Author Topic: Dem's vs GOP on economics.  (Read 18025 times)

Straw Man

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #50 on: August 05, 2014, 09:21:53 AM »
I suppose we can all find articles to fit our cause. I could probably find 20 more similar to this. So, in your words tell me how raising taxes in this country, again, especially to small businesses. As for California, NY and most other liberal ran states, corporations are either looking to get out or flat out leaving because they're getting killed.

http://m1.marketwatch.com/articles/BL-235B-1476?mobile=y&mobile=y

Hey Dopey,

I told you to first read the article I posted which gave 2 specific examples at the state level which was a direct response to your question "how raising taxes benefits the economy" which showed the negative effects on tax cuts in Kansas and the positive effects of tax increases in CA.   You clearly didn't bother to read the article or you would have addressed it or at least provided a valid counter argument.  

you respond with an article about Prop 13 and how the expansion of pension and other benefits are unsustainable for municipalities (something I happen to agree with).

Since you didn't bother to read the article you posted you obviously missed this line in your article:
"More recently, California has seen some short-term success in stabilizing its finances through spending restraint and a voter-approved tax increase"

I also told you to actually try to refute my statement about Fluke rather than one of your usual responses such as

Lmao..okay ::)

Hahaha. Ok

Jesus you're an idiot

Joe, I do understand that those responses are all you can do when confronted with facts which force you to consider that your current beliefs are not only false but also moronic.

How about this as a compromise.  I will go back to treating you like the moron which we all know you to be and you go back to listening to Rush 4 hours a day and pretending to be a "legitimate coach"

Straw Man

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #51 on: August 05, 2014, 09:23:23 AM »

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #52 on: August 05, 2014, 11:23:04 AM »
here are 3 answers for you

I'm sure you will find them to be more than adequate


Don't forget... "You just don't get it do you?"

Straw Man

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #53 on: August 05, 2014, 11:42:08 AM »
Don't forget... "You just don't get it do you?"

Yep, that's one of the classics, especially for the unintended irony

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #54 on: August 05, 2014, 11:47:01 AM »
Hey Dopey,

I told you to first read the article I posted which gave 2 specific examples at the state level which was a direct response to your question "how raising taxes benefits the economy" which showed the negative effects on tax cuts in Kansas and the positive effects of tax increases in CA.   You clearly didn't bother to read the article or you would have addressed it or at least provided a valid counter argument.  

you respond with an article about Prop 13 and how the expansion of pension and other benefits are unsustainable for municipalities (something I happen to agree with).

Since you didn't bother to read the article you posted you obviously missed this line in your article:
"More recently, California has seen some short-term success in stabilizing its finances through spending restraint and a voter-approved tax increase"

I also told you to actually try to refute my statement about Fluke rather than one of your usual responses such as

Joe, I do understand that those responses are all you can do when confronted with facts which force you to consider that your current beliefs are not only false but also moronic.

How about this as a compromise.  I will go back to treating you like the moron which we all know you to be and you go back to listening to Rush 4 hours a day and pretending to be a "legitimate coach"

Oh, I absolutely read then I retorted with an article showing why it's somewhat of a fallacy to think that California is doing great. Now, Mr. finance major with a degree, either answer my fucking question or I'll just assume you can't and let you decide whether you want to sue the institution where you go that degree from. This is retarded.  

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #55 on: August 05, 2014, 11:48:11 AM »
here are 3 answers for you

I'm sure you will find them to be more than adequate


We'll just leave it at you can't answer the question.

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Straw Man

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #57 on: August 05, 2014, 11:55:12 AM »
Oh, I absolutely read then I retorted with an article showing why it's somewhat of a fallacy to think that California is doing great. Now, Mr. finance major with a degree, either answer my fucking question or I'll just assume you can't and let you decide whether you want to sue the institution where you go that degree from. This is retarded.  

Again Dopey, your question was "how raising taxes benefits the economy"

I showed you proof of how raising taxes helped California (something the article you posted also stated) and conversely how lowering taxes harmed the economy of Kansas

I never said California is "doing great" though it's definitely doing a lot better than it was a few years ago (ignoring the drought of course)

Why is it you can't even pay attention long enough to remember the very question that you asked.

Now Mr Pretend "Coach" go try to refute the simple facts in my statement about Fluke

Straw Man

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #58 on: August 05, 2014, 11:56:32 AM »
We'll just leave it at you can't answer the question.

what's wrong with these asnwers

are you saying this is what you do when you can't answer a question or refute a point?

Lmao..okay ::)

Hahaha. Ok

Jesus you're an idiot

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #59 on: August 05, 2014, 12:07:11 PM »
Again Dopey, your question was "how raising taxes benefits the economy"

I showed you proof of how raising taxes helped California (something the article you posted also stated) and conversely how lowering taxes harmed the economy of Kansas

I never said California is "doing great" though it's definitely doing a lot better than it was a few years ago (ignoring the drought of course)

Why is it you can't even pay attention long enough to remember the very question that you asked.

