Author Topic: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!  (Read 1132998 times)

obsidian

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 7350
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9825 on: November 10, 2023, 04:15:19 PM »
obsidian, do you trade forex on the regular?
I got into trading futures but only on the ES presently as Im still in learning stages
A super good guy gifted me Jigsaw Trading software and holy, what a huge stepup from watching candles and price action

anyways, Im just curious if you are trading forex or anything else
I am not trading currently because it becomes a tax issue. And I already have enough taxable income fees for 2023 that I don't want to increase via more capital gains transactions. I'll look into that though in 2024. Right now I am content with earning staking yields via Ethereum, Cardano, and BNB. Hopefully I can get some Solana in 2024 - if cash flow will allow it. Or I might have to sell some crypto (and deal with capital gains), to get some Solana exposure. I keep saying I need to get some BTC but am never happy with the ratios and when it does turn favorably I don't make a move either - lol!

I traded a lot in 2017, 2018 & 2020 and spent a lot of time retracing my steps via online tax services to get my cost basis in order. But it was amazing how I could retrace it. I did some weird transactions. For example, I was mining Ethereum on a pool where I needed more hash power. So I swapped some Ethereum and ZCash for BTC via Coinbase / Binance and personal wallets to ShapeShift and ultimately NiceHash. On NiceHash I bought hashing power via BTC - they only accepted Bitcoin. I was able to retrace all those steps, because all the transactions are transparent. A benefit governments surely can appreciate.  There are of course privacy coins that can help conceal transactions - Monero and ZCash for example.

Binance.US btw worked great for me in 2020/2021. Made some nice house money via ETH / Doge swaps.

gib

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5100
  • Getbig!
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9826 on: November 11, 2023, 01:48:46 AM »
We are talking different timelines. You're talking the last 30 days and I'm talking about the last 48 hours.

ETH pumped on spot ETF news and pulled up ETH trading pairs with it. I was watching it happen in real time as I have nothing better to do. Tracked it from the source breaking the news to the masses and then the corresponding price increases.

Yes, you are correct there. However the key point I was making is that the key factor in the short and medium term for any alt, is inflows into BTC. That will be the vast determinant of how any alt performs. For Eth, unlikely any sport ETF would be approved any time soon, but yes an application (which in theory anyone can file) can have influence on sentiment, especially if from a large reputable name in finance.

gib

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5100
  • Getbig!
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9827 on: November 11, 2023, 02:16:51 AM »
He is a BTC Maxi. Nothing will change his mind, even if Ethereum flips Bitcoin's market cap.

Look at the 3 and 5 year returns.

3-YEARS:

BTC  =  +143,94%
ETH  =  +369.19%

5-YEARS:
BTC  =  +355.55%
ETH  =  +347.48%

These numbers can change at any point as we move along the timeline. Look at BNB and Solana! If you bought BNB 3 years ago or 5 years ago your portfolio would have outperformed BTC and ETH by a huge amount! We're talking about a 4.5 - 5.5X over BTC gains! It also outperformed ETH by a huge margin. I have BNB and bought it at $8 and converted some cryptos to BNB over the years. Just wish I bought a lot more when it was that cheap. But tribalism and my ETH tunnel vision prevented that. Yes, some of us also suffer from ETH Maximalism!  ;D

I wish you would read what I posted in this thread so that I do not need to repeat myself.

I could create an alt in 30 seconds, issue 1 Billion tokens, sell one to you for $100, and Boom we got a new alt with a 100 Billion dollar market cap.

BTC maximalism does not mean that you cannot consider securities, whether registered or unregistered, as viable investments. Indeed, if you understood this basic formula, then you could actually make an educated calculation as to the value of many types of alts:

T(1)      1
___  X ___
V(t)      S(t)

However, what BTC is, and what you need to understand, is that BTC is something entirely different from all other alts. Compared to ETH in particular, you need to understand that ETH does not operate on a proof of work model. Further, it is not decentralized. Further, some coins were pre-mined and retained by the issuers. And it was never intended or created to be a store of value as its sole and fundamental function - rather Eth is a token designed to used as a payment for work done supporting its blockchain. You are comparing and conflating 2 entirely different types of technologies.

