Author Topic: AAS Muscle memory  (Read 3126 times)

foodie

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AAS Muscle memory
« on: August 24, 2014, 12:59:32 PM »
New member here. Something I've been wondering, does heavy AAS use create a sort of "foundation" that doesn't really go away? Don't talk about tom prince or others who've stopped training entirely because of health problems. Reason I'm asking is that I know an older guy who competed in the 80s, he recently started a cycle again after like a 20+ year layoff and has exploded really fast. Makes me wonder if it's beneficial to juice heavily for a couple of years while young (while your body can still handle it) and then drop to HRT doses and blast for a month or two each year after that. 

BB

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2014, 01:06:15 PM »
Yes, that happens. It also resets the genetic limit in steroid users that go completely clean, not a huge amount, but a little.

Wiggs

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2014, 01:12:19 PM »
Good first post. Welcome.
7

anabolichalo

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #3 on: August 24, 2014, 01:13:59 PM »
REALLY DOUBT IT

cam off steroids once and all my gains vanished within weeks

ENZO

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #4 on: August 24, 2014, 01:19:54 PM »
My theory

A natural body builder has a hard time stretching the fascia where the steroid user in moderate to high dose gets his muscle extra volumized with fluid and gets great pumps leading to muscle growth via stretching the fascia that surrounds the muscle allowing new fibers to grow and fill in. Like a ballon its hard to blow up the first time but once it gets blown up over and over its is easier each time.

foodie

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2014, 01:27:38 PM »
My theory

A natural body builder has a hard time stretching the fascia where the steroid user in moderate to high dose gets his muscle extra volumized with fluid and gets great pumps leading to muscle growth via stretching the fascia that surrounds the muscle allowing new fibers to grow and fill in. Like a ballon its hard to blow up the first time but once it gets blown up over and over its is easier each time.

Do you think I should blast for say a year straight and then cruise after that? or am I just being a retard. I'm at the point where I've decided that I need to juice hard, or just quit and do yoga or swimming or something else like that 

Hulkotron

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #6 on: August 24, 2014, 01:28:56 PM »
Do you think I should blast for say a year straight and then cruise after that? or am I just being a retard. I'm at the point where I've decided that I need to juice hard, or just quit and do yoga or swimming or something else like that  

A working mastery of electricity should be your foremost concern friend.

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #7 on: August 24, 2014, 01:33:28 PM »
No need for theories. This has been answered by science. The East Germans recorded it first. After steroid discontinuation the athletes performance was still better than before steroids. Now we know the nuclei stay after steroid discontinuation.

Read this: https://www.sciencenews.org/article/steroids-boost-muscles-long-haul

When muscles were worked three months after the steroid treatment stopped, the muscle mass of animals that previously took testosterone bounced back right away, bulking up 31 percent in the first six days. Mice that never took steroids only added about 6 percent to their muscle mass during that time.

We still don't know how many years the nuclei last, but it may make sense to do a cycle every decade...


ENZO

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #8 on: August 24, 2014, 01:39:38 PM »
Do you think I should blast for say a year straight and then cruise after that? or am I just being a retard. I'm at the point where I've decided that I need to juice hard, or just quit and do yoga or swimming or something else like that 

What's your use history?

BB

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #9 on: August 24, 2014, 01:41:00 PM »
The fellow that does a lot of work on these matters name is Anders Eriksson -



http://www.ltu.se/research/subjects/halsovetenskap/Nyheter-och-aktuellt/Dopningsexperten-lutar-at-livstid-1.110628?l=en

http://umu.diva-portal.org/smash/record.jsf?pid=diva2:144813

If you google him, you'll get his work and others on the subject. It's been a while, but it was interesting reading.

dustin

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #10 on: August 24, 2014, 01:45:58 PM »
Over a year off juice and I blew back up in a week even leaner. I think three base remains there and that healthy body can bounce back. Just don't punish your body with drugs. People go overboard just for plastic trophies. I don't understand the rush, you can go less drugs and take a little more time.

Too much insecurity in this sport. I shrunk down and took it on the chin. Big whoop, life goes on. Stick the needle in your ass and you're big again, just be healthy and don't go nuts.

Simple Simon

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #11 on: August 24, 2014, 01:47:18 PM »
My theory

A natural body builder has a hard time stretching the fascia where the steroid user in moderate to high dose gets his muscle extra volumized with fluid and gets great pumps leading to muscle growth via stretching the fascia that surrounds the muscle allowing new fibers to grow and fill in. Like a ballon its hard to blow up the first time but once it gets blown up over and over its is easier each time.
Thats a pretty good explanation.

 ;D

foodie

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #12 on: August 24, 2014, 01:49:51 PM »
What's your use history?


