This is why I say deadlifts are basically useless

[Ropo]

The OP never said the deadlift was useless. And I never said that either.

The OP was challenging the idea that the deadlift is superior to other exercises, and that similar results can be achieved by doing other back exercises.

So why this is a headline of this topic: "This is why I say deadlifts are basically useless "?

In other words it means that this bozo has a reason to think that DL are useless, and that has to mean he have some kind of divine information about the matter, because hundred of thousands bodybuilders since this sport has invented, are all wasting their time with this useless exercise. If you look where we are, among the foil hats, little brats and fools, I have to say that his divine information is more likely something he has  eaten, than something what he has being thinking through and through. It is obvious that heavy multi joint exercises are beneficial, there isn't really any question about it, if you little fuckers have done your homework. It is apparent that this isn't the case, so this thread has to have born from the head of utterly stupid person.

[Ropo]

Your original post contained nothing about cosmetic effects, which is now 2/3 of your point above.   You said they were not a good gauge of strength, then struggled to make a case for it.  Maybe you did on the volumes of text in the middle pages, but judging by the current comments, it appears you have not.

Typical foil hat tactics : IF you seem to be wrong, just move the goal posts, and slide to another subject 

[Donny]

It's called a Roman Chair.

the term "Roman Chair" is used loosly. The original was a sit up bench  guys like Arnold used and Zabo for ab training. People use the bench prime is talking about primarily for lower back work. Some use it in a reverse fashion doing sit ups(not recomended). The original bench Arnold used had your feet positioned near the floor so you were in a sitting position. The rocking motion was to keep your abs under tension. Arnold put a block of wood under it to incline it...later the "Roman chair" was built at an angle. You can do the original version sitting sideways on a bench feet braced on the floor,Bill pearl calls these, "over a bench sit ups", just saying

[Donny]

The original version shown by Zabo and Frank Zane..

[polychronopolous]

the term "Roman Chair" is used loosly. The original was a sit up bench  guys like Arnold used and Zabo for ab training. People use the bench prime is talking about primarily for lower back work. Some use it in a reverse fashion doing sit ups(not recomended). The original bench Arnold used had your feet positioned near the floor so you were in a sitting position. The rocking motion was to keep your abs under tension. Arnold put a block of wood under it to incline it...later the "Roman chair" was built at an angle. You can do the original version sitting sideways on a bench feet braced on the floor,Bill pearl calls these, "over a bench sit ups", just saying

Agreed it does have multiple variations and the term is definitely used loosely.

[chaos]

Agreed it does have multiple variations and the term is definitely used loosely.

Like Donnys ass?

[Al Doggity]

The original version shown by Zabo and Frank Zane..

When I first started weightlifting, I would see these advertised in Muscle and Fitness and wanted one so bad. I was doing hundreds of situps a day and thought that this would turn me into a walking pile of abs.

[drkaje]

Abs are mostly diet, for me.

[Al Doggity]

Abs are mostly diet, for me.

I was 13/14. Everything I didn't have seemed like magic.

That being said, I see a big difference on me between dieted down abs, dieted down and killing it with ab work abs, and abs I've been killing with ab work before I dieted down. Alas, I try to spend no more than an hour in the gym, so I usually skip out on ab work until I'm dieting.

 I posted about this a little while ago, but I've been holding in my gut on  most movements. My bodyfat percentage is on the higher side for me right now, but my stomach is flat and hard and I can see ab definition when I flex.

[Hypertrophy]

Didn't read the entire thread Al, but I never really cared for standard dead lifts as part of my routine. Thought it was a power lifting move mostly. Tried them for a while and hit 455 but didn't really see a big change in my physique. My lower back felt like it was taking a beating though.

On the other hand, when I switched to stiff leg dead lifts for hamstrings -   boom - they grew like crazy. Wouldn't have believed it. I used lying and standing leg curl machines for years and never saw much happen.

I use 275-315 max for 6-10 reps, depending on how I feel. The  entire hamstring/glute/lower back  muscles work together smoothly and the changes in your physique are worth it. I'm no longer bothering with leg curls - don't need to do them anymore.

