Mike Libetore committing career suicide

[Shockwave]

you're welcome mike.

Thanks showstoppa.

FYI, would you be so kind as to post a typical off-season cycle and contest prep cycle for say, an amateur NPC competitor?

[DroppingPlates]

this guy is cool.

this is what just dont get into many ppls heads, but its the naked truth.

Question #2: "If I take that much drugs, could I be a pro?"

Mike Liberatore: Hell NO!!!

Exactly, how many mega users have that "pro look"? Most of them are walking balloons with poor proportions, lol

[galeniko]

Exactly, how many mega users have that "pro look"? Most of them are walking balloons with poor proportions, lol

but some of them think if they diet down "one day soon" they will have the same size.

then they diet down and whats left is a galenio type physique.

dont ask how i found out

[Shockwave]

but some of them think if they diet down "one day soon" they will have the same size.

then they diet down and whats left is a galenio type physique.

dont ask how i found out

Gotta give DJ credit here, at least he has no delusions that he'll be huge when he diets down.

His delusions are that hes going to gain an inch on his arms on the odd amounts of Dball and that his 16" arm makes him somehow impressive... so I dont know which is worse.

Probably the naive megadosing permabulker.

[DroppingPlates]

Gotta give DJ credit here, at least he has no delusions that he'll be huge when he diets down.

His delusions are that hes going to gain an inch on his arms on the odd amounts of Dball and that his 16" arm makes him somehow impressive... so I dont know which is worse.

Probably the naive megadosing permabulker.

DJ is a poor example. He isn't only poorly gifted, mentally lazy and makes important mistakes on every aspect (food, training & drugs), but he also never had the goal to "get big"*













* or he's in a strong denial because of his genetics.

[galeniko]

with dj, he thinks he can get away with the above mentioned lazyness bc he thinks he has zane-ish structure.

this is quite delusional, not to mention that zane carried alot of size on top of that.

but the permabulkers are still more deluded.

they confuse fat and water with muscle, it doesnt get any lower than that.

how can one confuse meat with butter?

and indeed,many would be suprised whatd be left when all the way dieted down, soemthing dj has done atleast.

they dont realize,that the regional heavyweights who step on stage 200lbs+ are 1 in 10000 mass monsters

nono, the permabulkers are worst, its very easy to calculate whatd be left when dieted down.

to speculate on extra size when lean is ok.

[240 is Back]

steve namat was a great getbig member, he had some really good posts.  haven't seen him here in a while.  his contributions are missed!

[Kim Jong Bob]

with dj, he thinks he can get away with the above mentioned lazyness bc he thinks he has zane-ish structure.

this is quite delusional, not to mention that zane carried alot of size on top of that.

but the permabulkers are still more deluded.

they confuse fat and water with muscle, it doesnt get any lower than that.

how can one confuse meat with butter?

and indeed,many would be suprised whatd be left when all the way dieted down, soemthing dj has done atleast.

they dont realize,that the regional heavyweights who step on stage 200lbs+ are 1 in 10000 mass monsters

nono, the permabulkers are worst, its very easy to calculate whatd be left when dieted down.

to speculate on extra size when lean is ok.

lots of truth here as usual..99% of all the permabulkers that never been shreddeded over estimate their lean mass ALOT. When they start to diet and realith strucks 8/10 stops the diet cause the cant stand to look that small in clothes and feel depressed over how little mass they have so they start to bulk again

[The Revelation]

Thanks showstoppa.

FYI, would you be so kind as to post a typical off-season cycle and contest prep cycle for say, an amateur NPC competitor?

hey bro, i just might happen to know i guy i can ask

like i said, mike keeps it pretty real. the dosages he states are pretty much ball park. but in all ya, hes being pretty honest.

its kind tough saying 'all guys do this', or 'all guys do that'. i know w a guy whos going to get his pro card who is off half the year, only just started gh last year, and only for the length of his prep, and only cycles when he starts prepping 20 weeks out. he grows into his shows. he'll go from 210-215 or so at 8% to a dry and very well conditioned 224 on game day. he has prolly the best response i have ever seen. now, this is the exception to the rule- and he will go far once he starts to mega dose. why? cause all these guys running 4g stacks wont be able to push the throttle much further once they get their cards. they've tapped out. look at how many pros fall off the radar once they get their cards. everyone says they burn out. bullshit. they maxxed out to early. they didnt have the genetic threshold to put on muscle at minimal dosages, hit their ceiling early and now have nowhere to grow. thats why ronnie was able to be so fucking dominant. he didnt start pushing the throttle until he got his card. he got tired of getting pushed around like a mop and the rest is history.

