Dylan Ratigan of MSNBC had his insurance cancelled due to ObamaCare

[chadstallion]

That's right.  Big Brother knows best. 

yes, She does.

[RRKore]

The prescription drugs might be cheaper, but if the price is cheaper because the government is taking that money through taxes, then it's really not a savings. 

It IS really a savings.  Per wiki, "Drug prices are negotiated with suppliers by the federal government to control costs."  This is why the USA should adopt single payer;  Our population/market is larger than Canada's so we would have even more power to demand reasonable prices. 

Our lack of "leverage" in our every-man-for-himself system is the biggest reason for why we pay so much more than other countries. 

Here, this guy explains it way better than I can:

[Dos Equis]

yes, She does.

No, he doesn't.

[Dos Equis]

It IS really a savings.  Per wiki, "Drug prices are negotiated with suppliers by the federal government to control costs."  This is why the USA should adopt single payer;  Our population/market is larger than Canada's so we would have even more power to demand reasonable prices. 

Our lack of "leverage" in our every-man-for-himself system is the biggest reason for why we pay so much more than other countries. 

Here, this guy explains it way better than I can:

How is it a savings if they make up for it with higher taxes? 

Who is the guy in the video and why should I invest seven minutes of my life listening to him? 

[polychronopolous]

How is it a savings if they make up for it with higher taxes? 

Who is the guy in the video and why should I invest seven minutes of my life listening to him? 

I can tell you just by looking at him that I won't spend 1 second listening to him because by appearance alone I already know he is completely full of shit.

[RRKore]

I can tell you just by looking at him that I won't spend 1 second listening to him because by appearance alone I already know he is completely full of shit.

Oh, you're right, he definitely looks like a goof.  He's smart, though.  On Youtube he has some show called, uh, mental truth or some shit.  I ran across it (via xbox live where the youtube functionality is kinda unwieldy).  I watched another of his videos called something like 25 superstitions that have to do with religion or something like that.

[RRKore]

How is it a savings if they make up for it with higher taxes? 

Who is the guy in the video and why should I invest seven minutes of my life listening to him? 

It's a savings because it's NOT made up from higher taxes. 

The consumers' price is lower because the supplier price to the US government will be lower (like it is for other countries who have single payer).  Similar to the savings you can get from buying crap from Wal-mart -- Because super-giant corp Walmart is such a huge and important customer to all the chinese companies they buy from (because they buy stuff in huge quantities), Wal-mart TELLS THEM how much they will pay for stuff and those companies whine and complain but they end up doing what Wal-mart says unless they're actually losing money.  (And then Wal-mart charges us bargain prices for shit until they've driven all the competition out of the market and then they raise the price again and make huge margins --- but that's another story...)

You should only listen to the guy in the video if you want to be able to better understand how important the different factors that affect healtcare price are.

[Dos Equis]

It's a savings because it's NOT made up from higher taxes. 

The consumers' price is lower because the supplier price to the US government will be lower (like it is for other countries who have single payer).  Similar to the savings you can get from buying crap from Wal-mart -- Because super-giant corp Walmart is such a huge and important customer to all the chinese companies they buy from (because they buy stuff in huge quantities), Wal-mart TELLS THEM how much they will pay for stuff and those companies whine and complain but they end up doing what Wal-mart says unless they're actually losing money.  (And then Wal-mart charges us bargain prices for shit until they've driven all the competition out of the market and then they raise the price again and make huge margins --- but that's another story...)

You should only listen to the guy in the video if you want to be able to better understand how important the different factors that affect healtcare price are.

I'm not sure we're talking about the same thing.  I'm talking about the Canadian vs. U.S. systems.  If the cost of prescription drugs in Canada is lower by a few bucks than the cost of prescription drugs in the U.S., but overall taxes in Canada are much higher than the U.S., then the "savings" people get on drugs isn't really a savings. 

