This continuous rat-race: The Omnipotent skylord dogs are inferior meltdown

[Las Vegas]

There is no God, hope this helps.

It is like saying get it right with some anonymous galaxy out the back of yonder, just nonsense, and only a desperate fool would put his faith in nonsense.  What can I say, the world is full of desperate fools.

Are you saying this because you've sought God?

[Radical Plato]

Are you saying this because you've sought God?

I think he is saying their is nothing to seek.

[Las Vegas]

I think he is saying their is nothing to seek.

I thought it was you who said it?

[Tapeworm]

The struggle itself towards the heights is enough to fill a man's heart. One must imagine Sisyphus happy.

The metaphor doesn't apply to us and Camus knows it.  In the story, Sisyphus' task is 'a curse' because he has no choice.  It's strange that Camus would neglect any discussion of self-direction and the responsibility of it since that's more or less the whole enchilada of existentialism.  Seems unlikely he just kinda forgot about it so I can only assume he considered these tenets so rudimentary as to not bear repeating.  He presents Sisyphus to us as a man freed from the responsibility of choice who is happy not because he digs his struggle and finds some fulfillment in it but because he has been given the gift of a fixed fate.

I guess you could tell me that the responsibility of choice itself is our burden and bearing it is our fate, and that even suicide is a choice, and in that sense our fate is also fixed so we're just like Sisyphus after all, but that would be some equivocal bullshit.  We have to accept ownership of our actions.  Sisyphus is spared this.  Camus' interpretation is about the irreplaceability of God and how we're all pretty much fuckin' screwed.

[Parker]

The metaphor doesn't apply to us and Camus knows it.  In the story, Sisyphus' task is 'a curse' because he has no choice.  It's strange that Camus would neglect any discussion of self-direction and the responsibility of it since that's more or less the whole enchilada of existentialism.  Seems unlikely he just kinda forgot about it so I can only assume he considered these tenets so rudimentary as to not bear repeating.  He presents Sisyphus to us as a man freed from the responsibility of choice who is happy not because he digs his struggle and finds some fulfillment in it but because he has been given the gift of a fixed fate.

I guess you could tell me that the responsibility of choice itself is our burden and bearing it is our fate, and that even suicide is a choice, and in that sense our fate is also fixed so we're just like Sisyphus after all, but that would be some equivocal bullshit.  We have to accept ownership of our actions.  Sisyphus is spared this.  Camus' interpretation is about the irreplaceability of God and how we're all pretty much fuckin' screwed.

Excellent breakdown.

[pellius]

God = philosophical suicide

All our American presidents and the founders of this country committed philosophical suicide.

Look around, man. Look at your own country. See what secularism, socialism and pacifism has brought you. Your culture is dying.

America in the end will be fine. There will always be a back lash against the European influence as there is now. The conservatives will win this round.

It is you, and your country, that has committed suicide.

Start getting fitted for your burka and getting on your knees three times a day.

 

[BigRo]

what to replace God with?

make yourself totally nothing then you will be on to something.

[10pints]

The metaphor doesn't apply to us and Camus knows it.  In the story, Sisyphus' task is 'a curse' because he has no choice.  It's strange that Camus would neglect any discussion of self-direction and the responsibility of it since that's more or less the whole enchilada of existentialism.  Seems unlikely he just kinda forgot about it so I can only assume he considered these tenets so rudimentary as to not bear repeating.  He presents Sisyphus to us as a man freed from the responsibility of choice who is happy not because he digs his struggle and finds some fulfillment in it but because he has been given the gift of a fixed fate.

I guess you could tell me that the responsibility of choice itself is our burden and bearing it is our fate, and that even suicide is a choice, and in that sense our fate is also fixed so we're just like Sisyphus after all, but that would be some equivocal bullshit.  We have to accept ownership of our actions.  Sisyphus is spared this.  Camus' interpretation is about the irreplaceability of God and how we're all pretty much fuckin' screwed.

I agree with much of your interpretation. But I think that Camus' reference is twofold, and can also be interpreted in a manner that provides guidance for humankind, inasmuch as: the struggle of Sisyphus, and repetitive nature of his predicament, are akin to our lives, and the need for a constant confrontation and revolt against the absurd are fundamental facticities of any epoch. Therefore, you should imagine Sisyphus happy, as to do otherwise is to give in, and see philosophical suicide as a viable alternative option.

[cephissus]

people come to these intractable debates for conflict -- the fun of beating an opponent in argument.  and whether christian or atheist, i think the participants often hate seeing their own reflection in their opponent.

[Tapeworm]

I agree with much of your interpretation. But I think that Camus' reference is twofold, and can also be interpreted in a manner that provides guidance for humankind, inasmuch as: the struggle of Sisyphus, and repetitive nature of his predicament, are akin to our lives, and the need for a constant confrontation and revolt against the absurd are fundamental facticities of any epoch. Therefore, you should imagine Sisyphus happy, as to do otherwise is to give in, and see philosophical suicide as a viable alternative option.