the doses are hard to say, cause everyone lies about their use. i dunno why but its true. but i will tell you the compounds we use and why. if i mention a dose, take it to the bank its being used. also, not everyone uses the same things, and it always seems its not individual, but regional.

most guys i know run test all year round. there are no breaks. if there is a break, its for no longer than 2 months, as after 6 weeks you really start to notice being off. so, just a test base year round, typically 1g to start at the low end. enanthate is the ester of choice. some like sustanon. if real sustaonon cant be found i know guys who'll run prop and a long ester together. i have one friend (pro) who loves this and he is absolutely massive in the offseason. prolly the largest human i have ever seen. i know his prop usage is at 1g, i cant recall off hand his long ester use- possibly 2g. take it for what its worth.

most guys i know prefer eq over deca. there is no science behind their choice. its what they feel suits them best. 900-1200mg a week is pretty standard fare. do some guys use more? im sure they do. do some use less? most likely not. if your nats level and have any kind of appreciable muscle your easily needing 900+ a week. 600mg is for kids who want to look good for summer.

orals. most guys i know avoid them in the offseason. the only oral i know some guys will use is arimidex once in a while to control their water. but for the most part orals are stayed away from, as opposed to guys who dont compete, a lot of them will use var for a good part of the year. also orals combined with a higher sodium/ carb diet will cause you to hold a very non-functional amount of water. a little water is great. too much makes it difficult to breath, and train and lethargy becomes an issue.

gh use. again this must be regional, cause i dont know many guys trying to get their cards can afford to pay $300+ for a 30iu box of nupes. BULLSHIT the generic stuff doesnt work. maybe in mikes experience cause he has a shit source. i like the guy and respect his opinion but hes way off base here. i know someone who has had generic gh (hyge) seized by Customs, tested by Customs and sent the lab assay ton explain why their package will not be arriving as it contained somatropin- and nothing else. this isnt a lab assay generated by a chinese source or remailer to show the authenticity of their product. so, that being said the guys i know use strictly Hygetropin, which is hugely faked. not kigs. not anything else. HYGE HYGE HYGE. period. how much? i over heard a top pro (former olympia) tell a friend of mine 'cycle your anabolics, but use as much gh as you can afford.' nuff said. most guys i know use between 4iu and 10 iu a day. i dont know anyone personally who uses more than this. if you've ever tried to use more you'll know why.

this is pretty typical of the compounds most guys i know use in their offseason, altho these days its more of a hybrid season. a combination of compounds used off and pre contest.

preseason. this is where the fun starts. when multi compounding it does not take long to get up into nosebleed type numbers so the numbers you hear are very much being used. think about it. you think we're using 300mg of tren ace a week? fuck no. 3x that. plus 5 other compounds. now add that up. see what im saying? makes sense now does it not?

now thats all i can really say about pre contest. why? because if varies SO WIDELY from guy to guy the amounts of each compounds used. for an example. i like a 1:1 ratio of test : tren pre contest. some guys drop their test down and run higher dosages of everything else. nothing stays static pre contest. as you get leaner things either are added, taken out, or increased. unlike the offseason where you run x amount of each for the whole length of your offseason. it is very much an individualistic approach to the compounds used, as everyone responds differently to the amounts they use. its that simple. esters changes, dosages change, compounds are added or taken out. nothing is static. but the amounts you hear being used ARE BEING USED.

hope this sheds some light on things.. what ive written i know to be fact. its not what ive read, what ive heard, its what i know. so take it all for whats its worth

[Mr Nobody]

really? what is there to do in Hungary? him and his wife moved to America to seek their fortune. It's a shame to give up so soon.

Steve was a good guy on the boards and didn't run away like other pros

I agree he tried it here close but no cigar.

