Author Topic: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".  (Read 4049 times)

IFBBwannaB

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Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« on: January 17, 2006, 12:04:59 AM »
Im thinking of dieting abit but juicing isnt an option at the moment.
I was thinking on Albuterol & Ketotifin with some Ephedra.Or something along those lines.

I dont want to use juice like Winny and such since I wont be able to get the full benefit of a cycle so no reason to screw up with my HPTA for that.

Any suggestions?

DIVISION

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2006, 12:24:40 AM »
Im thinking of dieting abit but juicing isnt an option at the moment.
I was thinking on Albuterol & Ketotifin with some Ephedra.Or something along those lines. Any suggestions?

Use Ketotifen with Clen when you are going over 14 days because it will recharge the receptors.  You can alternate ECA if you wish as well.

T3 is an option.

DNP is obviously the most effective drug for fatburning, if you want to risk that. 



DIV
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IFBBwannaB

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2006, 12:30:37 AM »
I rather go with Albuterol ,studies show it to be more effective and with less side effects in human.
I might go with them all togther though :D

Anything else beside these two that pops into your mind? IGF and GH will be cool...but kind of expensive for some lame diet :P

DIVISION

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2006, 12:42:51 AM »
I rather go with Albuterol ,studies show it to be more effective and with less side effects in human.
I might go with them all togther though :D

Anything else beside these two that pops into your mind? IGF and GH will be cool...but kind of expensive for some lame diet :P

Skool me on an Albuterol cycle..........dosages, etc.

Have you run this?




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IFBBwannaB

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2006, 09:39:18 AM »

Randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled trial of albuterol in facioscapulohumeral dystrophy.

Kissel JT, McDermott MP, Mendell JR, King WM, Pandya S, Griggs RC, Tawil R; FSH-DY Group.

Department of Neurology, The Ohio State University, Columbus, 43210, USA.

BACKGROUND/OBJECTIVES: Animal and human studies suggest that beta(2)-adrenergic agonists exert anabolic effects on muscles, inducing and preventing atrophy after a variety of insults. Based on data from an open-label trial of albuterol in 15 patients with facioscapulohumeral dystrophy (FSHD), the authors conducted a randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled trial of sustained-release albuterol in this disease. METHODS: Ninety patients were randomized to three groups: placebo; 8.0 mg albuterol twice daily; or 16.0 mg albuterol twice daily. Patients were treated for 1 year with assessments at baseline and weeks 13, 26, and 52. The primary outcome was the 52-week change in global strength by maximum voluntary isometric contraction testing (MVICT). Secondary outcomes included changes at 52 weeks in strength by manual muscle testing (MMT), grip strength, functional testing, and muscle mass assessed by dual energy x-ray absorptiometry (DEXA). RESULTS: Eighty-four patients completed the study. The mean changes in composite MVICT scores were not significantly different between the groups (mean +/- SD: placebo 0.20 +/- 0.91; low dose -0.04 +/- 0.84; high dose 0.08 +/- 0.98). Similarly, there were no differences in the mean MMT change (placebo 0.04 +/- 0.16; low dose -0.03 +/- 0.13; high dose 0.00 +/- 0.15). Grip improved in both treatment groups compared to placebo (placebo -0.53 +/- 4.13, low dose +1.90 +/- 3.34 [p = 0.02], high dose +1.70 +/- 4.13 [p = 0.03]). The high-dose group had a significant increase in lean mass by DEXA (+1.57 +/- 1.71 kg) compared to placebo (0.25 +/- 2.24; p = 0.007). Albuterol was well tolerated; side effects included cramps, tremors, insomnia, and nervousness. CONCLUSIONS: Although albuterol did not improve global strength or function in patients with FSHD, it did increase muscle mass and improve some measures of strength.



Albuterol improves response to levodopa and increases skeletal muscle mass in patients with fluctuating Parkinson disease.

Uc EY, Lambert CP, Harik SI, Rodnitzky RL, Evans WJ.

Department of Neurology, University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences and Central Arkansas Veterans Healthcare System, Little Rock, AR, USA. ergun-uc@uiowa.edu