[Al Doggity]

On the other hand, when I switched to stiff leg dead lifts for hamstrings -   boom - they grew like crazy. Wouldn't have believed it. I used lying and standing leg curl machines for years and never saw much happen.

I use 275-315 max for 6-10 reps, depending on how I feel. The  entire hamstring/glute/lower back  muscles work together smoothly and the changes in your physique are worth it. I'm no longer bothering with leg curls - don't need to do them anymore.

Love SLDLs, but something about my positioning makes them more of a lower back exercise. To hit hamstrings and glutes, I've been doing a variation of which I'm not sure of the name. It's basically SLDL, but instead of  using a bar, I hold a plate tight across my chest. I'm not sure why, but that little change really causes me to feel it in my glutes and hams. Even when not using weight, just doing the movement with my arms crossed makes a big difference in comparison to having my arms hang down.

[Donny]

When I first started weightlifting, I would see these advertised in Muscle and Fitness and wanted one so bad. I was doing hundreds of situps a day and thought that this would turn me into a walking pile of abs.

ha..we all did you were not alone. 

[drkaje]

I was 13/14. Everything I didn't have seemed like magic.

That being said, I see a big difference on me between dieted down abs, dieted down and killing it with ab work abs, and abs I've been killing with ab work before I dieted down. Alas, I try to spend no more than an hour in the gym, so I usually skip out on ab work until I'm dieting.

 I posted about this a little while ago, but I've been holding in my gut on  most movements. My bodyfat percentage is on the higher side for me right now, but my stomach is flat and hard and I can see ab definition when I flex.

They do look better (dieted down) if being regularly exercised. I avoid weighted crunches because they make my abs grow out, LOL!

In terms of dieting these days, I just try to be reasonable and watch sugar. No idea about boodyfat, but would guess it's less than 20%.

[polychronopolous]

Like Donnys ass?

haha nice 

[Primemuscle]

It's called a Roman Chair.

Thanks. It is interesting to look the different Roman Chair designs and the variety of exercises one can do on it. Because the design I pictured cannot be adjusted for various waist to foot measurements, it can be awkward to use for some folks. I tried lowering the rollers which go behind the heels and found I could not get into the machine. This might have something to do with a lack of flexibility. In all the years I've been going to this gym, I have yet to see someone use it for sit-ups. There are a number of angled sit-up devices at the gym which work better and offer more support.

[Primemuscle]

Abs are mostly diet, for me.

Agreed. My abs are hard as rocks. Unfortunately I don't have "thin skin" so it takes a lot for them to show. I'm already lean. If I were leaner, I'd be downright skinny. -Not sure what my fat percentage currently is at, but it can't be much since the veins on my arms, legs, chest and even stomach stand out in relief as it they were on top of the skin.

[mr.turbo]

Again, I find this an odd counterpoint. Firstly, the idea of "burden of proof" in a thread about deadlifting on
the gossip and opinion board of an internet forum is   . More to the point, what you're saying counts as proof is even more subjective than what I've already posted. Like someone posted earlier, your mind has latched on to this and you will accept anything to support your thesis.

A more reasonable challenge is the opposite: Deadlifts have a reputation as king of strength and muscle building movements. That's what you're claiming. Several people in this thread have stated that is the one movement you need or if they could only do one exercise, that would be it. You, yourself, have posted a variation of that. So, if the deadlift is the only movement you need, who are the people who have built great bodies using only or not much more than deadlifts?

[mr.turbo]

Reeves rightly prioritized deadlifts over rows

Reeves classic physique
Squat – 3 x 8-12
Barbell/Dumbbell Row – 3 x 8-12….Deadlift – 3 x 5* see note
Behind the Neck Press – 3 x 8-12
Bench Press – 3 x 8-12
Barbell/Dumbbell Curl – 3 x 8-12
Dips – 5 x 10 @ BW (bodyweight).  Try for sets of 10.
Barbell Calf Raise – 3 x 15-20
AB work
Perform M-W-F
**On Friday drop BB row and do 3×5 deadlifts** Deadlifts are to be done Reg Park style. 2 warmup/ 1 heavy work set.

http://muscleandbrawn.com/steve-reeves-intermediate-full-body-workout-variation/

[Donny]

