Author Topic: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment  (Read 7391 times)

Coach is Back!

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #100 on: June 20, 2014, 06:15:44 PM »
Impeachment and Jail is too good for him

Straw Man

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #101 on: June 20, 2014, 06:36:45 PM »
Impeachment and Jail is too good for him

what do you suggest

have you asked yourself what would jesus do?

I'm guessing he would forgive him (assuming Jesus even thought he did something wrong)


Soul Crusher

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #102 on: June 20, 2014, 07:16:06 PM »
what do you suggest

have you asked yourself what would jesus do?

I'm guessing he would forgive him (assuming Jesus even thought he did something wrong)



He needs to be sent to where he came from and banned from atepping foot ever in the usa again.

Straw Man

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #103 on: June 20, 2014, 07:50:57 PM »
He needs to be sent to where he came from and banned from atepping foot ever in the usa again.

are you Coach?

If not then STFU or at least don't reply for him

Coach is Back!

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #104 on: June 20, 2014, 08:31:47 PM »
what do you suggest

have you asked yourself what would jesus do?

I'm guessing he would forgive him (assuming Jesus even thought he did something wrong)



He's the devil. So ask YOURSELF what would Jesus do. Oh, that's right. You're a liberal. You can't believe in Jesus or the devil.

Coach is Back!

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #105 on: June 20, 2014, 08:33:13 PM »
He needs to be sent to where he came from and banned from atepping foot ever in the usa again.

x 2

Straw Man

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #106 on: June 20, 2014, 08:42:34 PM »
He's the devil. So ask YOURSELF what would Jesus do. Oh, that's right. You're a liberal. You can't believe in Jesus or the devil.

I don't know what JWD

that's why I asked you




Kazan

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #107 on: June 21, 2014, 06:15:01 AM »
what do you suggest

have you asked yourself what would jesus do?

I'm guessing he would forgive him (assuming Jesus even thought he did something wrong)



I have a question for you, if the POTUS\.gov doesn't follow the law, is there any law? Or do they just get to pick and choose which laws they follow without repercussion? Sure they put on a dog and pony show but at the end of the day no one is held accountable. If this is the case then all Americans should be able to pick and choose which laws they want to follow, they are only following the precedent set by elected officials 
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flipper5470

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #108 on: June 21, 2014, 06:51:05 AM »
Does Jesus forgive muslims?

RRKore

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #109 on: June 21, 2014, 08:36:50 AM »
I have a question for you, if the POTUS\.gov doesn't follow the law, is there any law? Or do they just get to pick and choose which laws they follow without repercussion? Sure they put on a dog and pony show but at the end of the day no one is held accountable. If this is the case then all Americans should be able to pick and choose which laws they want to follow, they are only following the precedent set by elected officials 

Sure there are laws.  But all laws aren't equal nor are they applied equally to all people. 

Some can be broken without much fear of consequences and others can't.  It works that way for political figures/gov't agents and for private citizens, though the laws one can break with impunity are different for those 2 groups. 

It should be added that which laws one can break with near impunity vary greatly depending on other factors like time and place.

I think you know this is how it works in the USA.  You probably think it sucks and I understand that, I think.

Me?  I'm not so sure it sucks.  I think that it's possible to go too far the other way, too;  When the gov't's view about breaking any law are TOO strict, you can end up living how they do in Singapore where folks can get whipped with a cane for graffiti and pay heavy fines for small-time stuff like chewing gum or not flushing after using a public toilet. 




flipper5470

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #110 on: June 21, 2014, 08:44:13 AM »
The standard for impeachment is  "treason, bribery or other high crimes and misdemeanors".   

Kazan

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #111 on: June 21, 2014, 08:47:07 AM »
Sure there are laws.  But all laws aren't equal nor are they applied equally to all people. 

Some can be broken without much fear of consequences and others can't.  It works that way for political figures/gov't agents and for private citizens, though the laws one can break with impunity are different for those 2 groups. 

It should be added that which laws one can break with near impunity vary greatly depending on other factors like time and place.

I think you know this is how it works in the USA.  You probably think it sucks and I understand that, I think.

Me?  I'm not so sure it sucks.  I think that it's possible to go too far the other way, too;  When the gov't's view about breaking any law are TOO strict, you can end up living how they do in Singapore where folks can get whipped with a cane for graffiti and pay heavy fines for small-time stuff like chewing gum or not flushing after using a public toilet. 





The fact that a politician can get away with tax evasion, murder and the list goes on is complete horseshit. They never face any real punishment, and if they do the exiting POTUS pardons them. No one wants to admit it, but there is a ruling class in the USA and then the rest of us. The rest of us need to understand that elected officials are public servants, not rock stars or untouchables. They should be held to a higher standard, because they choose that path. Instead we get the bottom of the barrel, sociopaths and con men making decisions that line their pockets and give them more power. All the while the populace argues about non sense and keeps sending the same lying bastards back to DC.
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Kazan

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #112 on: June 21, 2014, 08:48:14 AM »
The standard for impeachment is  "treason, bribery or other high crimes and misdemeanors".   