The vast vast influence on the price of Eth is simply sentiment spillover from Bitcoin, not based on any fundamental valuation based on tokenomics. If you really want an "alt" who's value truly is supported by fundamentals, look into Filecoin. Trust me, you will thank me big time if you buy/hodl Filecoin. But either way, I suggest anyone really needs understand why they would buy anything, beyond just "oh well I think it will go up". Unless you are really just gambling for fun, literally akin to punting at a casino, stick to Bitcoin. Again, you will thank me in the long term.

gib

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5100
  • Getbig!
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9828 on: November 11, 2023, 02:24:48 AM »

Regarding taxes. I do deduct business expenses. But I keep it legit and it is not wise to try and cheat the IRS. If I was not married and had no connections where I live, then sure I would move to a tax haven. But some of us have families or work connections grounding us where we are. If you live in the USA then you will have to pay taxes. Unless you want the IRS up your ass.

Yes, that is the decision we all have to make. Bear in mind, you are being taxed not just on your business profits, but also indirectly via the depreciation of the USD. And the irony of course is that BTC is your defense against that, which you seem worried about buying due to tax implications.

Its very easy to just buy BTC peer to peer, with the IRS being none the wiser. I would strongly urge you to consider doing this.

French

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 1899
  • Solana @ 2000$
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9829 on: November 11, 2023, 10:32:08 AM »
 8)
$

Mayday

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 3019
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9830 on: November 11, 2023, 11:37:39 AM »
I will address a few comments here in a single post.

With all options available in the world today, why on earth would you have structured yourself so that you are paying tax? There is currently zero reason why anyone today should be paying tax, unless they want to.

Blockchain created the ultimate taxation tool. 100% total traceability, totally visible and taxable. It stands against everything BTC maxis push which is to avoid taxes.

Structures to avoid tax are mostly fraudulent. Because there is no upfront test, your structure only gets tested under audit so you don’t know until you test it. The cleanest is to move to a low tax region.

Even the Deloitte partners here pay taxes around 8% if they’re going full on. They all use trusts and pay family members then investment properties drive it lower. But what they don’t tell you is those family members don’t work otherwise they’d be taxed……. so now you’re carrying unemployed people which means you are a top 1% earner in the country. Can’t do that for the 99% who earn fuck all in comparison.

Saylor pushed tax avoidance hard. People followed his advice and went into yielding, the companies went belly up and many lost their coins as a result, like I said it’s mostly fraudulent whether it’s the owner directly or the third party.

Saylor also said he would take debt against collateral to pay for living, his business issued junk bonds which he cannot do anymore so he resulted to diluting shares and has currently fucked over multiple investors…… fraudulent? No. Deceitful? Very. Now people who actually backed his business strategy are -50% down after 3yrs and the guy doesn’t care.

I don’t know of anyone not paying tax on earnings in my country who is over the tax free threshold that isn’t fraudulent. I have heard countless stories of people who thought they were super smart and had a strategy who then got fined or jailed.

gib

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5100
  • Getbig!
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9831 on: November 11, 2023, 11:00:27 PM »
Blockchain created the ultimate taxation tool. 100% total traceability, totally visible and taxable. It stands against everything BTC maxis push which is to avoid taxes..

I disagree.

Yes, every transaction performed with bitcoin is visible on the distributed public ledger known as the blockchain. But there are no identities of anyone recorded on the blockchain.

It is for this reason that BTC is best described as being pseudonymous. However, if you decide to disclose your identity (for example buying via a bank which records the identity of the buyer/seller, then yes, depending on how good the AML / KYC data is which the collected, your identity could be ascertained, and then, depending on how compliant that financial institution is, your data could be passed to tax authorities' in your countries, and then depending on how good their algorithms are, you could be identified as having a tax liability (depending of course on what the applicable tax laws are in your country). As you can see, quite a few dependencies here.