[Rambone]

steve namat was a great getbig member, he had some really good posts.  haven't seen him here in a while.  his contributions are missed!

PIP

[Shockwave]

hey bro, i just might happen to know i guy i can ask

like i said, mike keeps it pretty real. the dosages he states are pretty much ball park. but in all ya, hes being pretty honest.

its kind tough saying 'all guys do this', or 'all guys do that'. i know w a guy whos going to get his pro card who is off half the year, only just started gh last year, and only for the length of his prep, and only cycles when he starts prepping 20 weeks out. he grows into his shows. he'll go from 210-215 or so at 8% to a dry and very well conditioned 224 on game day. he has prolly the best response i have ever seen. now, this is the exception to the rule- and he will go far once he starts to mega dose. why? cause all these guys running 4g stacks wont be able to push the throttle much further once they get their cards. they've tapped out. look at how many pros fall off the radar once they get their cards. everyone says they burn out. bullshit. they maxxed out to early. they didnt have the genetic threshold to put on muscle at minimal dosages, hit their ceiling early and now have nowhere to grow. thats why ronnie was able to be so fucking dominant. he didnt start pushing the throttle until he got his card. he got tired of getting pushed around like a mop and the rest is history.

the doses are hard to say, cause everyone lies about their use. i dunno why but its true. but i will tell you the compounds we use and why. if i mention a dose, take it to the bank its being used. also, not everyone uses the same things, and it always seems its not individual, but regional.

most guys i know run test all year round. there are no breaks. if there is a break, its for no longer than 2 months, as after 6 weeks you really start to notice being off. so, just a test base year round, typically 1g to start at the low end. enanthate is the ester of choice. some like sustanon. if real sustaonon cant be found i know guys who'll run prop and a long ester together. i have one friend (pro) who loves this and he is absolutely massive in the offseason. prolly the largest human i have ever seen. i know his prop usage is at 1g, i cant recall off hand his long ester use- possibly 2g. take it for what its worth.

most guys i know prefer eq over deca. there is no science behind their choice. its what they feel suits them best. 900-1200mg a week is pretty standard fare. do some guys use more? im sure they do. do some use less? most likely not. if your nats level and have any kind of appreciable muscle your easily needing 900+ a week. 600mg is for kids who want to look good for summer.

orals. most guys i know avoid them in the offseason. the only oral i know some guys will use is arimidex once in a while to control their water. but for the most part orals are stayed away from, as opposed to guys who dont compete, a lot of them will use var for a good part of the year. also orals combined with a higher sodium/ carb diet will cause you to hold a very non-functional amount of water. a little water is great. too much makes it difficult to breath, and train and lethargy becomes an issue.

gh use. again this must be regional, cause i dont know many guys trying to get their cards can afford to pay $300+ for a 30iu box of nupes. BULLSHIT the generic stuff doesnt work. maybe in mikes experience cause he has a shit source. i like the guy and respect his opinion but hes way off base here. i know someone who has had generic gh (hyge) seized by Customs, tested by Customs and sent the lab assay ton explain why their package will not be arriving as it contained somatropin- and nothing else. this isnt a lab assay generated by a chinese source or remailer to show the authenticity of their product. so, that being said the guys i know use strictly Hygetropin, which is hugely faked. not kigs. not anything else. HYGE HYGE HYGE. period. how much? i over heard a top pro (former olympia) tell a friend of mine 'cycle your anabolics, but use as much gh as you can afford.' nuff said. most guys i know use between 4iu and 10 iu a day. i dont know anyone personally who uses more than this. if you've ever tried to use more you'll know why.

this is pretty typical of the compounds most guys i know use in their offseason, altho these days its more of a hybrid season. a combination of compounds used off and pre contest.

preseason. this is where the fun starts. when multi compounding it does not take long to get up into nosebleed type numbers so the numbers you hear are very much being used. think about it. you think we're using 300mg of tren ace a week? fuck no. 3x that. plus 5 other compounds. now add that up. see what im saying? makes sense now does it not?

now thats all i can really say about pre contest. why? because if varies SO WIDELY from guy to guy the amounts of each compounds used. for an example. i like a 1:1 ratio of test : tren pre contest. some guys drop their test down and run higher dosages of everything else. nothing stays static pre contest. as you get leaner things either are added, taken out, or increased. unlike the offseason where you run x amount of each for the whole length of your offseason. it is very much an individualistic approach to the compounds used, as everyone responds differently to the amounts they use. its that simple. esters changes, dosages change, compounds are added or taken out. nothing is static. but the amounts you hear being used ARE BEING USED.

hope this sheds some light on things.. what ive written i know to be fact. its not what ive read, what ive heard, its what i know. so take it all for whats its worth

thanks bro, very informative

[njflex]

revelation.. a bro in the know..great addition here..

