Author Topic: Intercepts caught Assad rejecting requests to use chemical weapons, German paper  (Read 1058 times)

Soul Crusher

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http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2013/09/09/201515/intercepts-caught-assad-rejecting.html#.Ui8xBT7D_IU

BERLIN —  Syrian President Bashar Assad has repeatedly rejected requests from his field commanders for approval to use chemical weapons, according to a report this weekend in a German newspaper.

The report in Bild am Sonntag, which is a widely read and influential national Sunday newspaper, reported that the head of the German Foreign Intelligence agency, Gerhard Schindler, last week told a select group of German lawmakers that intercepted communications had convinced German intelligence officials that Assad did not order or approve what is believed to be a sarin gas attack on Aug. 21 that killed hundreds of people in Damascus’ eastern suburbs.

The Obama administration has blamed the attack on Assad. The evidence against Assad was described over the weekend as common sense by White House Chief of Staff Denis McDonough on CNN’s "State of the Union."
      
“The material was used in the eastern suburbs of Damascus that have been controlled by the opposition for some time,” he said. “It was delivered by rockets, rockets that we know the Assad regime has, and we have no indication that the opposition has.”

Russia has questioned that logic, announcing last week that in July it filed a 100-page long “technical and scientific” report on an alleged March 19 chemical weapons attack on a suburb of Aleppo that it says implicates rebel fighters.

A U.N. team dispatched to Syria to investigate the March 19 attack was sent to the scene of the Aug. 21 incident. The samples it collected are currently being analyzed in Europe at labs certified by the Organization for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons, the international agency that monitors compliance with chemical weapons bans.

The German intelligence briefing to lawmakers described by Bild am Sonntag fits neither narrative precisely. The newspaper’s article said that on numerous occasions in recent months, the German intelligence ship named Oker, which is off the Syrian coast, has intercepted communications indicating that field officers have contacted the Syrian presidential palace seeking permission to use chemical weapons and have been turned down.

The article added that German intelligence does not believe Assad sanctioned the alleged attack on August 21.

Last week, the German newsmagazine Der Spiegel, also citing a briefing for German legislators, said that the Oker had intercepted a phone call between a commander from the Lebanese militant group Hezbollah and an official at an unidentified Iranian embassy saying that Assad had ordered the Aug. 21 chemical attack out of anger. The Hezbollah commander called the attack a “huge mistake,” Der Spiegel said. It was not clear if the two news accounts were based on the same or different briefings.

Assad told American journalist Charlie Rose in an interview to be broadcast in its entirety Monday night on PBS that “there has been no evidence that I used chemical weapons against my own people.”

Even if Assad didn’t approve the use of chemical weapons, he’d likely be held responsible for its use by a rogue unit within Syria’s security forces.

David Butter, a Syria expert with the British think tank Chatham House, called the German intelligence “an interesting distraction, but nothing more right now.”

“To build a case that Assad had no role in the use of chemical weapons, we’d need a lot more evidence,” he said. “And, of course, as head of state, if a war crime has been committed by his regime, he is ultimately responsible.”



The German intelligence report would seem to fit the European mood of the moment, however, that U.S. military action must wait for the results of the U.N. investigation. “What happened is all very murky,” Butler said. “Let’s wait for the United Nations investigation before talking about the next step.”

European foreign ministers on Saturday issued a statement calling the Aug. 21 attack a “war crime,” but said nothing should be done without U.N. approval. New opinion polls over the weekend in France, Germany and Great Britain showed strong disapproval of military action in Syria. The British poll, done for The Sunday Telegraph, indicated only 19 percent of the population backs the idea of military action with the United States, while 63 percent oppose it. The polls in France and Germany showed similar margins of opposition.

Meanwhile, a new tabulation of the dead from the Aug. 21 incident raised more questions about Obama administration officials’ account of what took place.

The Damascus Center for Human Rights Studies, an anti-Assad group, said that it had been able to document 678 dead from the attacks, including 106 children and 157 women. The report said 51 of the dead, or 7 percent, were fighters from the Free Syrian Army, the designation used to describe rebels that are affiliated with the Supreme Military Council, which the U.S. backs.

The report said that the organization was certain that more than 1,600 died in the attack, but that it had not been able to confirm the higher number.

U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry has said 1,429 people died Aug. 21, included 426 children, but has not said how the United States obtained the figures. Other estimates have ranged from a low of “at least 281” by the French government to 502, including “tens” of rebel fighters and about 100 children, by the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights, a London-based group that tracks violence in Syria.

Read more here: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2013/09/09/201515/intercepts-caught-assad-rejecting.html#storylink=cpy

240 is Back

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I tend to trust the word of the US sec of state over "German newspaper", 333386.

