Kicking the steroid habit

[Marlo Stanfield]

Lifted for 5 years naturally before starting AAS. I think most people would agree that after about 2 years you're about maxed out in size (strength is a different story, but I'm not a powerlifter). Most I've used is 2 grams. Never ran orals, just test, tren, npp. I also take a ton of supps on cycle to control BP, cholesterol, homocysteine, triglycerides, liver etc. to minimise the damage.

One reason why I went on was low T to start off with (low end of normal). I felt generally ok, but had practically no sex drive (muscle gains weren't bad actually for the low T levels), and slightly depressed (not to suicidal levels though). So, I'm not even sure if a restart will work, because I highly doubt I'll be able to restart to even where I used to be, much less an acceptable level. I do have some slightly unusual PCT protocols up my sleeve so I might try those though 

When you say no sex drive, are you sure thats physical? or is it due to you being depressed about your body image? its very important to distinguish between those two.

You can run 150-300mg Test a week without any problem. if youre on the 300 range weekly, its better to be under supervision or get routine bloodwork done, although it wont show all problems, it could show some of them and enable you to catch issues early. if youre taking 150-200mg, (im nit a doctor so i cant guarantee anything), but in my opinion, you can do that without any adverse risk to your health.

Heres what i would do if i were you. Cruise  at 200mg for a few months, take bloodwork and get your test numbers. Then taper off and do a proper PCT, and after a month or so get new bloodwork and see if you bounce back naturally. You just dont want to stop cold turkey and not bounce back properly, that would really fuck with your head since your levels and hormones would be off

[Marlo Stanfield]

I have to pick up on the 'how long to stay natty ' debate.... I think once you have your training sorted, your eating properly, 2 yrs is probly your max for growth as you stated, you will gain next to nothing after that, even with gear you get a good run then you hit a brick wall, where you will have to mega dose and/or add gh/slin to start growing again.

You gain nothing for training 10 yrs natty and then stepping over, you've just missed out looking and feeling great in the prime of your life, I had loads of fun in my early 20's, enjoying being huge, doing shows, slaying pussy etc etc

The time for moderation is after 30, youl prob settle down and have different priorities, watch your health if you must

Of course its all dependant on the person. I tweaked alot and was able to see results from it for almost 8-9 years of being natty. Im not talking about changing my routine and gaining 15 pounds of solid muscle or anything like that, but the changes were real enough for me to at least to know that there was room for improvement before dabbling with steroids. Sure if i had taken moderate steroids during the final 2-3 years the gains wouldve been more noticble? who knows.

My philosophy was that i enjoy working out and lifting, and want to lift as long as i can. So let me milk the natty life as much as i can while still seeing noticble gains, albeit not too extreme.

[local hero]

is fertility an issue for you? I'm pretty dead set against having kids, but I know most women do, and I intend to get married eventually. I do see all these IFBB pros with kids though, so a part of me thinks it isn't that big an issue with treatments like triptorelin, hcg, hmg, torem etc. noawadays. Also, I was long long finished with puberty when I started AAS

I've got 2 kids without using any real pct, I think the fertility thing is something that will affect you only if you are low to begin with, which you probly won't know till you start trying anyway

I get sick of being on after so long, miss it when I'm off....

[local hero]

Of course its all dependant on the person. I tweaked alot and was able to see results from it for almost 8-9 years of being natty. Im not talking about changing my routine and gaining 15 pounds of solid muscle or anything like that, but the changes were real enough for me to at least to know that there was room for improvement before dabbling with steroids. Sure if i had taken moderate steroids during the final 2-3 years the gains wouldve been more noticble? who knows.

My philosophy was that i enjoy working out and lifting, and want to lift as long as i can. So let me milk the natty life as much as i can while still seeing noticble gains, albeit not too extreme.

I don't think id have used if I stayed clean all that time, as I did enjoy the gym before I switched over, had decent size and strength, but its never the same after you've been on

[_aj_]

Try moderation. It does have to be an all or noting situation. I'm prescribed 300 mg of test a week. I've had no bad health issues from this.

300/week seems kinda high from a TRT perspective. Usually, it's in the 100-150 range. I need the name and number of your TRT doc, stat!

[aintitgrand]

+ toremifene PCT

i think the trip/torem combo is your best outlook, especially if youve been using for a long time

I have tripto laying around for when I'm ready to come off for a while, but I don't think I'll ever take it... Sounds too dangerous, seeing as its used to chemically castrate sex-offenders in prison...
I know you're only supposed to take 100mcg, and that's what the vial comes filled with, but it still fucks with my head that there's a small chance I'll chemically castrate myself.
Do you have any experience with it?