Schlemiel, schlimalzel.  Hassenpfeffer Incorporated.  Doing it our way, Pints!

[Raymondo]

Questions about the meaning of life come up from time to time. Almost always, the OP is facing some other adversity.

When people feel tormented about their life having no meaning, in the absence of some other prorblem, I tell them to consider a change of environments. Change job, or take a break from your job. Join a charity, go do something for someone else. By the way, some charities are filled with very attractive young women. Go and meet one (if you are a getbigger she will be instantly attracted to you). Travel to other countries, see how people live there. Learn a new skill. Learn to play a musical instrument! The options are limitless.

Turning to organised religion because you feel there is no meaning to life is like taking a screwdriver to your brain because you have a headache.

[pellius]

It's overwhelming the atheist that considers people of faith as stupid. That they lack the critical thinking and understanding of logic.

Whether you believe in God or not has little to do with intelligence. It has to do with your world view. There are intelligent people on both sides.

Antonin Scalia, a Supreme Court Justice who just passed away, was considered by all, whether you agreed with him or not, as a singularly brilliant man. One recently commented that when he first met Scalia what struck him most was his sheer brain power.

Scalia was a devout Roman Catholic.

The founding fathers of this country were overwhelmingly men of faith.

[10pints]

It's overwhelming the atheist that considers people of faith as stupid. That they lack the critical thinking and understanding of logic.

Whether you believe in God or not has little to do with intelligence. It has to do with your world view. There are intelligent people on both sides.

Antonin Scalia, a Supreme Court Justice who just passed away, was considered by all, whether you agreed with him or not, as a singularly brilliant man. One recently commented that when he first met Scalia what struck him most was his sheer brain power.

Scalia was a devout Roman Catholic.

The founding fathers of this country were overwhelmingly men of faith.

It is easy to come to this conclusion, when people of faith profess to believe in such gems as: the earth was created in 6 days.

[pellius]

It is easy to come to this conclusion, when people of faith profess to believe in such gems as: the earth was created in 6 days.

As well as such gems that the universe began instantly and out of nothing with the Big Bang.

[Radical Plato]

As well as such gems that the universe began instantly and out of nothing with the Big Bang.

It wasn't instant nor was it out of nothing. There was no time before the big bang.

And unlike creationism there is plenty of evidence to support The Big Bang Theory and zero evidence to support creationism.  So even if the Big Bang theory is wrong it is certainly closer to the mark than God created heaven and Earth in 6 days and put his feet up on the 7th.

[pellius]

It wasn't instant nor was it out of nothing. There was no time before the big bang.

And unlike creationism there is plenty of evidence to support The Big Bang Theory and zero evidence to support creationism.  So even if the Big Bang theory is wrong it is certainly closer to the mark than God created heaven and Earth in 6 days and put his feet up on the 7th.

You make my point. There was nothing before the Big Bang. It came out of nothing. You're a moron.

And, no, it's not closer to the mark. YOU just think it is. And you have more than proven that your intellect is more than wanting. Explain to me again how our market economy is a zero sum game?

Seriously, how old are you and what level of formal education do you have? For somewhat who claims this is all a big joke, this particular question seems to have a level of gravity that supersedes some of the greatest issues in life.

Why is that? 

[Man of Steel]

Krauss' lecture was presented at the 2009 National Atheist convention.

The gist of lecture provided below:

The universe is flat.
The universe has zero total energy.
The universe could’ve begun from nothing.

Why is there something rather than nothing? The answer is there had to be. If you have nothing in quantum mechanics you’ll always get something.  It’s that simple, but it’s true.

Quantum fluctuations produced the flat universe out of nothing.

What are Quantum fluctuations?  

Please note that Krauss gives no explanation to the audience concerning what the quantum fluctuations are that produced the universe out of nothing.  

That said I have the definition from one of my saved links (I copy and paste here because I can't express it better in my own words):

“In the strange non-intuitive world of quantum mechanics some very peculiar things are allowed. Within the limits of the Heisenberg uncertainty principle, changes in mass, energy, position, momentum and time are allowed that otherwise are impossible. Although the uncertainty principle is simply stated its consequences are complex and profound. Heisenberg showed that the product of momentum and position as well as the product of energy and time cannot be known in the usual sense to a precision less than of the order of magnitude of Planck's constant which is a very small number (about 10^-34 joule sec) but not zero. Below that limit the variables above are no longer conserved. What this "means" is energy can spontaneously appear from no where so long as it does not last too long. Particles can "pop up" out of a vacuum so long as they do not have too large a mass or do not last too long. One might be inclined to dismiss all this as the wild imagination of physicists, but some things have been observed that require that interpretation. One example is black holes from which nothing, not even light, is able to escape -- well not quite. Black holes are not quite black -- they leak -- due to quantum fluctuations. So called "virtual particles" appear out of a vacuum only to disappear very quickly -- in times less than the limits set by the uncertainty principle. Richard Feynman once said that anyone who claims to understand quantum mechanics does not understand the problem!!! So on the very small scale our intuition fails us completely. The Big Bang theory of the Universe is generally accepted as the best explanation of the evolution of the Universe, but even that theory does not begin at time = 0 (exactly) but only after a infinitesimally short time later. Such is the world of quantum fluctuations. “

Quantum fluctuations produced the flat universe out of nothing....virtual particles popping in and out of existence.  How is this possible?  We really don't know, but we've defined that their nature is to do so.