Wait . . . do Canadian citizens have to pay for prescription drugs?  That might make the entire comparison pretty meaningless. 

And I think I have exhausted my quota of talking about anything Canada related for the next year or so.

[bears]

at least he can still get insurance

I'm sure the the tens of thousands who died needlessly in Iraq and the many more who were maimed and disfigured wish they could trade problems with him

right.  and you should tell Joe Biden, Hillary Clinton, and Nancy Pelosi this.  I would tell you to tell George Bush.  But he's not in office anymore.  So whats the point?  But Joe Biden, Hillary Clinton, and Nancy Pelosi are. 

I'm sure you're absolutely outraged that they are still able to hold office after voting in favor of the war in Iraq right?  Oh wait.  you don't care.  they are for gay marriage and abortion.  so you'll vote for them no matter what they do.

[OzmO]

I'm not sure we're talking about the same thing.  I'm talking about the Canadian vs. U.S. systems.  If the cost of prescription drugs in Canada is lower by a few bucks than the cost of prescription drugs in the U.S., but overall taxes in Canada are much higher than the U.S., then the "savings" people get on drugs isn't really a savings. 

Wait . . . do Canadian citizens have to pay for prescription drugs?  That might make the entire comparison pretty meaningless. 

And I think I have exhausted my quota of talking about anything Canada related for the next year or so.

http://www.businessinsider.com/see-how-much-more-americans-pay-for-prescription-drugs-2012-8

Americans have the highest prescription drug costs in the world.

And more than ever, nearly half, fill a monthly prescription, according to this infographic from YellowRobin via visual.ly.

U.S. citizens pay more than twice as much for common prescription drugs than in countries like Canada, Germany and Australia.

For instance, the acid reflux drug Nexium costs the average British person $782 a year. However, Americans pay much more than that, $2,710.

[Soul Crusher]

And guess what - Obama made a deal w these same companies to make it even worse.  Hope and Change sucker

http://www.businessinsider.com/see-how-much-more-americans-pay-for-prescription-drugs-2012-8

Americans have the highest prescription drug costs in the world.

And more than ever, nearly half, fill a monthly prescription, according to this infographic from YellowRobin via visual.ly.

U.S. citizens pay more than twice as much for common prescription drugs than in countries like Canada, Germany and Australia.

For instance, the acid reflux drug Nexium costs the average British person $782 a year. However, Americans pay much more than that, $2,710.

[Dos Equis]

http://www.businessinsider.com/see-how-much-more-americans-pay-for-prescription-drugs-2012-8

Americans have the highest prescription drug costs in the world.

And more than ever, nearly half, fill a monthly prescription, according to this infographic from YellowRobin via visual.ly.

U.S. citizens pay more than twice as much for common prescription drugs than in countries like Canada, Germany and Australia.

For instance, the acid reflux drug Nexium costs the average British person $782 a year. However, Americans pay much more than that, $2,710.

Does Britain make up for the annual $1928 in additional prescription drug medication costs by imposing higher overall taxes? 

[OzmO]

Does Britain make up for the annual $1928 in additional prescription drug medication costs by imposing higher overall taxes? 

Don't know.  Do they?

Are the 23% of of savings eaten by taxes in Canada?

We have to pay 7-9% sales tax, they have to pay 13%-15% i think.

Their income tax is higher?  How much higher?

Do we pay that much less income taxes than those countries?

Is it logical to directly relate taxes and health care costs?   

[Dos Equis]

Don't know.  Do they?

Are the 23% of of savings eaten by taxes in Canada?

We have to pay 7-9% sales tax, they have to pay 13%-15% i think.

Their income tax is higher?  How much higher?

Do we pay that much less income taxes than those countries?

Is it logical to directly relate taxes and health care costs?   

I have no idea.  You posted the info on Britain.  I don't think the prescription drug cost differential means much when viewed in isolation. 