Otherwise, I'm a conspiracy theorist, like anyone who belives this newspaper article woudl be.

Our media lies all the time - How do we know this foreign newspaper isn't making this up?

Soul Crusher

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I tend to trust the word of the US sec of state over "German newspaper", 333386.

Otherwise, I'm a conspiracy theorist, like anyone who belives this newspaper article woudl be.

Our media lies all the time - How do we know this foreign newspaper isn't making this up?

Kill yourself

240 is Back

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Kill yourself


Look, you KNOW what I think - I think the whole fcking thing is a big ass lie, made up to declare another war.  It's so obvious it makes my brain hurt.  It's stupid and obvious and only a fcking fool believes the crap that assad, clearly already winning, would do the one thing that could cost him his job.

Now, that being said... this is the EXACT opposite of the 'official story'.  and for 6 years, I was mocked as a crazy conspiracy theorist for pointing out obvious fcking lies with the official us govt story.

So sorry, and this doesn't include you, since you're a CT on most thing before 9/10/2001 and everything from 9/12/2001 on...
But everyone who spent years saying "That's a CT, that's a CT"... just ADMIT that you're a CT now.

I wore that nickname for years... and ended up proven right on most of it.  It pisses me off that it's suddenly so cool to be a CT, now that Bush isn't the one selling it.  Not you, 33, but a lot of others here.  "240 is a crazy CTer" and now all these fcking clowns are all "The govt is lying!!!"   

Soul Crusher

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And by extension you believed Hillary on Benghazi too right despite the obvious lies? 

Like I said - kill yourself. 


Look, you KNOW what I think - I think the whole fcking thing is a big ass lie, made up to declare another war.  It's so obvious it makes my brain hurt.  It's stupid and obvious and only a fcking fool believes the crap that assad, clearly already winning, would do the one thing that could cost him his job.

Now, that being said... this is the EXACT opposite of the 'official story'.  and for 6 years, I was mocked as a crazy conspiracy theorist for pointing out obvious fcking lies with the official us govt story.

So sorry, and this doesn't include you, since you're a CT on most thing before 9/10/2001 and everything from 9/12/2001 on...
But everyone who spent years saying "That's a CT, that's a CT"... just ADMIT that you're a CT now.

I wore that nickname for years... and ended up proven right on most of it.  It pisses me off that it's suddenly so cool to be a CT, now that Bush isn't the one selling it.  Not you, 33, but a lot of others here.  "240 is a crazy CTer" and now all these fcking clowns are all "The govt is lying!!!"   

Fury

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And by extension you believed Hillary on Benghazi too right despite the obvious lies? 

Like I said - kill yourself. 


He's so pathetic.

240 is Back

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My beef here is with the politicla board definition of "conspiracy theory".

That is, anything which contradicts the official govt story.  This talk of "The rebels did a self-attack using chemical weapons" is the biggest CT of the year.  Yet it is on the main board.  WHY?

Cause everything that mattered about Iraq, 911, it all got shuffled off to the CT board, because it countered the "official story" - and hey, this story does too.  Even if it's true.  But somehow, under obama, a CT is heroic and amazing and beautiful and awesome... under bush I was called unpatriotic and everything else.

Pissed me off bigtime... and the hypocrisy of "US govt lying!" suddenly no longer being a CT is pretty ironic here.  When they lied under Bush, anyone who pointed it out was a CTer... When they lied under obama, anyone who points it out is awesome, mainstream getbig politics.   Hmmmmm

240 is Back

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And by extension you believed Hillary on Benghazi too right despite the obvious lies? 

Like I said - kill yourself. 


you fucking liar.   I've said that a million times.  They sat and let those americans die to avoid relvealing what they were doing there - and to avoid a big mess of 200 dead ter'ists on CNN, a month before the election

Another CT right there, of course.  Obama lied thru his teeth.  Yet it wasn't a CT then, was it?  Nope. 

But when attacks were allowed prior to Obama taking office?  "Move it to the CT board, it counters the official story!"


Do ya see why it pisses me off?  Also, the mis-characterization of my position - you just made that up.  I was one of the first to say obama let benghazi happen.  You're lying here.  WHy?

Soul Crusher

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 ::)  ::)  ::)

so despite obvious lies from Obama - ones that are provable in real time beyond anything which the 911 trooofers could ever point to, you still support Obama.  Why?  Cause you cant help yourself being under the delusions of the fool you voted for 2x over

Off yourself

My beef here is with the politicla board definition of "conspiracy theory".