[galeniko]

lots of truth here as usual..99% of all the permabulkers that never been shreddeded over estimate their lean mass ALOT. When they start to diet and realith strucks 8/10 stops the diet cause the cant stand to look that small in clothes and feel depressed over how little mass they have so they start to bulk again

man i wish i could ost pics of a frend whos like that,its very good case study material.


he got down to where abs started to shine through,the rest of body was becoming lean and he looked bigger every week, despite weighing less.

but then the above happened, he felt too small,(hed be my size dieted down id say), just bc his arms arent bigger than mine(when theyre kinda to big on me ,the rest is soso)and decided to bulk again.he looks plain fat and small now.realy,badly fat.

when i got ripped the first time, i had the following mindset," ill diet down so far and dont care if all that will be left is bones and skin",none of that sparing muscle blabla,and it worked.

they dont get it, when leaner, more muscle area is visible through the skin and this gives the illusion of bigger look.
say when the back muscle bulges are covered in fat and water, they look small,and puffy.
whne lean enough so the skin lays directly on the muscle, it pops out more and sharper, and looks big.

the guys who add size visibly over a year or so, they never get fat,fatter yes, but not really fat.
when the lower back starts to get soft, when you grab the skin there and theres soft fat tissue, then thats already the upper limit imo

[O.Z.]

man i wish i could ost pics of a frend whos like that,its very good case study material.


he got down to where abs started to shine through,the rest of body was becoming lean and he looked bigger every week, despite weighing less.

but then the above happened, he felt too small,(hed be my size dieted down id say), just bc his arms arent bigger than mine(when theyre kinda to big on me ,the rest is soso)and decided to bulk again.he looks plain fat and small now.realy,badly fat.

when i got ripped the first time, i had the following mindset," ill diet down so far and dont care if all that will be left is bones and skin",none of that sparing muscle blabla,and it worked.

they dont get it, when leaner, more muscle area is visible through the skin and this gives the illusion of bigger look.
say when the back muscle bulges are covered in fat and water, they look small,and puffy.
whne lean enough so the skin lays directly on the muscle, it pops out more and sharper, and looks big.

the guys who add size visibly over a year or so, they never get fat,fatter yes, but not really fat.
when the lower back starts to get soft, when you grab the skin there and theres soft fat tissue, then thats already the upper limit imo

lol I will never get back to where I was no mater what. Fuck that. Will rather be lean than 'big' (fat) in clothes. Still thinking to see a doctor

[galeniko]

lol I will never get back to where I was no mater what. Fuck that. Will rather be lean than 'big' (fat) in clothes. Still thinking to see a doctor

where we come from, not paying attention to diet never ends well,lol.

we have negative impact from the getgo, we out-ate the americanos even before they turned an obese nation.

ha,i see some doctor all the time

clean as a whistle, heavy eating , no roids ever

[O.Z.]

where we come from, not paying attention to diet never ends well,lol.

we have negative impact from the getgo, we out-ate the americanos even before they turned an obese nation.

ha,i see some doctor all the time

clean as a whistle, heavy eating , no roids ever

are you back to full training?

[galeniko]

are you back to full training?

yes, now it can be called training, the first couple times was more like re learning to walk, had bit hard time squatting bc there was so much food int he bowels, if id go all the way down, would risk having a spontaneus anal depleting

[O.Z.]

yes, now it can be called training, the first couple times was more like re learning to walk, had bit hard time squatting bc there was so much food int he bowels, if id go all the way down, would risk having a spontaneus anal depleting

 

good to hear you are back.

[Big Chiro Flex]

THE REVELATION:

good post dude!

