IFBB Pro -Milos Sarcev..and his 'insulin protocols'

[ESFitness]

This is wrong, Kevin English, Warren, and Jose all had better lines at the beginning of their careers. Come contest when there is no water or fat left, some lines are missing due to the visceral fat build up within the muscle caused by insulin.

The lines are also not as deep and they are are shallow, of course this is not an over night occurrence, we are talking abuse for a very long time.

what i'm saying is... if they stopped using insulin, it IS possible to get back the separation they had.

It's not gone forever.

[Teutonic Knight]

You are the biggest haters of the pros out there you POS, you start threads about them hating like a jealous little bitch. 

....a jealous little bitch.

hmmm who could be this , 5'4 tall resident of Newcastle (Australia)

(1Xhard deserves a bottle of "Blue Label Johnie Walker")

[OTHstrong]

....a jealous little bitch.

hmmm who could be this , 5'4 tall resident of Newcastle (Australia)

(1Xhard deserves a bottle of "Blue Label Johnie Walker")

hell ya

[Caro]

Luke Wood followed Milos' protocols to the letter...well almost:

10-12 iu HGH pre-workout
10-12iu Novalog pre-workout
120-140mcg igf-1lr3 post-workout

Luke was a great guy but not the sharpest tool in the shed.  Milos knew this and exploited Luke's gullibility.  I personally hounded Luke for years to dump Milos and his evil regime....Luke never listened!

[Vince B]

There is no science behind professional bodybuilding. This is a fact. Lots of 'experts', including Caro, Hank Wood and others believe they are knowledgeable but they are not authorities on drugs in bodybuilding. So I hope they are careful about statements blaming parties about consequences relating to drug protocols, etc. They could be right about some claims but have no way of establishing cause and effect re particular bodybuilders. I presume most pros have a long, long history of using many substances and who can state the consequences of those sustained and varied cocktails?

[Caro]

There is no science behind professional bodybuilding. This is a fact. Lots of 'experts', including Caro, Hank Wood and others believe they are knowledgeable but they are not authorities on drugs in bodybuilding. So I hope they are careful about statements blaming parties about consequences relating to drug protocols, etc. They could be right about some claims but have no way of establishing cause and effect re particular bodybuilders. I presume most pros have a long, long history of using many substances and who can state the consequences of those sustained and varied cocktails?

Fair call Vince.  But just for the record, i have never claimed to be an 'expert' re. drug protocols.  To the contrary, to this day 'i call out' the misinformed bro scientists and backyard- endocrinlogists.You are aware of this Vince and i am not sure why you are trying to stir up shit.

Vince, you are aware of Luke and his relationship with Milos?  Furthermore, don't you recall Luke saying that he got his dosages of insulin wrong -hence, brought about the precipitation of his health issues?

[Vince B]

If Luke stuffed up what was 'prescribed' by a factor of 10 then where does the blame lay? My point is that the pros, including Luke have a long, complicated history of using all manner of substances and only medical people can make statements about what happened. So posting about matters of fact as if one were an authority is totally unacceptable.

[Disgusted]

Insulin.  

[Caro]

If Luke stuffed up what was 'prescribed' by a factor of 10 then where does the blame lay? My point is that the pros, including Luke have a long, complicated history of using all manner of substances and only medical people can make statements about what happened. So posting about matters of fact as if one were an authority is totally unacceptable.

Where does the blame lay? Of course, ultimately with the person holding the needle.  However, with everything in life, it is just a little more complicated than that. 

Luke was a flawed character.  Yes, he was a big, lovable and gullible teddy bear.  Yes, he was overtly insecure and self loathing -as most Pros are. This in turn lead Luke down an obsessive route. As in life, everything is about timing -and in walked the brash, cocky and confident Milos who had a dream and a vision to sell.  Luke was instantly hooked.

Milos was, and is, a very conniving, manipulative and dominating personality.  Luke was putty in his hands.  Luke would become the guinea pig for Milos' trials of the chemical theories and insulin protocols that we hear so much about.

Vince, you must be able to see this for what it is?

[Vince B]

We all saw that Luke was a huge guy. He needed bigger triceps but was a top competitor. Imagine the incentive to get a little bit better and win shows and prize money for those gifted like Luke. Milos took Luke on and befriended him. Can anyone say that what happened was intentional? No. Luke might have already damaged himself from previous things and that we don't know. I agree that using what the pros allegedly do is insanity. But there you are. They make that choice and some pay the ultimate price.

