galeniko etc theory on squats, can someone explain biomechanics behind it?

[Mawse]

Drugs determine leg size more than training voodoo .

All you can do is minimize chance of injury to the back, knees and load the muscle as much as possible.

I do high bar squats with 225-315 MAX for several sets of 8-10 slow reps. I take two -three seconds to lower, pause for a beat the squeeze back up. No explosion makes it much easier on the back and limits how much weight you can use, which is a good thing.

[Disgusted]

Maybe your form is changes with the heavier weight, or the heavier weight stresses the glutes and lower back to a greater degree,

Like when barbell curling light weight it feels  all biceps, but when the weight gets really heavy you start to cheat and use more lower back.

This. Good observation.

[tommywishbone]

Anabolic, we can't answer this question for you. We can only tell you what and why things work for us. Weider called it "Instinctive training." I know, I know he didn't think of that by himself.     Bobdybuilding, BODYBUILDING is not science. You will find out what works for you and that is what you will do.

A few ideas to consider for your squats:

-Slightly closer that normal foot spacing
-Never lock anything out
-No sets less than 10 reps
-Wear a belt but only snug not pulled super tight

Send me a postcard when you get the girls.

[kohl]

this cant be argues. a strong mid section will also have maxed out oblique muscles, they have great amount of receptors for meany, esp on steroids.

this is the one reason why i refuse to do heavy squats.

well that, and they not needed for my kind of development, which isnt going to win the mr o, but is better than some nat competitors here.
its a fair enough deal to me

Very very very true. If you're a bodybuilder, once you start juicing you have to be carefull not to stimulate the obliques too much, they grow like weed!

Squatting is for natural bodybuilders and for powerlifters who don't care about how they look.

No bodybuilder ever needs to put more then 315lb on the bar for ATG squats. Once you've reached that weight, climb in reps.

[flinstones1]

Dear dumb ass fuck, are you really mentally handicapped or something? When you do something like squats, what is your weakest link in that range of motion? Quads, which are able to press thousand pounds in leg press, or hips and back? You have more strength in your legs than you have your back and gluteus, because you don't train them properly. There is old thumb rule about the matter, which says that you must be able to do same reps of good morning with half of your squat weights, than you do squats with full weight. Like 20 reps with 140kg squat = 20 reps of 70kg good mornings. That way you can maintain balance between these muscles, and hips and back isn't the weakest link in your squat. Therefor the point is that if you do it right, squats are best exercise for quads, and if you do it like a moron, it is waste of time.

False.  the glutes and hamstrings have a much greater potential for force production than the quads. It's the reason powerlifters squat with a wide stance.

[ProudVirgin69]

False.  the glutes and hamstrings have a much greater potential for force production than the quads. It's the reason powerlifters squat with a wide stance.

Well that, and it decreases the range of motion.

[Van_Bilderass]

No bodybuilder ever needs to put more then 315lb on the bar for ATG squats. Once you've reached that weight, climb in reps.

Hypothetical question here. If Tom Platz never went above 315 would he have had exactly the same
leg development? Were all those 40 reps sets with 405 in vain? Were all those yearly tapers to low rep maxes useless?

was all this for nothing?






Another thing I wondered. Remember how Levrone used to have quads, when he was still able
go crazy heavy on squats? Why did they regress when he had to squat "light" only after his back injury? I presume he could still do lots of leg presses, unlimited extensions, and the light squats.
Is it possible the lack of squatting had something to with him not being able to keep building the quads... could it have something to do with the legs actually starting to regress?

And if 315 is the max you should use on squats, it stands to reason you'd need no more than maybe 180lbs on benches for example.

An extremely old Aceto quote just popped into my mind. Went something like, I have good quads and I can squat a house, I can't press much and my upper body lags.

[flinstones1]

Van what would happen if I took 5 grams of testosterone every week for a year? do you think a 500lb bench press would be possible for a guy benching 385-400 ish?

[Roger Bacon]

I did squats like Coleman today and it killed!!!!

No lockout, limited range of motion, keeping tension on the muscles.

[flinstones1]

did platz use gh?

[Van_Bilderass]

Van what would happen if I took 5 grams of testosterone every week for a year? do you think a 500lb bench press would be possible for a guy benching 385-400 ish?

