Random Bodybuilding Pics

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[NarcissisticDeity]

 

[pamith]

Holy crap her shoulders are so wide, guys are jealous

[Methyl m1ke]

Escrima told me that nobody trained harder than Dorian. I personally witnessed that this was not the case. Well, at least it wasn't the case when I witnessed Casey Viator do his work set on the Nautilus pullover versus Dorian's set on the the exact same machine (The 70's chain version). Now, Dorian is my top three favorite bber of all time, and I consider the best that has ever competed. Better than Ronnie. So I hesitate to criticize the greatest of all time, especially when it comes to his back which was also the greatest of all time.

First, Dorian does not do the movement as intended. He hunches forward instead of lifting his chest up which will allow him to draw his elbows as far back as possible enabling a full contraction. He does five concentric reps and three forced reps. In comparison, Casey, did 7 positive reps very strictly stretching back so far that I thought he dislocated his shoulders on the first rep. And with his chest up he drove his elbows well past his hips. This was follow by 3 very intense forced reps, much like Dorian's forced reps, and then this was taken further by doing another three very slow negatives, he attempted a fourth but could control the descent before the spotter caught him so I didnt count it. 

Casey couldn't match Dorian's grunting and groaning but I do believe he took the set further than Dorian did measured objectively.

Dorian trained brutally hard, and more importantly, consistently hard but I think he's a little dillusonal when he said that no one trained as hard as he did because it simply was not possible for a human being to train harder than he did.

Its a shit machine to start with as using a dumbell is far superior.

Attempting to gauge how intense Dorian trained by watching one single workout on a video is absurd. Im surprised you would make this mistake.

People talk about how hard Ronnie trained and only because Ive been using his split will I agree. Ronnie Coleman is, to date, at least the first bodybuilder to nearly perfect bodybuilding training. Given the poundages he consistently worked with is way beyond what I would think a human was capable of steroids or not.

[Methyl m1ke]

Not yet. The North Americans are soon.

Im speechless. With a better chest we have Mr Olympia for a stretch and he doesnt even have a pro card? That is unreal. Good for him. I hope he doesnt burn out. 

Second opinion this kid strikes me as likeable his physique screams modest genetics and lots of drugs. But thats every bber nowadays right. Looks like he overdiets or something. His physique looks better at heavier weight. Much better. Good luck to him.

[ArnoldPlatz]

1986 mo lh

[pellius]

Its a shit machine to start with as using a dumbell is far superior.

Attempting to gauge how intense Dorian trained by watching one single workout on a video is absurd. Im surprised you would make this mistake.

People talk about how hard Ronnie trained and only because Ive been using his split will I agree. Ronnie Coleman is, to date, at least the first bodybuilder to nearly perfect bodybuilding training. Given the poundages he consistently worked with is way beyond what I would think a human was capable of steroids or not.

Why is the dumbbell more effective when the lats only get resistance on the bottom, 25%, stretched part of the movement? The Nautilus pullover gives you resistance throughout the full range of motion. Look at the elbows/upper arms. There is no resistance on the back by the time the dumbell is above the chest. Full contraction is impossible. That's the problem with free weights. The resistance is controlled by gravity. Only up and down. Your joints work in a rotary fashion so Jones' designed his machines to provide resistance in a rotary fashion providing full range resistance.

It may be a shit machine to you but most people don't perform it correctly and pull with their hands rather than drive back with their elbows. It simulates the exact motion of the underhand pulldown (again look at the elbow/upper arms and the plane of motion) except it provides resistance throughout the entire range of motion, and eliminates the forearms and biceps from the movement which Jones' considered "weak links" which prevented fully exhausting the much larger and stronger muscles of the back. It was Dorian's favorite and built one of the best, if not the best, back on the planet. Not a shit movement for one of the greatest bbers ever who was known for his back.

I try be precise with my words. I had hope that I made it clear that I said that I concluded that Casey did his set of Pullover with more intensity that Dorian did. Again, this one set. I never concluded from that that he trained consistently more intensely than Dorian did. That I can't possibly know.

No, I am not talking about strength. Of course Dorian was much bigger and stronger than Casey ever was. I am saying in this particular case, Casey trained harder than Dorian. He took the set much further.

I don't know what makes you think Casey couldn't hang with Dorian. If Dorian's partner could why not Casey? Certainly Sergio Olivia couldn't "hang" with Casey went he first went to Florida. Elington Darden describe how Sergio couldn't complete the quad routine in the manner that Casey did and just collapse to the floor and didn't move for several minutes.  I would also imagine that Sergio, not only being much bigger, but was stronger than Casey.

