Are people that brainwashed they dont even stop and question their religion?

[Man of Steel]

Yes, this is what most of religious persons I've ever met say. My question to that is always: So what is that "Jesus Christ" without "generic" religion? How do you even know what it's about then? Or is it just....believing that he....well... exists? What's the point?

When you sin you create a divide between yourself and God.  God requires that his law be followed and if it is not we will be individually judged for our breaking of that law.  Jesus Christ, the incarnate son of God, came to earth become the perfect sacrifice for that holy law.  He died on calvary's cross so that you, me and everyone that seeks him can have that gulf between you and God bridged.  You and I can become aligned with God and forever deemed righteous.  Jesus Christ didn't come to spread to religion.  He didn't commission his disciples to spread religion.  He came to spread the good news that our sin can be overcame through him if we claim him as God, Lord and savior over our lives.  We then have an advocate before God the Father and saved from his wrath and judgment.

Religion is just religion....by itself it isn't anything.   Everything is about Jesus Christ.....that's the point.  When a believer is saved or "born again" he/she becomes filled with the Holy Spirit of God and made anew.  We see the world differently.  We approach the world differently.  We devote our lives for Jesus Christ.  It's the Holy Spirit whose tangible presence we can feel in everyday life that guides according to his good and will purposes for our lives.  Religion can't do any of that.....it's just "religion".   Mix "religion" with Jesus Christ and then you have something worthwhile.

[Man of Steel]

Bullshit. You are only human. Doubts are what make us normal.

If you were knelt, being judged before god, you would not dare lie to him about your fears of his existence. He is all knowing, therefore why lie to us.

MOS, I know you believe, but you cannot control every thought or emotion that happens within you.

I would advise you to ask for forgiveness every night, because you sin everyday.

I do not engage in willful sin and I do not have doubts.   It's when we engage in willful sin and defy our witness and defy God that we have issues.

[Man of Steel]

Every wise person is in doubt all the time. Only thing that is sure is that everything is an assumption. I mean - yeah, I leave a chance that there actually is god (just like an unicorn and bigfoot) and if anyone would prove me - I'd adjust my beliefs, too bad I only see scared and weak people who are reaching for straws when life hits them hard and they doesn't have much to lean on.

Again, I no longer have any doubts about Jesus Christ, who he is, my eternal salvation or his reality.  It's really cool actually to be that secure.

Many believers are not.   I have questions about scripture at times, but yet I still have confidence in his word.

[Man of Steel]

Man, what are you talking about? I do NOT CARE what's after death, hell, heaven, nothing - I simply do not care, I don't ponder about that, I don't fear it, I just don't care. And if there's hell somewhere, it's here already, on earth. But at least it's not boring. If there's a heaven, I sure do not want to go there, I'd die again out of boredom.

You should and that's why I'm here today sharing the gospel with you.   You may not care at all today, but tomorrow is another day.

[King Shizzo]

As many of you all know, I absolutely love ancient history. In fact, it has helped shaped our modern society. Americans, just take a look at the majority of the capital buildings and monuments around the country. We are a nation of copycats (I mean that as a compliment)

This quote by Marcus Aurelius, who lived 2,000+ years ago, and at a time when there was pantheon of gods, best describes my way of thinking.

If there exists a god/s, then they will already know if you have lived a just life as a flawed human being.

[da_vinci]

When you sin you create a divide between yourself and God.  God requires that his law be followed and if it is not we will be individually judged for our breaking of that law.  Jesus Christ, the incarnate son of God, came to earth become the perfect sacrifice for that holy law.  He died on calvary's cross so that you, me and everyone that seeks him can have that gulf between you and God bridged.  You and I can become aligned with God and forever deemed righteous.  Jesus Christ didn't come to spread to religion.  He didn't commission his disciples to spread religion.  He came to spread the good news that our sin can be overcame through him if we claim him as God, Lord and savior over our lives.  We then have an advocate before God the Father and saved from his wrath and judgment.

Religion is just religion....by itself it isn't anything.   Everything is about Jesus Christ.....that's the point.  When a believer is saved or "born again" he/she becomes filled with the Holy Spirit of God and made anew.  We see the world differently.  We approach the world differently.  We devote our lives for Jesus Christ.  It's the Holy Spirit whose tangible presence we can feel in everyday life that guides according to his good and will purposes for our lives.  Religion can't do any of that.....it's just "religion".   Mix "religion" with Jesus Christ and then you have something worthwhile.

