Author Topic: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years  (Read 4797 times)

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #50 on: February 23, 2014, 02:06:25 PM »
You either didn't READ any of the articles posted ...or you have a SEVERE READING COMPREHENSION challenge!

I read it and it's pretty clear he had other choices he could have made.  He's was a soldier and should have known better.

24KT

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #51 on: February 23, 2014, 02:11:17 PM »
I read it and it's pretty clear he had other choices he could have made.  He's was a soldier and should have known better.

Read them again.
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RRKore

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #52 on: February 23, 2014, 02:12:48 PM »
He was able to leave the brawl as it was happening and grab the gun from his car because he wasn't involved in the brawl originally.  He returned to the brawl and put himself in harms way.  He was punched but what did he expect when he inserted himself into something he wasn't a part of from the start.  What did he hope to do with his gun when he retrieved it and returned to the brawl?  From the time he walked away from the brawl and retrieved his gun he had many alternative options but he choose to enter the brawl with a gun.

He did not go back to the brawl. The brawl occurred about an an hour before he was attacked.  (He was attacked at about 2am, FWIW.)

The reason he left the (questionable) security of his car was because he was worried when his 2 friends did not return to the car.

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #53 on: February 23, 2014, 02:15:52 PM »
Read them again.

Did he or did he not go retrieve a weapon from his car without a prior threat to his life?    Did he wait in his car for over an hour but did not notify authorities?  Did he take his weapon and insert himself into a brawl he was not a part of?

RRKore

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #54 on: February 23, 2014, 02:16:29 PM »
he waited at his car "for a while"?

how long did the brawl go for?   I mean, 5 or 10 minutes?   


Not sure but that's a good question.  The one article states that he was attacked at 2am which was allegedly an hour after the brawl.

 An hour after the brawl started or ended, I don't know.  An hour-long brawl sounds a little unlikely to me, but what do I know?  
(Except that each of the 2 co-mainevents from the UFC yesterday lasted less than 2 minutes, haha.  -- Thank god for free streaming sites!)

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #55 on: February 23, 2014, 02:20:44 PM »



"According to court documents, an argument quickly escalated into a brawl involving 30 to 40 young men.

Giles reportedly was not involved in the melee but, separated from his friends, went outside to the car where he had a gun, for which he had a concealed carry permit. Giles put the weapon in his pants pocket and searched the crowd for his friends."





He waited for over an hour in his car as purported by 24k.   He was in his car away from the brawl he was not involved in.  An hour is a long time.  He didn't need to enter the area of the brawl with his gun.   If had happened to be carrying it the whole time we have a different story.  He retrieved the weapon and intentionally returned to the area of the brawl. 

RRKore

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #56 on: February 23, 2014, 02:23:22 PM »
Did he or did he not go retrieve a weapon from his car without a prior threat to his life?    Did he wait in his car for over an hour but did not notify authorities?  Did he take his weapon and insert himself into a brawl he was not a part of?

You know it's likely that he didn't "insert himself into a brawl" but whatever.

And I'm not saying that your suggestions are totally unrealistic but what would he have said to the authorities? 

Airman phones police:  "My friends have been missing for an hour after that black brawl at Club hole-in-the-wall and I'm worried."

Police:  "How old are your friends?"

Airman: "Over 21"

Police:  <click>

Irongrip400

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #57 on: February 23, 2014, 02:24:28 PM »
The sentence is way too long. Shouldn't be doing anymore than a year, and that's for wounding bystanders. Also, I think he probably already had the gun on him while he was in the club. He had a CC permit, so it was probably already on him. Not that it matters, but this dude did get hosed.

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #58 on: February 23, 2014, 02:26:43 PM »
You know it's likely that he didn't "insert himself into a brawl" but whatever.

And I'm not saying that your suggestions are totally unrealistic but what would he have said to the authorities? 

Airman phones police:  "My friends have been missing for an hour after that black brawl at Club hole-in-the-wall and I'm worried."

Police:  "How old are your friends?"

Airman: "Over 21"

Police:  <click>


There are a lot of assumptions there.    What is a fact is that he had at least an hour of safety to make many different choices.

RRKore

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #59 on: February 23, 2014, 02:34:20 PM »
He waited for over an hour in his car as purported by 24k.   He was in his car away from the brawl he was not involved in.  An hour is a long time.  He didn't need to enter the area of the brawl with his gun.   If had happened to be carrying it the whole time we have a different story.  He retrieved the weapon and intentionally returned to the area of the brawl. 

The airman's car was parked in the club's parking lot and that's where he was attacked (after he exited his car with handgun for which he had a valid CC permit).

Brawl began in the club and then spilled out to the front of the club when a large number of folks were kicked out.  (And that's allegedly how he became separated from his friends.)