Now Mr Pretend "Coach" go try to refute the simple facts in my statement about Fluke

Yes, California is doing better. But YOU didn't answer the question. It's a fact that small business is the biggest contributor to an economy. When you hit small business with tax increases and cuts into profit that usually means the cost of goods and services will increase which eventually leads to a decrease consumer buying. If consumer buying decreases how does that business not stay open? If you know anything about business you know the repercussions of that, or do you???

Straw Man

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #60 on: August 05, 2014, 12:26:05 PM »
Yes, California is doing better. But YOU didn't answer the question. It's a fact that small business is the biggest contributor to an economy. When you hit small business with tax increases and cuts into profit that usually means the cost of goods and services will increase which eventually leads to a decrease consumer buying. If consumer buying decreases how does that business not stay open? If you know anything about business you know the repercussions of that, or do you???

so why did the economy of CA improve after having a tax increase while the economy of Kansas tanked when they cut taxes

do you think CA small business were harmed while the rest of the economy improved   

did small business in Kansas thrive while the rest of the economy tanked?

again, back to my original response to your question


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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #61 on: August 05, 2014, 12:38:52 PM »
Let me just add. Raising taxes is ALWAYS a temporary fix, a band aid. In the long run it takes it's toll. You CANNOT create long term economic growth by gouging small businesses and consumers (yes, they get hit hard as well).


BTW, as for the prop 18. It all ties in. One other prop I want to bring up is prop 13  (1978 look it up, I'm in no mood to explain it) but there has been rumors about Brown repealing it to create more revenue. If this clown does this, it's going to displace people on fixed incomes (mostly elderly) who cannot afford to pay those kind of property taxes and eventually losing their property. It's bullshit.

Dos Equis

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #62 on: August 05, 2014, 12:42:51 PM »
Yes, California is doing better. But YOU didn't answer the question. It's a fact that small business is the biggest contributor to an economy. When you hit small business with tax increases and cuts into profit that usually means the cost of goods and services will increase which eventually leads to a decrease consumer buying. If consumer buying decreases how does that business not stay open? If you know anything about business you know the repercussions of that, or do you???

Correct.  Business always passes along increased costs of doing business to consumers.

Straw Man

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #63 on: August 05, 2014, 12:50:31 PM »
Correct.  Business always passes along increased costs of doing business to consumers.

No they don't

But you always say they do

That never changes

Dos Equis

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #64 on: August 05, 2014, 12:56:19 PM »
Let me just add. Raising taxes is ALWAYS a temporary fix, a band aid. In the long run it takes it's toll. You CANNOT create long term economic growth by gouging small businesses and consumers (yes, they get hit hard as well).


BTW, as for the prop 18. It all ties in. One other prop I want to bring up is prop 13  (1978 look it up, I'm in no mood to explain it) but there has been rumors about Brown repealing it to create more revenue. If this clown does this, it's going to displace people on fixed incomes (mostly elderly) who cannot afford to pay those kind of property taxes and eventually losing their property. It's bullshit.

Good points.  And what inevitably happens is pork barrel spending, mismanagement, debt, deficits, etc. 

Straw Man

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #65 on: August 05, 2014, 12:59:04 PM »
Good points.  And what inevitably happens is pork barrel spending, mismanagement, debt, deficits, etc. 

yeah, too bad that reality doesn't support anything that Joe wrote

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #66 on: August 05, 2014, 01:50:24 PM »
yeah, too bad that reality doesn't support anything that Joe wrote


HAHAHA.  You lost me at "reality".  As if it penetrates the fog that surrounds the Isle of Lala Land.

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #67 on: August 05, 2014, 01:58:28 PM »

HAHAHA.  You lost me at "reality".  As if it penetrates the fog that surrounds the Isle of Lala Land.

Look mother fu#$ker, if you can't some how constructively contribute to this thread then get the fuck out. You've proven you can't defend any issue in any thread. How about you making an attempt to answer the questions. 

Straw Man

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #68 on: August 05, 2014, 02:05:02 PM »
Look mother fu#$ker, if you can't some how constructively contribute to this thread then get the fuck out. You've proven you can't defend any issue in any thread. How about you making an attempt to answer the questions. 

Yes Lurker.  Take a lesson from our illegitimate Coach on how to constructively contribute to a thread

Lmao..okay ::)

Hahaha. Ok

Jesus you're an idiot


Dos Equis

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #69 on: August 05, 2014, 02:07:00 PM »
Look mother fu#$ker, if you can't some how constructively contribute to this thread then get the fuck out. You've proven you can't defend any issue in any thread. How about you making an attempt to answer the questions. 

Good luck with that.  I don't think he's interested in anything other than calling you and Soul Crusher names. 

Soul Crusher

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #70 on: August 05, 2014, 02:22:43 PM »

Politics


Have You Taken Your Obama Loyalty Oath?
 
Or do you hate America?


 


David Harsanyi
By David Harsanyi
August 5, 2014
 


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Jonathan Alter at the Daily Beast has an idea that will infuse the president’s “economic patriotism” rhetoric with some bite: Compel companies to take “loyalty oaths” to prove their patriotism.


