EQ vs. Deca

[Bypass]

See alot of people using Deca, I've been told that EQ will give you the same desired results, without the Decadick side affect, any truth to this or just rumor? I've used both and do prefer EQ, and didn't notice any sides with the EQ, but wanted to ask some of you more experienced guys the benefits of the two, which in your opinion is the better compound and why?

[DIVISION]

See alot of people using Deca, I've been told that EQ will give you the same desired results, without the Decadick side affect, any truth to this or just rumor? I've used both and do prefer EQ, and didn't notice any sides with the EQ, but wanted to ask some of you more experienced guys the benefits of the two, which in your opinion is the better compound and why?

Bypass what you heard, nugga.

Fu.ck those rumors!   

Deca is alot more anabolic than EQ.

EQ improves appetite and vascularity, used more as part of a cutting stack.

Deca increases progesterone which has suppressive effects on the libido, hence "decadick".

EQ does not suppress like Deca.

There is a simple way to get around this.

Stack your Testosterone at a 2:1 ratio to your Deca and you shouldn't have any problems with sexual performance.

EQ is not even close to Deca in terms of anabolic strength, it's a weaker anabolic and I don't use it. 

Hope this helps.

BTW:  Do not listen to RUMORS.  Women do that.





DIV

[adren]

Deca does not affect everyone with libido problems.. some get it some don't. Either way as long as you stack it with test you'll have no worries. Deca is more often used in mass cycles while eq is used to gain lean muscle mass although it is also used in mass cycles. Deca will put on more mass than eq ever will but they both have their advantages and disadvantages. Eq is also good for vascularity and increased appetite but also increases the blood pressure.

[Bypass]

Thanks Div, that's why I came to you guys, wanted to have the most acurate info possible, I'm looking at 750 mg a week of Sust, so was gonna run about 400 Deca with that, and some Tren, and dbol the first few weeks, 75 mg eod of Tren, and some dbol on the front end wks 1 - 4 or 5, depending on how I feel and look.

[muscle19]

thats wont be a bad cycle but u have to remember that tren and deca for the most part should not be ran together as they r very hard on ur system.


muscle

[Bypass]

I usually run EQ with Tren, Test and Dbol, I'm switching out EQ for the Deca this time around, I have special circumstances as far as most people are concerned.

[muscle19]

well, it wont kill ya i hope. try it out and go through normal pct and see if it had any diff. effects on ur body. good luck with it


muscle

[freakfestMD]

Interesting thing for me-I've included deca in every cycle I've done.  In my 20s, no problem with deca dick and I knew nothing about PCT (didn't use any anti-e's during or post-cycle).  In my 20s, a light wind could make my dick hard.

Now in my 40s, last 2 cycles I felt low libido which I attributed to deca.  My test dosages were quite high so this was a bit of a surprise.  I felt the same thing coming into this present cycle, so I made 1 switch--I dropped letrozole for arimidex instead and !POW!  No libido issues now. 

In retrospect, I think letrozole was indeed the culprit.

[SulkingGreekGod]

Stack your Testosterone at a 2:1 ratio to your Deca and you shouldn't have any problems with sexual performance.

I've always wondered about this, why does it have to be 2:1? If all you want is to maintain your libido then a normal replacement dose (~100mg/wk) should be sufficient, shouldn't it? Or do you need more testosterone to "compensate" for deca's progestagenic properties? I mean, is deca dick due to testosterone suppression only, or deca's progestagenic quality?

[muscle19]

im pretty sure u need the test to componsate for the effetcs of deca. but again thats not with all people as some dont get those sides when they run deca without test


muscle

[muscle19]

really...


muscle

[DIVISION]

I've always wondered about this, why does it have to be 2:1? If all you want is to maintain your libido then a normal replacement dose (~100mg/wk) should be sufficient, shouldn't it? Or do you need more testosterone to "compensate" for deca's progestagenic properties? I mean, is deca dick due to testosterone suppression only, or deca's progestagenic quality?

The 2:1 ratio is to compensate for the progesterone suppression issues.....that's to be on the safe side.

You could to 3:2 instead and be fine with that.

I wouldn't risk it though, I've had decadick and it's nothing I want to experience again.