If that was the case then the simple fact that Obama care was passed by buying off senators would have seen a lot of politicians out on their ass.
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RRKore

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #114 on: June 21, 2014, 10:05:38 AM »
The fact that a politician can get away with tax evasion, murder and the list goes on is complete horseshit. They never face any real punishment, and if they do the exiting POTUS pardons them. No one wants to admit it, but there is a ruling class in the USA and then the rest of us. The rest of us need to understand that elected officials are public servants, not rock stars or untouchables. They should be held to a higher standard, because they choose that path. Instead we get the bottom of the barrel, sociopaths and con men making decisions that line their pockets and give them more power. All the while the populace argues about non sense and keeps sending the same lying bastards back to DC.

I understand and even go along with your thinking to a point.  

I agree that if a political leader is guilty of a serious crime like murder, then he or she should pay for that crime like any other citizen.  For lesser crimes, though...I'm not so sure.  

To play devil's advocate here, don't you think there's a downside to prosecuting political leaders for things like tax evasion and other relatively minor crimes?  Seems to me that nearly every president would end up behind bars because even if the transgressions were minor and relatively common (like lying about getting a blowjob from some slutty intern), the opposition political party would see it only as an opportunity to hurt the other party.  And even if just removing one from office were the penalty, that can easily be taken too far.

You actually see this in other countries, btw.  Ever heard of Thai Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej?  The 73-year old Sundarevej (along with his whole cabinet) were removed from office in 2009 by the Thai Supreme Court for the crime of....receiving $2,300- for appearing on some cooking shows.  In Thailand.  The same Thailand where prostitution is illegal (wink wink, nudge nudge).  Is that some excessive shit or what?  

It's easy to make the case that prosecuting your political leaders for anything except the most egregious offenses is not something a politically stable government should be doing.

So, what should be done when our leaders cravenly break the laws that they know they can get away with?  I think the answer may be to just publicly call them out on it.  If a large percentage of the people are expressing their condemnation over some politician's misdeeds, then, for today's politicians who live and die by polls, that very well might be enough of a penalty by itself.  (Maybe not, though; Some politicians, particularly ones in their last legal term of office, might not GAF...)

flipper5470

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #115 on: June 21, 2014, 10:35:38 AM »
So..hypothetically..if I can lie,cheat and steal my way to the top...that provides me with immunity from prosecution from a whole list of minor crimes?   

Kazan

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #116 on: June 21, 2014, 11:34:31 AM »
I understand and even go along with your thinking to a point.  

I agree that if a political leader is guilty of a serious crime like murder, then he or she should pay for that crime like any other citizen.  For lesser crimes, though...I'm not so sure.  

To play devil's advocate here, don't you think there's a downside to prosecuting political leaders for things like tax evasion and other relatively minor crimes?  Seems to me that nearly every president would end up behind bars because even if the transgressions were minor and relatively common (like lying about getting a blowjob from some slutty intern), the opposition political party would see it only as an opportunity to hurt the other party.  And even if just removing one from office were the penalty, that can easily be taken too far.

You actually see this in other countries, btw.  Ever heard of Thai Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej?  The 73-year old Sundarevej (along with his whole cabinet) were removed from office in 2009 by the Thai Supreme Court for the crime of....receiving $2,300- for appearing on some cooking shows.  In Thailand.  The same Thailand where prostitution is illegal (wink wink, nudge nudge).  Is that some excessive shit or what?  

It's easy to make the case that prosecuting your political leaders for anything except the most egregious offenses is not something a politically stable government should be doing.

So, what should be done when our leaders cravenly break the laws that they know they can get away with?  I think the answer may be to just publicly call them out on it.  If a large percentage of the people are expressing their condemnation over some politician's misdeeds, then, for today's politicians who live and die by polls, that very well might be enough of a penalty by itself.  (Maybe not, though; Some politicians, particularly ones in their last legal term of office, might not GAF...)

Why should they get a pass on "minor crime's"? The average american has the IRS crawling up their ass with a microscope for tax evasion.

And as far as they will use this against the other candidate\party, how is that any different then todays political climate? When was the last time you heard a politician out line what they are going to do, instead of simply attacking the opposition? Hey I'm the lesser of 2 evils, for for me.....

These assholes are entrusted with the nations treasure, can send our armies to war, make treaties and the list goes on, your damn right I expect them to obey the law, no matter how large or how small
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RRKore

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #117 on: June 21, 2014, 12:01:38 PM »
So..hypothetically..if I can lie,cheat and steal my way to the top...that provides me with immunity from prosecution from a whole list of minor crimes?   