24KT

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #60 on: February 23, 2014, 02:38:27 PM »

I read it and it's pretty clear he had other choices he could have made.  He's was a soldier and should have known better.



The brawl ballooned to anywhere between 30 to 40 people, and Giles did his best to avoid getting caught in the fray. The prosecution’s own witnesses even recalled that the man who eventually ended up attacking Giles had already instigated many fights that night and was behaving in a violently erratic manner. Not only did several witnesses confirm that Giles was attempting to avoid the fights and mind his own business, but a state witness, who was also a friend of the man who attacked Giles, even alleged that she feared her violent friend may seriously injure or kill someone.

All of a sudden a large crowd rushed Giles and someone struck him to the ground, causing him to fire a shot
that hit his attacker in the leg, but did not seriously injure him. Giles was not only trained to fire a handgun by the U.S. military, but he was also trained to recognize threatening situations. He had a legal right to carry and conceal a firearm and defend himself against his aggressor, who later admitted in court that Giles did nothing to provoke the attack, following up with: “I wanted to badly hurt the next person I saw.”

Despite having no criminal record or violent history, Giles was arrested, charged, and subsequently convicted to a mandatory minimum of 25 years in prison. At sentencing, the judge admitted that he thought the punishment was far too severe in this case, but his hands were tied by the Florida laws.

So now Michael Giles, a U.S. military veteran, a son of parents who have both served over 40 years in the military, and an outstanding father, is now fighting for the rest of his life.

Giles completed tours in Iraq and Kuwait and fought bravely for his country, so it shouldn’t be too much to ask that you sign a petition and fight for him now in his greatest hour of need

http://www.change.org/petitions/commute-the-25-year-mandatory-minimum-sentence-for-michael-giles
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RRKore

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #61 on: February 23, 2014, 02:48:06 PM »
The sentence is way too long. Shouldn't be doing anymore than a year, and that's for wounding bystanders. Also, I think he probably already had the gun on him while he was in the club. He had a CC permit, so it was probably already on him. Not that it matters, but this dude did get hosed.

All of this seems reasonable to me.  Even the part about having the gun in the club (unless that place uses metal detectors). 

As an Airforce guy who was the child of parents who both served their careers in the service, I wouldn't doubt if if he was probably a little concerned about security issues that might occur at that club.

He got hosed by FLA's laws, for sure. 

Compare and contrast Airman Giles' punishment with what happened to NBA player Stephen Jackson who didn't seem to get in much trouble for shooting his gun in the air outside an Indiana strip club after being punched in the face during some sort of brawl:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Jackson

On October 6, 2006, there were police reports that Jackson and three other Pacers players were involved in an argument with several patrons at Club Rio, a strip club in Indianapolis. Jackson was punched by one of the patrons and was hit by a car, rolling onto the hood. His injuries were considered minor. Jackson says he fired several gunshots from a 9-mm pistol as an act of self-defense. However, prosecutors later said he fired first. Jackson was charged October 11, 2006 with a felony count of criminal recklessness. He served a seven game suspension at the beginning of the 2007–08 NBA season as a Warrior for his legal problems.

I recall Jax saying something like, "I heard someone say, Dump! Dump!, and where I come from that means to empty your gun quick!"  Scary-ass upbringing he must have had, for sure. lol

24KT

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #62 on: February 23, 2014, 02:49:02 PM »

There are a lot of assumptions there.    What is a fact is that he had at least an hour of safety to make many different choices.

Like what? ...leave his guys behind to get caught up in a brawl. He was the one driving.
He's a military vet . They are trained not to leave a man behind.

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RRKore

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #63 on: February 23, 2014, 02:51:57 PM »
There are a lot of assumptions there.    What is a fact is that he had at least an hour of safety to make many different choices.

True enough.  Concerns for one's friends is what makes me sympathetic, I guess.  

I would NEVER just leave if my friends were there and I'd reasonably expect that I could lawfully use my gun to defend myself against some physical attack that I hadn't at all provoked, too.

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #64 on: February 23, 2014, 02:52:59 PM »
Like what? ...leave his guys behind to get caught up in a brawl. He was the one driving.
He's a military vet . They are trained not to leave a man behind.



Veterans don't do stupid things like take a gun and go back into a confrontation you weren't a part of.




The brawl ballooned to anywhere between 30 to 40 people, and Giles did his best to avoid getting caught in the fray. The prosecution’s own witnesses even recalled that the man who eventually ended up attacking Giles had already instigated many fights that night and was behaving in a violently erratic manner. Not only did several witnesses confirm that Giles was attempting to avoid the fights and mind his own business, but a state witness, who was also a friend of the man who attacked Giles, even alleged that she feared her violent friend may seriously injure or kill someone.