You may find this suggestion a little creepy, maybe even a little fascistic; but Alter says that “it’s time for red-blooded Americans to take matters into our own hands.”

 




And by taking the matter into “our” hands, Alter means that President Obama would unilaterally bar any company that practices “inversion” – corporate merging with foreign firms to save on U.S. tax bills – from doing business with the federal government. Companies that follow the administration requirements will earn a government seal of approval. If you act “un-American” and fail to recognize your “real interests” and those of the United States – which are, naturally, indistinguishable from the president’s agenda – you will be shunned and your business punished.


You will be powerless to stop it.



That’s because efforts to stop desertion aren’t populist or socialist but nationalist, a much more powerful force in American politics. Unbridled nationalism is a menace; it leads to trade wars and, all too often, real wars. But properly channeled, nationalism and patriotism are matters of the heart that cut to our deepest ideas of who we are.


Ah, properly channeled nationalism. You see, when you do it it’s just a bunch of dangerous jingoist rubbish. When we do it … America! And after five years of conflating patriotism and left-wing economic policy, you are expected to treat a completely legal tax designation as an attack on the homeland. Unless, of course, you’re a seditious weasel who’s betting against America.


Now, I suppose, a conservative might ask: Can we really trust politicians who offered legislation to limit free expression and religious freedom (as defined by the Supreme Court, which still decides these issues) to be arbiters of American patriotism? Or is it only the president who’s tasked with deciding who deserves special status? A liberal might ask, what happens when the next administration, one with different views on “nationalism,” begins divvying out golden stars? When the future GOP president punishes companies that aren’t helping fight the war on Iran, for instance, will that be cool, as well?


Now, we could lower corporate tax rates to be more competitive with the nations that are enticing companies to move elsewhere and avoid this sort of ugliness. There is some unanimity on the issue. But as Alter notes, this probably won’t work considering how many countries continue to cut corporate taxes or eliminated them altogether.


Clearly I’m not the rock-ribbed patriot Alter is, because I hope corporations continue to use inversion to avoid taxation until DC is forced to pass reform that completely eliminates corporate taxes that unnecessarily burden consumers. Multinational corporations do not exist to be tax collectors. Now, if a person was going to get into the economic patriotism game, he might point out that rent-seeking companies that subsist on government subsidies and use their political connections in Washington as a cudgel against competition, are engaged in something far more un-American.  And you can imagine the unholy cronyism that’s likely to erupt once the executive branch begins deciding which companies deserved to be rewarded for their patriotism.


It’s worth remember that when Alter proposes that Obama discipline companies that have done nothing illegal or illegitimate, he’s simply taking Obama’s “economic patriotism” to its next logical step. He wants the administration to threaten the close “easy access to American markets” companies enjoy. And really, haven’t we all suffered enough with all this unhindered access to affordable goods, exotic merchandise and cool gadgets?  Samsung. Honda. Toyota. Nestle. GlaxoSmithKline. Do you believe shoppers concern themselves with the fact that Food Lion is subsidiary of a Belgium company? I suspect that most Americans, in their everyday lives, don’t care where their favorite companies are situated, because intuitively they understand the benefits of trade.


In politics, we have a different story. Voters are susceptible to crass nationalistic – in this case, isolationist – economic appeals. So here we are. In a world where so-called centrists demand loyalty oaths.


This week, Brookings Institution released a study that found American entrepreneurship was slowing – dying out, is probably a more accurate way to describe it. Considering what’s gone on, it’s not surprising that companies are looking for relief from convoluted regulatory schemes and high taxes. But this obsession over inversion – what The Joint Commission on Taxation estimates “costs” the IRS around $20 billion over a decade – is only a reflection of how frivolous and small the Democrats’ economic agenda has become.


As far as patriotism, it’s typically defined as a devotion to one’s country and a concern for its welfare. While people are free to argue that Tea Party types misunderstand or misappropriate the Constitution, at the very least they’ve hitched themselves to a patriotism that is tangentially related to some form of recognizable American idealism. If Alter is right, and our “deepest sense of who we are” really entails whining about tax receipts of multinational companies, then we’re probably in bigger trouble than I think.


Follow David Harsanyi on Twitter.

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #71 on: August 05, 2014, 08:04:30 PM »
No they don't

But you always say they do

That never changes

Wait, what?????

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #72 on: August 05, 2014, 09:20:04 PM »
Look mother fu#$ker, if you can't some how constructively contribute to this thread then get the fuck out. You've proven you can't defend any issue in any thread. How about you making an attempt to answer the questions. 

I can't dumb the truth down low enough so that it can be spoon fed to an idiot like you.

But that is your problem, not mine.

LurkerNoMore

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #73 on: August 05, 2014, 09:21:35 PM »
Good luck with that.  I don't think he's interested in anything other than calling you and Soul Crusher names. 

It isn't an insult if it is the truth.    ::)

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Re: Dem's vs GOP on economics.
« Reply #74 on: August 05, 2014, 09:46:37 PM »
I can't dumb the truth down low enough so that it can be spoon fed to an idiot like you.

But that is your problem, not mine.

You can't Answer the question you irritating little fuck. Admit it.