[Caro]

We all saw that Luke was a huge guy. He needed bigger triceps but was a top competitor. Imagine the incentive to get a little bit better and win shows and prize money for those gifted like Luke. Milos took Luke on and befriended him. Can anyone say that what happened was intentional? No. Luke might have already damaged himself from previous things and that we don't know. I agree that using what the pros allegedly do is insanity. But there you are. They make that choice and some pay the ultimate price.

What? Luke a top competitor?  You see Vince this lies at the root of the problem.  It was enablers like yourself that attributed to Luke  believing he could be anything above an average regional competitor.

Luke did not have the basis genetic structure to be a top Pro. His deep insecurities and lack of self belief lead him down the yellow brick road....where he met the callous, charismatic, manipulative and deceptive Milos.

Milos seduced Luke into believing he could one day achieve elite Pro status.  The dream was embodied in syringes full of insulin...Poor Luke.

[deceiver]

Who the fuck is Caro?

[Caro]

lukes boyfrned or a homo who way rejected by milos

yawn.  trolling again. leave this thread you pathetic gimmick!

[OTHstrong]

Who the fuck is Caro?

The knew little annoying bitch in town here at a getbig, you know how it goes with these little pest. ¸

They lurk for 3 years here at getbig and then say, ``fuck it, I am ready`` then gear up the courage to post here on getbig and come guns a blazing but within 500 posts their morale is weakened and they wither away for another 3 years.

TRUE STORY

[Caro]

So from Vince's post... Is it safe to say Caro is a guru to the pros?


And the term guru is relative, mind you...

Yes Bro, everything in life is 'relative.'

All shit aside, Luke was a stand up guy. When he walked into a room it would light up!  He always had a smile and a kind word.  Milos saw these qualities as weaknesses that could be manipulated.  

I stand by my assertion that if Luke had NOT recklessly embarked upon the insulin protocols he  would be with us today!

[deceiver]

The knew little annoying bitch in town here at a getbig, you know how it goes with these little pest. ¸

They lurk for 3 years here at getbig and then say, ``fuck it, I am ready`` then gear up the courage to post here on getbig and come guns a blazing but within 500 posts their morale is weakened and they wither away for another 3 years.

TRUE STORY

Yeah, it looks like it. And what the fuck is wrong with this dude saying "get out of the thread, gimmick"? Does he really think someone is gonna listen to him?

And who the hell is his avi, his boyfriend?

[Caro]

Yeah, it looks like it. And what the fuck is wrong with this dude saying "get out of the thread, gimmick"? Does he really think someone is gonna listen to him?

And who the hell is his avi, his boyfriend?

boring troll !

[dustin]

What a lot of people don't understand is that the guys abusing insulin are the same guys haphazardly cycling tons of gear and eating equally as sloppy. Insulin isn't as forgiving and most people who aren't respectful of the drug will provide too large of a buffer and simply over eat and eat poorly at that.

Insulin can and is used at safe doses. But like anything else we only talk about the horror stories. We've all see idiots eat handfuls of dbol and anadrol, shoot vials of sust and drink and party 5 nights a week and look like they're on the verge of death. Just gear, no insulin.

Same douche takes insulin and everyone online points and tells each other to be careful because insulin is dangerous. No, misinformation is dangerous. Millions take it daily and dozens of thousands of bodybuilders do too. Not all of those bodybuilders destroy their physique.

[Vince B]

Luke was Mr Australia and far above a regional winner. I offered to help Luke get his triceps up but he never presented at my gym.
I made the same offer to Milos and he sure didn't accept the suggestion! We sorted things out later.

Guys who have no hope of winning a big title have just as much motivation as the guys who place in the top 6 at the Olympia. Who are we to deny them the chance to
transcend who they are and win important titles. The best example of a guy with seemingly poor genetics was Larry Scott. He was narrow and just a local title winner
from Idaho. Vince Gironda wasn't impressed. Larry even invented new training methods and exercises to build his arms and shoulders to Mr Olympia level. If a guy like
Larry presented at my gym in those days saying he wanted to be a big bodybuilder I would have discouraged him. Today I let people choose their own destiny. Most
ignor good advice, anyway.

