What's your guess on who trained Tsarnaev brothers? and what will happen?

[mogulgangi]

i truly believe we are being sold a bill of goods and total bs.   Nlt saying a 911 type bs, but i trult believe the FBI knew about this gut from day 1 and didnt do dick  

Do some research on the NSA and its link with 911 attacks..the NSA knew of the potential attacks coming to America on September .they .had scripts and pictures of terrorist planning such events but all under secrecy and without discretion...why didn't they stop it from happening? Well , in America we have privacy laws. If you read up on this, George bush was alerted about the potential attacks, wanted to seize and arrested the terrorist but the NSA would not allow him to do so because the NSA obtained this information without their consent..the NSA would not allow for the gov to stop them because of the potential issues of privacy law that would be broken...if you look at history after the attacks, the patriot act was enacted because of this...a major part of the patriot act was to allow gov agencies to tap into any phones or get as much intel without our consent..

The FBI and CIA probably knew about this guy....but compliance and strict regulation prohibit the agencies from just barging at their doors and shooting them down...unfortunately there are many dirty attorneys who know a angle slip up in the procedure of arresting a subject can be detrimental to a case and potentially can put a killer back out..

[Hugo Chavez]

I just can't see not using them in a case like this.

1. It was a fresh scent trail.
2. They had available to them his scent and he would have been leaving a hell of a trail after the night and morning he went through.
3. Even if the dog loses the scent, valuable information can still be attained like if he's headed in a direction vs. circling back or staying in a general area.  I've seen PD's use these dogs before and the dog lose the trail but I doubt they regretted the info attained.

[Agnostic007]

I just can't see not using them in a case like this.

1. It was a fresh scent trail.
2. They had available to them his scent and he would have been leaving a hell of a trail after the night and morning he went through.
3. Even if the dog loses the scent, valuable information can still be attained like if he's headed in a direction vs. circling back or staying in a general area.  I've seen PD's use these dogs before and the dog lose the trail but I doubt they regretted the info attained.

Can't argue with any of that

[doison]

1. I only have your word bloodhounds were available
2. I don't know all the facts surroundiing the situation
3. I DO know they wanted to catch this person in the worst way, so I would imagine all available options were considered.  
4. If it comes to light that someone suggested bloodhounds, or the situation warranted bloodhounds that could have readily been located and transported to the scene then I will be right up there on the soapbox with you

It was a national security issue.  If there are bloodhounds in the US, they were available.  Did they only use whatever local police force happened to be in the neighborhood? 

Unless there are no trained bloodhounds in America, I can't see how they wouldn't have been "available."

[Agnostic007]

It was a national security issue.  If there are bloodhounds in the US, they were available.  Did they only use whatever local police force happened to be in the neighborhood? 

Unless there are no trained bloodhounds in America, I can't see how they wouldn't have been "available."

So a bloodhound in florida would be considered available to you? Time effects scent spores.. hell, time of day, heat, moisture in the air, effects scent spores. So there is a clock ticking from the time the suspects foot leave the ground. Secondly we don't know if the situation warranted a bloodhound attempt.. (I'm actually smiling at that sentence).. we assume so but we don't have all the information. 

[tu_holmes]

It was a national security issue.  If there are bloodhounds in the US, they were available.  Did they only use whatever local police force happened to be in the neighborhood? 

Unless there are no trained bloodhounds in America, I can't see how they wouldn't have been "available."

Dogs need to have a scent in the first place. Something distinctly his own. You can't use a car... There's too many people in it.

What could they have used?

[blacken700]

if the armchair qbs say its possible it's possible   what's funny some of the best minds in the fbi and none of them thought of dogs  

[Agnostic007]

Dogs need to have a scent in the first place. Something distinctly his own. You can't use a car... There's too many people in it.

What could they have used?

If there was blood in the car, that would work.. but I'm making a lot of assumptions about how much he was bleeding   

[tu_holmes]

If there was blood in the car, that would work.. but I'm making a lot of assumptions about how much he was bleeding   

Fair point.

[Hugo Chavez]

Dogs need to have a scent in the first place. Something distinctly his own. You can't use a car... There's too many people in it.

What could they have used?

They had his scent if they wanted it.  They had plenty of access to his personal items.  Those dogs can be crazy good too.  They've even tracked the sent of someone that's in a moving car.  Now that's really good and not something they can all do but you get my point...  They're in an area of the country that does have quick access to tracking dogs like this.  even if you had to fly them in from a county or so away it would be minutes, maybe an hour, not hours or days.

[Hugo Chavez]

OH OOPS!!!!  So much for speculating they were not available or not up to the job....


Holly is one of the best and brightest detectives on the Massachusetts State Police Force. She is an expert in her ability to assemble clues while tracking missing persons or hunting down criminals. How did she get to be so good at her job? That’s easy — she works like a dog.

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/episodes/underdogs/the-bloodhounds-amazing-sense-of-smell/350/

[Roger Bacon]

333 is on his cut and paste binge this morning.. screwing up other threads as well

haha!!!

