How soon to discover the lies?

[MCWAY]

When I was 15 I bought NitroTech after seeing the adds with Jay Cutler in Flex Magazine and thought I was gonna get big as fuark. Then I stumbled onto getbig about 8 years ago at 16 and learnt the truth.

What you learnt was how to find fellow crybabies who complain about being duped.

Common sense would tell you that these dudes were fairly big before they touched Nitro-Tech and had been training for at least a decade.

It's no different than 20 years ago, when bodybuilders sang the praises of Met-Rx. Of course, upon further reading, you learn they're drinking the stuff like Kool-Aid (6-8 servings a day), on top of the ungodly amounts of regular food they eat.

Steroids or no steroids, the average bloke ain't getting big without heavy training, plenty of rest, and enough food to feed a family of 4 (with leftovers). Rather than face that reality, we get people who whine about it being "all drugs".

[Never1AShow]

No, this is not right.  Common sense wouldn't tell you anything prior to the internet.  Why would you think it would be drugs, when you hadn't even heard of them?  Worse, all of the magazines avoided it like the plague pretty much, at least before the late 80s.

It was as if there was this huge conspiracy amongst cake bakers to never mention sugar and all of the cookbooks leaving out sugar and there being no sugar in stores or other products containing sugar.

[MCWAY]

No, this is not right.  Common sense wouldn't tell you anything prior to the internet.  Why would you think it would be drugs, when you hadn't even heard of them?  Worse, all of the magazines avoided it like the plague pretty much, at least before the late 80s.

Hardly! People would look at muscle magazines and "steroids" would be the first thing to come out their mouths. That happened when they saw my magazines, and I started training in the 80s, before the Internet was even a thought in folks' head.

Again, steroids or no steroids, the training, rest, and diet must be on point or you go nowhere.

[Vince B]

The problem you have is one kind of broscience is replaced with the latest nonsense in most gyms and even online.

Think about it, even the top pros have gurus to help them. What does this tell us? Things get complicated when you

mess with substances. Everyone 'knows' that big muscles = steroids.

Supplements are useful for their calorie content and little else. Bodybuilders ingest way too much protein. Shows you

that old beliefs persist and some never die probably because the supplement companies and magazines have a vested

interest for those lies to persist.

Guys think about steroids as soon as their gains stop or if a mate gets bigger than them!

[John Crabtree]

The problem you have is one kind of broscience is replaced with the latest nonsense in most gyms and even online.

Think about it, even the top pros have gurus to help them. What does this tell us? Things get complicated when you

mess with substances. Everyone 'knows' that big muscles = steroids.

Supplements are useful for their calorie content and little else. Bodybuilders ingest way too much protein. Shows you

that old beliefs persist and some never die probably because the supplement companies and magazines have a vested

interest for those lies to persist.

Guys think about steroids as soon as their gains stop or if a mate gets bigger than them!

Your nonsense assertions are immaterial since you are a proven liar and imbecile. Sorry. [I am an eminent scientist.]

[Never1AShow]

Hardly! People would look at muscle magazines and "steroids" would be the first thing to come out their mouths. That happened when they saw my magazines, and I started training in the 80s, before the Internet was even a thought in folks' head.

Again, steroids or no steroids, the training, rest, and diet must be on point or you go nowhere.

Perhaps in some places, but this was far from my experience in a similar timeframe.  Kids in gyms did not automatically assume you could not get big without steroids.  They were much, much more underground than now.  We're people more naive?  Yes, absolutely

Best analogy I can think of is to homosexuality.  It was far from mainstream or on anyone's mind.  I knew plenty of people that did not know that Freddy Mercury or the Village People or George Michael or Boy George were gay.  Seriously, people watching the Wake Me Up Before You Go Go video from Wham with George Michael did not know he was gay.

[Never1AShow]

And how does the title of my thread get changed?  It's about first discovering the lies, not about whether it is all steroids.

[MCWAY]

Perhaps in some places, but this was far from my experience in a similar timeframe.  Kids in gyms did not automatically assume you could not get big without steroids.  They were much, much more underground than now.  We're people more naive?  Yes, absolutely

Best analogy I can think of is to homosexuality.  It was far from mainstream or on anyone's mind.  I knew plenty of people that did not know that Freddy Mercury or the Village People or George Michael or Boy George were gay.  Seriously, people watching the Wake Me Up Before You Go Go video from Wham with George Michael did not know he was gay.

Please say you're joking. Those three being gay ( or at least, suspected of such) was among the WORST kept secrets in entertainment. Michael with Wham was seriously suspect. When he went solo, he got a major makeover (cut his hair, ditch the guy shorts, grew a beard, and submerged himself in supermodels. Not to mention that scandalous (by 80s standards, at least) "I Want Your Sex" video.

And Boy George? Come on! He was as fruity as you could get.

[MCWAY]

And how does the title of my thread get changed?  It's about first discovering the lies, not about whether it is all steroids.

"It's all just steroids" is part of your title.

[SF1900]

The problem you have is one kind of broscience is replaced with the latest nonsense in most gyms and even online.

Think about it, even the top pros have gurus to help them. What does this tell us? Things get complicated when you

mess with substances. Everyone 'knows' that big muscles = steroids.

Supplements are useful for their calorie content and little else. Bodybuilders ingest way too much protein. Shows you

that old beliefs persist and some never die probably because the supplement companies and magazines have a vested

interest for those lies to persist.