I think it would take a lot of work, and constantly having a plan on how you plan to progress
on the lift, strengthening weak points, working on technique, and most importantly avoiding injury.
Benching is dangerous, especially if you try to gain over 100lbs on the lift in a year.

It might be possible, if you have it in you in the first place.

did platz use gh?

Not in any meaningful dose at least. You have to wonder how his legs would have looked on the peptides.

[kohl]

Hypothetical question here. If Tom Platz never went above 315 would he have had exactly the same
leg development? Were all those 40 reps sets with 405 in vain? Were all those yearly tapers to low rep maxes useless?

was all this for nothing?






Another thing I wondered. Remember how Levrone used to have quads, when he was still able
go crazy heavy on squats? Why did they regress when he had to squat "light" only after his back injury? I presume he could still do lots of leg presses, unlimited extensions, and the light squats.
Is it possible the lack of squatting had something to with him not being able to keep building the quads... could it have something to do with the legs actually starting to regress?

An extremely old Aceto quote just popped into my mind. Went something like, I have good quads and I can squat a house, I can't press much and my upper body lags.

If we all knew our body at the moment we started training, that would have spared us from a lot of unnecessary trouble. We all have done things that weren't really necessary.

I'm absolutely convinced that Tom Platz could have developed exactly the same quads if for one reason or another he wouldn't have had access to more plates then to load 315 on the bar.

A guy like Platz is perfectly built to further expand his quads only by doing hack squats.

[galeniko]

Well that, and it decreases the range of motion.

thats why i close my legs to very narrow stance.knee on knee.gives full rep.

this ofc puts my" small" weight used in other perspective

@kohl, yes if everyone had as many receptors in arms as they have in obliques, wed all lok phenomenal

[Van_Bilderass]

A guy like Platz is perfectly built to further expand his quads only by doing hack squats.

But these would never have to heavy either right? What is the max weight anyone would need on these in your opinion?

Regradless whether anyone needs "heavy" weights, nearly every pro goes heavier than the 315lbs example, or equivalent on other exercises, even the ones who preach the "load doesn't matter" mantra, like Milos or whoever.

I have trained extremely light on many exercises for years due to injuries, but when I load the bar heavy sometimes in my foolishness I experience an immediate size increase effect, even the soreness in my body is different... you just can't tap your potential for growth merely by "exhaustion" training IMO... maybe come close, but it's not the same. Like I said, even most of the pros are merely maintaining their size, you hardly have to train to maintain. Many preach how good their "mind-muscle connection" is nowadays and how good lighter weights work, yet they have stayed the same size for a decade.

[ProudVirgin69]

But these would never have to heavy either right? What is the max weight anyone would need on these in your opinion?

Regradless whether anyone needs "heavy" weights, nearly every pro goes heavier than the 315lbs example, or equivalent on other exercises, even the ones who preach the "load doesn't matter" mantra, like Milos or whoever.

Yeah but not many go beyond 405. Jay Cutler has had the best quads of the last decade and he never went over 405

[Van_Bilderass]

Yeah but not many go beyond 405. Jay Cutler has had the best quads of the last decade and he never went over 405

Sure, but Jay has basically just blowed up the body with hormones periodically, to different degrees depending on the time of year. He already built all he "needs" and there is no use risking injury.
I'm not against light training, the positives have to be weighed against the negatives.

But if we isolate the training aspect, keeping everything else the same, the higher the load the higher the hypertrophy response. NO ONE really believes otherwise. Otherwise we would never move the pin on the weight stack beyond warmups... we would never need to leave the house because we could get very pumped doing frog squats in the front yard.

[kohl]

But these would never have to heavy either right? What is the max weight anyone would need on these in your opinion?

Regradless whether anyone needs "heavy" weights, nearly every pro goes heavier than the 315lbs example, or equivalent on other exercises, even the ones who preach the "load doesn't matter" mantra, like Milos or whoever.

I have trained extremely light on many exercises for years due to injuries, but when I load the bar heavy sometimes in my foolishness I experience an immediate size increase effect, even the soreness in my body is different... you just can't tap your potential for growth merely by "exhaustion" training IMO... maybe come close, but it's not the same. Like I said, even most of the pros are merely maintaining their size, you hardly have to train to maintain. Many preach how good their "mind-muscle connection" is nowadays and how good lighter weights work, yet they have stayed the same size for a decade.