333386 cracks me up when he starts going bonkers like this.

[Agnostic007]

OH OOPS!!!!  So much for speculating they were not available or not up to the job....


Holly is one of the best and brightest detectives on the Massachusetts State Police Force. She is an expert in her ability to assemble clues while tracking missing persons or hunting down criminals. How did she get to be so good at her job? That’s easy — she works like a dog.

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/nature/episodes/underdogs/the-bloodhounds-amazing-sense-of-smell/350/

2008 article

[Hugo Chavez]

2008 article

yea, and?  

yea sure, they might not have holly there but it's pretty clear the state police valued having those dogs available... I seriously doubt they just said fuck it if Holly retired.

From the article: "For the past 25 years, Larry Allen, a member of Barbour County Tactical Search and Recovery Teams in West Virginia, has been training bloodhounds for law enforcement agencies across the country."

[Agnostic007]

yea, and? 

yea sure, they might not have a holly there but it's pretty clear the police valued having those dogs available... I seriously doubt they just said fuck it if Holly retired.

From the article: "For the past 25 years, Larry Allen, a member of Barbour County Tactical Search and Recovery Teams in West Virginia, has been training bloodhounds for law enforcement agencies across the country."

Okay, so assuming Holly was there, healthy and raring to go.. I agree with you that it may have been an option. But you and I weren't there and we do not know the circumstances. Great question to ask for sure, but I can't at this point conclude they screwed the pooch by not bringing in a bloodhound

[Roger Bacon]

Hey, l've been in the business a long time. Never had a bloodhound respond to any call. Wouldn't know where to find one.. maybe a prison? I don't know any departments around here that have them.. maybe you know something about the area and the dogs they hvae available that I dont..

Obama offered the full resources of the federal government.   I imagine they could have flown a blood hound in from Georgia.

[Agnostic007]

Obama offered the full resources of the federal government.   I imagine they could have flown a blood hound in from Georgia.

Yep, probably coulda..

[Hugo Chavez]

Okay, so assuming Holly was there, healthy and raring to go.. I agree with you that it may have been an option. But you and I weren't there and we do not know the circumstances. Great question to ask for sure, but I can't at this point conclude they screwed the pooch by not bringing in a bloodhound

I'm not assuming Holly was there but it's clear the state police valued having these type of dogs available.  I highly doubt they dropped that since 2008.  Of course we were not there but that's the hole point of public debate, to raise questions and hopefully if enough people start questioning something maybe it gets answered either through investigation or explanation or a combo of both or whatever.  It's valid to challenge these things.  In a free society it's almost a duty citizens have to question.  I'm asking why the fuck they didn't.  For all I know they did and not one single media outlet in all their blubbering have mentioned it yet.  But it doesn't sound like they did.

[Hugo Chavez]

LOL, I derailed my own thread

[Agnostic007]

I'm not assuming Holly was there but it's clear the state police valued having these type of dogs available.  I highly doubt they dropped that since 2008.  Of course we were not there but that's the hole point of public debate, to raise questions and hopefully if enough people start questioning something maybe it gets answered either through investigation or explanation or a combo of both or whatever.  It's valid to challenge these things.  In a free society it's almost a duty citizens have to question.  I'm asking why the fuck they didn't.  For all I know they did and not one single media outlet in all their blubbering have mentioned it yet.

Here's what I got so far, correct me where I'm wrong. You think they should have used a bloodhound to track the suspect from his vehicle to the boat, or at least make the attempt. Or at least find out why they didn't. Ok, cool. I would be surprised if they didn't at least use a police dog to try and locate the suspect after he bailed. That is a common thing to do.. but the bloodhound angle.. interesting. Let's see if that ever comes up  

[Agnostic007]

LOL, I derailed my own thread

It will be learned that an Al Queda operative who happens to own bloodhounds, trained the brothers ...

[Hugo Chavez]

Here's what I got so far, correct me where I'm wrong. You think they should have used a bloodhound to track the suspect from his vehicle to the boat, or at least make the attempt. Or at least find out why they didn't. Ok, cool. I would be surprised if they didn't at least use a police dog to try and locate the suspect after he bailed. That is a common thing to do.. but the bloodhound angle.. interesting. Let's see if that ever comes up  

yup, that's it! And the only reason I'm asking that is because of the massive show of force by the government that involved shutting down the town and effectively enacting martial law with semi war zone like door to door searches, but no mention of using bloodhounds... uh yea... definitely a valid question if we're going to start doing shit like that in America. 

[Hugo Chavez]

It will be learned that an Al Queda operative who happens to own bloodhounds, trained the brothers ...

Ok, I'm good then

[Soul Crusher]

Obama hopefully wll be impeahed over tis failure.

[Agnostic007]

Obama hopefully wll be impeahed over tis failure.

what failure are you talking about? You need to be specific as he has a lot of them