Author Topic: sleeping with a legend... (Read 4829 times)

bigmikecox · « **Reply #25 on:** July 17, 2015, 07:38:30 AM »

Quote from: funk51 on July 16, 2015, 12:04:40 PM

giants fab 4

Little early to put Posey in that class yet IMO

Pet shop boys · « **Reply #26 on:** July 17, 2015, 07:39:31 AM »

Quote from: Grape Ape on July 17, 2015, 07:01:19 AM

Getting the production out of a shortstop that ARod did is more rare, and more valuable.

However, Bonds' production was so superior ARod's defensive position isn't enough to overcome it.

Both legendary, but Bonds is superior.

Sosa doesn't even belong in the conversation.

You win more games by having a great SS than a great OF

And that is why Alex Rodriguez is the best player in the story of MLB business

not to mention the records that AROD holds as offensive player.... Bonds has the HR record but that's about it

WoooSSHHHHHHHHHHH C H A P O

Grape Ape · « **Reply #27 on:** July 17, 2015, 07:43:02 AM »

Quote from: Pet shop boys on July 17, 2015, 07:39:31 AM

And that is why Alex Rodriguez is the best player in the story of MLB business

Except he's not, for reasons I explained.

Plus, he didn't stay at SS his whole career.

Pet shop boys · « **Reply #28 on:** July 17, 2015, 07:45:41 AM »

Quote from: Grape Ape on July 17, 2015, 07:43:02 AM

Except he's not, for reasons I explained.

Plus, he didn't stay at SS his whole career.

But he was at his peak a Short stop gold glober with 50 plus HRs.....

Barry Bonds hitting HRs alone doesnt make him more talented ....

Grape Ape · « **Reply #29 on:** July 17, 2015, 07:50:23 AM »

Quote from: Pet shop boys on July 17, 2015, 07:45:41 AM

Barry Bonds hitting HRs alone doesnt make him more talented ....

No, but putting up an OPS+ of greater than 260 in his peak years does.

And golden globes are for hollywood, not baseball players.

Pet shop boys · « **Reply #30 on:** July 17, 2015, 08:31:15 AM »

Quote from: Grape Ape on July 17, 2015, 07:50:23 AM

No, but putting up and OPS+ of greater than 260 in his peak years does.

And golden globes are for hollywood, not baseball players.

Had he been a center field ... I might go with your theory.

I'll go with A-ROD and you can keep Bonds. (no homo)

WooOSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Grape Ape · « **Reply #31 on:** July 17, 2015, 08:35:22 AM »

Quote from: Pet shop boys on July 17, 2015, 08:31:15 AM

Had he been a center filed ... I might go with your theory.

I'll go with A-ROD and you can keep Bonds. (no homo)

WooOSSHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Bonds peak years were just better than ARods.....that's without question. If you want to add defense in, Bonds is #2 all time in fWar (which is adjusted for position), where Rodriquez is 11th.

Nothing against ARod's ability as a ballplayer, and the value of him being a SS isn't lost on my. He's one of the best ever. Bonds was just better.

Hulkotron · « **Reply #32 on:** July 17, 2015, 11:29:26 AM »

Quote from: Grape Ape on July 17, 2015, 08:35:22 AM

Bonds peak years were just better than ARods.....that's without question. If you want to add defense in, Bonds is #2 all time in fWar (which is adjusted for position), where Rodriquez is 11th.

Nothing against ARod's ability as a ballplayer, and the value of him being a SS isn't lost on my. He's one of the best ever. Bonds was just better.

.362/.609/.812

Averaged 8.2 at-bats per HR that year. 19% of his plate appearances were intentional walks

Pet shop boys · « **Reply #33 on:** July 17, 2015, 01:55:54 PM »

Quote from: Grape Ape on July 17, 2015, 08:35:22 AM

Bonds peak years were just better than ARods.....that's without question. If you want to add defense in, Bonds is #2 all time in fWar (which is adjusted for position), where Rodriquez is 11th.

Nothing against ARod's ability as a ballplayer, and the value of him being a SS isn't lost on my. He's one of the best ever. Bonds was just better.

I'm talking about ALL AROUND PLAYER ....not where they rank separately ...

Ask any manager who they rather have on their team ...

Short stop is possibly the most difficult position in baseball.... and he won a gold globe while hitting more than 50 HRs in a season how can you top that ? Boy are you crazy? ...... AROD is the most talented player

Grape Ape · « **Reply #34 on:** July 17, 2015, 05:00:06 PM »

Quote from: Pet shop boys on July 17, 2015, 01:55:54 PM

I'm talking about ALL AROUND PLAYER ....not where they rank separately ...

Ask any manager who they rather have on their team ...

Short stop is possibly the most difficult position in baseball.... and he won a gold globe while hitting more than 50 HRs in a season how can you top that ? Boy are you crazy? ...... AROD is the most talented player

fWar takes into account position and defense and Bonds is still ahead.

And you keep saying "golden globe" instead of "gold glove" so you lose just for that. Plus, "gold glove" is voted on by morons and means nothing. Jeter won one when he had a horrid defensive year.

tom joad · « **Reply #35 on:** July 18, 2015, 02:42:07 AM »

wonder when Bonds, Clemens (and eventually) Arod are gonna get elected to the Hall of Fame?

Bonds & Clemens each received about 37% of the vote last year (need 75%.)

McGwire got only 10%, and I think next year is his last with his name on the ballot.

dr.chimps · « **Reply #36 on:** July 18, 2015, 05:11:00 AM »

Quote from: tom joad on July 18, 2015, 02:42:07 AM

wonder when Bonds, Clemens (and eventually) Arod are gonna get elected to the Hall of Fame?