What happens if GH is ran higher than 10IU's though??

[The Revelation]

THE REVELATION:

good post dude!

What happens if GH is ran higher than 10IU's though??

hey bro thanks man the problem in my experience over 10 the water issues become more exaggerated, 'the hands' get much much worse like if your using an iPad they fall asleep within minutes, and I don't like to do the frequent daily shots you hear some people using. I like one shot 2 at the most always around an empty stomach in my offseason pre contest ill divide it up. just personal preference after years of experimenting. I dunno if you've ever taken more than 15iu in one punch but within 20 min your ready for a nap. btw want to know if your gh is good- take 10iu in one shot. if it's good you'll feel the tiredness setting in. 15iu bro the sides become really exaggerated for me anyway. and like you know tolerance to sides/ ability to utilise dictates length of career (ability to get that card and still progress) and amount of tissue you'll be able to hold.

also bro you gotta remember a lot of us who do this actually have kids, wives, families, responsibilities the whole 9. we're arent kids or single guys living an Animal ad here. so to drop say 3000$ a month on pharma gh isn't realistic. for a lot of guys dropping say 700$ a month on hyge plus the rest of the compounds needed for prep, your food, travel expenses for show all have to be worked into your family budget.

I've been lucky I represent myself well have a good look and as such have picked up endorsements and  contracts along the way that have really helped out. truthfully I don't know that I could have gotten here without that. my hat goes off to the hundreds of guys doing it exactly the way I mentioned. and in a that the guys I know always put family first. remember we had that talk abt the shitty end of the industry? this is the bigger, very real end nobody sees- the guy who just loves to train following his dream while supporting a family I whatnot.

juice dealing is rampant too. it's easy to get caught up in that bullshit too. easy money right? grab this and this and this and pay for my own. hard for a guy to work 40-50 hrs a week support those he loves. and not be tempted but they put family first. chances are if you know a guy who's dealing and chasing that card he's single and a trainer or 'coach'. bro why you think g4p is so rampant? these guys get their gh from these 'sponsors' tell me who do you know that can afford to spend 3k a month on nupes or novos? exactly bro.

anyway I digress. just wanted to give you a look at another end of it you don't hear a lot about and give then their props

[njflex]

hey bro thanks man the problem in my experience over 10 the water issues become more exaggerated, 'the hands' get much much worse like if your using an iPad they fall asleep within minutes, and I don't like to do the frequent daily shots you hear some people using. I like one shot 2 at the most always around an empty stomach in my offseason pre contest ill divide it up. just personal preference after years of experimenting. I dunno if you've ever taken more than 15iu in one punch but within 20 min your ready for a nap. btw want to know if your gh is good- take 10iu in one shot. if it's good you'll feel the tiredness setting in. 15iu bro the sides become really exaggerated for me anyway. and like you know tolerance to sides/ ability to utilise dictates length of career (ability to get that card and still progress) and amount of tissue you'll be able to hold.

also bro you gotta remember a lot of us who do this actually have kids, wives, families, responsibilities the whole 9. we're arent kids or single guys living an Animal ad here. so to drop say 3000$ a month on pharma gh isn't realistic. for a lot of guys dropping say 700$ a month on hyge plus the rest of the compounds needed for prep, your food, travel expenses for show all have to be worked into your family budget.

I've been lucky I represent myself well have a good look and as such have picked up endorsements and  contracts along the way that have really helped out. truthfully I don't know that I could have gotten here without that. my hat goes off to the hundreds of guys doing it exactly the way I mentioned. and in a that the guys I know always put family first. remember we had that talk abt the shitty end of the industry? this is the bigger, very real end nobody sees- the guy who just loves to train following his dream while supporting a family I whatnot.

juice dealing is rampant too. it's easy to get caught up in that bullshit too. easy money right? grab this and this and this and pay for my own. hard for a guy to work 40-50 hrs a week support those he loves. and not be tempted but they put family first. chances are if you know a guy who's dealing and chasing that card he's single and a trainer or 'coach'. bro why you think g4p is so rampant? these guys get their gh from these 'sponsors' tell me who do you know that can afford to spend 3k a month on nupes or novos? exactly bro.

anyway I digress. just wanted to give you a look at another end of it you don't hear a lot about and give then their props

\
THANKS FOR SHARING,HOPE U REACH YOUR GOAL ON A COMPETITVE LEVEL..SEEM ALRIGHT.