Ok...so.... how would you know all that if not religion?   Honestly - it does not make any sense. How would you know what is "sin" without religion?

[da_vinci]

You should and that's why I'm here today sharing the gospel with you.   You may not care at all today, but tomorrow is another day.

Do you realize that you suggest me to start believing in Santa once again? I used to believe in god when I was a teen, later on I found out it's all bullshit for weak people, I cannot "wind back" my awareness, you can't "unknow". You suggest me to try to become an alcoholic just to see how "good it feels", yet I'm perfectly aware that it may feel good for a while, but it's all an illusion and dissapears when you get sober (and the reality is still there).

[King Shizzo]

I do not engage in willful sin and I do not have doubts.   It's when we engage in willful sin and defy our witness and defy God that we have issues.

More like a willful excuse and fear. Do you deny the human thought process? Doubt exists in all of us. An all mighty god would be able to see through to your faith. Why does it seem to me, that you are more scared to be judged by god than I am?

[da_vinci]

Again, I no longer have any doubts about Jesus Christ, who he is, my eternal salvation or his reality.  It's really cool actually to be that secure.

Many believers are not.   I have questions about scripture at times, but yet I still have confidence in his word.

Why do you feel "not secure" to begin with?

[The Ugly]

Bullshit. You are only human. Doubts are what make us normal.

If you were knelt, being judged before god, you would not dare lie to him about your fears of his existence. He is all knowing, therefore why lie to us.

MOS, I know you believe, but you cannot control every thought or emotion that happens within you.

I would advise you to ask for forgiveness every night, because you sin everyday.

Silly. Why would you assume he doesn't? Dude knows the routine.

MoS, sort of an odd question. Christians believe the soul's eternal, right? We were all at God's side prior to our earthly birth. Ok, this is the awkward part: Why do you suppose God would take some already perfect soul, which has basked perfectly content in God's loving warmth for time immemorial, only to dump it in, say, some poor Sub-Saharan tribesman for the shortest of windows (eternally speaking), knowing full well this man will never hear the words "Jesus Christ" before the lions or cannibals send him back to the nonphysical, where he will henceforth be condemned to eternal suffering for never having the slightest access to the correct earthly gameplan?

Seems absolutely bizarre (and sadistically unfair) to f up what was already perfect, when that poor soul expressed no interest in ever leaving God's side. How does one reconcile this with Divine love and justice?

[King Shizzo]

Silly. Why would you assume he doesn't? Dude knows the routine.

MoS, sort of an odd question. Christians believe the soul's eternal, right? We were all at God's side prior to our earthly birth. Ok, this is the awkward part: Why do you suppose God would take some already perfect soul, which has basked perfectly content in God's loving warmth for time immemorial, only to dump it in, say, some poor Sub-Saharan tribesman for the shortest of windows (eternally speaking), knowing full well this man will never hear the words "Jesus Christ" before the lions or cannibals send him back to the nonphysical, where he will henceforth be condemned to eternal suffering for never having the slightest access to the correct earthly gameplan?

Seems absolutely bizarre (and sadistically unfair) to f up what was already perfect, when that poor soul expressed no interest in ever leaving God's side. How does one reconcile this with Divine love and justice?

Duh.......Its called "blind faith", Ugly.

[King Shizzo]

[Radical Plato]

I think the only real answer is terrorist action against religion. Start blowing up Churches, Mosques, Synagogues etc regardless of the domination, just target religion in general and this will start making folks think twice about where they go on Sunday or when they hear call to prayer etc etc.  Religious fuckers have made the average man's life more dangerous anywhere he goes, why can't we return the favour.  Religion just needs to be seen like any other fascist movement or organization, a danger to civilised societies everywhere and needs to be attacked and defeated.

Won't work. You cannot kill ideology. Furthermore, it is the religions that want what you want---patriachial families. So, you want to wage war against those who agree with you?

I am not talking about killing it, but containing it, like we have with Nazism.  Push it from mainstream acceptance to the fringes where the loonies live.  I think it will happen anyway, people get sick and tired of being told their only choice is to be a passive victim.

[lilhawk1]

Thanks for the clarification.