DIV

[BIG_O]

Interesting thing for me-I've included deca in every cycle I've done.  In my 20s, no problem with deca dick and I knew nothing about PCT (didn't use any anti-e's during or post-cycle).  In my 20s, a light wind could make my dick hard.

Now in my 40s, last 2 cycles I felt low libido which I attributed to deca.  My test dosages were quite high so this was a bit of a surprise.  I felt the same thing coming into this present cycle, so I made 1 switch--I dropped letrozole for arimidex instead and !POW!  No libido issues now. 

In retrospect, I think letrozole was indeed the culprit.

Your last statement really puzzles me Freakfest. The reason is that you are not the only one who has complained about this. I have had a talk with a couple other people over the years that have had the same issues with Femara. They have reported that sexual function is low and then switched to Arimidex or Nolvadex and it mysteriously came back. I can see how switching to Nolvadex would make a marked improvement but not another aromatase inhibitor.

After initially hearing this I'd assume that it had to do with their cycle or something else but when a few people have noticed this same side it makes me wonder what is really going on. I'd say it is your Deca but you said everything came back so I will assume you still ran the Deca right?

The only thing I could possibly think of is that Letrozole inhibits estrogen formation so much that it impairs cognitive sexual function. Many research papers over the years have shown a direct correlation to sexual function and ER in the brain. Letrozole does a far better job on the aromatase enzyme than Arimidex. So less circulating oestrogen is causing a domino effect in the HPTA.

http://www.pnas.org/cgi/content/full/97/26/14737
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=16350725&query_hl=15&itool=pubmed_docsum
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=16338079&query_hl=15&itool=pubmed_DocSum
http://www.medscimonit.com/medscimonit/modules.php?name=Current_Issue&d_op=summary&id=3357

Thoughts?

[DIVISION]

The only thing I could possibly think of is that Letrozole inhibits estrogen formation so much that it impairs cognitive sexual function. Many research papers over the years have shown a direct correlation to sexual function and ER in the brain. Letrozole does a far better job on the aromatase enzyme than Arimidex. So less circulating oestrogen is causing a domino effect in the HPTA.

I have no idea what the mechanism is behind Femara's supposed effection on libido, but the phenomenon is real.  I won't use it specifically for this reason.  I will use Arimidex or Aromasin.




DIV

[Double XL]

eq is the only drug that ive tried that makes me break out, the 2 times i ran it i got acne all over my shoulders and back, it was gross, im not even acne prone.

[HeyNow]

I like to use eq over deca. I gained alot more weight with deca, but alot of it was water.  My face blew up, it gave me chipmunk cheeks.  I looked like shit with deca.  Eq is alot weaker, but I saw decent results that were maintainable and without the severe water retention that I got from deca. 

[DIVISION]

I like to use eq over deca. I gained alot more weight with deca, but alot of it was water.  My face blew up, it gave me chipmunk cheeks.  I looked like shit with deca.  Eq is alot weaker, but I saw decent results that were maintainable and without the severe water retention that I got from deca. 

That's what it comes down to....

Water retention and bigger gains vs. less water retention and modest gains.




DIV

[freakfestMD]

I'd say it is your Deca but you said everything came back so I will assume you still ran the Deca right?

The only thing I could possibly think of is that Letrozole inhibits estrogen formation so much that it impairs cognitive sexual function.
name=Current_Issue&d_op=summary&id=3357

Thoughts?

Yes, I did indeed continue the deca.  I think you are entirely correct here.  It wasn't a performance issue at all.  It was complete lack of interest in sex.  This lack of interest completely disappeared with the letro to arimidex switch, so much so that recently why wife inquired as to why I've "been so horny lately."

Thanks for the research articles.  I found them interesting.  In the end, it shows how we all respond so differently to different compounds, and why it takes so long to actually put together a cycle that works for you as an individual.  We should keep this in mind when recommending cycles/compounds to others on the board, and others responding to our comments should likely do the same (it would make for less haytin').

[DIVISION]

What do you think about all these guys runnin' deca all the way to their show?

Running Deca all the way up to a show is counterproductive.

The water retention alone will make shedding water impossible.

Deca is not the drug to run on a cutter, which is pre-contest for bodybuilders. 

Never heard of people running it all the way up to a show, suppose it's possible, but would think it would really make dieting and water depletion difficult.




DIV