What Bodyfat % is optimal for gaining muscle?

[Big Chiro Flex]

I think between 8-10%.

1-You are more insulin sensitive at this leaner Bodyfat. Better fasting blood glucose levels here as well.

2-Nutrient partitioning is at its peak around this time.

3-Hormonally, this is the optimal environment for higher test levels and lower estrogen levels.

4-joints should feel decent here, as opposed to much leaner levels where you'll really be feeling the aches and pains. Not to mention saving your joints by carrying around less unnecessary fat weight.

5-Good everyday lean level of Bodyfat, yet you should never feel depleted from workouts around 8-10% on a normal training program. Recovery seems to be the best here.


Im just not convinced that you gain more muscle by being fatter. What does GetBig think?

[Wolfox]

I think it depends on the person. Some peoples bodies like being at a higher bf level while others can be in high single digit.

But for a natty such as myself with the goal of looking good year around I think it's best to get lean and then stay lean. No higher than 13% on a bulk. Cutting as a natural is a bitch so it's best not to get overly fat.

Currently high teens  but chipping away.

[Henda]

Around 8 to 12.
Beyod the 12 to 15 range anabolic hormones go to shit.

[Big Chiro Flex]

Around 8 to 12.
Beyod the 12 to 15 range anabolic hormones go to shit.

That's another great point bro. AAS sides can get brutal if you're permabulking.

[stavios]

the leanest you can be

[Big Chiro Flex]

I think it depends on the person. Some peoples bodies like being at a higher bf level while others can be in high single digit.

But for a natty such as myself with the goal of looking good year around I think it's best to get lean and then stay lean. No higher than 13% on a bulk. Cutting as a natural is a bitch so it's best not to get overly fat.

Currently high teens  but chipping away.

I trained for years as a very disciplined natty. I think my above post is even more crucial to natty's. There's zero leeway with you poor bastards....ive been there man  

[Nomad]

Def under 10%

I'd say 8-9% in my case.

[cephissus]

man is this ever an age old debate

i remember back when i used to visit t-nation

this guy over there, "professor x", some huge mothe fucker, made it his personal mission attack "8-10%" claim

guy was like 300 5'10" or sth, big as hell, and had basically convinced the rest of the board (a lot of huge bastards, included)

i always wondered what caused him to say that... of course he also only touched a (legal) prohormone here and there

even though he was obviously full of shit, in general, i think he really DID believe in going up to like 20% or so

makes you wonder...

[AVBG]

Sub 10% anything more then you're delusional

[local hero]

i think for your 1st few years, theres nothing wrong with overeating and making big jumps in bodyweight, especially if your in your late teens... make a huge leap, diet down, do a show, then never let your self go over 12 at the least, under 10 is optimum tho

[Bevo]

I predict between 3 to 4

[DroppingPlates]

9.874368959% is the correct answer

[JasonH]

Hmm, interesting posts - I don't think I've been under 12% for a VERY long time, although personally I think I'm in fairly good shape at the moment.

Guess I'd better up the cardio and clean my diet up a bit because I've been gaining muscle just fine on what I estimate is around 12-15%, although probably nearer 15%.

[cephissus]

i think for your 1st few years, theres nothing wrong with overeating and making big jumps in bodyweight, especially if your in your late teens... make a huge leap, diet down, do a show, then never let your self go over 12 at the least, under 10 is optimum tho

this is what i did

i think this is what a lot of people do

and then usually go on to tell people "never go above 10%... EVER!"

lol

[Sophus]

6% on hormones
12% without hormones

For men atleast

[Mrdibbs]

Below 10% i have the strength of a thirtheen year old girl. That can't be good?

[SmallPole]

8-10 % is about right i guess... the lower the better until you start feeling uncomfortable because of low bf levels (but that's not gonna be applicable to the vast majority of people anyway because it's simply too hard for them to go down on bf% so much without putting a shitton of effort into it)

so yeah, definitely easier to gain lean mass if you're lean and fat if you're fat

i'd say you have to put your own genetics into consideration as well, some (most) people, myself included, just have a hard time staying lean, regardless of the 'hormonas'

[DroppingPlates]

Below 10% i have the strength of a thirtheen year old girl. That can't be good?

Maybe you're a perfect candidate for a sex change, mrsdibbs

[local hero]

Hmm, interesting posts - I don't think I've been under 12% for a VERY long time, although personally I think I'm in fairly good shape at the moment.

Guess I'd better up the cardio and clean my diet up a bit because I've been gaining muscle just fine on what I estimate is around 12-15%, although probably nearer 15%.

i think you have a similar kind of frame to me, i used to carry my fat n water quite well without looking like a bloated pig

[dyslexic]

It depends on SO MANY variables.

If you are in the single digits, chances are, you are in a caloric deficit.

If you are running shit, well, that's another story. A "variable" so to speak (that which you did not clarify)

Some people do much better with a surplus of calories. Look at what Lee Priest "used to" do. Please don't look at him today.. .it's traumatic and terrifying.

If you are in a caloric deficit and you happen to be one of the lucky few who is below 10% BF, your chances of making any real noticeable gains are going to be slim. Does that make sense?

What do bodybuilders do before a contest? It's all about the nutrition (drugs) and nutrition, right? They cut calories, water, etc. They don't expect to grow into the show. They say they do, but it's a lie and a denial in regards to their drug usage.


If you've been in a caloric deficit for quite some time, have a fair amount of LBM, and are in the single digits, you can indeed make yourself extremely anabolic, but it would only be by increasing your calories and bringing your overall composition UP ~ more calories, more bodyfat, more muscle.

The dieting phase is a constant struggle to try and maintain your muscle while losing fat. Hopefully the fat you need to lose is minimal.

I would say the 10 -14% range for starters.

[Big Chiro Flex]

Below 10% i have the strength of a thirtheen year old girl. That can't be good?

I only feel this when I'm sub 6% (only pre contest). 8% I'm strong as ever.

[Papper]

The optimal level for gains is precisely 3.1415926535.

[Big Chiro Flex]

The optimal level for gains is precisely 3.1415926535.

Ive had enough of your lip Stinkypus. Give me a serious answer. My muscle gains are not a joking matter. 

[local hero]

Ive had enough of your lip Stinkypus. Give me a serious answer. My muscle gains are not a joking matter. 

are you maximising your anabloic wondows, serios question?

[chaos]

20%+