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Author Topic: Obama Voted to Strengthen Illinois’s Stand Your Ground Law in 2004  (Read 404 times)
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« on: July 22, 2013, 09:02:38 AM »

Obama Voted to Strengthen Illinois’s Stand Your Ground Law in 2004
NRO ^  | July 22, 2013 8:56 AM | By John Fund

Posted on Monday, July 22, 2013 11:09:54 AM by


President Obama spent part of his surprise appearance at last Friday’s White House press briefing urging that the Stand Your Ground laws that exist in 31 states be reexamined. But only nine years ago, in the Illinois state senate, he co-sponsored a bill that strengthened his state’s 1961 Stand Your Ground law.


(Excerpt) Read more at nationalreview.com ...




Obama = total FAIL
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« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2013, 09:10:03 AM »

HEHEHEHEHEH!!!

Another example of his hypocrisy.
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« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2013, 10:15:40 AM »

President Obama spent part of his surprise appearance at last Friday’s White House press briefing urging that the Stand Your Ground laws that exist in 31 states be reexamined. But only nine years ago, in the Illinois state senate, he co-sponsored a bill that strengthened his state’s 1961 Stand Your Ground law.

I really wish zimmerman would have never tried to use that defense.  Really hurt gun owners and his case had nothing to do with stand your ground.  It was a legal self defense shoot under FL law.  No matter who started the fight with a punch - we will never know the truth there - the shoot was legal.  FL law is super gun friendly (maybe a little too lax).

But this call for change to SYG is completely unrelated to justifiable fear or castle doctrine.  Neither.
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« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2013, 10:19:02 AM »

I really wish zimmerman would have never tried to use that defense.  Really hurt gun owners and his case had nothing to do with stand your ground.  It was a legal self defense shoot under FL law.  No matter who started the fight with a punch - we will never know the truth there - the shoot was legal.  FL law is super gun friendly (maybe a little too lax).

But this call for change to SYG is completely unrelated to justifiable fear or castle doctrine.  Neither.

WTF are you talking about!!!

Zimm rested on common law self defense not SYG!@


Why you lying bro?
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« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2013, 10:22:23 AM »

WTF are you talking about!!!

Zimm rested on common law self defense not SYG!@


Why you lying bro?

For 2 days after he was charged, his original lawyer went on anderson cooper and claimed stand your ground.

2 days later, on sunday AM shows, he changed this.  We had multiple getbig threads when this happened.

Are you saying this didn't happen, 333386?

He eventually decided self-defense, but the 'muddying the waters' phase with SYG had me SCREAMING at the time, that obama woudl be using this shit down the road to pull gun rights.

Are you denying this, 33?
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« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2013, 10:22:59 AM »

All that matters is the trial.  Just stop now - please

For 2 days after he was charged, his original lawyer went on anderson cooper and claimed stand your ground.

2 days later, on sunday AM shows, he changed this.  We had multiple getbig threads when this happened.

Are you saying this didn't happen, 333386?

He eventually decided self-defense, but the 'muddying the waters' phase with SYG had me SCREAMING at the time, that obama woudl be using this shit down the road to pull gun rights.

Are you denying this, 33?
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« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2013, 10:29:14 AM »

WTF are you talking about!!!

Zimm rested on common law self defense not SYG!@
Why you lying bro?

On February 26, 2012, Trayvon Martin, 17, was shot and killed by 28-year-old George Zimmerman, the self-appointed neighborhood watch leader at the Retreat at Twin Lakes, a gated community in Sanford, Fla. Zimmerman was initially questioned by the Sanford Police Department, but he claimed self-defenese under Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” law, and was released without being charged. Within three weeks, the story went national, sparking outrage that an unarmed teenager had been killed without anyone being charged with the crime. After intense pressure, Zimmerman was charged with second-degree murder last April. The trial begins today.


Read more at http://allhonesty.com/complete-timeline-trayvon-martin-case/#Gj0KfPvayE7E2pvL.99

33, after losing his first 2 lawyers and hooking up with OMara, Zimm realized he wouldn't win on SYG and waived a trial he originally requested for SYG.