Animal studies indicate that beta(2)-adrenergic receptor agonists enhance transport of levodopa across the blood-brain barrier. Preliminary studies showed improved response to levodopa in patients with Parkinson disease (PD) who were given albuterol as adjunctive therapy. Beta(2)-adrenergic agonists may offer additional benefits to PD patients via their skeletal muscle anabolic effects, particularly those who experience decreased muscle strength and weight loss. Nondemented, fluctuating PD patients receiving levodopa but not experiencing severe dyskinesias underwent the following tests at baseline and 14 weeks after treatment with albuterol sulfate (4 mg four times a day, orally): Unified Parkinson's Disease Rating Scale motor, tapping, and stand-walk-sit tests every 30 minutes between 8 am and 5 pm; body composition analyses using whole-body plethysmography and computed tomography of the thigh; muscle strength tests; and the Parkinson's Disease Questionnaire (PDQ-39). Results were analyzed using paired t-tests (2 tailed), repeated-measures analysis of variance, and the Wilcoxon signed-rank test. Seven of 8 enrolled patients completed the study; 1 patient withdrew because of headache and anxiety. The area under the curve for all-day UPDRS motor scores improved by 9.8 +/- 9.1% (mean +/- standard deviation; P < 0.05) and tapping improved by 7.6 +/- 8.1% (P < 0.05). The effect was more pronounced when only the response to the first levodopa dose (area under the curve, 8-11 am) was analyzed: 13.0 +/- 9.8% and 9.8 +/- 9.6% respectively. Thigh muscle cross-sectional area increased significantly as measured by computed tomography (5.3 +/- 3.2%, P < 0.01), as did fat-free mass by whole-body plethysmography combined with total-body water determination (9.5 +/- 2.9%, P < 0.05). There was no significant improvement in the stand-walk-sit test, muscle strength tests, other UPDRS sections, daily OFF time, or PDQ-39. Four patients were rated as having a mild global improvement (+1 point) on a -3 to +3-point scale, and 3 of them chose to continue albuterol beyond the termination of the study. The mean heart rate increased from 78.3 +/- 9.3 beats/minute to 85.6 +/- 8.7 beats/minute (P < 0.05). No laboratory abnormalities or electrocardiographic changes were induced by albuterol in any subject. This open-label pilot study suggests that albuterol increases muscle mass and improves the therapeutic response to levodopa in patients with fluctuating PD. A double-blind, placebo-controlled study is needed to confirm the effects and safety profile of beta(2)-agonists in PD


IFBBwannaB

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2006, 09:40:37 AM »
Drug treatment for facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy.

Rose MR, Tawil R.

Department of Neurology, King's College Hospital, Academic Neuroscience Centre, Denmark Hill, London, UK, SE5 9RS.

BACKGROUND: Facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy is a progressive muscle disease which has no agreed treatment. Early suggestions that corticosteroids might be helpful were not supported by a subsequent open label study. The beta 2 adrenergic agonist albuterol, also known as salbutamol, is known to have anabolic effects which might be beneficial for facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy. Creatine has been used as a muscle performance enhancer by athletes and it might be helpful in muscular dystrophies including facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy. OBJECTIVES: The objective of the review was to determine whether there is any drug treatment which alters the progression of facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy. SEARCH STRATEGY: We searched the Cochrane Neuromuscular Disease Group specialised register (searched August 2003), MEDLINE (January 1966 to August 2003) and EMBASE (January 1980 to August 2003) for any references to facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy. Abstracts from the major neurological meetings and trial bibliographies were also searched for further references to trials. Experts were contacted for information regarding unpublished trials or trials in progress. SELECTION CRITERIA: We included all randomised or quasi-randomised trials of any drug treatment for facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy, in adults with a recognised diagnosis of facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy. Trials had to include an assessment of muscle strength at one year. DATA COLLECTION AND ANALYSIS: All identified trials were independently assessed by both reviewers to ensure that they fulfilled the selection criteria and were then rated for their quality. Trial data were extracted and entered by one reviewer and checked by the other. If appropriate data existed a weighted treatment effect was to be calculated across trials using the Cochrane statistical package, Review Manager. The results were to have been expressed as relative risks and 95% confidence intervals and risk differences and 95% confidence intervals for dichotomous outcomes, and weighted mean differences and 95% confidence intervals for continuous outcomes. MAIN RESULTS: Two published high quality randomised controlled trials fulfilled the selection criteria. One compared creatine supplementation with placebo and the other compared high and low-dose albuterol with placebo. A further unpublished randomised controlled trial of albuterol in facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy was identified. The creatine trial showed a non-significant difference in favour of creatine. The albuterol trial showed no significant difference in muscle strength at one year but some secondary measures such as lean body mass and handgrip strength did improve. REVIEWERS' CONCLUSIONS: There is no evidence from randomised controlled trials to support any drug treatment for facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy but only two randomised controlled trials have been published.



Strength training and albuterol in facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy.

van der Kooi EL, Vogels OJ, van Asseldonk RJ, Lindeman E, Hendriks JC, Wohlgemuth M, van der Maarel SM, Padberg GW.

Neuromuscular Center Nijmegen, University Medical Center Nijmegen, PO Box 9101, 6500 HB Nijmegen, The Netherlands. e.vanderkooi@neuro.umcn.nl

BACKGROUND: In animals and healthy volunteers beta2-adrenergic agonists increase muscle strength and mass, in particular when combined with strength training. In patients with facioscapulohumeral muscular dystrophy (FSHD) albuterol may exert anabolic effects. The authors evaluated the effect of strength training and albuterol on muscle strength and volume in FSHD. METHODS: Sixty-five patients were randomized to strength training of elbow flexors and ankle dorsiflexors or non-training. After 26 weeks albuterol (sustained-release, 8 mg BID) was added in a randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled design. Primary outcome was maximum voluntary isometric strength (MVIC) at 52 weeks. Secondary outcomes comprised dynamic strength and muscle volume. RESULTS: Training and albuterol were well tolerated. Training of elbow flexors did not result in a significant effect on MVIC, but dynamic strength improved significantly. Elbow flexor MVIC strength increased significantly in albuterol vs placebo treated patients. Ankle dorsiflexor strength decreased in all groups. Eleven out of twelve non-trained muscles in the albuterol group showed a positive effect on MVIC compared to the placebo group (p < 0.05 in seven muscle groups). Muscle volume decreased in the placebo-treated, and increased in the albuterol-treated patients. No synergistic or antagonistic effects were observed between training and albuterol. CONCLUSIONS: In FSHD strength training and albuterol appear safe interventions with limited positive effect on muscle strength and volume. Consequences of prolonged use are presently unclear, which precludes routine prescription.