[herne]

.

[Methyl m1ke]

Why is the dumbbell more effective when the lats only get resistance on the bottom, 25%, stretched part of the movement? The Nautilus pullover gives you resistance throughout the full range of motion. Look at the elbows/upper arms. There is no resistance on the back by the time the dumbell is above the chest. Full contraction is impossible. That's the problem with free weights. The resistance is controlled by gravity. Only up and down. Your joints work in a rotary fashion so Jones' designed his machines to provide resistance in a rotary fashion providing full range resistance.

It may be a shit machine to you but most people don't perform it correctly and pull with their hands rather than drive back with their elbows. It simulates the exact motion of the underhand pulldown (again look at the elbow/upper arms and the plane of motion) except it provides resistance throughout the entire range of motion, and eliminates the forearms and biceps from the movement which Jones' considered "weak links" which prevented fully exhausting the much larger and stronger muscles of the back. It was Dorian's favorite and built one of the best, if not the best, back on the planet. Not a shit movement for one of the greatest bbers ever who was known for his back.

I try be precise with my words. I had hope that I made it clear that I said that I concluded that Casey did his set of Pullover with more intensity that Dorian did. Again, this one set. I never concluded from that that he trained consistently more intensely than Dorian did. That I can't possibly know.

Dumbell pullovers are the equivalent of squats for the upper body. Ive gone over this before. They are the lats stretch position exercise. POF training is what we are talking here. Ronnie nasser dorian arnold id imagine lee haney all did them with great results. They are the well kept secret of the greats as far as back training goes. And i know for a fact dorian did not exclusively use the machine as he tore his left triceps before the olympia doing what? Barbell pullover and press (im not exactly sure what that it is exactly.)

Anyway yeah dumbell pullovers if done properly will do things to you that you will not believe.

You said "Dorian trained brutally hard, and more importantly, consistently hard but I think he's a little dillusonal when he said that no one trained as hard as he did because it simply was not possible for a human being to train harder than he did."

I said what i did because your assertion is that, based on watching one video of one workout per bodypart, you see Dorian as delusional. You are making a few mistakes in ypur thinking. Firstly what Dorian said was he knew no one was working harder at the sport 100% of the time than him because it was not humanly possible to do so. He was talking his perfect meal consumption perfect sleep schedule perfect workouts. He mentions how he had a great workout every time he trained for over ten years. He got the most he could from every rep of every set for over ten years. Think about that. The consistency and dedication eschewing the rest of your life for one single goal or purpose for over ten years is unreal. So i agree with his assertion.

Second, once again, you saw viator take one set tp what appeared to you to be deeper into total muscular failure than what you saw on the video but you arent Dorian Yates and you have no idea what he was feeling doing his set. A genetic hallmark of top pro bbers is their ability to recruit greater numbers of muscle fibers than most at any given time. And we are talking the mount rushmore of bodybuilding training here, Dorian took us through his workouts but we can never know what he was feeling but it can be presumed he left nothing behind. If he says his own words are that it was IMPOSSIBLE to train harder i believe him and i dont give a fuck about casey viator or arthur jones or whatever the fuck. Dorian has credibility in my eyes and what he says i take as gospel.

Also and ive said this before and its slightly off topic but as much a fan of Yates as I am Ronnie eclipsed him badly. Someone, i dont know who, taught that man how to train. His split, which is rarely talked about and when it is is always badly butchered, is off the scales. I know exactly how he got as big and strong as he did and his dedication amd work ethic is breathtaking. I consider myself to be blessed to actually have figured out what he did and like I said, it is amazing.

[joswift]

Its a shit machine to start with as using a dumbell is far superior.

Attempting to gauge how intense Dorian trained by watching one single workout on a video is absurd. Im surprised you would make this mistake.

People talk about how hard Ronnie trained and only because Ive been using his split will I agree. Ronnie Coleman is, to date, at least the first bodybuilder to nearly perfect bodybuilding training. Given the poundages he consistently worked with is way beyond what I would think a human was capable of steroids or not.

perfected bodybuilding training?

Guy fucking destroyed himself, you really think those 2 reps with 800lb on his back improved his legs to any degree?

[Methyl m1ke]

perfected bodybuilding training?

Guy fucking destroyed himself, you really think those 2 reps with 800lb on his back improved his legs to any degree?