So, if in your country, you are worried about being identified with a transaction, then buy BTC anonymously. Simple. A big chunk of the BTC I hold is in a wallet not in any way identified to me. So no authority knows I own it, and no authority will know if I ever exchange it for any good/service/fiat currency, depending of course on how I make this transaction.

We also have seen the proliferation of BTC privacy tools, such as mixing and tumbling services. And remember, more recently we had the Taproot upgrade which also enables your transactions to stay anonymous. And on top of this, we in any case will see more and more day to day transactions on the Lightening network, which adds a further layer of inability to easily trace transactions on a layer above Bitcoin.

Good basic article on this topic here:

https://www.coincenter.org/education/crypto-regulation-faq/how-anonymous-is-bitcoin/

Basically, how much of your identity you decide to associate with your Bitcoin transactions is up to you.

obsidian

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 7350
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9832 on: November 12, 2023, 02:46:40 AM »
I disagree.

Yes, every transaction performed with bitcoin is visible on the distributed public ledger known as the blockchain. But there are no identities of anyone recorded on the blockchain.

It is for this reason that BTC is best described as being pseudonymous. However, if you decide to disclose your identity (for example buying via a bank which records the identity of the buyer/seller, then yes, depending on how good the AML / KYC data is which the collected, your identity could be ascertained, and then, depending on how compliant that financial institution is, your data could be passed to tax authorities' in your countries, and then depending on how good their algorithms are, you could be identified as having a tax liability (depending of course on what the applicable tax laws are in your country). As you can see, quite a few dependencies here.

So, if in your country, you are worried about being identified with a transaction, then buy BTC anonymously. Simple. A big chunk of the BTC I hold is in a wallet not in any way identified to me. So no authority knows I own it, and no authority will know if I ever exchange it for any good/service/fiat currency, depending of course on how I make this transaction.

We also have seen the proliferation of BTC privacy tools, such as mixing and tumbling services. And remember, more recently we had the Taproot upgrade which also enables your transactions to stay anonymous. And on top of this, we in any case will see more and more day to day transactions on the Lightening network, which adds a further layer of inability to easily trace transactions on a layer above Bitcoin.

Good basic article on this topic here:

https://www.coincenter.org/education/crypto-regulation-faq/how-anonymous-is-bitcoin/

Basically, how much of your identity you decide to associate with your Bitcoin transactions is up to you.
Your proposal is completely unworkable. And I am not moving to some Asian third world to try and avoid paying taxes.

If you plan on holding BTC and never sell it ever then sure, you can hide what you have and never enjoy any of it. Then you might as well buy a painting and put it up on a wall and look at it every year until you die. For people that want to own crypto but also use it down the road to buy whatever is needed there is really no alternative than to come clean with your holdings. Especially if you live in USA, Australia or any other place that requires that you pay taxes. Tax fraud is serious and can land you in the slammer here. How are you going to for example convert $100,000 worth of BTC to fiat? Who will you trust if it is not KYC? How will you explain the $100,000 that ended up in your bank account. If you don't have a bank account, how to you get the fiat? Maybe you get screwed out of your BTC because you went to a back alley?! lol!

For US Citizens, the IRS can show up and ask how you paid for that car, the stereo, the house, your food, etc. The list goes on. Until tax laws change the best most of us can do is deduct legitimate business expenses or hold on to stock or crypt long term to avoid capital gains tax. But in the end you get taxed on it one way or another. My father-in-law has tax free municipal bonds but he's getting a lower interest rate to make up the difference. One way or another you get hit.

gib

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5100
  • Getbig!
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9833 on: November 12, 2023, 06:31:07 AM »
Your proposal is completely unworkable. And I am not moving to some Asian third world to try and avoid paying taxes.

If you plan on holding BTC and never sell it ever then sure, you can hide what you have and never enjoy any of it. Then you might as well buy a painting and put it up on a wall and look at it every year until you die. For people that want to own crypto but also use it down the road to buy whatever is needed there is really no alternative than to come clean with your holdings. Especially if you live in USA, Australia or any other place that requires that you pay taxes. Tax fraud is serious and can land you in the slammer here. How are you going to for example convert $100,000 worth of BTC to fiat? Who will you trust if it is not KYC? How will you explain the $100,000 that ended up in your bank account. If you don't have a bank account, how to you get the fiat? Maybe you get screwed out of your BTC because you went to a back alley?! lol!

