Whichh cycle is the best for me?

[Christo]

 Hi everybody,

I need your advise and help:

I am guy of 41 years old and my total trainingshistory is at least about 23 years. I have always been natty till now.
my stats are:

1.83 m
96 Kg
BF 16-17%

Now i'm doubing about my first and even last AAS cycle. ( i promised my wife )
Because i am afraid of the siteeffects such as hairloss, prostate and a libidodip i am not planning high doses AAS.

Some clean gains of 5-6 kg netto should be perfect for me, however i am hard doubing about 3 different cycles of 8-10 weeks
Which of the three should be for ME ok??

Cycle 1)
Test E 500 (also with HCG and also maybe with finasteride 1 mg)

Cycle 2)
Test/Deca 250/200

Cycle 3)
Test/Primo 250/200 (maybe also with finasteride 1 mg)

Purpose: 5-6 kg lean muscles with minimum side effects

Pct= 15 days Clomid 50mg per day

Which cycle i should take?

Thanks in advance for your advise!

[SmallPole]

don't do it at all if you're gonna be a woos about it

once you pop, you can't stop; it becomes a part of your life

[Christo]

This.

Plus, once u come off u will lose all of your "gains." So either grow a pair or take up a hobby your wife will approve of.

I don;t believe that. you always maintain a few kg of solid mass, maybe not much but little increase always

So what is the best cycle for me?

[Borracho]

poor guys been asking the same question for about a year lol

[qwert]

If you're at your max right now, you will eventually lose all of your gains when you go off.

If you're not at your max, then you may keep a few lbs.

For a 1st cycle, I think good old test is best. I'd forget the HCG & finasteride. Save it for afterwards if you've set your mind on PCT & going off.

At your age, I'm positive that you're a legit candidate for HRT. Go to an endo & get tested. he'll probably put you on 200mg test. Then I would cruise on 200mg test & then do blasts back & forth. Much more of a sane way of doing things.

[Psychopath]

lol, wife? Only one cycle? scared of side effects?

Stick a dildo in your stupid vagina and fuck off.

[mikewhoelse]

Def 2 or 3 .

you MAY,MAYBE,when everything goes perfect hold on to SOME SMALL AMOUNT of muscle afterwards , but its still not worth it . Stay on or stay natty.

Period.

But you are going to do it anyway , so id say 2 or 3 ...pick and enjoy.

[Mad-scientist]

If I was you I would do something like 500mgs test a week and throw in some primo at around 500mgs a week to and do that for like 12 to 16 weeks. It would be crazy expensive but you will keep more gains with a drug like primobolan than you would almost anything else. And the side effects are not to horrible from what I hear. You might be able to keep like 5 pounds after like 6 months. But eventually it will go back to normal after about a year I would say. Something will happen like you will catch the flue and lose 5 pounds in a week and than your gains are gone. Muscle memory might help you to get them back to a certain degree. But I honestly have found that not to be true when it comes to steroids. For example when I took steroids with in 2 months I had a insane upper chest. And naturally I can have my diet on and perfect and eat as much as I can work out 5 days a week and take it really seriously. And I can never get a upper chest that looks anything similar to when I was on gear. But it is possible if you aren't to close to your genetic limit that maybe you could keep more weight. But I just think that its really hard to when you look at it over a couple year period.

Also it is true once you see how much fun steroids are your going to want to keep doing them. And talk your self into believing side effects won't happen it happens to almost every one. There are reasons people get addicted to any kind of drug and those reasons are that they work really damn good. At doing what they are suppose to. My opinion is just think about how bad you really want to do it. And if its something that your really want to do go for it. Just get blood tests done before you do it to see if you are in good health and get your testosterone levels checked. And than get blood tests maybe half way through your cycle. And than again after Pct to make sure you are fully recovered. That is the safest and best way to do it honestly. Good luck man.

[gym**rat]

There is no right answer but rule of thumb for first cycles is test only. I would do 500 a week broke up in 2 shots. Kick start it off with 20-30mg dbol if available. I have never used a pct but I never get tender nips or anything. And my head has been shaved for 10 years. You should really have lower body fat before doing a cycle but your call. Just try and keep your carb intake low during. Good luck.

[ESFitness]

without even reading through the whole thread. my generic answer is a 300 test and 200 npp mwf for as long as you can afford. with a couple mg's of adex and couple .5mg prami's during the week.

[AVBG]

You have no business doing a "cycle".

[LurkerNoMore]

#3 in your case.  But that PCT sucks ass.

[Christo]

lol, wife? Only one cycle? scared of side effects?

Stick a dildo in your stupid vagina and fuck off.

Fuck your mother.

[Christo]

nah, some will stay.

but the guy has doubts and second thoughts and wants to only do one cycle, best to stay away from it altogether then.

i mean whats he expecting from 1 cycle?