HE was the one who introduced it into the case, giving bag of shit obama room to run with it (well, bloomberg first).

please never give zimm a pass on this - HE intro'd it to this case then later decided he'd lose by a mile and changed to justified shooting by self defense, way easier under FL law.
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« Reply #7 on: July 22, 2013, 10:30:50 AM »

 Roll Eyes  Roll Eyes

What happened had nothing to do w SYG

On February 26, 2012, Trayvon Martin, 17, was shot and killed by 28-year-old George Zimmerman, the self-appointed neighborhood watch leader at the Retreat at Twin Lakes, a gated community in Sanford, Fla. Zimmerman was initially questioned by the Sanford Police Department, but he claimed self-defenese under Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” law, and was released without being charged. Within three weeks, the story went national, sparking outrage that an unarmed teenager had been killed without anyone being charged with the crime. After intense pressure, Zimmerman was charged with second-degree murder last April. The trial begins today.


Read more at http://allhonesty.com/complete-timeline-trayvon-martin-case/#Gj0KfPvayE7E2pvL.99

33, after losing his first 2 lawyers and hooking up with OMara, Zimm realized he wouldn't win on SYG and waived a trial he originally requested for SYG.

HE was the one who introduced it into the case, giving bag of shit obama room to run with it (well, bloomberg first).

please never give zimm a pass on this - HE intro'd it to this case then later decided he'd lose by a mile and changed to justified shooting by self defense, way easier under FL law.
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« Reply #8 on: July 22, 2013, 10:32:00 AM »

All that matters is the trial.  Just stop now - please

Disagree.

Shitbags like bloomberg know they can't get permit and mag capacity, so they're chipping away at what they can.  The MINUTE zimmerman's lawyers went on CNN and tried this bullshit, the left was ALL OVER it.  He opened up that door.

He only stopped using it after the writer of the SYG bill went on CNN and FOX and NBC and everywhere else, screaming "This case has NOTHING to do with SYG".

Immediately, I took an anti-zimmerman stance - but not because I am so sad he shot a drug dealer.  Rather, because he gave the libs ammo to come after gun rights.
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« Reply #9 on: July 22, 2013, 10:33:41 AM »

Roll Eyes  Roll Eyes

What happened had nothing to do w SYG



AGREED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


BUT

Zimmerman decided to use his platform to intro SYG into the national discussion and give the shithead dems reason and means to go after it.

He KNEW the case wasn't about that, and he didn't care about american's gun rights.  So yeah, he eventually settled upon another defense.  You called me a liar on this, and that kinda hurt man Smiley  I was IRATE on getbig when that shithead zimmerman intro'd SYG.  Because I KNEW it'd be used against gun owners down the road.  I was fcking right, man.
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« Reply #10 on: July 22, 2013, 10:35:04 AM »

Zimm was an idiot and trying to save his ass - you or anyone else would have done the same thuing.


AGREED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


BUT

Zimmerman decided to use his platform to intro SYG into the national discussion and give the shithead dems reason and means to go after it.

He KNEW the case wasn't about that, and he didn't care about american's gun rights.  So yeah, he eventually settled upon another defense.  You called me a liar on this, and that kinda hurt man Smiley  I was IRATE on getbig when that shithead zimmerman intro'd SYG.  Because I KNEW it'd be used against gun owners down the road.  I was fcking right, man.
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« Reply #11 on: July 22, 2013, 10:39:47 AM »

Zimm was an idiot and trying to save his ass - you or anyone else would have done the same thuing.

I agree he was an idiot trying to save his own ass.   

And no, I wouldn't have claimed SYG for a shooting where I feared for my life.  They're opposite things lol.  The thing here is that maybe he only realized later "um, I'd better convince them I feared for my life because SYG is kinda thin, upon further review".

And that's a PROBLEM - because anyone who REALLY feared for their life, and just had to shoot a person - that's ALL they would talk about.  "He was gonna kill me!!!!"  not "Hey, I was just standing my ground, dude".