For US Citizens, the IRS can show up and ask how you paid for that car, the stereo, the house, your food, etc. The list goes on. Until tax laws change the best most of us can do is deduct legitimate business expenses or hold on to stock or crypt long term to avoid capital gains tax. But in the end you get taxed on it one way or another. My father-in-law has tax free municipal bonds but he's getting a lower interest rate to make up the difference. One way or another you get hit.

Not unworkable at all. I know from the experience of myself and many around me.

First of all, almost anyone in a developed country are there by choice. Even those of us with the misfortune (from a tax perspective) are were born Americans can give up our US citizenship and acquire another. In Asia, you have many choices, including Hong Kong and Singapore (both more commercially and financially sophisticated than Australia). Or you can just structure your time out of a country so you are no longer considered a tax resident.

BTC is meant for HODLing, So yes, what we ALL should be doing is buying BTC and hodling for long term appreciation. Even Chinese who are carefully monitored, store their wealth in BTC. First thing many Chinese do when arriving in HK is to  buy BTC OTC (Over the Counter), with zero ability for anyone, including the CCP, to know the identity of their wallet. From there they can transport their wealth to anywhere in the world as needed (or draw upon it as needed in the future). Again, all totally untracked.

There are obvious advantages with BTC over art or physical gold, including transportability, divisibility, and frictionless liquidity to sell at any time in any amount.

Further, you can chose to live in countries where BTC gains are not taxed (being treated as a capital gain, in a country where there is no capital gains tax). Singapore and HK and New Zealand or Dubai are good examples for you in Asia. And many choices in Europe tax haven countries. You don't need to reside in a tax haven full time. What I do is reside for residency purposes in a tax haven, and then just travel as I wish.

As for converting BTC into fiat, may ways to do it without being identified. I have converted BTC to cash in many countries - All over Asia, Europe, Latin America, including also Australia. Not once have I had a problem. I have a friend who bought an apartment in Thailand with BTC, no questions asked. Another friend bought an apartment in Malta. And a 3rd bought 3 villas in Bali, Indonesia. All with BTC. I have a friend in Ibiza who is a yacht broker. They also do the occasional BTC deals for sales of boats. I also have a Bitcoin Visa card, which I registered in my resident location. I then can fund this with BTC and can spend it anywhere in fiat, no questions asked.

But yes, if you are in a heavily controlled country, then putting 100K into your bank without explaining the source, may result in questions. In my case, if I came to Australia, as a non-resident, I could indeed open a bank acct and deposit 100K in BTC proceeds into it, with zero tax as there was no income earned in Australia. There might however be questions as to the source of the income (and there I of course have appropriate documents I could produce from my accountant that would satisfy that the source of the income is not illicit).

And what if you were in a country, where you would be worried about being scrutinized as to how you acquired certain assets? Well that's easy - when you are ready you go overseas where your money is more welcome and your freedom is greater, in the meantime only spending freely on items that will draw less attention - dinners, clubs, clothing, or become more "creative" in being able to show the source of funds (not that I necessarily recommend that).

The irony here, is that those in highly taxed jurisdictions probably need BTC most, yet may be deterred because of tax laws, and as a result miss out on massive wealth gains as BTC adoption grows. Meanwhile, far less sophisticated people sih as Africans, Asians, Middle East Arabs, Jews, Eastern Europeans are all stacking sats without fear, and will get a massive headstart on the BTC adoption curve.  My advice, is to acquire peer to peer. The more and the sooner, the better. Hodl. In this next cycle I believe we will get another "0" to over 100K by 2025. And then in the cycle after that, I believe we will get to over 1 million in 2029. In the meantime, use your time to be productive in earning an income in the country you reside in, and of course also continue to educate others on BTC. In time, the BTC will increase so very significantly such that the huge gain you have, will be a "nice problem to have" which you won't be complaining about.