Bonds & Clemens each received about 37% of the vote last year (need 75%.)

McGwire got only 10%, and I think next year is his last with his name on the ballot.

Got a signed Pete Rose ball (who doesn't). That's farked up.

/see you in september, in the 200's

Grape Ape · « **Reply #37 on:** July 18, 2015, 05:21:34 AM »

Quote from: dr.chimps on July 18, 2015, 05:11:00 AM

Got a signed Pete Rose ball (who doesn't). That's farked up.

/see you in september, in the 200's

Go get some pitching.

dr.chimps · « **Reply #38 on:** July 18, 2015, 05:24:04 AM »

Quote from: Grape Ape on July 18, 2015, 05:21:34 AM

Go get some pitching.

No kidding. I'd just take Dickey out of the rotation.

King Shizzo · « **Reply #39 on:** July 18, 2015, 05:51:50 AM »

Quote from: Grape Ape on July 17, 2015, 06:45:43 AM

Bonds > ARod

ARod > Sosa

What about a guy like Frank Thomas? He was always one of my favorite players, and that big bastard just might have been steroid free

Great player.

funk51 · « **Reply #40 on:** July 18, 2015, 06:59:35 AM »

Quote from: Shizzo on July 18, 2015, 05:51:50 AM

What about a guy like Frank Thomas? He was always one of my favorite players, and that big bastard just might have been steroid free Great player.

little weak with the glove and no speed at all... when your talking all-timers as opposed to reg hofer you've got to have all 5 tools...

tom joad · « **Reply #41 on:** July 19, 2015, 04:02:03 PM »

Quote from: dr.chimps on July 18, 2015, 05:11:00 AM

Got a signed Pete Rose ball (who doesn't). That's farked up.

/see you in september, in the 200's

did he write, I'm sorry I bet on baseball ...?

you go to many Jays games?

Grape Ape · « **Reply #42 on:** July 19, 2015, 04:07:15 PM »

Quote from: The Scott on July 19, 2015, 04:05:04 PM

Hammerin' Hank and the Babe are superior to Bonds. Dopers suck butt. Baboon butt.

Baseball is pussfied for not striking druggers from the books.

Nope.

All sports have PEDs. The NFL lives off it.

Can't strike them from the books, because you can't selectively pick - just have to accept it.

tom joad · « **Reply #43 on:** July 19, 2015, 04:07:23 PM »

Quote from: Shizzo on July 18, 2015, 05:51:50 AM

What about a guy like Frank Thomas? He was always one of my favorite players, and that big bastard just might have been steroid free Great player.

Pedro Martinez just said he believes that 60% of players were juicing during the steroid era ... and even if it was just 50% ... it's hard to give guys the benefit of the doubt (which is too bad.)

tom joad · « **Reply #44 on:** July 19, 2015, 04:15:13 PM »

Quote from: Grape Ape on July 19, 2015, 04:07:15 PM

Nope.

All sports have PEDs. The NFL lives off it.

Can't strike them from the books, because you can't selectively pick - just have to accept it.

yeah, almost everybody associated with the game turned a blind eye to obvious steroid use, so it really became the wild wild west where anything goes ...

even before the steroid era began in the early '90s, I can remember fans chanting "STEROIDS, STEROIDS!" to Jose Canseco back in 1985!

Walter Sobchak · « **Reply #45 on:** July 19, 2015, 04:19:08 PM »

Quote from: Shizzo on July 18, 2015, 05:51:50 AM

What about a guy like Frank Thomas? He was always one of my favorite players, and that big bastard just might have been steroid free Great player.

Not nearly as good as Ken Griffey Jr., who was also believed to be drug free

Grape Ape · « **Reply #46 on:** July 19, 2015, 04:21:04 PM »

Quote from: The Scott on July 19, 2015, 04:13:35 PM

I don't accept it, I just refuse to view or support it. Especially so the Olympics. The same "august" body that shamed Jim Thorpe allows drugs to run rampant over them. For example, "women's" Oly lifting is a joke as is most everything else associated with the games.

There is no honor in sport these days or at the very least it is rare indeed. Like Pete Rose, Bonds and others of his kind should (at the minimum) forever be banned from the HoF.

It's not "these days".....if PED use was known the way it is now, all those old timey "sacred" players would have used. It's the nature of the beast.

tom joad · « **Reply #47 on:** July 19, 2015, 04:40:56 PM »

Quote from: The Scott on July 19, 2015, 04:28:01 PM

Without drugs, what would Bonds be? Mediocre to slightly above average.

Bonds (and Arod) would be Hall of Famers even without drugs.

(but it's too bad we'll never know what their overall numbers would've been roid-free.)

dr.chimps · « **Reply #48 on:** July 19, 2015, 05:42:24 PM »

Quote from: tom joad on July 19, 2015, 04:02:03 PM

did he write, I'm sorry I bet on baseball ...?

you go to many Jays games?

Exactly, the one I have. It's a black ball, as well. Kinda funny.

Been to 3, so far this year. Next one is the last home game. Sept 27th? The one with the free hoodie.

Pet shop boys · « **Reply #49 on:** July 19, 2015, 07:56:10 PM »

Quote from: tom joad on July 19, 2015, 04:40:56 PM

Bonds (and Arod) would be Hall of Famers even without drugs.

(but it's too bad we'll never know what their overall numbers would've been roid-free.)

Just substrac an entire season and a half from Arods career and the numbers you get is what would've been his production without drugs ......

Wait a min , they just did that with the suspension !!!!

Woooshhhhhhhh