Reeves rightly prioritized deadlifts over rows

Reeves classic physique
Squat – 3 x 8-12
Barbell/Dumbbell Row – 3 x 8-12….Deadlift – 3 x 5* see note
Behind the Neck Press – 3 x 8-12
Bench Press – 3 x 8-12
Barbell/Dumbbell Curl – 3 x 8-12
Dips – 5 x 10 @ BW (bodyweight).  Try for sets of 10.
Barbell Calf Raise – 3 x 15-20
AB work
Perform M-W-F
**On Friday drop BB row and do 3×5 deadlifts** Deadlifts are to be done Reg Park style. 2 warmup/ 1 heavy work set.

http://muscleandbrawn.com/steve-reeves-intermediate-full-body-workout-variation/

Steve Reeves was a fan of Cable work for lats..like Gironda was too. In his Book, "Building the classsic Physique the natural way" his lat workout was:

Chin behind neck or lat pulldown behind neck 3x8-12
Low pulley lat pull 3x8-12
one arm row 3x8-12(dumbbell)
Lower back he worked with Good mornings 3x8-12

of course he no doubt used Deads time to time but mainly Good Mornings and seated. He writes in his book he switched to good mornings because he felt Deads and squats together gave too much glute work.

[Al Doggity]

Not sure what this is supposed to be proving?  This is supposed to be an example of the kind of great body you can build using only deadlifts? 

[Al Doggity]

Reeves rightly prioritized deadlifts over rows

Reeves classic physique
Squat – 3 x 8-12
Barbell/Dumbbell Row – 3 x 8-12….Deadlift – 3 x 5* see note
Behind the Neck Press – 3 x 8-12
Bench Press – 3 x 8-12
Barbell/Dumbbell Curl – 3 x 8-12
Dips – 5 x 10 @ BW (bodyweight).  Try for sets of 10.
Barbell Calf Raise – 3 x 15-20
AB work
Perform M-W-F
**On Friday drop BB row and do 3×5 deadlifts** Deadlifts are to be done Reg Park style. 2 warmup/ 1 heavy work set.

http://muscleandbrawn.com/steve-reeves-intermediate-full-body-workout-variation/

Not that I'm convinced of the veracity of this workout either way, but in the link you posted, this isn't the workout Reeves performed. This was cooked up by the author of that article. What's presented as Reeves' workout has more dumbbell row sets earlier in the workout.

[mr.turbo]

Not that I'm convinced of the veracity of this workout either way, but in the link you posted, this isn't the workout Reeves performed. This was cooked up by the author of that article. What's presented as Reeves' workout has more dumbbell row sets earlier in the workout.

you can't dispute this. Doesn't matter anyway donny is probably right reeve ditched deadlifts too. Just like you did.

that's why he doesn't have a powerful look. He gave up on it. Sorry to have posted this.  

regardless it seems you sir have committed to this line of reasoning for one simple reason.

you are highly ignorant of the history of physical culture.

you have no standing to comment on this subject.

hope this helps.

[mr.turbo]

Hey Doggity

let me put it this way.

I like you

I like your posts

you're a good guy

just stop posting about deadlifting and we can remain comrades.

[Al Doggity]

you can't dispute this. Doesn't matter anyway donny is probably right reeve ditched deadlifts too. Just like you did.

that's why he doesn't have a powerful look. He gave up on it. Sorry to have posted this.  

There's nothing to dispute. What I said is right there in the link you posted and you literally apologized for posting as it didn't even prove whatever it was you were trying to prove.

regardless it seems you sir have committed to this line of reasoning for one simple reason.

you are highly ignorant of the history of physical culture.

you have no standing to comment on this subject.

hope this helps.

Once again, no concrete argument about the benefits of the deadlift."Highly ignorant of physical culture?" 

Hey Doggity

let me put it this way.

I like you

I like your posts

you're a good guy

just stop posting about deadlifting and we can remain comrades.

You  just posted that you want to be buds with me, but you can't if I talk shit about deadlifts. I'm not gonna analyze that any further. I will leave that up to  whoever is still checking in on this thread.

[chaos]

I'm deadlifting in a few hours. Should I be worried?