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Author Topic: So much for the theory that it was "Just That House"  (Read 2175 times)
Soul Crusher
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« Reply #25 on: April 23, 2013, 07:50:54 PM »

the problem is nobody's constitutional rights were violated

The scumbag was bleeding out in a boat in the backyard while homeowers were in lockdown and a state of terror
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Jack T. Cross
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« Reply #26 on: April 23, 2013, 07:51:12 PM »

How are you going to sue after the fact. If the cops broke something and you have proof, sure. What they did feels so absolutely wrong. It looked wrong and to me violated Constitutional rights but the cops are going to say that public safety overroad that. I'm not a lawyer but 3 could tell you chapter and verse on both sides I'm sure.



That's why they refer to it as damage, yes.  That's the point.
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headhuntersix
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« Reply #27 on: April 23, 2013, 07:51:20 PM »

the problem is nobody's constitutional rights were violated

Look I know full well that your a gun grabbing police state lib so I'm sure it looked wonderful. I'm also sure you would have prefered that it was West Virginians or Texans instead of my fellow blue state massholes, getting pulled out by the velcro commando's.
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« Reply #28 on: April 23, 2013, 07:53:07 PM »

Exigent circumstance in United States law


From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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An exigent circumstance, in the American law of criminal procedure, allows law enforcement to enter a structure without a search warrant, or if they have a "knock and announce" warrant, without knocking and waiting for refusal under certain circumstances. It must be a situation where people are in imminent danger, evidence faces imminent destruction, or a suspect will escape.
 
In the criminal procedure context, exigent circumstance means:
 

An emergency situation requiring swift action to prevent imminent danger to life or serious damage to property, or to forestall the imminent escape of a suspect, or destruction of evidence. There is no ready litmus test for determining whether such circumstances exist, and in each case the extraordinary situation must be measured by the facts known by officials.[1]
 

Those circumstances that would cause a reasonable person to believe that entry (or other relevant prompt action) was necessary to prevent physical harm to the officers or other persons, the destruction of relevant evidence, the escape of a suspect, or some other consequence improperly frustrating legitimate law enforcement efforts.[2]
 
Exigent circumstances may make a warrantless search constitutional if probable cause exists. The existence of exigent circumstances is a mixed question of law and fact.[3] There is no absolute test for determining if exigent circumstances exist, but general factors have been identified. These include: clear evidence of probable cause; the seriousness of the offense and likelihood of destruction of evidence; limitations on the search to minimize the intrusion only to preventing destruction of evidence; and clear indications of exigency.
 
Exigency may be determined by: degree of urgency involved; amount of time needed to get a search warrant; whether evidence is about to be removed or destroyed; danger at the site; knowledge of the suspect that police are on his or her trail; and/or ready destructibility of the evidence.[4] In determining the time necessary to obtain a warrant, a telephonic warrant should be considered. As electronic data may be altered or eradicated in seconds, in a factually compelling case the doctrine of exigent circumstances will support a warrantless seizure.
 
Even in exigent circumstances, while a warrantless seizure may be permitted, a subsequent warrant to search may still be necessary.[5]


Thank you for proving my point.
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« Reply #29 on: April 23, 2013, 07:54:03 PM »

That's why they refer to it as damage, yes.  That's the point.

I think his point is that that's just about as far as your grounds for complaining go.  If they broke your china, okay they'll replace it.  If they violated your constitutional rights you're shit out of luck.
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Hugo Chavez
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« Reply #30 on: April 23, 2013, 07:55:03 PM »

These people all helped elect Obama....same people that would vote down the 2nd Amendment and allow other people to take away their rights. These are not the same people that fought at Bunker Hill. This has bothered me since it happened. The individual police officer's were doing their jobs but those at the top knew how fucking wrong it was running combat patrols with MRAPS through US streets. This has become normal......Obama was just a few years to early trying to take our guns. A few more years and a few million worthless, illiterate's from south of the border and it will all be over. I think alot of u lib bastards will wake up and realize what you did to this country was wrong and that over the space of 8 years you destroyed the greatest experiment in world history.
excellent post!!!!!.

I do think conservatives have a little responsibility in this.  They watched while the neoconservatives pushed forth the building blocks to all the crap we're seeing now.  A few like Pat Buchanan publically opposed it but not many.  The neoconservatives in what they did under Bush is partly what made if possible for Obama to become president.  People like me wouldn't have been voting for Obama in that first term otherwise.  McCain was seen at the time as a natural course to keep the progression of what Bush did going.  But as we see now, Obama failed in all his promises in this area and not only continued the path but hit the fast forward button!
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« Reply #31 on: April 23, 2013, 07:55:34 PM »

Look dude....we did this in Iraq. We ran patrols and kicked doors. We grabbed people in much the same manner..guess what, I don't care now, didn't care then. The only reason to ever care was that you didn't want to make more enemies so you used restraint. The cops doing the searches, especially on the video treated American citizens exactly like Iraqi's The other thing..many of the Iraqi's were douchbag terrorist sympathizers. I doubt that many citizens of watertown Mass are chechen sympathizers...or could find it on a map.
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« Reply #32 on: April 23, 2013, 07:56:40 PM »

I think his point is that that's just about as far as your grounds for complaining go.  If they broke your china, okay they'll replace it.  If they violated your constitutional rights you're shit out of luck.

I think this would be an ideal situation to explore that.
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headhuntersix
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« Reply #33 on: April 23, 2013, 07:58:50 PM »

excellent post!!!!!.