Yes it's logical to directly relate taxes to health care costs, if we're talking about a socialist country.  A socialist country is able to offer "free" stuff by taxing its citizens.

[Kim Jong Bob]

600dollar per month? Thats alot of money/year. It should be 600/year.  Im glad we dont need that here in sweden if would not be fun to pay 1/4 of your salary to that

[OzmO]

I have no idea.  You posted the info on Britain.  I don't think the prescription drug cost differential means much when viewed in isolation.  

Yes it's logical to directly relate taxes to health care costs, if we're talking about a socialist country.  A socialist country is able to offer "free" stuff by taxing its citizens.

In order to do that you would have to know what percentage of taxes go to health care costs.  

The cost differential does mean much when it comes out of pocket.  I realize a portion of that comes out with taxes.  However, to what extent?

Until i see something that says otherwise i find it hard to believe that "extra" taxes i would pay in Canada that directly relate to healthcare would make it more expensive than the "extra" cost i pay in the USA.

[Dos Equis]

In order to do that you would have to know what percentage of taxes go to health care costs.  

The cost differential does mean much when it comes out of pocket.  I realize a portion of that comes out with taxes.  However, to what extent?

Until i see something that says otherwise i find it hard to believe that "extra" taxes i would pay in Canada that directly relate to healthcare would make it more expensive than the "extra" cost i pay in the USA.

Not really.  I'm unaware of government segregating tax revenue they take from individuals to allocate to socialized healthcare costs.  That's not typically how tax collection works.

So if a person "saves" $50 a month on prescription medication, but pays $150 in higher overall taxes, the person is still saving money? 

I don't know what the precise numbers are, but in order for me to conclude the cost of healthcare is less expensive, I have to know what the overall tax burden is in both countries. 

[OzmO]

Not really.  I'm unaware of government segregating tax revenue they take from individuals to allocate to socialized healthcare costs.  That's not typically how tax collection works.

So if a person "saves" $50 a month on prescription medication, but pays $150 in higher overall taxes, the person is still saving money? 

I don't know what the precise numbers are, but in order for me to conclude the cost of healthcare is less expensive, I have to know what the overall tax burden is in both countries. 

Are they paying $150 a month higher taxes due to cheaper meds?   I don't think so.   

They are paying higher taxes and one of the things they get free health care.  They still pay for their prescriptions.

So a Canadian citizen while paying higher taxes gets free healthcare, and cheaper prescriptions.

[Soul Crusher]

http://theweek.com/article/index/252607/how-obama-is-soaking-the-young


Fuck Obama and everyone who voted for him - robbing us blind

[Dos Equis]

Are they paying $150 a month higher taxes due to cheaper meds?   I don't think so.   

They are paying higher taxes and one of the things they get free health care.  They still pay for their prescriptions.

So a Canadian citizen while paying higher taxes gets free healthcare, and cheaper prescriptions.

It doesn't really matter if the higher taxes are due to cheaper meds, roads and bridges, education, etc.  Higher taxes feel exactly the same.  It's money out of someone's pocket. 

I know we're talking hypothetical numbers, but the way I see it is if a person's net income after taxes is higher, but they wind up with the same benefits at the end of the day, then the system that allows the person to keep more of their own money is both less expensive and better for the taxpayer.   

[OzmO]

It doesn't really matter if the higher taxes are due to cheaper meds, roads and bridges, education, etc.  Higher taxes feel exactly the same.  It's money out of someone's pocket. 

I know we're talking hypothetical numbers, but the way I see it is if a person's net income after taxes is higher, but they wind up with the same benefits at the end of the day, then the system that allows the person to keep more of their own money is both less expensive and better for the taxpayer.   

I can agree with that in principle, IF the cost for private healthcare is cheaper vs the extra amount they pay in taxes for free health care.  Which is something i find hard to believe considering the costs we are seeing before ACA and now with ACA increasing costs.

And Canadians still get cheaper drugs, 23% less cheaper on average.