SOMEPARTS

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 16628
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9834 on: November 12, 2023, 07:41:12 AM »
I disagree.

Yes, every transaction performed with bitcoin is visible on the distributed public ledger known as the blockchain. But there are no identities of anyone recorded on the blockchain.

It is for this reason that BTC is best described as being pseudonymous. However, if you decide to disclose your identity (for example buying via a bank which records the identity of the buyer/seller, then yes, depending on how good the AML / KYC data is which the collected, your identity could be ascertained, and then, depending on how compliant that financial institution is, your data could be passed to tax authorities' in your countries, and then depending on how good their algorithms are, you could be identified as having a tax liability (depending of course on what the applicable tax laws are in your country). As you can see, quite a few dependencies here.

So, if in your country, you are worried about being identified with a transaction, then buy BTC anonymously. Simple. A big chunk of the BTC I hold is in a wallet not in any way identified to me. So no authority knows I own it, and no authority will know if I ever exchange it for any good/service/fiat currency, depending of course on how I make this transaction.

We also have seen the proliferation of BTC privacy tools, such as mixing and tumbling services. And remember, more recently we had the Taproot upgrade which also enables your transactions to stay anonymous. And on top of this, we in any case will see more and more day to day transactions on the Lightening network, which adds a further layer of inability to easily trace transactions on a layer above Bitcoin.

Good basic article on this topic here:

https://www.coincenter.org/education/crypto-regulation-faq/how-anonymous-is-bitcoin/

Basically, how much of your identity you decide to associate with your Bitcoin transactions is up to you.


LOL

Mayday

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 3019
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9835 on: November 12, 2023, 11:35:13 AM »
I disagree.

Yes, every transaction performed with bitcoin is visible on the distributed public ledger known as the blockchain. But there are no identities of anyone recorded on the blockchain.

It is for this reason that BTC is best described as being pseudonymous. However, if you decide to disclose your identity (for example buying via a bank which records the identity of the buyer/seller, then yes, depending on how good the AML / KYC data is which the collected, your identity could be ascertained, and then, depending on how compliant that financial institution is, your data could be passed to tax authorities' in your countries, and then depending on how good their algorithms are, you could be identified as having a tax liability.

Good basic article on this topic here:

https://www.coincenter.org/education/crypto-regulation-faq/how-anonymous-is-bitcoin/

Basically, how much of your identity you decide to associate with your Bitcoin transactions is up to you.

You are looking too short term.

It’s a ledger for all movements meaning shit you did will always be visible forever. The tax authority just need your name so your assumption is you can be nameless for the rest of your life.

Dude, We have digital identification  coming inside the next 2yrs and you will be visible like a MOFO meaning the odds you get ID squeezed are 100%.

Any exchange to exit to a bank is KYC so you will never be able to off ramp. Defi is going to become KYC. Wallet KYC is also coming. Crypto cards will become KYC once the digital ID comes out. You want to sell P2P you’ll transact with people who are KYC and your wallet address will be visible to all the transactions you did.

Your only option as you get ID squeezed is to go P2P and scour the internet….. but you’ll need to ensure you have VPN 100%….. but for that you can never turn off your PC because it’ll log into Microsoft/Apple and they’ll have your name…. You can never use a mobile device because the imea is registered to you…..

  it’s soooo easy to ping people using on/off ramps and once digital ID for internet is there you won’t be able to access jack ever again. If you do, they’ll have your name, your wallet and 100% of your tax evasion history.

In a nutshell this is the worst time in history for anyone to think they’re going to be ahead of the curve for tax evasion. Just move to a tax haven, if that doesn’t make sense, pay your taxes and move on with life.

gib

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5100
  • Getbig!
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9836 on: November 13, 2023, 01:39:03 AM »
You are looking too short term.

It’s a ledger for all movements meaning shit you did will always be visible forever. The tax authority just need your name so your assumption is you can be nameless for the rest of your life.