I have done one 7 week cycle of test e, 500 mg a week. Blew up like crazy with minimal fat and water gain. No sides: no gyno, hair loss, mood swings, ball shrinkage, etc. but slowly shrank back down to my pre-cycle state over the 6-month post cycle period. no post-cycle crash at all. But I'm thinking that I need to use heavier doses for longer to kind of "solidify" the gains somewhat before coming off

ENZO

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #13 on: August 24, 2014, 02:05:08 PM »
I have done one 7 week cycle of test e, 500 mg a week. Blew up like crazy with minimal fat and water gain. No sides: no gyno, hair loss, mood swings, ball shrinkage, etc. but slowly shrank back down to my pre-cycle state over the 6-month post cycle period. no post-cycle crash at all. But I'm thinking that I need to use heavier doses for longer to kind of "solidify" the gains somewhat before coming off

Personally I don't come OFF because from my own experience I feel it puts me 10 steps back. I cruise on low dose test with HCG between cycles. Straight blasting a year straight is unnecessary and can lead to damage. Get blood work and let the results help map out what you're doing

foodie

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #14 on: August 24, 2014, 02:07:37 PM »
Personally I don't come OFF because from my own experience I feel it puts me 10 steps back. I cruise on low dose test with HCG between cycles. Straight blasting a year straight is unnecessary and can lead to damage. Get blood work and let the results help map out what you're doing

I was reading galeniko's book, was thinking of trying out his 500mg of test for a year method

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #15 on: August 24, 2014, 02:09:55 PM »
I was reading galeniko's book, was thinking of trying out his 500mg of test for a year method

I believe that was the upper bound. He was an advocate of 250/week for a year.

Simple Simon

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #16 on: August 24, 2014, 02:11:58 PM »
Personally I don't come OFF because from my own experience I feel it puts me 10 steps back. I cruise on low dose test with HCG between cycles. Straight blasting a year straight is unnecessary and can lead to damage. Get blood work and let the results help map out what you're doing
This
Whats the point of fucking around trying to get your test levels back to normal and then going right back on again?

Kwon_2

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #17 on: August 24, 2014, 02:27:43 PM »

trapz101

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #18 on: August 24, 2014, 07:51:53 PM »
REALLY DOUBT IT

cam off steroids once and all my gains vanished within weeks

this....
T

dustin

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #19 on: August 24, 2014, 10:17:07 PM »
This
Whats the point of fucking around trying to get your test levels back to normal and then going right back on again?

I did the on/off jig and realized there's no point in coming off. Just go on a low dose, mind your health every now and again and then go hard for however long your body can handle it.

Coming off entirely is a bigger waste of time than anything. Don't go on if you figure you'll be going off any time soon. People don't understand this or try thinking they'll be some sort of exception and can cycle on and off... they end up in disappointment.

Lord Chronos

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #20 on: August 25, 2014, 03:26:50 AM »
New member here. Something I've been wondering, does heavy AAS use create a sort of "foundation" that doesn't really go away? Don't talk about tom prince or others who've stopped training entirely because of health problems. Reason I'm asking is that I know an older guy who competed in the 80s, he recently started a cycle again after like a 20+ year layoff and has exploded really fast. Makes me wonder if it's beneficial to juice heavily for a couple of years while young (while your body can still handle it) and then drop to HRT doses and blast for a month or two each year after that. 

Yes, even a single course of steroids will have a permanent effect.

Steroids have been shown to rapidly increase the recruitment of satellite cells into muscle tissue. Once these cells have been converted to muscles cells they will not revert back. The rate at which the body without steroids can recruit these cells is much slower.

As we know when you come off, you loose much of the size, however there are residual gains that are kept. Assuming you have not shut down your own test levels through many cycles, you should be able to train and maintain some of these gains.
Most people ruin their test levels, so whilst their recruit additional satellite cells into the muscle, they loose muscle mass due to having test levels lower than when they started steroids.

anabolichalo

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #21 on: August 25, 2014, 03:29:13 AM »
I did the on/off jig and realized there's no point in coming off. Just go on a low dose, mind your health every now and again and then go hard for however long your body can handle it.

Coming off entirely is a bigger waste of time than anything. Don't go on if you figure you'll be going off any time soon. People don't understand this or try thinking they'll be some sort of exception and can cycle on and off... they end up in disappointment.
so true

i came off once for 6 weeks and i was falling apart by the days

ProudVirgin69

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #22 on: August 25, 2014, 06:17:39 AM »
This
Whats the point of fucking around trying to get your test levels back to normal and then going right back on again?

It feels good for some to slim down and not think about bodybuilding.  I juice from February to September or so...the rest of the year, I just do mostly cardio instead and eat a "normal" diet.

Definitely not the best approach for optimal gains, but it's enough for me

anabolichalo

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #23 on: August 25, 2014, 06:21:56 AM »
It feels good for some to slim down and not think about bodybuilding.  I juice from February to September or so...the rest of the year, I just do mostly cardio instead and eat a "normal" diet.

Definitely not the best approach for optimal gains, but it's enough for me
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Mr. MB

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Re: AAS Muscle memory
« Reply #24 on: August 25, 2014, 01:03:13 PM »
After several years  of training really heavy while on AAS then you drop down to HRT levels you will maintain most/not all of your gains. That is if you continue to train with the same assisted heavy ass weights. The hard part will be the pain and slower recovery. Keeping your nitrogen intake off the wall, super hydration, and scheduled rest/recovery will be paramount. With the use of AAS and lifting heavy ass weights you have developed new corpuscles and nerve pathways which will not go away. The fascia has been stretched and if kept full it will not thicken/harden. 
I was able to do this for about 3 years until my central nervous system could no longer take the stress. During that time I competed natural and passed all the criteria (except the natural for life shows) and was always challenged with a second lie detector test and/or urine sample.