Within metaphysics the impossible is allowed......better, it's acceptable provided the caveat of "we just haven't discovered the reason yet" or "we don't have the math yet" is applied then all impossibilities are reasonably justified.  

Please note, it's perfectly acceptable to not have an answer to something, but that can't be the crutch on which the final argument/conclusion is grounded.   For example, the Heisenberg uncertainty principle allows for changes in mass, energy, position, momentum and time that are basically impossible.  

In the end, as long as the "singularity event" isn't God all else is justifiably fair game.  Just too much accountability appended to that idea.....and who needs that noise, right?!  Let's concentrate on reasoning that one away, disguised in the noble yet generic endeavour of "the name of science". As long as we define terms and state that things within our metaphysical ideas have been "reasonably observed" all is good and acceptable.  And then we pat each other on the back and hand each other medals and plaques.

[Yamcha]

insert an hour long YouTube video here


One of life's biggest set-ups for being lonely is living with the erroneous belief that your way is the best way of doing things and insisting others agree with you. Some people seem to have taken a life course called, How To Be Absolutely Sure of Everything! It's like their reality testing mechanism is stuck on "It so because I think it is so." People who feel constantly threatened and angry when others question their actions substitute being right for living a happy life. Living daily always on the defense, being in charge of the rights and wrongs of the Universe, is no fun!

[Man of Steel]

insert an hour long YouTube video here


One of life's biggest set-ups for being lonely is living with the erroneous belief that your way is the best way of doing things and insisting others agree with you. Some people seem to have taken a life course called, How To Be Absolutely Sure of Everything! It's like their reality testing mechanism is stuck on "It so because I think it is so." People who feel constantly threatened and angry when others question their actions substitute being right for living a happy life. Living daily always on the defense, being in charge of the rights and wrongs of the Universe, is no fun!

Given all the Nobel Laureates on GB I figured an hour long lecture on cosmology and physics (also presented in layman's terms) would be a calkwalk LOL.  Like listening to Sade in a hammock sipping sun tea.

[Parker]

You mean philosophically speaking? Nietzsche was constantly grappling with that. He came of age in the 1860s. One of the most turbulent times in the history of humanity.

I think the question of what to replace God with is preceded by the question of is there a need for God. So really, it becomes a question about human nature. Do we need the concept God anymore? As individuals? As families? As communities? As countries? As a species?

God=anything that you put above yourself. People used to worship nature, mountains, the sun, the moon. Anything that we have viewed as more powerful than man. And in today's world, that can be science or the worship of the self. We have become our own Gods.

[Raymondo]

God=anything that you put above yourself. People used to worship nature, mountains, the sun, the moon. Anything that we have viewed as more powerful than man. And in today's world, that can be science or the worship of the self. We have become our own Gods.

It is pointless to worship anything. I view worship as an evolutionary remnant, almost like the tail that grows on an embryo in the first few weeks of gestation but is then absorbed by the body.

Worship helped man survive when man was not equipped to understand the world and when man's life was nasty, brutish and short.

[Man of Steel]

It is pointless to worship anything. I view worship as an evolutionary remnant, almost like the tail that grows on an embryo in the first few weeks of gestation but is then absorbed by the body.

Worship helped man survive when man was not equipped to understand the world and when man's life was nasty, brutish and short.

Again, to be crystal clear, you do not need even a moment of professed belief in God to live out a second of your life. 

From birth to death you can successfully exist without a moment of God in your life.

[OB1]

God=anything that you put above yourself. People used to worship nature, mountains, the sun, the moon. Anything that we have viewed as more powerful than man. And in today's world, that can be science or the worship of the self. We have become our own Gods.

Not quite.
Most today's western people's gods are: money, cars, pussy, status.
Yet some claim religious.

 

[Parker]

Not quite.
Most today's western people's gods are: money, cars, pussy, status.
Yet some claim religious.

 

Materialistic possessions that represent self gratification, correct? You can have many gods, and firmly believe the top one is ourselves, we've fallen prey to our own narcissism. Remember, you are on a bodybuilding board. Bodybuilding is about the glorification and praise of our own bodies. And now more than ever, people are more into trying to get the perfect body or the one that garners the most attention. Whether it be by plastic surgery or the gym, our society as put forth the notion that the self or the individual is far more important than the group. Which goes at odds responsibility for ones actions, which also feeds into the larger socialist leanings (if you eff up, there is a larger entity else to clean up).  A nation of dysfunction.

[OB1]

A nation of dysfunction.

Generation nothingness,,,