 

haha@"just buy the book", but seriously, christo should really buy the book, it has al the answers and is catering to pretty much what-where he is.

btw, idont understand how ppl can tell total newcomers to do 500mg test weekly, its just not necesary,its overkill and then what?

are you guys daft?whats he gonna do afterwards?come off?increase dosage?

hes 6ft, 215 lbs with kinda obese bodyfat levels.sorry man, but 16%,wtf is your diet lol.can you walk past a hotdog stand and not eat out the buffet once in a while
i mean sure, ppl at family gathering say things like"man you seem to work out,or work hard on construction site"

this means hed be,let me calculate, some 170something lbs shredded.
you know what is 170lbs at 6ft? whats this thing called which witches ride?that stick thing.

such a physique needs no 500mg of test.

i just read the whole first post, the naivity in it is heartbreakng, chritos, just buy the galeniko-noone book and educate yourself there.

seriously.

all that 1,2 and 3 options are plain shit and that approach will not net pure gain of 6kgs muscle.you might gain 6kgs of water, but 6kgs of pure muscle, im not sure if you understand what that is.

get the book, i have so much to say to you, or alternatively, dont get it and listen to the facelss experts here telling you to do 500mg test cycles which will take couple weeks to even fully work(and then you go off shortly afterwardss)

everything, your 1,2,3 ideas and the advice in here are shit.this is not how its done.

the only thing you should do on steroids, is get lean, your easking for all problems in the world with that bodyfat and wanting to "gain".

if you do it right, as so far lifetime natty, you could grow into leanness.

guy is concerned about sex drive and ppl tell him to use deca and npp

why not tell him to cut own penis off

I thought you were the expert of this board?

I know guys with  high bodyfat >17% which are using Tren Acetaat, Clen, winstrol  and they are dry and big.
So what you wrote it is bullshit. it is possible only not wise playing with deca.
BF% does't matter, only the kind of stuff you are using

Thanks anyway

[Christo]

If I was you I would do something like 500mgs test a week and throw in some primo at around 500mgs a week to and do that for like 12 to 16 weeks. It would be crazy expensive but you will keep more gains with a drug like primobolan than you would almost anything else. And the side effects are not to horrible from what I hear. You might be able to keep like 5 pounds after like 6 months. But eventually it will go back to normal after about a year I would say. Something will happen like you will catch the flue and lose 5 pounds in a week and than your gains are gone. Muscle memory might help you to get them back to a certain degree. But I honestly have found that not to be true when it comes to steroids. For example when I took steroids with in 2 months I had a insane upper chest. And naturally I can have my diet on and perfect and eat as much as I can work out 5 days a week and take it really seriously. And I can never get a upper chest that looks anything similar to when I was on gear. But it is possible if you aren't to close to your genetic limit that maybe you could keep more weight. But I just think that its really hard to when you look at it over a couple year period.

Also it is true once you see how much fun steroids are your going to want to keep doing them. And talk your self into believing side effects won't happen it happens to almost every one. There are reasons people get addicted to any kind of drug and those reasons are that they work really damn good. At doing what they are suppose to. My opinion is just think about how bad you really want to do it. And if its something that your really want to do go for it. Just get blood tests done before you do it to see if you are in good health and get your testosterone levels checked. And than get blood tests maybe half way through your cycle. And than again after Pct to make sure you are fully recovered. That is the safest and best way to do it honestly. Good luck man.

Thanks bro

[ESFitness]

500mg/wk and then what?

eh, how about 500mg/wk again, and again, until he doesn't think he's getting anything out of it.

allllll this bullshit and people spewing this bro-science about how you need to increase the dose every cycle. it's absolutely bullshit and based on what they read on message boards and old 80's steroid folklore.

you can use 2g's/wk for your first cycle, and your next 'cycle' use the same goddamn 2g's a week and if you know how to train and eat, you'll still fucking grow.

using that 'logic' would be guys using steroids for 20yrs.. guys like Darrem Charles or Chris Cormier... hell, even Bob Chic, would be using 20g's a week!

170lb know-it all's who've never read a goddamn text book or an ACTUALL STUDY... only Copied & Pasted Abstracts from Medline.

[qwert]

500mg/wk and then what?

eh, how about 500mg/wk again, and again, until he doesn't think he's getting anything out of it.

allllll this bullshit and people spewing this bro-science about how you need to increase the dose every cycle. it's absolutely bullshit and based on what they read on message boards and old 80's steroid folklore.

you can use 2g's/wk for your first cycle, and your next 'cycle' use the same goddamn 2g's a week and if you know how to train and eat, you'll still fucking grow.

using that 'logic' would be guys using steroids for 20yrs.. guys like Darrem Charles or Chris Cormier... hell, even Bob Chic, would be using 20g's a week!

170lb know-it all's who've never read a goddamn text book or an ACTUALL STUDY... only Copied & Pasted Abstracts from Medline.

There will come a time where you will have to increase the dose, since whatever dose you're using will not allow you to put on & maintain any more muscle.