Dude, We have digital identification  coming inside the next 2yrs and you will be visible like a MOFO meaning the odds you get ID squeezed are 100%.

Any exchange to exit to a bank is KYC so you will never be able to off ramp. Defi is going to become KYC. Wallet KYC is also coming. Crypto cards will become KYC once the digital ID comes out. You want to sell P2P you’ll transact with people who are KYC and your wallet address will be visible to all the transactions you did.

Your only option as you get ID squeezed is to go P2P and scour the internet….. but you’ll need to ensure you have VPN 100%….. but for that you can never turn off your PC because it’ll log into Microsoft/Apple and they’ll have your name…. You can never use a mobile device because the imea is registered to you…..

  it’s soooo easy to ping people using on/off ramps and once digital ID for internet is there you won’t be able to access jack ever again. If you do, they’ll have your name, your wallet and 100% of your tax evasion history.

In a nutshell this is the worst time in history for anyone to think they’re going to be ahead of the curve for tax evasion. Just move to a tax haven, if that doesn’t make sense, pay your taxes and move on with life.

Mayday - you are right that moving to a tax haven is the easiest solution.

However you are wrong that "It’s a ledger for all movements meaning shit you did will always be visible forever. The tax authority just need your name so your assumption is you can be nameless for the rest of your life."

Again, what they need is both your name, and then to associate that name with private keys. So long as you keep these separate you are fine.

You can use BTC to make a purchase for goods / service or exchange for fiat anywhere in the world. Yes, if you do this via a KYC compliant financial institution in which you are a tax resident, then of course you are risk of being identified. In which case, you either need to go peer to peer, or just spend your Sats safe overseas jurisdictions if you wish to avoid that risk

There as so many ways for you right now to gets Sats and store these safely. Just one example - last time I was in Macau on a boys trip I saw so many mainland Chinese. They use their credit card to buy 100K Rolex's or jewelry. Right next door to these shop there is a shop which "buys back" what they just bought at a 1-2% discount for cash. And right next to that shop is a BTC OTC shop, that allows them to buy Bitcoin, which they store on a hard wallet. They then have the ability to spend this at any time in the future, in any country they with. The BTC they have bought is in no way identifiable to them and can't be seen or seized by the CCP.

You ae a smart guy mate. If those Chinese can figure it out, I am sure you can too.

Either way, I think we can both agree that fear of taxes is not any reason to not buy this incredibly important asset.

Mayday

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 3019
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9837 on: November 13, 2023, 12:26:37 PM »
Mayday - you are right that moving to a tax haven is the easiest solution.

However you are wrong that "It’s a ledger for all movements meaning shit you did will always be visible forever. The tax authority just need your name so your assumption is you can be nameless for the rest of your life."

Again, what they need is both your name, and then to associate that name with private keys. So long as you keep these separate you are fine.

You can use BTC to make a purchase for goods / service or exchange for fiat anywhere in the world. Yes, if you do this via a KYC compliant financial institution in which you are a tax resident, then of course you are risk of being identified. In which case, you either need to go peer to peer, or just spend your Sats safe overseas jurisdictions if you wish to avoid that risk

There as so many ways for you right now to gets Sats and store these safely. Just one example - last time I was in Macau on a boys trip I saw so many mainland Chinese. They use their credit card to buy 100K Rolex's or jewelry. Right next door to these shop there is a shop which "buys back" what they just bought at a 1-2% discount for cash. And right next to that shop is a BTC OTC shop, that allows them to buy Bitcoin, which they store on a hard wallet. They then have the ability to spend this at any time in the future, in any country they with. The BTC they have bought is in no way identifiable to them and can't be seen or seized by the CCP.

You ae a smart guy mate. If those Chinese can figure it out, I am sure you can too.

Either way, I think we can both agree that fear of taxes is not any reason to not buy this incredibly important asset.

That’s the first mistake. Your computer, your household, your wallet. Not providing a password is not solid proof it isn’t yours lol 😂  there was a case which hit the media a while ago involving a drug dealer who had a boatload of BTC. Authorities attempted to force him to give up the keys, he wouldn’t, they chucked him in jail anyway for a long time. It didn’t matter whether he gave the password or not.