Of course they did. As an aside his back problems which ended his career came from him slipping a disk in 96. Im not sure if anything could be done at that point to prevent future damage. I asked a friend who is knowledgeable could he have gotten so big without training like he did he said lol heck no. I also asked did the heavy training destroy his body he said yes and could he have prrvented that damage while still lifting super heavy he said no. He said Ronnies form was actually very very good and that the damage was inevitable.

You are one of those incapable of appreciating and admiring the man for giving everything he had to the sport you supposedly love. I think thats sad but you have a right to your own opinion. Shame I have to hear it, again and again.

[joswift]

Of course they did. As an aside his back problems which ended his career came from him slipping a disk in 96. Im not sure if anything could be done at that point to prevent future damage. I asked a friend who is knowledgeable could he have gotten so big without training like he did he said lol heck no. I also asked did the heavy training destroy his body he said yes and could he have prrvented that damage while still lifting super heavy he said no. He said Ronnies form was actually very very good and that the damage was inevitable.

You are one of those incapable of appreciating and admiring the man for giving everything he had to the sport you supposedly love. I think thats sad but you have a right to your own opinion. Shame I have to hear it, again and again.

You really think 1 rep max and 2 reps risk reward ratio is worth it while bodybuilding, look at Vince Taylor, Arnold Classic winner 3rd in the Olympia uses moderate weights and high reps, you really think if he had fucked about under 700lbs for squats he would have made significantly more gains?

Oh, and hes fit and well and in fantastic shape today, the only guys who are fucked up are the ego lifters

[Methyl m1ke]

You really think 1 rep max and 2 reps risk reward ratio is worth it while bodybuilding, look at Vince Taylor, Arnold Classic winner 3rd in the Olympia uses moderate weights and high reps, you really think if he had fucked about under 700lbs for squats he would have made significantly more gains?

Oh, and hes fit and well and in fantastic shape today, the only guys who are fucked up are the ego lifters

Vince taylor did well with the genetic package he had to work with. Ronnie was always strong and his genetics gave him the option to anything he wanted. He chose to take his body to and past its limits, for US. This is why I dont find your perspective particularly useful or appropriate. I also dont see any correlation between the relative physical health of either man today as being relevant to my assertion:that Ronnie Coleman nearly perfected bodybuilding training. He did and you cannot say otherwise the only thing you seem to care about knocking the man for doing what he wanted to do. I very much appreciate his sacrifice and if i had the chance i would do exactly what he did. Then again i love my sport i would die for it i would trade places with Ronnie in a second if i could. You wouldnt and thats fine but it is shameful for you to come to a bodybuilding forum and knock the greatest bodybuilder all time for doing what he had to do to be the best.

[joswift]

Vince taylor did well with the genetic package he had to work with. Ronnie was always strong and his genetics gave him the option to anything he wanted. He chose to take his body to and past its limits, for US. This is why I dont find your perspective particularly useful or appropriate. I also dont see any correlation between the relative physical health of either man today as being relevant to my assertion:that Ronnie Coleman nearly perfected bodybuilding training. He did and you cannot say otherwise the only thing you seem to care about knocking the man for doing what he wanted to do. I very much appreciate his sacrifice and if i had the chance i would do exactly what he did. Then again i love my sport i would die for it i would trade places with Ronnie in a second if i could. You wouldnt and thats fine but it is shameful for you to come to a bodybuilding forum and knock the greatest bodybuilder all time for doing what he had to do to be the best.

Die for the sport???

Jeez, thats one dumb statement

And to trade places with someone who is in pain 24/7 and a cripple is pretty stupid.

By the way, have you ever posted pics, I would love to see what you determination and devotion to the sport had achieved.

[escrima]

Die for the sport???

Jeez, thats one dumb statement

And to trade places with someone who is in pain 24/7 and a cripple is pretty stupid.

By the way, have you ever posted pics, I would love to see what you determination and devotion to the sport had achieved.

yeah we still have Pellius posting 10+ year old pictures
even giving training advices when it made him a cripple
really is a Joke

[bigbychoices]

