Riverside boy quietly crept downstairs with a loaded revolver, held it at his sleeping father's head and, using two fingers, squeezed the trigger.

That's not in dispute. Neither is this: The youngster will be a free man before his 23rd birthday, if not sooner.

A Riverside County judge will make the difficult decision Monday about whether the boy, now 12, possessed the mental capacity to know it was wrong to kill his father, an abusive neo-Nazi activist. But lurking behind that legal issue is a more vexing moral one: what should be done long term about a boy who was born to a heroin-addled mother, raised in a house steeped in violence and, by all accounts, is sporadically consumed by uncontrollable rage.

"The thing is, eventually he'll be out there so we need to help this kid," said his attorney, public defender Matthew Hardy.

Jeffrey Hall, the boy's father, was a leader in a budding neo-Nazi organization known as the National Socialist Movement. His son, who is not being named by The Times because of his age, was charged as a juvenile and will not land in adult prison. His future is up to the judge, and no matter where the boy goes, he can be held only until he turns 23.

If Superior Court Judge Jean P. Leonard finds that the boy grasped the difference between right and wrong when he pulled the trigger, she could be send him to one of California's three juvenile detention centers. Those institutions are filled with young murderers, rapists and gang members. None currently house anyone younger than 14.

Hardy said that if his client is sent there, he would probably leave as either a corpse or a serial killer.

The judge also could sentence the boy to probation, placing him in foster care or with a family member and order him to undergo intensive counseling.

On the other hand, if Leonard rules that the boy didn't know the difference between right and wrong, the youngster would be released from juvenile hall and, most likely, into the custody of the county social service agency. A judge then will have the burden of deciding whether to place him with relatives or into the foster care system.

The boy's birth mother, who divorced Hall shortly after their son was born, has a checkered history. She is accused of neglecting the boy as a baby and using heroin and methamphetamine while pregnant, possibly planting the seeds to his violent, disturbed behavior, say psychologists who examined him.

His grandmother would be the most likely relative to take him in. She visits him weekly and says he has told her that he wants to come live with her.

She said she is torn. She still grieves for her son.

"I don't know that I could handle him," said the grandmother, Jo Ann Patterson. "I have a double interest in all this. I want justice for my son, but I don't want it at the cost of my grandson."

The grandmother and a psychologist who examined the child agree that the best option may be to place the youngster, at least at the outset, in an intensive juvenile rehabilitation facility where he can receive professional care. Those can include private facilities or juvenile centers run by the Riverside County Department of Probation. They can range from residential group homes to high-security compounds.

"Honestly, the best-case scenario we believe is that he gets some rehabilitation" while also going to school, Patterson said.

A probation officer will assess the boy's history and eventually make a recommendation to the judge about what's best for him, said Mark Hake, the county's interim chief probation officer.

"Our first goal is to reunify kids with a family member," Hake said. "You're looking at trying to gear them up and equip them to go out in the world on their own."

Anna Salter, a clinical psychologist from Wisconsin who testified for the prosecution, offered a relatively bright assessment of the boy's chances. In testimony last week, Salter rejected the defense argument that the boy, brutalized by his father and indoctrinated in the violent, hate-filled world of neo-Nazis, was too morally confused to know that killing was wrong.

She said the youngster's show of remorse offered a glimmer of hope. He is not a psychopath, a monster void of empathy or a conscience, she testified. "I do believe there is hope for [him]. I believe he wants to have a good life. I believe he will work hard to get one."

Killings committed by children under 14 are exceptionally rare, according to the U.S. Department of Justice. Just 29 occurred nationwide in 2010. Killing a parent is rarer still.

"The research shows that kids who kill their parents typically don't go on to kill others," said Paul Mones, a Portland, Ore., attorney who has handled numerous cases involving children accused of killing a parent.

The vast majority of patricide cases are "situational homicides" committed against controlling fathers who abused multiple members of their families, he said. The young killers are focused on ending that abuse and rarely lash out at outsiders, he said.

Chief Deputy Dist. Atty. Michael Soccio, the prosecutor in the Hall case, agrees that there still is hope for the boy. But he argued in court that the boy's rehabilitation cannot begin until he acknowledges that he is guilty of his father's death.

"He's not a lost cause," Soccio said. "He had virtues in him that could be fostered. But that won't work if we minimize, if we justify the murder."

phil.willon@latimes.com
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Raymondo
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« Reply #1 on: January 14, 2013, 10:04:16 AM »

Stark is dead?
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Alex23
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« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2013, 10:09:59 AM »

Stark is dead?

Stark doesn't sleep on the couch.
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Stark
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« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2013, 10:21:58 AM »

hang that little shit!!!
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« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2013, 11:11:00 AM »

If Superior Court Judge Jean P. Leonard finds that the boy grasped the difference between right and wrong when he pulled the trigger, she could be send him to one of California's three juvenile detention centers.

I'd say they are a couple years too fucking late to ask that question.  Roll Eyes
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« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2013, 11:33:01 AM »


If my son killed me for whatever reason, I hope he'd be smart enough to evade the law and hopefully come to terms for what he did in his own way without hurting anyone. I'd never want to see him spend even a minute in prison, even if he put a bullet in my head.