Luke wasn't far from winning pro titles. Especially a few weeks out. Dennis James had a similar problem and a few weeks out seemed unbeatable.

[Ropo]

What? Luke a top competitor?  You see Vince this lies at the root of the problem.  It was enablers like yourself that attributed to Luke  believing he could be anything above an average regional competitor.

Luke did not have the basis genetic structure to be a top Pro. His deep insecurities and lack of self belief lead him down the yellow brick road....where he met the callous, charismatic, manipulative and deceptive Milos.

Milos seduced Luke into believing he could one day achieve elite Pro status.  The dream was embodied in syringes full of insulin...Poor Luke.

Yes, it is clearly insanity to claim that this guy has any potential to be one of the top pro's in modern bodybuilding: Or is it? Well, no. It is only an opinion of the teen "guru", who is talking from his ass. We all know that any fucking bleeding idiot can be "expert" in the internet, but even then your claims have to make sense. Luke Wood did have great potential, just like some other guys like Marko Savolainen for example. Problem is that one can survive that amount of drugs, and one doesn't. Luke and Marko burnt out their system and lose their kidneys. Marko has new one and he is willingly burning that out too. We all know what happen to Luke. So what is the truth? Fuck Milos, he is just as stupid and fake as any of the experts in this sport. Only truth is that they all are experiencing with expence of the health of the others. This is how the bodybuilding gurus work. Best of these guys has the claim: it worked on me, it has to work on you, like Milos, but even that doesn't prove anything because it is all about your personal metabolism and its ability to utilize these drugs. Only history will show what happen, did you survive or not, and this is only truth in this matter. These guys put's their healt on the hands of some freaking idiots and hope for glory. There is no sciense in it, only some luck, which is better for some of us. Next victim of Milos is here, and only time will tell what happen to him:

[Teutonic Knight]

Who the fuck is Caro?

Someone who placed 4th at the Ifbb World 

[flinstones1]

This is wrong, Kevin English, Warren, and Jose all had better lines at the beginning of their careers. Come contest when there is no water or fat left, some lines are missing due to the visceral fat build up within the muscle caused by insulin.

The lines are also not as deep and they are are shallow, of course this is not an over night occurrence, we are talking abuse for a very long time.

BOOM! knocked the fuck out.

"Its not the insulin that blurs lines it's the fat and water"

are you fucking kidding me?!!

 I called this EFTfitness bitch out on his bullshit a while ago OTH.... he claims he was 260lbs and shredded in 2005 lol

[flinstones1]

it's not the insulin blurring the lines... it's bodyfat and water.

I used copious amounts and when I was big, I wasn't 'crisp' or deeply separated. Then recently (a few months ago) I was the leanest, driest, most separated i'd ever been.

it's also not insulin causing 'growth' of the muscles in the stomach. In my opinion, based on my experience, anyways. It's the ability of insulin to make you hungry alllllll the time, and gh's ability to keep you lean when pounding down food. That much food bloats your stomach. Doesn't matter if you're 12% or 5% bf.

I say 'in my experience', because when I was big (bbing 'big', not when I was pling), my stomach was in the 36-38's. Hard with abs/serratus ect. Now a few months ago I was down to 31 damn near 30, and couldn't push my stomach out if I tried. If it were permanent growth, that wouldn't have happened (esp considering about 18months before that I was at a 41" waist and about 50lbs heavier (heavier than I was then, not now).

just how stupid are you?

[ESFitness]

BOOM! knocked the fuck out.

"Its not the insulin that blurs lines it's the fat and water"

are you fucking kidding me?!!

 I called this EFTfitness bitch out on his bullshit a while ago OTH.... he claims he was 260lbs and shredded in 2005 lol

i'm still waiting on your PM to let me know when and where you want to meet kid.

you're a 20yr old KID and you're fucking with the wrong person.

[honest]

Milos gets a bad wrap, Truth be told Luke followed a protocol of whatever Milos advises x 3 and that's where he got into trouble, im not a fan of insulin, I don't like the modern look, Ifbb judging criteria is to blame, as with most big companies these days they are more worried about potential liability and with the new look there are less guys dropping dead from dehydration due indirectly to the new look retaining more fluid in the body.