IFBBwannaB

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #6 on: January 17, 2006, 09:41:15 AM »
Oral albuterol dosing during the latter stages of a resistance exercise program.

Caruso JF, Hamill JL, De Garmo N.

Healthcare Research Associates Inc., Orlando, Florida 32819, USA. john-caruso@utulsa.edu

Subjects performed isoload variable resistance exercise (REX) 3 days per week. After 10 weeks, they received a double-blind albuterol (n = 11) or placebo (n = 11) capsule assignment with no crossover and continued training. During the first week of capsule administration, dosages were increased from 4 mg to 16 mg daily and then maintained for 14 days. At weeks 0, 10, and 13, we measured upper arm and thigh cross-sectional area, knee and elbow extensor and flexor (KE, KF, EE, EF) strength at 3 angular velocities, and lean body mass. Data after 10 weeks showed insignificant between-group differences. From weeks 10-13, as subjects continued REX training, albuterol evoked higher (p < 0.05) KE-KF strength gains at multiple velocities versus placebo dosing. A higher lean body mass trend also occurred with albuterol from weeks 10-13. Results suggest that albuterol augments REX to provide greater strength gains from hypertrophic factors than an REX-placebo assignment.


IFBBwannaB

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #7 on: January 17, 2006, 09:49:18 AM »
I have never run Albeutrol.But from what I can fish from these studies it can be a nice addon for a diet.

I think Im missing a few studies that I used to have.It basicly share most of Clen attributes but unlike Clen which never been proven to really work in human subjects Albe does.Combined with Ketotefin it might be a worth while addon :D


.It show more promise then Clen.
.Clen side effects are nasty and hard to avoid.
Thing is the dosages that seem effective are quite high and will be very pricy :( But I will use Ketotefin so it might counter the need for high dosage...who knows... :-\

muscle19

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2006, 08:19:23 PM »
what type of nasty sides on clen r u talkin about?


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J-Land_Joe

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2006, 09:12:47 PM »
Ketotefin is gonna make you some hungry.

IFBBwannaB

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2006, 11:41:39 PM »
Clen can be harsh sometimes.
Shakes,loss of sleep,nervousness and more.And considering it aint too effective I see no reason to use something to get mostly side effects.

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #11 on: January 18, 2006, 05:13:03 AM »

ho ho ho ... merry xmas...

im on salbutamol nebuliser (5mg 4 times per day) due to a smokin related illness.

iv dropped 2.5 kilos since last tuesday!  ;D

im only on it for another 5 days... but im gonna raid the pharmacy before then.

its mental stuff..... my stomach has dramatically deflated.

clen is rubbish compared to salbutamol ... the normal inhaler is excellent but the nebulised preperation is fantastic stuff!

i defy anyone on a dnp/t3 stack to beat me in weight loss .... and i got non of the dangers too!  :)


J-Land_Joe

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #12 on: January 18, 2006, 05:14:50 AM »
Clen can be harsh sometimes.
Shakes,loss of sleep,nervousness and more.And considering it aint too effective I see no reason to use something to get mostly side effects.

Yeah I don't like it much after 2 weeks about once every 3 or 4 months :-\

J-Land_Joe

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #13 on: January 18, 2006, 05:17:43 AM »
ho ho ho ... merry xmas...

im on salbutamol nebuliser (5mg 4 times per day) due to a smokin related illness.

iv dropped 2.5 kilos since last tuesday!  ;D

im only on it for another 5 days... but im gonna raid the pharmacy before then.

its mental stuff..... my stomach has dramatically deflated.

clen is rubbish compared to salbutamol ... the normal inhaler is excellent but the nebulised preperation is fantastic stuff!

i defy anyone on a dnp/t3 stack to beat me in weight loss .... and i got non of the dangers too!  :)



I just got back from 2 weeks in India and due to the stomach flu lost 6 kilos :'(

freeagain

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #14 on: January 18, 2006, 05:43:02 AM »

so thats 3 kilos a week.... i can garauntee most of that will be drastic dehydration and you felel like death.

i feel great ... and aparently gettin more buff.


IFBBwannaB

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Re: Any recommendation for a none HPTA effecting "juice".
« Reply #15 on: January 18, 2006, 01:46:21 PM »
If I recal correct Salbutamol is just a diffrent name for Albeutrol right?
Thing is Alb got a short half life which require the dosages you said you are using,about 5mgX4 times per day.And that sums up to be very pricy since not many sell it :(