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« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2013, 11:36:23 AM »

Fact is, this kid is damaged goods, and will never be rehabilitated.  Not trying to get all Uberman on you, but it is most likely the fact.  Had he been taken away at an earlier age, things may have been different but he is now too old I believe to turn it around.  Poor kid, his remaining parent should be shot as well.
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airosol
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« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2013, 11:46:50 AM »

That kid had been in trouble a lot even before this . Shit dad brought up shit kid.
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« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2013, 11:47:32 AM »

Good.
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Mattyh7688
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« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2013, 11:48:43 AM »

With all the peace and love taught in that household, this is truly mind blowing and shocking.
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« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2013, 03:39:59 PM »

  Put him down.
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airosol
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« Reply #11 on: January 14, 2013, 05:02:38 PM »

FWIW the kid was found "guilty" today. Not really "guilty" B/C hes a juevnile, but found to have committed the crime.

So now he'll go to CYA for 8 or so years, turn into a total and complete piece of shit, be paroled, kill again and spend the rest of his life in prison. thanks dad!

white people  Roll Eyes
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Alex23
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« Reply #12 on: January 14, 2013, 05:45:53 PM »

If Superior Court Judge Jean P. Leonard finds that the boy grasped the difference between right and wrong when he pulled the trigger, she could be send him to one of California's three juvenile detention centers.

I'd say they are a couple years too fucking late to ask that question.  Roll Eyes

Yea no shit.

"Neo Nazis" = The white culture excremental left overs battling to stay relevant as blue collars stuck at the bottom of the social scale competing with uneducated immigrants.

beat your children
ridicule education and cultural diversity
promotes dead end ideology
Alcoolism, drugs

 In the meantime, the white elite prospers and embraces diversity and freedom.

The only power is economic.
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MAXX
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« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2013, 05:49:50 PM »

Yea no shit.

"Neo Nazis" = The white culture excremental left overs battling to stay relevant as blue collars stuck at the bottom of the social scale competing with uneducated immigrants.

beat your children
ridicule education and cultural diversity
promotes dead end ideology
Alcoolism, drugs

 In the meantime, the white elite prospers and embraces diversity and freedom.

The only power is economic.
kind of self-contradictory  Cheesy
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« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2013, 08:15:20 PM »

Yea no shit.

"Neo Nazis" = The white culture excremental left overs battling to stay relevant as blue collars stuck at the bottom of the social scale competing with uneducated immigrants.

beat your children
ridicule education and cultural diversity
promotes dead end ideology
Alcoolism, drugs

 In the meantime, the white elite prospers and embraces diversity and freedom.

The only power is economic.

By embracing diversity you mean paying the welfare cheque for lazy immigrants and wasting tax dollars on their inflated crime per capita of their population.

The white elite will prosper without "diversity".
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« Reply #15 on: January 15, 2013, 12:16:21 AM »

If my son killed me for whatever reason, I hope he'd be smart enough to evade the law and hopefully come to terms for what he did in his own way without hurting anyone. I'd never want to see him spend even a minute in prison, even if he put a bullet in my head.



AAAWWWWWWWW!  That's so sweet!   Roll Eyes
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« Reply #16 on: January 15, 2013, 12:37:54 AM »

By embracing diversity you mean paying the welfare cheque for lazy immigrants and wasting tax dollars on their inflated crime per capita of their population.

The white elite will prosper without "diversity".

Nope. I mean natural selection at its purest; regardless of where you're from, your skin color, if you're smart enough to create a new business, raise to the top in your discipline, being academics, sports, science or arts, join our team: Culture, USA.

In the meantime, bottom of the barrel white trash, focus on your "blue collar" "European" roots and see what you can make out of it between two 12 packs of Miller "genuine draft" and a couple of wife / children beating.  In the meantime, I'll be meeting with the Elite to decide of your fate.

Case closed.
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Naggash
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« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2013, 02:14:34 AM »

Nope. I mean natural selection at its purest; regardless of where you're from, your skin color, if you're smart enough to create a new business, raise to the top in your discipline, being academics, sports, science or arts, join our team: Culture, USA.

In the meantime, bottom of the barrel white trash, focus on your "blue collar" "European" roots and see what you can make out of it between two 12 packs of Miller "genuine draft" and a couple of wife / children beating.  In the meantime, I'll be meeting with the Elite to decide of your fate.

Case closed.

What you mentioned has nothing to do with diversity, is is about drive and initiative, and is obviously something few people would disagree with. That doesn't exactly mean you have to throw away your heritage though.

Funny how you try to insinuate that I'm white trash who drinks Miller's when I barely drink alcohol and I'm college educated, and probably won't be getting married with kids in my lifetime.

Btw "I'll be meeting with the Elite to decide of your fate" is grammatically incorrect...............

In any case, I've never offered a random woman on the net $8000 to sleep with her, ROFL socially retarded fatty
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« Reply #18 on: January 24, 2013, 04:32:33 AM »

I'd take the poor kid under my wing and show him what a real father is, fucking nazi scumbag.
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dr.chimps
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« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2013, 04:38:49 AM »

Now, here's a story with no winners.
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lovemonkey
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« Reply #20 on: January 24, 2013, 05:19:55 AM »

I'm surprised this thread hasn't turned into a gun control debate yet.
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from incomplete data
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« Reply #21 on: January 24, 2013, 07:01:30 AM »

I'm surprised this thread hasn't turned into a gun control debate yet.
Add some idiots. Let simmer for 3 pages. Bon appetit.
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« Reply #22 on: January 24, 2013, 07:55:05 AM »

AAAWWWWWWWW!  That's so sweet!   Roll Eyes

You would want different for your own son, given the same circumstances?
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« Reply #23 on: January 24, 2013, 05:10:49 PM »

he should be given an award

QUOTED FOR FUCKING TRUTH !!!
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Alex23
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« Reply #24 on: January 30, 2013, 12:53:03 AM »

 Huh
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