Let's say you're doing a cycle of 1g test a week. This will eventually allow you to max out your gains for this particular dosage. If you keep doing the same cycle over & over again, you will still only reach your genetic limit for that dosage. This is where you will have to increase the dosage of test OR add in GH & insulin.

You can only get as big as your genetics for your current dosage allows. If you want to 'break on through to the other side' you absolutely have to increase the hormone level or stay stagnant.

Having said this, the human body will only allow a certain amount of muscle for a human to obtain & hold on to. Just because you got to 250lbs with 5g test doesn't mean 10g will give you anything more than just side effects. You may be at your absolute genetic limit at 5g. Then even more test will just result in diminishing returns.

At this point, the introduction of high dose GH at 10-30iu a day along with insulin is needed for hyperplasia.

Amen...

[Borracho]

There will come a time where you will have to increase the dose, since whatever dose you're using will not allow you to put on & maintain any more muscle.

Let's say you're doing a cycle of 1g test a week. This will eventually allow you to max out your gains for this particular dosage. If you keep doing the same cycle over & over again, you will still only reach your genetic limit for that dosage. This is where you will have to increase the dosage of test OR add in GH & insulin.

You can only get as big as your genetics for your current dosage allows. If you want to 'break on through to the other side' you absolutely have to increase the hormone level or stay stagnant.

Having said this, the human body will only allow a certain amount of muscle for a human to obtain & hold on to. Just because you got to 250lbs with 5g test doesn't mean 10g will give you anything more than just side effects. You may be at your absolute genetic limit at 5g. Then even more test will just result in diminishing returns.

At this point, the introduction of high dose GH at 10-30iu a day along with insulin is needed for hyperplasia.

Amen...

Do you believe in running such high amount of test (1g) when you can just throw in something else?

Personally, I don't think I'd ever like to run that amount being afraid of things like excess estrogen.

[qwert]

Do you believe in running such high amount of test (1g) when you can just throw in something else?

Personally, I don't think I'd ever like to run that amount being afraid of things like excess estrogen.

Depends on your goals. If you want put on as much mass as possible in the off season, it's a waste to use primo, anavar, winstrol etc. Just stick with the tried & true mass builders. A strong base of test + deca or EQ + anadrol or dbol. Done!!!

Excess estrogen is easily fixed with femera or aromasin.

[Borracho]

Depends on your goals. If you want put on as much mass as possible in the off season, it's a waste to use primo, anavar, winstrol etc. Just stick with the tried & true mass builders. A strong base of test + deca or EQ + anadrol or dbol. Done!!!

Excess estrogen is easily fixed with femera or aromasin.

Yeah that's true what you say about goals. At this point, I don't see myself running over a gram combined ever. I like test but the water retention at a gram of that has to be an issue even on a perfect diet and the less ancillaries the better imo. Having said that maybe a combination of test and eq would work well for me. I know eq aromatizes but I hear water retention is not so much an issue with that one...

[ESFitness]

everything I say, I say from experience. things I've experienced with myself first and had clients to after(every client is different, mind you).

I go up and down in dosage. just because I've used 6-7g in the past, doesn't mean I NEED to use 6-7g NOW. in fact I use quite a bit less than that, and I still grow and get great pumps and get lean and hard, ect... now, if I was 260lbs + i'd need to bump it up again.

from my experience, i'd rather have a guy run a gram from the start, and move up to 2g quickly. ASSUMING he wants to look like the dudes they see in the mag's.

some foo-foo guy can get away with 500mg/wk.

CONTROL YOUR SIDES! don't just short-change yourself by taking small doses just because you're afraid of sides.

Take your Aromasin (I HATE Femera... kills sex drive).. (*edited this part.. orig said 'have', not 'HATE')

take your nolva (use enough AAS and the neg impact nolva has is minimal. you don't need a lot. I know of women with tits like watermelons shrink down to oranges with use 10-15mg/day)

take your dutasteride.

if blood pressure is high, take lincinopril (sp? lol) or captopril, and Cialis (although I prefer Levitra) in a small dose ED.

can't sleep? take a halcion (get a script) or benedryl.

bad skin? use Retin-A.


ALLL THIS SHIT CAN BE CONTROLLED!

you can run 2g of test/wk with 150mg anadrol and still be lean, hard, and vascular. (actually, I believe anadrol gives much less water retention than dbol... but anyways).

[Borracho]

I'm not trying to be a wise ass but why not address this w/ your mentor? Start a new thread. It'll be a good read.

 

yes, 1g test even on cleanest diet there will be issues.

esfitness has said something above which i kinda agree to.running the same doses will yield results for longer than ppl think.

its said in the book i cant be botherd to post it for the faceless knowbetters,or argue them.

the ppl who just say nee to increase dosage to add weight just bc they stall after 2 months are too stupid to argue with.

Yeah I'm with ya. Doubt I'll even get to that point of running 1 g tbh. I'll run 500 for a longer period than I have if I wanna grow a bit more before anything else. No problems being a "foo-foo guy"... whatever that means lol