[Big Chiro Flex]

hey bro thanks man the problem in my experience over 10 the water issues become more exaggerated, 'the hands' get much much worse like if your using an iPad they fall asleep within minutes, and I don't like to do the frequent daily shots you hear some people using. I like one shot 2 at the most always around an empty stomach in my offseason pre contest ill divide it up. just personal preference after years of experimenting. I dunno if you've ever taken more than 15iu in one punch but within 20 min your ready for a nap. btw want to know if your gh is good- take 10iu in one shot. if it's good you'll feel the tiredness setting in. 15iu bro the sides become really exaggerated for me anyway. and like you know tolerance to sides/ ability to utilise dictates length of career (ability to get that card and still progress) and amount of tissue you'll be able to hold.

also bro you gotta remember a lot of us who do this actually have kids, wives, families, responsibilities the whole 9. we're arent kids or single guys living an Animal ad here. so to drop say 3000$ a month on pharma gh isn't realistic. for a lot of guys dropping say 700$ a month on hyge plus the rest of the compounds needed for prep, your food, travel expenses for show all have to be worked into your family budget.

I've been lucky I represent myself well have a good look and as such have picked up endorsements and  contracts along the way that have really helped out. truthfully I don't know that I could have gotten here without that. my hat goes off to the hundreds of guys doing it exactly the way I mentioned. and in a that the guys I know always put family first. remember we had that talk abt the shitty end of the industry? this is the bigger, very real end nobody sees- the guy who just loves to train following his dream while supporting a family I whatnot.

juice dealing is rampant too. it's easy to get caught up in that bullshit too. easy money right? grab this and this and this and pay for my own. hard for a guy to work 40-50 hrs a week support those he loves. and not be tempted but they put family first. chances are if you know a guy who's dealing and chasing that card he's single and a trainer or 'coach'. bro why you think g4p is so rampant? these guys get their gh from these 'sponsors' tell me who do you know that can afford to spend 3k a month on nupes or novos? exactly bro.

anyway I digress. just wanted to give you a look at another end of it you don't hear a lot about and give then their props

Great post Rev.

So what's your opinion on the gh15 lackeys claiming these pros like Lesukov or Flex Lewis are using 30-40 IUs a day of GH? Is that even humanly possible?

[The Revelation]

Great post Rev.

So what's your opinion on the gh15 lackeys claiming these pros like Lesukov or Flex Lewis are using 30-40 IUs a day of GH? Is that even humanly possible?

fuck bro who knows. me personally from what I've seen and know there's no way. first you couldn't handle the sides. the lethargy would be out of this world. your hands would be fucked. that's 1200iu a month. lol

c'mon man!

if I was going to point a finger at anyone for megadosing gh it wouldn't  be flex Lewis. look at his amateur pics. he had a phenomenal build to start with. I don't see it in flex's physique to be honest. I think flex is just a helluva responder. lesukov for some reason looks to me like he really dialed up the volume lately. the quality of his physique has actually depreciated imo. he'd be a guy I would say is really pushing the envelope dosage wise but 40iu not happening I know PJ posts here maybe he can offer his opinion but I don't see it.

[njflex]

fuck bro who knows. me personally from what I've seen and know there's no way. first you couldn't handle the sides. the lethargy would be out of this world. your hands would be fucked. that's 1200iu a month. lol

c'mon man!

if I was going to point a finger at anyone for megadosing gh it wouldn't  be flex Lewis. look at his amateur pics. he had a phenomenal build to start with. I don't see it in flex's physique to be honest. I think flex is just a helluva responder. lesukov for some reason looks to me like he really dialed up the volume lately. the quality of his physique has actually depreciated imo. he'd be a guy I would say is really pushing the envelope dosage wise but 40iu not happening I know PJ posts here maybe he can offer his opinion but I don't see it.

that Russian kid offseason is so thick it looks like he can't even sleep on any angle without any help ,he's so damn thick at 5'5/5'6 everywhere.