Zimm won this case because of a laid back, unclear law.  Not because he was shitting his pants with fear.  The law is flawed but he's a bag of shit - because yes, sadly, we ARE going to see an erosion of gun rights because his narrow/fat ass coudn't stop going on CNN and FOX talking about the gun laws.
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« Reply #12 on: July 22, 2013, 10:41:06 AM »

Bullshit - Zimm won because the DA was a political thug doing the dirty work of racist in chief Obama and black lynch mob demanding murder charges

I agree he was an idiot trying to save his own ass.   

And no, I wouldn't have claimed SYG for a shooting where I feared for my life.  They're opposite things lol.  The thing here is that maybe he only realized later "um, I'd better convince them I feared for my life because SYG is kinda thin, upon further review".

And that's a PROBLEM - because anyone who REALLY feared for their life, and just had to shoot a person - that's ALL they would talk about.  "He was gonna kill me!!!!"  not "Hey, I was just standing my ground, dude".

Zimm won this case because of a laid back, unclear law.  Not because he was shitting his pants with fear.  The law is flawed but he's a bag of shit - because yes, sadly, we ARE going to see an erosion of gun rights because his narrow/fat ass coudn't stop going on CNN and FOX talking about the gun laws.
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« Reply #13 on: July 22, 2013, 10:42:45 AM »

Bullshit - Zimm won because the DA was a political thug doing the dirty work of racist in chief Obama and black lynch mob demanding murder charges


we are gonna have to disagree there.  I know the FL law pretty well... it's the wild west here.  SO VAGUE on when you can shoot and can't.  I hate it.  Some day I might run into some dumbfck hillbilly who says "give me your wallet or I'll shoot you and saY i feared for my life" - and he'll get away with it.   No witnesses.  maybe he'll give himself a black eye. 

weak law.  weak.
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« Reply #14 on: July 22, 2013, 10:46:30 AM »

we are gonna have to disagree there.  I know the FL law pretty well... it's the wild west here.  SO VAGUE on when you can shoot and can't.  I hate it.  Some day I might run into some dumbfck hillbilly who says "give me your wallet or I'll shoot you and saY i feared for my life" - and he'll get away with it.   No witnesses.  maybe he'll give himself a black eye. 

weak law.  weak.

Bullshit - every single legal expert and even most attorneys said from day 1 this was a political prosecution - and people like yourself emotionally wrapped up in it refused to see the reality of what it was. 
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« Reply #15 on: July 22, 2013, 10:53:10 AM »

Bullshit - every single legal expert and even most attorneys said from day 1 this was a political prosecution - and people like yourself emotionally wrapped up in it refused to see the reality of what it was. 

Personally, I feel anytime you shoot someone in the heart - and the crux of your defense is your WORD - and then multiple versions of your word appear showing exaggerated inconsistencies each time...

well...

I'd like to think that person goes on trial, because they're lying about a shoot.  Period.  If some dude capped your neighbor, and every time he told the story, the details got more violent, how many versions until you said "ya know, maybe that dude lied about fearing for his life?"

If he stuck to version 1, maybe he doesn't go on trial.  But by the time he was telling version 3 (reenactment #2), it went from "he saw my gun" to "he reached for my gun" to "he grabbed my gun".

Um, those are some big differences.  The difference between a shoot being legal and not legal Wink

So yeah, if he sticks with first story, I have no reason to not believe him.  When that 3rd tale arrived, prosecutors didn't have a choice but to charge.  Did they overcharge? YES.  But when a guy kills someone and can't make up his mind what happened, you have to charge him.
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« Reply #16 on: July 22, 2013, 10:55:22 AM »

33, I can't get mad at you, evne though i get so involved in this.  I live in FL and have sat thru that permit class 8 - 10 times in 16 years.  I've heard the law evolve as SYG and castle were added.  You know what has been on the news this year.  that's what you know about FL shooting laws.  I'm emtionally involved because I see rights in states that are gun friendly (mine not yours) being fcked up.  And I see people in gun-hating states like yours cheering on this cowboy zimmerman.   Maybe in NY he's a hero, but in FL he's a bag of shit that ran into a situation where he thought he'd be alone with an armed junkie - then changed his story over and over of the shoot.