Actually my "relief" didn't come from the generic "religion".  Religion in and of itself is basically nothing.

My hope, peace and joy came from Jesus Christ.

So, do you believe God is a person?  Do you believe God has a plan for everyone, but intervenes from above?  Do you believe there is only one pathway to God, and the only true religion is yours?  Why does God let innocent babies, who have never 'sinned' die of horrible diseases, or birth defects?  Why doesn't he intervene to save people from dying in plane crashes or car wrecks?  Is he taking a nap when those things happen?  Why doesn't he intervene to stop natural disasters like the tsunami that killed hundreds of thousands in Indonesia years ago?  How can he be a loving God, yet let these horrible things happen all the time?   

[SF1900]

Your mental stability is hanging by a thread. I fear you're quite close to a massive emotional and spiritual implosion. No one is as close to the edge as someone who spouts off like you do.

Explore a backup plan for when your god fails to deliver/your delusion hits a brick wall.

And you gotta love the whole cliche threat of eternal damnation (hell). 

[Radical Plato]

So, do you believe God is a person?  Do you believe God has a plan for everyone, but intervenes from above?  Do you believe there is only one pathway to God, and the only true religion is yours?  Why does God let innocent babies, who have never 'sinned' die of horrible diseases, or birth defects?  Why doesn't he intervene to save people from dying in plane crashes or car wrecks?  Is he taking a nap when those things happen?  Why doesn't he intervene to stop natural disasters like the tsunami that killed hundreds of thousands in Indonesia years ago?  How can he be a loving God, yet let these horrible things happen all the time?   

[SF1900]

True, but the opposite also occurs. People who do not believe in organized religion (like myself) still ponder from time to time, "what is all of this here for?" Which is why I categorize myself as Agnostic. I do not believe humans were meant to solve the mysteries of the universe.

Science helps, but even that is still a guessing game, that constantly changes.

Who cares why its all here. Who cares if this universe was made for a purpose. It most likely wasn't.

You should read about the philosophical doctrine of "Absurdism."

"The absurd is born out of this confrontation between the human need and the unreasonable silence of the world."

"But if life is absurd, what is the point of living on? Why shouldn’t we commit suicide and hasten our fate? Using the Greek myth of Sisyphus as a metaphor, Camus attempts to answer this question and present an alternative to suicide. How to live with the consciousness of this absurdity of life is the central question of Camus’s philosophy. “Does the absurd dictate death?”[4] Camus believes that the answer is no. The appropriate response to the experience of Absurd, Camus suggests, is to live in full consciousness of it. He rejects all those things which erase the consciousness of absurd, such as religious faith, suicide and Existentialism."

[Radical Plato]

Who cares why its all here. Who cares if this universe was made for a purpose. It most likely wasn't.

You should read about the philosophical doctrine of "Absurdism."

"The absurd is born out of this confrontation between the human need and the unreasonable silence of the world."

"But if life is absurd, what is the point of living on? Why shouldn’t we commit suicide and hasten our fate? Using the Greek myth of Sisyphus as a metaphor, Camus attempts to answer this question and present an alternative to suicide. How to live with the consciousness of this absurdity of life is the central question of Camus’s philosophy. “Does the absurd dictate death?”[4] Camus believes that the answer is no. The appropriate response to the experience of Absurd, Camus suggests, is to live in full consciousness of it. He rejects all those things which erase the consciousness of absurd, such as religious faith, suicide and Existentialism."

Good Post. Comes at just the right point in my life.  I am wrestling with this exact same issue.  I will look into it. Thanks.

[Man of Steel]

Sorry went to Spurs game tonight so just getting back.  Will try to answer stuff again tomorrow.

[SF1900]

Good Post. Comes at just the right point in my life.  I am wrestling with this exact same issue.  I will look into it. Thanks.

Some fodder for you.

Read, "The Myth of Sisyphus" by the Nigerian philosopher and author, Albert Camus.

"In the essay (Myth of Sisyphus), Camus introduces his philosophy of the absurd: man's futile search for meaning, unity, and clarity in the face of an unintelligible world devoid of God and eternal truths or values. Does the realization of the absurd require suicide? Camus answers: "No. It requires revolt." He then outlines several approaches to the absurd life. The final chapter compares the absurdity of man's life with the situation of Sisyphus, a figure of Greek mythology who was condemned to repeat forever the same meaningless task of pushing a boulder up a mountain, only to see it roll down again. The essay concludes, "The struggle itself [...] is enough to fill a man's heart. One must imagine Sisyphus happy."