Guys think about steroids as soon as their gains stop or if a mate gets bigger than them!

Shut up. Your hypothesis of hypertrophy has never been proven by any sort of evidence and your shitty bicep supination machine is a piece of crap.

[John Crabtree]

Shut up. Your hypothesis of hypertrophy has never been proven by any sort of evidence and your shitty bicep supination machine is a piece of crap.

I thought you and Vince were on the same side. His beliefs are identical to yours.

[dj181]

Lots of guys on drugs who look liek shit. Not much lies... quality takes time, consistency. It shows in golden era physiques.

All these YT juiced from day one clowns. Yet... very few ones can touch this (and dude was on a gear that was more simple! Probably on a lot less gear either. And you can see he's not a walkign water balloon, blown out from within in a completely artificial way. It just shows. a real fukkin muscle right here):

i wouldn't say they look like shit man, it's more like they look ok or not too bad 

still can't believe that Nubret is under two bills there at six foot tall 

[Vince B]

I thought you and Vince were on the same side. His beliefs are identical to yours.

Nothing identical about our beliefs and thank goodness for that. I doubt many here can come up with a coherent, valid theory about anything let alone hypertrophy.

[jon cole]

It used to be that when a guy started lifting it took many years to discover it was all based on lies.  Years of training and learning about protein powder, super sets, reading magazines, learning the history and the ropes, building something of a foundation.  Unless you happened to know someone who clued you in early to the game that all the supplements are lies and its all just steroids (which was probably unfortunate becuase youd lose the chance to develop a base and some fire).

How long does it take the average guy who walks into a gym for the first time today?  Now that information is available on the Internet for free, is it a year?  a couple of months?  Is it better or worse to know so early that the ace was always up the sleeve, the rabbit was always in the hat and there is no magic?

I realised how bodybuilding is a fraud too late. Reading those 90's flex now makes me laugh, but with a lot of regret.

All that time spent in gym, my teenage futile hope.

If i had to start all over again = training 2/3 time a week full body style with basic (bench squat chin etc), simple diet without supp, and enjoying life outside the gym.

[da_vinci]

still can't believe that Nubret is under two bills there at six foot tall 

That's how it is when muscle is earned by a hard work and some steroids.

[Yamcha]

I don't even know what SF1900 looks like, but I'd much rather look like him than the biceps supinator master beast rider.

[Thin Lizzy]

The problem with steroids is that they work too well.

It's not as though you can't make natural gains, but, they seem like nothing compared to those made by heavy steroid users.

[devilsmile]

The problem with steroids is that they work too well.

It's not as though you can't make natural gains, but, they seem like nothing compared to those made by heavy steroid users.

Indeed. The difference is like a mouse and a tasmanian devil. It's also irritating to me that some users in getbig claim that the ammount of test they inject only replaces their naturally low test levels and hence they think it's no differend than a guy who has normal levels of test, oh brother  

the fact is, if you even use "small" ammounts of test, percentage wise it's humongous difference to being a full natty brah

[spiro]

I remember stumbling across a British Dragon website when I was in college. That's how it all started.

[DroppingPlates]

Plenty of impulsive youngsters who start juicing in their first 1-2 years of 'training'.

[njflex]

Please say you're joking. Those three being gay ( or at least, suspected of such) was among the WORST kept secrets in entertainments. Michael with a Wham was seriously suspect. When he went solo, he got a major makeover (cut his hair, ditch the guy shorts, grew a beard, and submearced himself in supermodels. Not to mention that scandalous (by 80s standards, at least) "I Want Your Sex" video.

And Boy George? Come on! He was as fruity as you could get.

NEVER once in 1985 did I want to cut off a pair of knit gloves /where all white and paint 80's glow makeup/lipstick on my face and glow in the dark with puffed hair and swaying like George Michael 'nothing straight about that video'.at all...

[Disco187]

I picked up my first flex magazine when i was in college and sick as a dog for a few days and read it cover to cover and i remeber i tore a page out of shawn ray and i actually believed that they must be naturarl because they must do steroid testings etc.

I was natural for many years simply becaue i did not have the connections or knowledge of aas, but i sure wasted plenty of money on things like designer protein, cell tech, nitro tech, mesotech bars, metrex bars, gnc creatine.  my first cycle was 100 pink thailand d bols that i paid 100 bucks for and i thought i was getting a sweet deal  You live and you learn

I also believe it was muscle mag that used to have those steroid sections in them along with the hot fitness models so that was pretty much my go to for info on AAS .  I couldnt afford a computer back then

[Never1AShow]

"It's all just steroids" is part of your title.

Can you read?  Someone changed my original title.  This was NOT part of mine.

[Never1AShow]

Please say you're joking. Those three being gay ( or at least, suspected of such) was among the WORST kept secrets in entertainments. Michael with a Wham was seriously suspect. When he went solo, he got a major makeover (cut his hair, ditch the guy shorts, grew a beard, and submearced himself in supermodels. Not to mention that scandalous (by 80s standards, at least) "I Want Your Sex" video.

And Boy George? Come on! He was as fruity as you could get.

You admit it yourself, "or at least suspected".  See today it is obvious, back then not so much. 

[SF1900]

Nothing identical about our beliefs and thank goodness for that. I doubt many here can come up with a coherent, valid theory about anything let alone hypertrophy.

You don't have a theory, dingus. You have a hypothesis.