That is, anything which contradicts the official govt story.  This talk of "The rebels did a self-attack using chemical weapons" is the biggest CT of the year.  Yet it is on the main board.  WHY?

Cause everything that mattered about Iraq, 911, it all got shuffled off to the CT board, because it countered the "official story" - and hey, this story does too.  Even if it's true.  But somehow, under obama, a CT is heroic and amazing and beautiful and awesome... under bush I was called unpatriotic and everything else.

Pissed me off bigtime... and the hypocrisy of "US govt lying!" suddenly no longer being a CT is pretty ironic here.  When they lied under Bush, anyone who pointed it out was a CTer... When they lied under obama, anyone who points it out is awesome, mainstream getbig politics.   Hmmmmm

240 is Back

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::)  ::)  ::)

so despite obvious lies from Obama - ones that are provable in real time beyond anything which the 911 trooofers could ever point to, you still support Obama.  Why?  Cause you cant help yourself being under the delusions of the fool you voted for 2x over

Off yourself



DUDE - of course they are obvious lies.  The dude was born in kenya, let benghazi happen, and is lying thru his fcking teeth about syria.

however, when a foreign paper revealed shit about iraq or 911, and I posted it, people here called me unpatriotic for believing foreign media over my own govt.  Even though the foreign paper was actually telling the truth. 

And now, the german paper is probably telling 100% truth...and that standard of evidence no longer applies.  That pisses me off.  And it really shounldt.   But it does. 

Hugo Chavez

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I tend to trust the word of the US sec of state over "German newspaper", 333386.

Otherwise, I'm a conspiracy theorist, like anyone who belives this newspaper article woudl be.

Our media lies all the time - How do we know this foreign newspaper isn't making this up?
Fucking just maybe because it backs up what Assad is saying AND backs up previous UN accusations that the rebels were responsible for chemical weapons attacks AND backs up numerous rebel videos showing rebels touting their chemical weapons expertise AND backs up what was in Assad's best interest at the time AND fits with the fact that the original reports about the intercepts actually show that the communications were frantic and demanding answers of what just happened AND because the rebels had a motive AND because they we are not even willing to release the audio of the intercepts even though they couldn't possible endanger anyone in the field AND because Alawite families from Latakia a few hundred miles away have identified their children among those gassed a few weeks ago as those who were kidnapped by rebels before the gassing happened. on and on...  This is the kind of shit you get budding into a civil war.  If you support it that much, go join a side, that's your right, but 240 is Nuts needs to keep America out of civil wars..

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Fucking just maybe because it backs up what Assad is saying AND backs up previous UN accusations that the rebels were responsible for chemical weapons attacks AND backs up numerous rebel videos showing rebels touting their chemical weapons expertise AND backs up what was in his best interest at the time AND fits with the fact that the original reports about the intercepts actually show that the communications were frantic and demanding answers of what just happened AND because the rebels had a motive AND because they we are not even willing to release the audio of the intercepts even though they couldn't possible endanger anyone in the field AND because Alawite families from Latakia a few hundred miles away have identified their children among those gassed a few weeks ago as those who were kidnapped by rebels before the gassing happened. on and on...  This is the kind of shit you get budding into a civil war.  If you support it that much, go join a side, that's your right, but 240 is Nuts needs to keep America out of civil wars..


Dude.  I believe the rebels did the whole damn thing.  It's actually obvious.

My beef is probably more with the getbig board... how when we talked about the obvious lies on WMD, we were labeled unpatriotic america-haters, and moved to the CT board.

Now, for some reason, more obvious lies about WMD are now viewed with opposite eyes... I don't get it.  I really disliked being called all those things... and now it's suddenly super-cool to question the official story regarding WMD

240 is Back

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it's a message board, and i'm taking inconsistent things wayyyy too seriously.  I'm going to watch some football.  

obviously, kerry/obama are bush/powell all over again.  media is playing ball just like they did before.  

I'd just hope we can develop some consensus for what is a "credible" foreign newspaper article, what is a "credible" statement from al-q rebels or an america-hating assad govt.  When something is a CT, and when it's political issue.  Drives me crazy, but it's only a message board, I need to relax.

Soul Crusher

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Dude.  I believe the rebels did the whole damn thing.  It's actually obvious.

My beef is probably more with the getbig board... how when we talked about the obvious lies on WMD, we were labeled unpatriotic america-haters, and moved to the CT board.

Now, for some reason, more obvious lies about WMD are now viewed with opposite eyes... I don't get it.  I really disliked being called all those things... and now it's suddenly super-cool to question the official story regarding WMD

Its not a matter of questioning anything - what Kerry and Obama are peddling is provably FALSE in real time. 