All of a sudden a large crowd rushed Giles and someone struck him to the ground, causing him to fire a shot
that hit his attacker in the leg, but did not seriously injure him. Giles was not only trained to fire a handgun by the U.S. military, but he was also trained to recognize threatening situations. He had a legal right to carry and conceal a firearm and defend himself against his aggressor, who later admitted in court that Giles did nothing to provoke the attack, following up with: “I wanted to badly hurt the next person I saw.”

Despite having no criminal record or violent history, Giles was arrested, charged, and subsequently convicted to a mandatory minimum of 25 years in prison. At sentencing, the judge admitted that he thought the punishment was far too severe in this case, but his hands were tied by the Florida laws.

So now Michael Giles, a U.S. military veteran, a son of parents who have both served over 40 years in the military, and an outstanding father, is now fighting for the rest of his life.

Giles completed tours in Iraq and Kuwait and fought bravely for his country, so it shouldn’t be too much to ask that you sign a petition and fight for him now in his greatest hour of need

http://www.change.org/petitions/commute-the-25-year-mandatory-minimum-sentence-for-michael-giles

He didn't do his best to avoid the confrontation.  Leaving his car with a gun was the furthest thing from doing his best to avoid conflict.  

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #65 on: February 23, 2014, 02:54:14 PM »
True enough.  Concerns for one's friends is what makes me sympathetic, I guess.  

I would NEVER just leave if my friends were there and I'd reasonably expect that I could lawfully use my gun to defend myself against some physical attack that I hadn't at all provoked, too.

He left his friends for over an hour.  He basically hid in his car until he grabbed his weapon and got enough nerve to leave his car.

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #66 on: February 23, 2014, 02:55:59 PM »
No doubt he's being railroaded but he has a hand in his own fate.

RRKore

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #67 on: February 23, 2014, 02:56:53 PM »
Avoiding conflict is not a higher priority than protecting others to a real soldier.  

How could it be?

The airman's lawyer must have really sucked.

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #68 on: February 23, 2014, 02:58:40 PM »
He left his friends for over an hour.  He basically hid in his car until he grabbed his weapon and got enough nerve to leave his car.

He didn't "leave" his friends. He was separated from them.

Only a child of the father of lies can put forth the deliberately skewed depiction of events you just did.
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StreetSoldier4U

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #69 on: February 23, 2014, 03:03:39 PM »
Avoiding conflict is not a higher priority than protecting others to a real soldier.  

How could it be?

The airman's lawyer must have really sucked.

Avoiding unnecessary conflict is the smart thing to do.  Apparently he didn't feel as though he was in that much danger because as far as we know he waited around for over an hour and didn't call the police.

RRKore

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #70 on: February 23, 2014, 03:04:28 PM »
He left his friends for over an hour.  He basically hid in his car until he grabbed his weapon and got enough nerve to leave his car.

Have you seriously never become separated from friends in an unfamiliar place?  

(One of these days I'll regale y'all with a seriously funny and salacious story about my 3 work colleague's and me all becoming separated during a wild night in Rio's Copacabana back in 2007.)

Unless some other location has been talked about as a meeting place beforehand, it's perfectly reasonable to think that everyone will come back to the car.  

RRKore

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #71 on: February 23, 2014, 03:06:36 PM »
Avoiding unnecessary conflict is the smart thing to do. 
...

Do all soldiers think this?  Really?

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #72 on: February 23, 2014, 03:06:41 PM »
He didn't "leave" his friends. He was separated from them.

Only a child of the father of lies can put forth the deliberately skewed depiction of events you just did.

He went to his car and waited for an hour?  He didn't call the police or his friends?   When he did get knocked down he discharged his weapon into the crowd, right?  Bystanders were injured.

I'm not going to address the rest of your statement because it's batshit crazy.

StreetSoldier4U

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #73 on: February 23, 2014, 03:07:36 PM »
Do all soldiers think this?  Really?

The ones who live do.  He was out numbered.  Apparently he didn't feel distressed because he wait for an hour doing nothing.

24KT

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Re: US airman stands his ground in Florida, sentenced to 25 years
« Reply #74 on: February 23, 2014, 03:08:25 PM »
Avoiding conflict is not a higher priority than protecting others to a real soldier.  

Yep


How could it be?

The airman's lawyer must have really sucked.

Fu*king Lawyers!!! They don't give a crap about their clients, they're just a bunch of blood sucking leeches!
His lawyer was looking to suck as much money as he could, ...even after this poor kid was sentenced.
He knew damned well he was screwing this kid, or he wouldn't have been preparing his appeal instead of his case.

Truly sucks when your own military gets screwed over in your courts, ...but we all know who the US military industrial complex really fights for.

w