Absurdism quotes:

“Man stands face to face with the irrational. He feels within him his longing for happiness and for reason. The absurd is born of this confrontation between the human need and the unreasonable silence of the world.” - Camus

“But it is obvious that absurdism hereby admits that human life is the only necessary good since it is precisely life that makes this encounter possible and since, without life, the absurdist wager would have no basis. To say that life is absurd, the conscience must be alive.” Camus

“This world in itself is not reasonable, that is all that can be said. But what is absurd is the confrontation of this irrational and the wild longing for clarity whose call echoes in the human heart.” Camus

"Revolt … is a constant confrontation between man and his own obscurity … [It] is certainty of a crushing fate, without the resignation which out to accompany it’." Camus

[SF1900]

Good Post. Comes at just the right point in my life.  I am wrestling with this exact same issue.  I will look into it. Thanks.

"The world we live in is one of absurdity , human beings are trapped in this world with no chance of escape. Are only choices are to avoid the absurd through absolute faith or suicide. Albert Camus in his philosophy tells us that there is still a way to be happy and fulfilled in this world through revolt. We must revolt against the meaninglessness of our life and of our death that awaits."

https://20th-century-philosophy.wikispaces.com/Revolt+and+The+Meaning+of+Life

[Radical Plato]

"The world we live in is one of absurdity , human beings are trapped in this world with no chance of escape. Are only choices are to avoid the absurd through absolute faith or suicide. Albert Camus in his philosophy tells us that there is still a way to be happy and fulfilled in this world through revolt. We must revolt against the meaninglessness of our life and of our death that awaits."

https://20th-century-philosophy.wikispaces.com/Revolt+and+The+Meaning+of+Life

Cool, I have been investigating it, really resonating with where I am at in life currently.
I found this site, good info here. http://www.philosophytalk.org/community/blog/laura-maguire/2015/04/camus-and-absurdity

But I found a comment that claimed the consensus of his friends was that Camus, too, committed suicide.

This is the problem I found with digging deep into existential issues, finding out that it might be true that life is hopeless, meaningless and essentially not worth living.

[Man of Steel]

Ok...so.... how would you know all that if not religion?  Honestly - it does not make any sense. How would you know what is "sin" without religion?

My point is simple: organized religion is not necessary to follow Christ.   Following Christ is not about organized religion....it's about saving souls.   

Fellowship is a good thing and some do so in an organized church, some gather in a small group in someone's home.

Honestly, I learned the vast majority of what I know because of independent study.  I listen to a ton of debate.  I listen to lectures.  I read books.   I study online.

I understand what I do about sin because of many things:  reading scripture, reading books, listening to sermons, listening to lectures, fellowship with other believers, attending church, prayer and meditation......all this has contributed.

[Man of Steel]

Do you realize that you suggest me to start believing in Santa once again? I used to believe in god when I was a teen, later on I found out it's all bullshit for weak people, I cannot "wind back" my awareness, you can't "unknow". You suggest me to try to become an alcoholic just to see how "good it feels", yet I'm perfectly aware that it may feel good for a while, but it's all an illusion and dissapears when you get sober (and the reality is still there).

I suggested that you believe in Santa?  I asked you to become an alcoholic?  Huh?

So as teen you believed in God.  Tell me about your experience with the Holy Spirit or when you gave your live in humble surrender to the Lord Jesus Christ.  Tell me about your relationship with God.  Tell me about your prayer life.  Tell me then how you found out it was for weak people.

[Man of Steel]

More like a willful excuse and fear. Do you deny the human thought process? Doubt exists in all of us. An all mighty god would be able to see through to your faith. Why does it seem to me, that you are more scared to be judged by god than I am?

A willful excuse and fear of what exactly?   

No, I do not deny the human thought process.

Yes, doubt exists in all of us.  I just don't have doubt about Jesus Christ.

I fear and respect God because I know his reality because of special revelations of who he is in my life.

You deny God and therefore have no fear or respect for God.  God is more of a ridiculous notion for you.....a fairystory.  I'm not afraid of Peter Pan either.