I do think conservatives have a little responsibility in this.  They watched while the neoconservatives pushed forth the building blocks to all the crap we're seeing now.  A few like Pat Buchanan publically opposed it but not many.  The neoconservatives in what they did under Bush is partly what made if possible for Obama to become president.  People like me wouldn't have been voting for Obama in that first term otherwise.  McCain was seen at the time as a natural course to keep the progression of what Bush did going.  But as we see now, Obama failed in all his promises in this area and not only continued the neocon path but hit the fast forward button!


The Patriot Act was the slippery slope. Bush used to make sure we could kill douchebags. Obama is and will use it to control the population. I will never again even hint that I'm for such things. I'm all for the things we do overseas to keep us safe....all the "black" things we do. All the things hinted at under Bush. Obama uses drones and fights an open war that makes us look even worse then we did under Bush.
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« Reply #34 on: April 23, 2013, 08:01:25 PM »

Thank you for proving my point.

better read it again
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« Reply #35 on: April 23, 2013, 08:02:27 PM »

excellent post!!!!!.

I do think conservatives have a little responsibility in this.  They watched while the neoconservatives pushed forth the building blocks to all the crap we're seeing now.  A few like Pat Buchanan publically opposed it but not many.  The neoconservatives in what they did under Bush is partly what made if possible for Obama to become president.  People like me wouldn't have been voting for Obama in that first term otherwise.  McCain was seen at the time as a natural course to keep the progression of what Bush did going.  But as we see now, Obama failed in all his promises in this area and not only continued the path but hit the fast forward button!

I'm torn on some of it about Iraq. Ive seen and heard enough about them getting wmds out to Syria..who knows. But mainly because I believe that muslims are the number one threat to the West and that given time they might have done much worse here or in Europe then 911. If there was no flame to draw them in, the best and brightest would still be alive. We've killed so many of them. Set them back so far.
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« Reply #36 on: April 23, 2013, 08:14:19 PM »

better read it again

Please explain what you think I missed.
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« Reply #37 on: April 23, 2013, 08:14:22 PM »

excellent post!!!!!.

I do think conservatives have a little responsibility in this.  They watched while the neoconservatives pushed forth the building blocks to all the crap we're seeing now.  A few like Pat Buchanan publically opposed it but not many.  The neoconservatives in what they did under Bush is partly what made if possible for Obama to become president.  People like me wouldn't have been voting for Obama in that first term otherwise.  McCain was seen at the time as a natural course to keep the progression of what Bush did going.  But as we see now, Obama failed in all his promises in this area and not only continued the path but hit the fast forward button!

Agreed 100 percent Xs infinity + 1 billion.
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blacken700
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« Reply #38 on: April 23, 2013, 08:18:24 PM »

Please explain what you think I missed.

explain where it proves your point  Huh
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« Reply #39 on: April 23, 2013, 08:22:46 PM »

explain where it proves your point  Huh

The entire body of it proves the point.  Are you suggesting that I must have missed something?
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blacken700
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« Reply #40 on: April 23, 2013, 08:30:15 PM »

i must be confusing your point,what was your point again
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« Reply #41 on: April 23, 2013, 08:31:46 PM »

By the way, this should have been handled by simply speaking with the resident, asking the person to step outside (to be sure he or she wasn't under threat).  That's it. 

Unless there is a distinct reason to believe the subject is in a particular location, there is NO reason to violate private space. NONE.
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« Reply #42 on: April 23, 2013, 08:32:34 PM »

i must be confusing your point,what was your point again

 Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes


 Grin
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blacken700
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« Reply #43 on: April 23, 2013, 08:37:10 PM »

By the way, this should have been handled by simply speaking with the resident, asking the person to step outside (to be sure he or she wasn't under threat).  That's it. 

Unless there is a distinct reason to believe the subject is in a particular location, there is NO reason to violate private space. NONE.

that would work great if only one person there,but if they ask one person to come who's to say they're not inside with a gun to the head of their wife or child
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Jack T. Cross
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« Reply #44 on: April 23, 2013, 08:54:58 PM »

that would work great if only one person there,but if they ask one person to come who's to say they're not inside with a gun to the head of their wife or child

Blacken, that's why the person is asked to step outside as an alternative to a search.
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« Reply #45 on: April 23, 2013, 08:56:29 PM »


"Virtually all voters -- 91 percent -- approve of law enforcement’s handling of the Boston bombings"

I would not believe polls if it came from Fox or CNN. Have you validated their polls? Did you personally call up people and asked their opinion? They could tell you anything or grab a number out of the air. Polls are a fucking joke!
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blacken700
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« Reply #46 on: April 23, 2013, 09:00:59 PM »

Blacken, that's why the person is asked to step outside as an alternative to a search.

if you pull me outside and ask me if everything is alright and i know some fucker has a gun to my child's head ready to pull the trigger,what do you think i'm going to tell you
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« Reply #47 on: April 23, 2013, 09:05:08 PM »

if you pull me outside and ask me if everything is alright and i know some fucker has a gun to my child's head ready to pull the trigger,what do you think i'm going to tell you

I think your behavior will indicate a condition that would legally warrant entry.
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Jack T. Cross
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« Reply #48 on: April 23, 2013, 09:11:53 PM »

Quote
I think this would be an ideal situation to explore that.

BTW, I'd imagine this will cause all valid claims to be quickly and generously handled.
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blacken700
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« Reply #49 on: April 23, 2013, 09:12:02 PM »

I think your behavior will indicate a legal condition that would warrant entry.

according to this site were lucky if the cops can walk and and talk at the same time,let alone judge behavioral habits  Grin
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