     Im tired of this bullshit talk about casey training harder than dorian or anyone else.  casey himself even said that "ARNOLDS PRE CONTEST TRAINING WOULD KILL ANYONE ELSE"  or something to that effect.  people dont realize how hard arnold trained and for longer amounts of time.  casey did not  repeat DID NOT train like jones and the mags wrote about. he trained like every other bodybuilder on the planet. more sets more reps more exercises.  guys would go to positive failure and sometimes forced reps but not on every exercise of every set.  anything near training like jones wanted would destroy anyone minds and nervous system ( maybe thats what happened to mentzer) the body can not recover from that and by the time it has recovered you  lost what ever you thought you were going to gain from it. you simply can not rest  so long between bodyparts or workouts the muscles will not grow. proven that after 96 hours the muscles start returning to normal.  smh so go ahead and train every 7 to 10 days. get injuries and keep looking like a concentration camp victim .  AND another thing the pullover is not as great as pullovers. not even close. I have one. and no matter how you use it it just does NOT compare to pullovers. also there is little to no need to work a muscle thru "a full range of motion" if your trying to build muscles.  ever see pros train? they dont do full range they do basically half or 3/4ths. they use the biggest part of the muscle and use the max weight they can. it hits the bulk of the muscle.  so go ahead and start saying all kind of text book crap you have read upon. i go by real world results. remember text books ( pdr and others) used to say steroids did not work.  dont believe what you read or taught. go with results

[escrima]

Why is the dumbbell more effective when the lats only get resistance on the bottom, 25%, stretched part of the movement? The Nautilus pullover gives you resistance throughout the full range of motion. Look at the elbows/upper arms. There is no resistance on the back by the time the dumbell is above the chest. Full contraction is impossible. That's the problem with free weights. The resistance is controlled by gravity. Only up and down. Your joints work in a rotary fashion so Jones' designed his machines to provide resistance in a rotary fashion providing full range resistance.

It may be a shit machine to you but most people don't perform it correctly and pull with their hands rather than drive back with their elbows. It simulates the exact motion of the underhand pulldown (again look at the elbow/upper arms and the plane of motion) except it provides resistance throughout the entire range of motion, and eliminates the forearms and biceps from the movement which Jones' considered "weak links" which prevented fully exhausting the much larger and stronger muscles of the back. It was Dorian's favorite and built one of the best, if not the best, back on the planet. Not a shit movement for one of the greatest bbers ever who was known for his back.

I try be precise with my words. I had hope that I made it clear that I said that I concluded that Casey did his set of Pullover with more intensity that Dorian did. Again, this one set. I never concluded from that that he trained consistently more intensely than Dorian did. That I can't possibly know.

exactly so STFU creepy old man
the height of arrogance is quoting yourself
but you do not need too, no one gives a fuck about your boring rambling on here
take up Golf you retard if your broken body will allow it

[TheGreatOak]

also there is little to no need to work a muscle thru "a full range of motion" if your trying to build muscles.  ever see pros train? they dont do full range they do basically half or 3/4ths. they use the biggest part of the muscle and use the max weight they can. it hits the bulk of the muscle.

Interesting. If you watch some pro's like Dexter train, they do sometimes do half or quarter reps... and you can't deny the progress they've made.

Thing is, Arnold always did full reps. Even when cheat curling a heavy barbell, always started from full extension.

I feel Arnold training through a full ROM got him the best results possible but do find your concept of quarter reps training the 'bulk' of the muscle interesting.

[joswift]

Interesting. If you watch some pro's like Dexter train, they do sometimes do half or quarter reps... and you can't deny the progress they've made.

Thing is, Arnold always did full reps. Even when cheat curling a heavy barbell, always started from full extension.

I feel Arnold training through a full ROM got him the best results possible but do find your concept of quarter reps training the 'bulk' of the muscle interesting.

its best to incorporate all the ranges, do the first reps full range then finish with shorter reps

[bigbychoices]

 even in pumping iron big louie tells his dad "dont let me complete a full rep" on the incline. and watch his training.  shoulder presses and inclines he never did a full rep. the bulk of the muscle only does so much then other smaller muscles take over.  example is any press. triceps take over after about 3/4 of a rep. back exercises the biceps take over after about 3/4 of a rep. so if you want to build muscle hit the bulk of it with heavy basic exercises for 3/4 of a rep and always include 1 isolation exercise and do full reps to pump the blood in there.

[Titus Pullo]

Bigbychoice,

You speak with a very authoritative tone in your knowledge of how all these guys trained.  What do you say to the people who personally witnessed Viator and the Mentzer brothers training just as advertised back in the 70s? 

No, they didn't do one hard set per body part and run from the gym for weeks on end before coming back   Mike told me his best gains were from training each muscle roughly thrice in a two week period, a'la Frank Calta's split.  Mike said he averaged from 3-6 failure sets per muscle group.  Dave Mass was witness to these sessions and could confirm what Mike said.  If the late Keith "onlyme" were still here, may God rest his soul, he would confirm that Ray was a HIT fanatic.