that's why I'm so mad.  Florida gun rights won't be the same in ten years.  Thanks to this fcking cowboy.
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« Reply #17 on: July 22, 2013, 10:56:12 AM »

33, I can't get mad at you, evne though i get so involved in this.  I live in FL and have sat thru that permit class 8 - 10 times in 16 years.  I've heard the law evolve as SYG and castle were added.  You know what has been on the news this year.  that's what you know about FL shooting laws.  I'm emtionally involved because I see rights in states that are gun friendly (mine not yours) being fcked up.  And I see people in gun-hating states like yours cheering on this cowboy zimmerman.   Maybe in NY he's a hero, but in FL he's a bag of shit that ran into a situation where he thought he'd be alone with an armed junkie - then changed his story over and over of the shoot.

that's why I'm so mad.  Florida gun rights won't be the same in ten years.  Thanks to this fcking cowboy.

You were told over the last year endless times why you were so misguided on this case.  Sorry you lost a year of your life being so misguided over this. 
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« Reply #18 on: July 22, 2013, 11:02:18 AM »

You were told over the last year endless times why you were so misguided on this case.  Sorry you lost a year of your life being so misguided over this. 

not sure what you mean here.  i know the DA overcharged.  I know the media made a shitload of $ from exploiting everyone's anger.  And I know the dems are going to make some headway into eroding gun rights thanks to zimm claiming SYG.

I'm sorry if you still can't fault zimmerman for his inability to keep SYG out of his mouth.  But when he briefly endorses something, and he is reviled by half the nation, suddenly that something is up for shredding.  Thanks, zimm... "it's not your fault" but obama sure woudln't have had this ammo if you had stayed in your fcking truck.  Idiot.
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« Reply #19 on: July 22, 2013, 11:04:13 AM »

and yeah, what up with the coddling, 33?  Normally you have no problem saying things like it is... if someone sucks, you say it.

Why is it so hard to admit "Zimmerman, you fat shit, you are fcking up gun rights, you moron"

Why is it so hard to say that?  Why defend him with "well, TECHNICALLY, he only said SYG until the trial began?"  I admire the fact you're not a pussy, 33... why use the kid gloves when discussing zimmerman, who (given his past record with dom violence and shoving cops and voting obama) - I thought you'd hate the dude.
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« Reply #20 on: July 22, 2013, 11:07:06 AM »

I said my peace many times on this.  Idiots all around in this, but the biggest idiot was the DA
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« Reply #21 on: July 22, 2013, 11:13:01 AM »

I said my peace many times on this.  Idiots all around in this, but the biggest idiot was the DA

that we can agree on.   


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« Reply #22 on: July 22, 2013, 11:24:26 AM »

For 2 days after he was charged, his original lawyer went on anderson cooper and claimed stand your ground.

2 days later, on sunday AM shows, he changed this.  We had multiple getbig threads when this happened.

Are you saying this didn't happen, 333386?

He eventually decided self-defense, but the 'muddying the waters' phase with SYG had me SCREAMING at the time, that obama woudl be using this shit down the road to pull gun rights.

Are you denying this, 33?

Funny how he didn't get charged until the left started with their rants of racism. How long did it take again?
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« Reply #23 on: July 22, 2013, 11:28:36 AM »

Funny how he didn't get charged until the left started with their rants of racism. How long did it take again?

3 weeks.  And that might be the case.  BUT during those 3 weeks, he kept retelling various versions of the story. 

The media pointed out the differences in the story, and it became obvious he was embellishing and exaggerating the details each time.

And I think ANY of us would want him charged - if he killed a fmaily member of ours - and the story kept changing.



So while yeah, maybe it was about appeasing the masses, etc - if that story had remained the same, it was a pretty clean shoot.  he just kept changing what happened, adding more and more details that weren't true, we later learned. 
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« Reply #24 on: July 22, 2013, 05:28:52 PM »

He was for it before he was against it. 
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