[Jizmo]

I have tripto laying around for when I'm ready to come off for a while, but I don't think I'll ever take it... Sounds too dangerous, seeing as its used to chemically castrate sex-offenders in prison...
I know you're only supposed to take 100mcg, and that's what the vial comes filled with, but it still fucks with my head that there's a small chance I'll chemically castrate myself.
Do you have any experience with it?

not at all, i never come off at the moment
its the plan B if i ever have to come off fully

[equipoise]

I have tripto laying around for when I'm ready to come off for a while, but I don't think I'll ever take it... Sounds too dangerous, seeing as its used to chemically castrate sex-offenders in prison...
I know you're only supposed to take 100mcg, and that's what the vial comes filled with, but it still fucks with my head that there's a small chance I'll chemically castrate myself.
Do you have any experience with it?

Actually I think for tripto castration they do have to administer repeated shots. So it's not permanent lifelong castration i think

[Gainsi]

These coming off steroids conversations put me so much on the edge lool, best place to find pct protocols are on those forums where anything over 25mgs of tren a day on a blast is too much and will cause permanent damage to your body. You should post these threads there lol. Reading this annoys me, sorry to be direct or rude but i had to say it

[aintitgrand]

These coming off steroids conversations put me so much on the edge lool, best place to find pct protocols are on those forums where anything over 25mgs of tren a day on a blast is too much and will cause permanent damage to your body. You should post these threads there lol. Reading this annoys me, sorry to be direct or rude but i had to say it

Sorry that it bums you out, but over here we give solid advice to whoever asks, even if its something they don't want to hear.
Why not educate yourself on proper PCT in case you have to come off one day, whether for health or personal reasons? And guys like Jizzmo are an invaluable source of info on pretty much anything PED, its like we have a collection of the best info on one forum. This place has something for everyone, from blasting, to cruising, to PCT. If you don't like reading about it, just don't click the link.

[Primemuscle]

300/week seems kinda high from a TRT perspective. Usually, it's in the 100-150 range. I need the name and number of your TRT doc, stat!

The doc noted that the dosage was high. I originally got him to prescribe it thusly, because it worked with how my medical insurance will pay for it. My copay has been $16 for 10 mil. I am able to fill this monthly. This might be changing though. Each new year insurance requires prior approval from the doctor. The lady I spoke to said the copay would be higher this year. Not sure why. It has always been classed as a tier 3 drug.

I try to avoid having my labs come in too high by taking a two week break from test and HCG prior to doing the labs. This results in it being in the low normal range.

Are you in the Portland area. I doubt he'd prescribe anything to someone who is not a patient. 

[local hero]

Sorry that it bums you out, but over here we give solid advice to whoever asks, even if its something they don't want to hear.
Why not educate yourself on proper PCT in case you have to come off one day, whether for health or personal reasons? And guys like Jizzmo are an invaluable source of info on pretty much anything PED, its like we have a collection of the best info on one forum. This place has something for everyone, from blasting, to cruising, to PCT. If you don't like reading about it, just don't click the link.

I have to but in.... Pct didn't even exist until the interweb era, I wouldn't take it too seriously... I know plenty guys in there 50's who have been on and off for decades and they laugh and roll eyes when asked about it

[theworm]

I have to but in.... Pct didn't even exist until the interweb era, I wouldn't take it too seriously... I know plenty guys in there 50's who have been on and off for decades and they laugh and roll eyes when asked about it

I'm going to just do clomid for pct as I'm only on test right now

[equipoise]

The doc noted that the dosage was high. I originally got him to prescribe it thusly, because it worked with how my medical insurance will pay for it. My copay has been $16 for 10 mil. I am able to fill this monthly. This might be changing though. Each new year insurance requires prior approval from the doctor. The lady I spoke to said the copay would be higher this year. Not sure why. It has always been classed as a tier 3 drug.

I try to avoid having my labs come in too high by taking a two week break from test and HCG prior to doing the labs. This results in it being in the low normal range.

Are you in the Portland area. I doubt he'd prescribe anything to someone who is not a patient. 

it's good to get a high dosage. then you can use half or less then stockpile some in case of a rainy day.

[falco]

Since you are young, i believe you might be able to come off and restore your testicular function.
I recomend you to use low dose pregnyl for some weeks, dufine, and dostinex will be of good use also.
Keep training, sleep alot. If you feel sluggish, fatiged all the time, there is a chance you might need to use another pregnyl/dufine protocol.
Recovery will most likely not be fast.
Regarding the mental aspect of getting off, prepare yourself to look like shit within a year.