We know from a big case of that music file sharing site decades ago Napster, the kids would illegally download music and they charged the Mum because it was her house, her computer. The defence was it was her kid’s friend when he was over and wasn’t her, the court didn’t give a shit and she was guilty of fraud and fined a spastic amount of money. The key part being Obviously it wasn’t the Mum.

So it’ll be your name, your house, your computer, your phone, your iPad…… but your defence will be ‘it’s not mine because I don’t know the password and all my friends use my things…..’ dude that doesn’t stack up in the slightest so don’t even think that passes level 1 criminal minds. Keep in. Mind you are committing fraud even using that defence which is a criminal act in itself.

The other part you outlined of fraud in Macau….. doesn’t really help me if I don’t live in Macau lol 😂 say I buy a Molex for 100k, pawn it for 98k, then what? Buy 98k of groceries? Buy 490 x $200 gift cards for a shops in Macau? I can’t take over 10k Aussie pesos back home. Let’s say I fly over to Maccau, buy a Molex and get my 10k cash, fly home. I don’t have to declare my 10k cash so I stand in line and pray like a drug mule I don’t get picked to be examined.

I’ll get flagged for having cash even if under 10m if they check me so the Odds increase of being picked aside after that increase. So you would vary my amounts between 3k and 10k all claiming gambling. Now I’m spending 3k per trip to bring back 10k which is a 30% tax rate which is what I can pay locally without all this fucking around. The tax frauds will say ‘oh but you get a holiday, eat out and enjoy the money whole there’ no! Just no! Amway and pyramid schemes drive the exact same message ‘it’s tax deductible so it’s awesome’……  no, I wanted laundered tax fraud money, not piss it down the drain because the reality is you can’t get it back home ie the method doesn’t work.

People might argue gift cards or prepaid credit cards can be used, no, you can’t bring back 100k in prepaid credit cards pretending it’s not the same as cash and be a normal citizen. money laundering taskforce will be all over you like a rash.

I can come up with a solid plan no doubt but I’m saying for average people it can’t be done. They’ll fuck it up and get fined or jailed. Tax fraud on as little as 2k here will get you an 8k fine if it’s blatant. Not worth the risk.

tax fraud is not a benefit of Bitcoin. We agree it’s a digital gold.


Schadenfreude

  • Guest
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9838 on: November 15, 2023, 01:54:20 PM »
I missed the bitcoin train. Forever broke. :-\

gib

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5100
  • Getbig!
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9839 on: November 16, 2023, 12:12:06 AM »
I missed the bitcoin train. Forever broke. :-\

You didn't miss it mate. This train will keep going for decades. Get on board now.

When this thread started I advised everyone here to at least get to one coin to secure their future - to become a wholecoiner. At that time a coin was less then USD 5K. Now its 7x that.

BTC is a freedom tool, and that freedom that you get exist no matter what price you buy at.

But as a value preservation tool, BTC's rise will continue for ever, and that value will massively grow both due to adoption of a limited in supply asset over time, as well as due to debasement of fiat currency purchasing power in real terms.

So, my advice to you is BUY NOW. (And either way, remember this advice when BTC hits 100K, which with time, it will. Eihter you will be thanking yourself for acting now, or kick yourself for failing to act when you could have).

French

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 1899
  • Solana @ 2000$
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9840 on: November 16, 2023, 12:45:28 AM »
Solana to the moon
$

gib

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 5100
  • Getbig!
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9841 on: November 16, 2023, 01:01:38 AM »
There are many companies which have technology which will be useful in the future.

Ideally you invest in companies which have good prospects of a future return, and who have legitimately issued tradable shares, and not, like Solana, who are engaged in securities fraud (issuing unregistered securities, failure to comply with listing rules, etc), for obvious reasons.