I know many pro's. Typically they can hack a lot heavier then they can squat. That's how you recognize an advanced bodybuilder. Squat on a certain moment becomes more a glute and obliques exercise then a quad exercise. Quads however have an enormous potential of development, and most people can not maximize this by doing squats (people who are perfectly built for squats can). An advanced bodybuilder who has developed his quads above squat level, is able to hack more then he can squat.

Most advanced bodybuilders will need 4 plates each side to fully work them. Some stronger guys who prefer to stay lower in reps will go to 5 plates. But that's a personal choice, I personally don't believe that there's a benefit in doing minus 12 reps for quads, but some just like the feeling so if the knees allow it, why not. I see more and more advanced guys sticking to 20 reps. Then 4 plates each side is plenty. And then I'm talking about maximum needed weights for top physiques! A gymrat can already get decent quads on one plate per side!

Quads, as calves and delts, can be built on relatively light weights with (very) high reps.
All other muscles respond well to 8-15 reps.

Remember I talk about bodybuilding on juice after some years of natural powerbuilding.

The more juice you take, the more you should stimulate instead of shock the muscles.

[Van_Bilderass]

Hacks are great for quads, but unfortunately murder the knees for many.
Somewhat big chance of ripping the quad off the bone too (like Milos).

How many here can hack consistently with no knee issues at all?

I recently mentioned to my training partner that hacks were probably the best quad exercise.
He wants bigger quads but he says he will never do them, they always kill his knees even with light weights. He's fine with squats and different leg presses.

[anabolichalo]

careful, abolhalo has been olympic style lifter, he knows pretty well what and how

van b: my legs ,quads,grew better with the exact style cholo4life has desribed than with heavy squats.

i do not see how squats are any superior in building quads than curls are.

some have good build for heay squats ,most will gain only injuries long term from that.

ofc using 2 plates in the way cholo describes will give better gains thn using 1 plate.

we have powerlifters in the gym who i seen sqaut 7oolbs, piss poor legs, mine look a million times better, then we have some ppl who barely squat and they have pro cards,or on the way to earn one.

i remember myself wonderin about it years ago how can that kind of trining give them such legs, but theres a consistent pattern

pretty much but because i question things not just believe i know it all

that's why ppl think i dont know shit


oh well

[anabolichalo]

Once and for all: squat is a basic for bodybuilding, which means that you need to learn to squat in the beginning of your bodybuilding carreer, when you are more focused on power-bodybuilding.

Learn optimal form (perfect form sometimes can't be achieved due to specific built) and go as heavy as possible for at least 8 reps (you're still not a powerlifter).

Once you maxed out on that, you're ready to start juicing. Once you start juicing, squat little by little will move towards the end of your workout, finally to disappear. An advanced bodybuilder stimulates his quads with hack squats. Heavy juicing + heavy squats = big obliques and glutes.

And yeah, Ronnie used to squat real heavy in the beginning of his carreer when power-bodybuilding, and with fake weights for photoshoots later in his carreer.

i am actually doing everything right then according to your theory

5x170kg olympic squat at 85kg natural no belt no nothingness

since roiding up i said fuck squats and just do leg presses 300kg for sets of 20

i also thought ronnie lifted fake weights but everyone mocked me

[flinstones1]

If we all knew our body at the moment we started training, that would have spared us from a lot of unnecessary trouble. We all have done things that weren't really necessary.

I'm absolutely convinced that Tom Platz could have developed exactly the same quads if for one reason or another he wouldn't have had access to more plates then to load 315 on the bar.

A guy like Platz is perfectly built to further expand his quads only by doing hack squats.

 

[kohl]

i am actually doing everything right then according to your theory

5x170kg olympic squat at 85kg natural no belt no nothingness

since roiding up i said fuck squats and just do leg presses 300kg for sets of 20

i also thought ronnie lifted fake weights but everyone mocked me

You're pretty strong. Built a good foundation before juicing. That will be rewarded later in your lifting carreer and life in general.

Do hack squats for sets of 20 (if your knees allow it).

[flinstones1]

black women love big asses on guys...just sayin.

[Hulkotron]

frog squats in the front yard.

Falcon Principles

[anabolichalo]

You're pretty strong. Built a good foundation before juicing. That will be rewarded later in your lifting carreer and life in general.

Do hack squats for sets of 20 (if your knees allow it).

should i do both leg press AND hack squat or alternate workouts?

which do i do first, how many sets

thanks