Fury

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it's a message board, and i'm taking inconsistent things wayyyy too seriously.  I'm going to watch some football.  

obviously, kerry/obama are bush/powell all over again.  media is playing ball just like they did before.  

I'd just hope we can develop some consensus for what is a "credible" foreign newspaper article, what is a "credible" statement from al-q rebels or an america-hating assad govt.  When something is a CT, and when it's political issue.  Drives me crazy, but it's only a message board, I need to relax.

This is your excuse every time you get owned in a thread. You and andreisadouche are carbon copies of each other.


Hugo Chavez

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I'm going to watch some football.
Yea I watched RGIII almost make a comeback and watched the Texans make a kick ass comeback.  It was fun as hell... Somehow that didn't stop me from calling BS on what you said.

240, this is a time to play it straight imo...  This is important shit and the only thing that should be happening imo is sincere honest debate.  There's a lot at play here that involves a lot of futures for a lot of people both here and there.

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Yea I watched RGIII almost make a comeback and watched the Texans make a kick ass comeback.  It was fun as hell... Somehow that didn't stop me from calling BS on what you said.

240, this is a time to play it straight imo...  This is important shit and the only thing that should be happening imo is sincere honest debate.  There's a lot at play here that involves a lot of futures for a lot of people both here and there.

I've been clear that I think obama/kerry is lying. 

My beef here is that over the past few years, I've been called unpatriotic, sympathetic to enemy, etc, frequently when I brought links from foreign newspapers showing major holes in official stories about 911, Iraq, etc. 

And, a lot of it got moved to the CT board, so I just stopped posting stuff about it.  Yes, it has a lot to do with ongoing wars and foreign policies - so it is relevant.

This new thing with 'info is false in realtime" being the loophole for it not being CT material?  I don't get it..

You and I were old-school CT, called every name in the book while sheep repeated Powell's nonsense and called anything quesiton pre-knowledge of 911 as unpatriotic.  Suddenly that's all out the window...

I'm playing it very straight.  This syria attacks smells like an inside job.  Why it's not being discussed in the CT board, though?

Soul Crusher

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Its not a CT when its provably false in real time and does not rely on a theory moron! 



I've been clear that I think obama/kerry is lying. 

My beef here is that over the past few years, I've been called unpatriotic, sympathetic to enemy, etc, frequently when I brought links from foreign newspapers showing major holes in official stories about 911, Iraq, etc. 

And, a lot of it got moved to the CT board, so I just stopped posting stuff about it.  Yes, it has a lot to do with ongoing wars and foreign policies - so it is relevant.

This new thing with 'info is false in realtime" being the loophole for it not being CT material?  I don't get it..

You and I were old-school CT, called every name in the book while sheep repeated Powell's nonsense and called anything quesiton pre-knowledge of 911 as unpatriotic.  Suddenly that's all out the window...

I'm playing it very straight.  This syria attacks smells like an inside job.  Why it's not being discussed in the CT board, though?

Soul Crusher

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The only one w a theory so far is Obama and Kerry w their "common sense" test that you buy in to

FYI - Russia lol at us for the moron we have in the WH

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2013/09/10/Russian-parliament-Gloats-as-Putin-Checkmates-Obama-Over-Syria


Hugo Chavez

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I've been clear that I think obama/kerry is lying. 

My beef here is that over the past few years, I've been called unpatriotic, sympathetic to enemy, etc, frequently when I brought links from foreign newspapers showing major holes in official stories about 911, Iraq, etc. 

And, a lot of it got moved to the CT board, so I just stopped posting stuff about it.  Yes, it has a lot to do with ongoing wars and foreign policies - so it is relevant.

This new thing with 'info is false in realtime" being the loophole for it not being CT material?  I don't get it..

You and I were old-school CT, called every name in the book while sheep repeated Powell's nonsense and called anything quesiton pre-knowledge of 911 as unpatriotic.  Suddenly that's all out the window...

I'm playing it very straight.  This syria attacks smells like an inside job.  Why it's not being discussed in the CT board, though?
You've made your beef with what you thought was hypocritical, it's time to move on... If you're waiting for someone's mea culpa, 3333 has already given it.  What more do you want?  Everyone's?  

I did all this shit a long time ago and moved on.  The most you can do is point it out then what?  Jesus, if my sole purpose was to point out the hypocrisy of how people posted 5+ years ago ::) yea fuck that.  I'd rather learn and move on and participate in honest discussion with my fellow Americans.

You've made your opinion on it.  We know it.  It's time to move on to what is happening now with an honest opinion.  I think people here or anywhere will respect that more.  Just post with honesty.