Author Topic: Remember the Original Muscle Media 2000 magazine and how great it was? (Read 9421 times)

myseone · « **on:** March 22, 2006, 08:32:57 PM »

I remember that when MM2k first came out it was an awesome magazine. Just about everything was discussed in that magazine from Dan Duchaine's advice on steriods, TC Luoma or Mentzer's training advice, advice from the Doctor who had AIDS, etc. what an awesome overall magazine it used to be. I used anxiously wait for the next issue.

Then the magazine to a sharp left turn off a cliff, and went from arguably one of the best Bodybuilding magazines of all time to a weak neutered version of its former self.

I always wondered why they would turn a magazine that was doing so great into one that was a joke. I understood their drive to expand into a bigger market, but during its hey day everyone that I knew who worked out for health, vanity, strength and performance read it.

I came across this audio interview last night about what actually went on at EAS, what happened with Bill Phillips, etc. It's an interesting interview, Here's the link below

http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do;jsessionid=77E1CF26C31B9679EC2A71D28113EF61.hydra?id=981410

michael arvilla · « **Reply #1 on:** March 22, 2006, 08:35:07 PM »

MM2M...........was the most talked about/bought magazine there was
finally a magazine "for us!"

then.................... ...............they turned on us and pussied out

myseone · « **Reply #2 on:** March 22, 2006, 08:45:49 PM »

Yeah it was and they did, I remember people at the gym being really angry about the way it turned.
Seemed like a case of, "Okay I've gotten your money now shove off!"

michael arvilla · « **Reply #3 on:** March 22, 2006, 08:54:19 PM »

we used to pour over that magazine
(we couldnt believe they were actually talking about/advocating steroid useage
after so many years of being spoon fed all that Weider crap)

we would read every single page
Bill Phillips was the man!
.finally a real "hardcore mag!"
he took that and turned it into a joke (and himself)

he went "male fitness" on us
didnt he write the "steroid books" as well?( BTiAh = before turning into a homo)

myseone · « **Reply #4 on:** March 22, 2006, 09:06:17 PM »

Up to that point the other magazines were really trying to insult peoples intelligence with their "Our bodybuilders are completely clean, they just use our principles"

Musclemaedia came out of nowhere and cried "BS, this is really whats going on"
I loved that aspect about the old magazine, it gave me that thought of, "okay now someone is being more truthful in this industry".

Then Someone got greedy and jacked up the magazine.

myseone · « **Reply #5 on:** March 22, 2006, 09:09:19 PM »

Quote from: michael arvilla on March 22, 2006, 08:54:19 PM

we used to pour over that magazine
(we couldnt believe they were actually talking about/advocating steroid useage
after so many years of being spoon fed all that Weider crap)

we would read every single page
Bill Phillips was the man!
.finally a real "hardcore mag!"
he took that and turned it into a joke (and himself)

he went "male fitness" on us
didnt he write the "steroid books" as well?( BTiAh = before turning into a homo)

I'm not sure what he wrote now after listening to that interview. The Anabolic Reference Guide was released with his name on it.

He also promoted Dan Duchaine's Underground Steriod Handbook and a great book BodyOpus.

Manninen dude · « **Reply #6 on:** March 23, 2006, 09:06:18 AM »

I still remenber the day when I picked up my first copy of MM2000 at local gym. I started to read it and I was rather surprised that there was a non-biased article on clenbuterol and other hard-core stuff ("Pretty cool... Certainly not just another sugar-coated Weider bullshit rag.."). Of course, I was hooked (I was a hard-core gym rat back then.. but not anymore) and bought every issue of MM2000 I was able to find from local newstands, and I read every issue from cover to cover several times.

However, Phillips clearly deciced to sell his soul to EAS and $$$. Obviously, the mag wasnt too intertesting anymore since there was some sort of EAS or Body-for-Life plug in every corner..

buffbodz · « **Reply #7 on:** March 23, 2006, 09:18:16 AM »

I can remember waiting for the new issue each month. It was one of the best and than Body for Life and the transformation contests. That was it. It seemed like everybody entered the first year, Bill liked the $$$ and all the percs that went with it and went mainstream. Now it sucks. All the mags were better 10 years ago. Ironman, Flex even Muscular development rocked. Look what the net did. Now we know who won a contest the same day not 6 weeks later. But the whole crew Bill, TC, Dan, Roger even Shawn had some interesting things to say and they were the first to ditch pros too. They were for the majority of minority's who make up the weight game.

Manninen dude · « **Reply #8 on:** March 23, 2006, 09:21:00 AM »

Quote from: buffbodz on March 23, 2006, 09:18:16 AM

They were for the majority of minority's who make up the weight game.

I think that was the main reason MM2000 was so popular. Weider mags pretty much offered Pro bb stuff for average guys too. Well, the difference between genetics is crystal clear.

Manninen dude · « **Reply #9 on:** March 23, 2006, 09:23:27 AM »

Quote from: buffbodz on March 23, 2006, 09:18:16 AM

Ironman, Flex even Muscular development rocked.

MD still rocks!

However, Weider mags still suck ("Flex: The Drug of Choice For Insomnia"). Ironman contains some interesting info once in a while.

PS. The popular belief (supported by T-mag audio) that EAS had creatine monohydrate first is clearly fallacious. In reality, TWINLAB (Blechman) was first but they had (and still have) gigantic distribution organization and thus it took some time before the bottles actually hit the shelfs.

torquemada · « **Reply #10 on:** March 23, 2006, 03:31:07 PM »

Here's a little bit of trivia: Phillips started MM in his mom's garage and "supposedly" used $ from selling gear to finance it. As far as selling out, I really can't be mad at him for making a huge amount of money. I CAN be mad that I was stupid enough to believe HMB really would "feel like deca."