Did Mike, Dave and Keith all lie?  To be sure, Casey DID go super-volume for the Olympia he should have won ('82?).  He explained that to Brian D. Johnston in an interview 20 years or so later, noting that he (Casey) thought it was necessary to "grossly overtrain" to get the cuts needed to win an Olympia in the post-Zane era.

There is also the fundamental question:  what IS HIT?  Back in Tom Prince's arrogant, drug-induced heydey, he once said, "I talked to Dorian, and he said he didn't 'do' HIT."  Setting aside the fact Tom was a Nubain addict and notorious liar, even if we take the quote at face value, AGAIN:  what does HIT mean?  Dorian obviously trained according to most definitions of high-intensity training.  If he really said that to Tom, could Dorian have meant he didn't do the old Art Jones routines?

Context, context, context. 

Before anyone says I think HIT in any form is some panacea, no, I certainly do not.  Various forms of it worked for me, but before I got sick, I wish I had experimented more with other methods.  I recognize the utility of higher volume, very heavy training and I know that, when I was "enhanced," Gironda-style lifting was also useful.  I was gravitating toward some of the latter before my illness and I liked it for shoulders and arms; sadly, the experiment was cut short : /

[pellius]

yeah we still have Pellius posting 10+ year old pictures
even giving training advices when it made him a cripple
really is a Joke

LOL. Coming from someone too ashamed and cowardly to post his own picture.

I tell you what, my little bitch, I post a pic taken today if you do the same. Deal? Yeah, I thought so. This when you slink away in silence and shame.

And you know very well that my injuries had nothing to do with weight training. I've never injure myself in the gym. Never. But you know that and it just goes to show how desperate you are that you have to tell a bald face lie.

That's why I keep destroying you in these exchanges. I tell the truth. I back up what I say. And I don't sound like I barely made it through the third grade. When compared to me you are such an inferior human being by every measure.

You're the joke.

[epic is back]

Die for the sport???

Jeez, thats one dumb statement

And to trade places with someone who is in pain 24/7 and a cripple is pretty stupid.

By the way, have you ever posted pics, I would love to see what you determination and devotion to the sport had achieved.

never in your life try to criticize a champion

you know nothing about it

he did what he did and lives as a champion. bodies dont last forever

what do you have to be proud of?

jizzfit

[pellius]

Dumbell pullovers are the equivalent of squats for the upper body. Ive gone over this before. They are the lats stretch position exercise. POF training is what we are talking here. Ronnie nasser dorian arnold id imagine lee haney all did them with great results. They are the well kept secret of the greats as far as back training goes. And i know for a fact dorian did not exclusively use the machine as he tore his left triceps before the olympia doing what? Barbell pullover and press (im not exactly sure what that it is exactly.)

Anyway yeah dumbell pullovers if done properly will do things to you that you will not believe.

You said "Dorian trained brutally hard, and more importantly, consistently hard but I think he's a little dillusonal when he said that no one trained as hard as he did because it simply was not possible for a human being to train harder than he did."

I said what i did because your assertion is that, based on watching one video of one workout per bodypart, you see Dorian as delusional. You are making a few mistakes in ypur thinking. Firstly what Dorian said was he knew no one was working harder at the sport 100% of the time than him because it was not humanly possible to do so. He was talking his perfect meal consumption perfect sleep schedule perfect workouts. He mentions how he had a great workout every time he trained for over ten years. He got the most he could from every rep of every set for over ten years. Think about that. The consistency and dedication eschewing the rest of your life for one single goal or purpose for over ten years is unreal. So i agree with his assertion.

Second, once again, you saw viator take one set tp what appeared to you to be deeper into total muscular failure than what you saw on the video but you arent Dorian Yates and you have no idea what he was feeling doing his set. A genetic hallmark of top pro bbers is their ability to recruit greater numbers of muscle fibers than most at any given time. And we are talking the mount rushmore of bodybuilding training here, Dorian took us through his workouts but we can never know what he was feeling but it can be presumed he left nothing behind. If he says his own words are that it was IMPOSSIBLE to train harder i believe him and i dont give a fuck about casey viator or arthur jones or whatever the fuck. Dorian has credibility in my eyes and what he says i take as gospel.