In terms of globally decentralized money, there is only one blockchain that matters, and that is Bitcoin. (Hence the saying, "Bitcoin, not crypto").

https://cointelegraph.com/news/class-action-lawsuit-claims-solana-s-sol-is-an-unregistered-security

https://fortune.com/crypto/2023/06/08/solana-foundation-denies-that-sol-is-a-security/


obsidian

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 7350
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9842 on: November 16, 2023, 11:57:04 AM »
Interesting discussion in this video. The alts are pumping because BTC and ETH did not dump as hard in 2022. Especially ETH. So now all those hodlers are sitting on their stash. Meanwhile, the degens that sold their alts are now getting back in. If the BTC ETFs and later ETH ETFs are approved, the money will flow to those two. Not sure if the degens buying alts now will be able to compete with the ETF inflows. We'll see.


Mayday

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 3019
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9843 on: November 16, 2023, 04:10:54 PM »
Interesting discussion in this video. The alts are pumping because BTC and ETH did not dump as hard in 2022. Especially ETH. So now all those hodlers are sitting on their stash. Meanwhile, the degens that sold their alts are now getting back in. If the BTC ETFs and later ETH ETFs are approved, the money will flow to those two. Not sure if the degens buying alts now will be able to compete with the ETF inflows. We'll see.



The masses front running the ETF aye?

What are the current BTC peak price targets?


obsidian

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 7350
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9844 on: November 16, 2023, 11:36:50 PM »
The masses front running the ETF aye?

What are the current BTC peak price targets?
Yes. But they are looking for degen gains with the alts. The ETF money will only go to BTC, and perhaps ETH if there is a spot approved for it. Can't go anywhere else because the alts won't have spot ETFs for a while.

I've read so many BTC peak price targets for the next bull run lol! But I think it should at least go past $100-120K. Will be interesting to see how it pans out.

Arthur Hayes is fascinating in this interview. I only started watching it and am going to listen to all of it on a long drive or two. Well worth listening to it I think.



(00:03:44) Rich countries' population decline and looming market disturbances.
(00:13:46) Intellectual disdain for communism and US's Eurasian resource goals.
(00:26:24) Our missed nuclear chance in an oil-dependent world.
(00:31:51) Indonesia's nickel strategy and global trade inequalities.
(00:46:20) The risks of selling low-interest bonds prematurely.
(00:55:39) Real estate lending's decline and bank stability concerns.
(01:05:53) Global debt's impact on long-term bond choices.
(01:19:57) Profiting from low-risk investments in any market.
(01:22:26) Navigating volatile assets with short-term cash safety.
(01:39:24) Predicting a stable economy vs. potential extremes.
(01:46:20) Long-term AI and crypto investments aiming for 2025 liquidity.
(01:56:32) US's self-sufficiency vs. global dollar protection.
(02:13:28) Crypto's resilience amidst crises and fraud.
(02:24:07) Centralized influences on Bitcoin's principles.
(02:25:36) Balancing Bitcoin's core values with mainstream demands.
(02:37:38) Economic collapse concerns.

Theoak*

  • Getbig IV
  • ****
  • Posts: 1436
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9845 on: November 18, 2023, 01:01:13 AM »
Eth finally flipped btc.

Schadenfreude

  • Guest
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9846 on: November 18, 2023, 03:48:46 AM »
Will gold lose value after BTC reaches univeral acceptance as a store of value?

Flexacon

  • Getbig V
  • *****
  • Posts: 8347
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9847 on: November 18, 2023, 05:55:24 AM »
Will gold lose value after BTC reaches univeral acceptance as a store of value?

Ask affeman and then go with the opposite of what he says.

Schadenfreude

  • Guest
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9848 on: November 18, 2023, 05:58:29 AM »
Ask affeman and then go with the opposite of what he says.
Is that Peter Schiff's handle? I get physically uncomfortable listening to that man. Seems very dishonest and untrustworthy. Probably a secret BTC maxi unloading third reich gold on the unwashed masses.

Schadenfreude

  • Guest
Re: Bitcoins - about to hit $5,000 per coin today!
« Reply #9849 on: November 18, 2023, 06:01:01 AM »
On a more serious note, I wonder if BTC can once again crash to near zero in the future if the market decides it is worthless after all.