Well, if you make it to the top, then basically, yeah, you're probably gonna be able to skate on a bunch of stuff that would cause a regular citizen, especially one without means, to live in a cage.

RRKore

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #118 on: June 21, 2014, 12:30:01 PM »
Why should they get a pass on "minor crime's"? The average american has the IRS crawling up their ass with a microscope for tax evasion.

And as far as they will use this against the other candidate\party, how is that any different then todays political climate? When was the last time you heard a politician out line what they are going to do, instead of simply attacking the opposition? Hey I'm the lesser of 2 evils, for for me.....

These assholes are entrusted with the nations treasure, can send our armies to war, make treaties and the list goes on, your damn right I expect them to obey the law, no matter how large or how small

The case can be made that they should get a pass for the sake of government stability.  Do you seriously want to change governments every time some leader cheats on his taxes or the like?  That's some banana republic shit, it seems to me.

And how would it be different from now if the opposition party had a more realistic chance to actually kick folks out of office for relatively minor offenses?  Well, most realistic folks from both parties now realize that ousting a president from office for anything less than a blatant, inarguable and serious crime is not gonna happen.  Furthermore, trying to make it happen without very good cause can backfire and hurt the opposition party.

Maybe your expectations are a little unrealistic?  My own admittedly cynical expectation is that our leaders only avoid getting caught totally red-handed while committing serious offenses.  Sadly, that alone makes the USA have a leg up on many foreign countries.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think it's at all good for leaders to try to govern as "do as I say, not as I do" types, but many people will lie, cheat, and steal and since our leaders are people...

Kazan

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #119 on: June 21, 2014, 01:12:28 PM »
The case can be made that they should get a pass for the sake of government stability.  Do you seriously want to change governments every time some leader cheats on his taxes or the like?  That's some banana republic shit, it seems to me.

And how would it be different from now if the opposition party had a more realistic chance to actually kick folks out of office for relatively minor offenses?  Well, most realistic folks from both parties now realize that ousting a president from office for anything less than a blatant, inarguable and serious crime is not gonna happen.  Furthermore, trying to make it happen without very good cause can backfire and hurt the opposition party.

Maybe your expectations are a little unrealistic?  My own admittedly cynical expectation is that our leaders only avoid getting caught totally red-handed while committing serious offenses.  Sadly, that alone makes the USA have a leg up on many foreign countries.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think it's at all good for leaders to try to govern as "do as I say, not as I do" types, but many people will lie, cheat, and steal and since our leaders are people...

Well maybe a precedent needs to be set, break the law pay the price. A few POTUS, congressmen, reps get sent packing and the rest will have to un-fuck themselves or face the same. Seems to me condoning the behavior only encourages it, the only ones that make it on the radar, are the arrogant pricks that thing they are above the law. Push the boundaries beyond what is ignored in DC. Why are my expectations unrealistic?   
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T-REX007

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #120 on: June 21, 2014, 07:55:41 PM »
Being impeached is just an accusation, it's the first step in a process of removal ..... the problem with putting the POTUS in jail is that he is considered the 'chief citizen" - he represents the USA, so if you impeach and carry out the process to the end, you have put the representative of the American people in jail/ prison - you want to be REALLY sure that is the best course of action for the country when considering this scenario ...... besides what POTUS hasn't done SOMETHING that would be considered an impeachable offense by some ?

Ford thought about it with Nixon -and got it right
Should the POTUS be above the law or members of congress -?  no way, but things must be thought out and decided in context of what is best for the country
just my 2 cents

Kazan

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #121 on: June 22, 2014, 06:20:19 AM »
Being impeached is just an accusation, it's the first step in a process of removal ..... the problem with putting the POTUS in jail is that he is considered the 'chief citizen" - he represents the USA, so if you impeach and carry out the process to the end, you have put the representative of the American people in jail/ prison - you want to be REALLY sure that is the best course of action for the country when considering this scenario ...... besides what POTUS hasn't done SOMETHING that would be considered an impeachable offense by some ?

Ford thought about it with Nixon -and got it right
Should the POTUS be above the law or members of congress -?  no way, but things must be thought out and decided in context of what is best for the country
just my 2 cents

I can see your point of view, but I do not believe that the reason whatever POTUS has not been impeached, is for the good of the country. These guys just keep seeing how far they can push the boundaries, how can a POTUS be impeached for what another POTUS did an was not? So when does it stop? Will it be to late when Americans wake up and the only course of action is to take up arms?
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T-REX007

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Re: "Obama clearly broke the law" - time for jail and impeachment
« Reply #122 on: June 22, 2014, 06:29:10 AM »
Agree with you Kaz, it's a slippery slope for sure

And the more that politicians push the envelope and get away with it just helps create a new generation of politician down the road who will push it even further ....