Also and ive said this before and its slightly off topic but as much a fan of Yates as I am Ronnie eclipsed him badly. Someone, i dont know who, taught that man how to train. His split, which is rarely talked about and when it is is always badly butchered, is off the scales. I know exactly how he got as big and strong as he did and his dedication amd work ethic is breathtaking. I consider myself to be blessed to actually have figured out what he did and like I said, it is amazing.

You make the blanket statement that dumbell pullover is the squat of the upper body. Why? Squats stress a lot of muscles and cause systemic exhaustion like no other exercise with the possible exception of deadlifts. Dumbbell pullovers are easy and doesn't exhaust you and only trains few muscles, none of them efficiently. It's mostly good for a lat stretch. By the time your arms start to become perpendicular to the floor the resistance of the lats are gone and moves over to the chest and triceps in an isometric fashion. This should be very obvious just by looking at the movement and even more so when doing it. That's why some use the pullover on back day and some, like Jay Cutler, use it on chest day. And what's this nonsense about the dumbbell pullover being a "well kept secret"? When has any exercise been a secret? Some people use them some don't. The idea that there was some collusion to keep that particular movement a secret is beyond laughable. And it's no great insight to claim that Dorian didn't use exclusively machines. When has anybody made this claim? Especially since the net is replete with photos and videos of Dorian using barbells and dumbbells and has never made any secret it about it. Acting like you have some special insight on the obvious doesn't really help your credibility.

It's not that difficult to do the dumbbell pullover properly. It is with the Nautilus pullover. Almost everybody I've ever seen use it pulls with their hands. When I had access to it I wouldn't even grab the bar with my hands. The only thing touching the pads were my elbows. It's too tempting to pull with your hands when you are squeezing out those reps. You make it sound like it's some kind of magic exercise and will do things I would not believe. Following joswift's lead, because we both believe that proof is in the pudding, can you show us a pic of this unbelievable result you got?

My claim that Dorian is using a bit of hyperbole that he "knows" nobody trained harder than he did because it just isn't possible. I don't base that on one workout. I've seen tons of his workouts. But I don't base that no matter how many workouts he's had. I base that on the belief that he cannot possibly know how hard others have trained. Dex says no one is as disciplined as he is. Patz was to the death training. In one of his youtube videos in Dorian's notes he specifically commented on how he had a shitty workout. The idea that he had a perfect, let alone good, most intense workout, where "every rep" he got the most out of everytime over the course of ten years is just hyperbolic nonsense that even he wouldn't claim. Dorian was still just a human and subject to the ebbs and flows, up and downs, of every human being. You can see it by the steady degradation in his physique during his latter years. Tearing muscles is hardly getting the most out of every rep.

Sure, I don't know what Dorian or Casey "feels". So what? If Dorian feels pain more than Casey so what? I can't read minds or chemical body processes going on. Neither can you, I, Dorian, Casey or anybody. What I can observe is what is actually done. Whereas Dorian stopped after 3 sloppy forced reps, Casey continued with more reps all the way to eccentric failure where it was impossible to control the weight anymore.
This is an objective observation. Your bias is painfully obvious. I am a much, much bigger fan of Dorian than Casey but I try to not let my personal feelings get in the way of my judgement. To say that if Dorian says something is "impossible" then he's the final word on the subject and you don't "give a fuck about Casey or Jones or whatever the fuck" is a clear statement that your conclusion is based on emotion and not rational objective thought. Once someone says that this is this and everything else is wrong then the debate is over. No evidence needed. You don't give a "fuck" about evidence and objective evidence. OK, preach on. After my yawn, I'll politely leave the room and hope I meet someone that thinks and makes me think.

It is interesting that you believe that you know "exactly" how Ronnie reached the level that he did. You consider yourself blessed for having such knowledge that has eluded the rest of the world and, more importantly, his competition whose very livelihood depends on it. Again, can you provide us some proof of how this knowledge has blessed you and what the real world results were?

[pellius]

Of course they did. As an aside his back problems which ended his career came from him slipping a disk in 96. Im not sure if anything could be done at that point to prevent future damage. I asked a friend who is knowledgeable could he have gotten so big without training like he did he said lol heck no. I also asked did the heavy training destroy his body he said yes and could he have prrvented that damage while still lifting super heavy he said no. He said Ronnies form was actually very very good and that the damage was inevitable.

You are one of those incapable of appreciating and admiring the man for giving everything he had to the sport you supposedly love. I think thats sad but you have a right to your own opinion. Shame I have to hear it, again and again.

Yep, perfect form. Nice and smooth. All muscular contraction and zero momentum. Since your friend is deemed "knowledgeable" by you then it must be true.