Manninen dude · « **Reply #11 on:** March 23, 2006, 04:14:31 PM »

We have to give Phillips dude some credit; thanks to his hype regarding EAS´s product-specific university studies, other companies also started to sponsor such studies.

tommywishbone · « **Reply #12 on:** March 23, 2006, 04:26:24 PM »

Did Phillips ever make any money with all that Phosphagain-betagen-HMB stuff?

Manninen dude · « **Reply #13 on:** March 23, 2006, 04:53:43 PM »

Quote from: tommywishbone on March 23, 2006, 04:26:24 PM

Did Phillips ever make any money with all that Phosphagain-betagen-HMB stuff?

PS. Did Gates ever make any money with all that Microsoft stuff?

HowieW · « **Reply #14 on:** March 23, 2006, 05:15:35 PM »

Mainstream overall fitness is where the really big bucks are and sadly Bill P went that way after he got his name on the map from us in hardcore bodybuilding. YUP it was a great mag.

knny187 · « **Reply #15 on:** March 23, 2006, 05:36:25 PM »

Was the best mag.....talked about gear & cycles.

No bullshit articles & didn't have 3/4 of the magazine filled with ads.

myseone · « **Reply #16 on:** March 23, 2006, 06:07:06 PM »

Quote from: torquemada on March 23, 2006, 03:31:07 PM

Here's a little bit of trivia: Phillips started MM in his mom's garage and "supposedly" used $ from selling gear to finance it. As far as selling out, I really can't be mad at him for making a huge amount of money. I CAN be mad that I was stupid enough to believe HMB really would "feel like deca."

A lot of organizations or men rise to prominance via breaking the law first then supposedly going clean later; the were'nt the Kennedy's selling booze during prohibition. Bill just transitioned intelligently I guess.

HMB was very expensive, produced poor results and lasted all of 10 days for a bottle. They used to compare a stack of creatine and HMB to Deca, funny stuff.

myseone · « **Reply #17 on:** March 23, 2006, 06:14:03 PM »

Quote from: Manninen dude on March 23, 2006, 04:14:31 PM

We have to give Phillips dude some credit; thanks to his hype regarding EAS´s product-specific university studies, other companies also started to sponsor such studies.

There is a problem here; If a manufacturer sponsors a particular university or lab to test a product, then the tester might feel the need to make positive comments about the product, due to the money being received and potential monies to be received in the future. I would rather see third party, unrelated tests done.

myseone · « **Reply #18 on:** March 23, 2006, 06:17:00 PM »

Quote from: HowieW on March 23, 2006, 05:15:35 PM

Mainstream overall fitness is where the really big bucks are and sadly Bill P went that way after he got his name on the map from us in hardcore bodybuilding. YUP it was a great mag.

Yeah I agree with that, I still think that the mag did'nt have to take the turn it did though, they could have left some of the hardcoreness to it. How many people have bought Flex magazine or MD over the years, people who are'nt even bodybuilders, people who train for fitness, and these magazines are or were fairly hardcore.

Manninen dude · « **Reply #19 on:** March 24, 2006, 03:41:08 AM »

Quote from: myseone on March 23, 2006, 06:14:03 PM

There is a problem here; If a manufacturer sponsors a particular university or lab to test a product, then the tester might feel the need to make positive comments about the product, due to the money being received and potential monies to be received in the future. I would rather see third party, unrelated tests done.

Third party, unrelated studies are best. However, supplement company-sponsored studies published in well-known peer-reviewed journals are generally just fine. The key here is the peer-review process, ie. 2 or 3 scientists in the same area review the manuscript and then send their reports to Editor-in-Chief.

rocket · « **Reply #20 on:** March 24, 2006, 05:24:51 AM »

There is shit all money in bodybuilding and less and less as up go up the scale of "hardcore".

So Bill did the right thing and went the opposite way.

Manninen dude · « **Reply #21 on:** March 24, 2006, 05:49:20 AM »

Quote from: rocket on March 24, 2006, 05:24:51 AM

There is shit all money in bodybuilding and less and less as up go up the scale of "hardcore".

So Bill did the right thing and went the opposite way.

I tend to disagree with this contention. Why he didnt simply decide to publish a "sister-magazine" called Fitness Media or something.

Also, if you ask some strength-power athlete (other than bodybuilder or powerlifter) where he/she gets his info on nutrition, supplementation, etc., he/she will also likely say "from bb mags" (especially MD)

theworm · « **Reply #22 on:** March 24, 2006, 07:21:04 AM »

I was just thinking about MM2000. I loved that mag! I am still pist they went the fitness route. However, to some extent, MM2000 kinda mutated into present day Muscular Development. Without MM2000, I don;t think MD would be as great today.

My advice is for MD to see how much we all liked MM2000 and kinda adapt to some of its features. Cut out about 100 pages of the same damn pictures that are used over and over, and put more "hardcore" topics in there. Why did the monthly steroid profile stop???

Manninen dude · « **Reply #23 on:** March 24, 2006, 07:57:16 AM »

Quote from: theworm on March 24, 2006, 07:21:04 AM

Cut out about 100 pages of the same damn pictures that are used over and over, and put more "hardcore" topics in there.

I agree.

Manninen dude · « **Reply #24 on:** March 24, 2006, 08:55:47 AM »

Quote from: theworm on March 24, 2006, 07:21:04 AM

My advice is for MD to see how much we all liked MM2000 and kinda adapt to some of its features.

Excluding contest coverage, MD is very similar to the original MM2000 (i.e., uncensored, cutting-edge stuff) but we have clearly more qualified authors than M2000 had. However, we also offer contest coverages, so you will get best of the BOTH worlds.